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[gatotsu911]

The event on the 13th and TGS will make or break the 3DS. I thought this was pretty much common knowledge by now.

 

[theBishop]

So, because Nintendo has a different design philosophy when it comes to making AAA titles compared to western developers those games can't be considered impressive games?

Don't mistake what you want in a game to be a deciding factor in if it is an impressive title or not.

It has nothing to do with Japan vs "The West". It's Nintendo vs everyone else making video games today. I could point to obvious big budget examples like MGS or every Final Fantasy since 7, but even smaller downloads and handheld games from Japan generally have voice acting. Look at Jeanne D'Arc or Valkyria Chronicles. Unless the game has a tiny budget, full voice is just standard.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

I do like how "Nintendo is going to go third party" has slowly evolved in to "I really wish Nintendo would go third party."

It is refreshingly honest.

Yeah, but you still have the qualifier of "but all their games are shit and also the same game they made 20 years ago just with different graphics" addendums.

Which honestly makes me wonder why people who don't want Nintendo games and don't want to buy Nintendo hardware are so keen on them going third party.

 

[GDGF]

This is the kind of Nintendo article that I like

 

[manueldelalas]

DQIX was on the DS bro.

Yes, DQIX was good, but not up to par with other DQ releases (like DQ II, III, IV, V, VI and VII), and certainly not the best jRPG on the handheld (Bowser's Story mops the floor with DQIX, Nostalgia is better (strictly my opinion though, most people didn't endure until the really awesome post game content)), which doesn't have that many great jRPGs if you leave the remakes out, but it has some decent but not great ones. DQV, which was never released here, is thousands of times better than DQIX, and is the best DQ ever. DQ VI which wasn't released either, is also much better.

But Xenoblades on the Wii, is probably one of the best jRPGs ever made, such a great game, visually impressive too.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

It has nothing to do with Japan vs "The West". It's Nintendo vs everyone else making video games today. I could point to obvious big budget examples like MGS or every Final Fantasy since 7, but even smaller downloads and handheld games from Japan generally have voice acting. Look at Jeanne D'Arc or Valkyria Chronicles. Unless the game has a tiny budget, full voice is just standard.

It's nice to have a developer that doesn't feel it should be forced to make games up to any sort of standard, isn't it?

Grin ticked all the goddamn boxes and look where it got them.

Yeah, but you still have the qualifier of "but all their games are shit and also the same game they made 20 years ago just with different graphics" addendums.

Which honestly makes me wonder why people who don't want Nintendo games and don't want to buy Nintendo hardware are so keen on them going third party.

Because they're afraid to admit they like Nintendo, lest they called some sort of fanboy.

 

[Jive Turkey]

I do like how "Nintendo is going to go third party" has slowly evolved in to "I really wish Nintendo would go third party."

It is refreshingly honest.

It's amazing how many posters are now letting their fanboy flag fly.

 

[Colonel Mustard]

Every company capitalizes on its successful franchises by giving them frequent releases.

It's idiotic to say only nintendo does this, or even say they're the worst offenders. If the polish and fun is there, so will I. Theres a reason we're on our third Uncharted in four years and dont give a shit that it's considered milking.

Or: I just play games, bro.

 

[theBishop]

It's nice to have a developer that doesn't feel it should be forced to make games up to any sort of standard, isn't it?

No.

 

[StevieP]

Every company capitalizes on its successful franchises by giving them frequent releases.

It's idiotic to say only nintendo does this, or even say they're the worst offenders.

They're not that frequent. You might have been able to say that in regards to Mario Party, but those have died down now too.

It has nothing to do with Japan vs "The West". It's Nintendo vs everyone else making video games today. I could point to obvious big budget examples like MGS or every Final Fantasy since 7, but even smaller downloads and handheld games from Japan generally have voice acting. Look at Jeanne D'Arc or Valkyria Chronicles. Unless the game has a tiny budget, full voice is just standard.

Both recently released Nintendo games:

 

[EvilMario]

It has nothing to do with Japan vs "The West". It's Nintendo vs everyone else making video games today. I could point to obvious big budget examples like MGS or every Final Fantasy since 7, but even smaller downloads and handheld games from Japan generally have voice acting. Look at Jeanne D'Arc or Valkyria Chronicles. Unless the game has a tiny budget, full voice is just standard.

Nintendo does voice acting where appropriate (Xenoblade, Disaster, StarFox 64, Metroid: Other M.. lulz..). It's just most titles Nintendo puts out don't gain anything from having voice acting. I don't want to hear from the Waddledees in the next Kirby game, I don't need every Toad in Mario Galaxy to be voiced, and for the love of God, I don't want Link to be given any sort of noise outside of grunts.

 

[Truth101]

It has nothing to do with Japan vs "The West". It's Nintendo vs everyone else making video games today. I could point to obvious big budget examples like MGS or every Final Fantasy since 7, but even smaller downloads and handheld games from Japan generally have voice acting. Look at Jeanne D'Arc or Valkyria Chronicles. Unless the game has a tiny budget, full voice is just standard.

So, because Nintendo doesn't conform to adding "modern features" that makes them against the entire game industry?

I could also argue that a lot of those AAA Japanese titles have had a lot of elements added to make them more appealing to the western audience, so in a sense yes it is a western design philosophy still.

 

[KevinCow]

buying a ds and fact checking every single game as such - "does it use both screens? does it use the stylus? because i hate both of those things" - makes zero sense. eventually someone reasonable would have to inquire "Why the fuck did you buy a Nintendo Dual Screen if you dont like the idea of dual screens?"

similar to buying a wii if i dont like motion controls - why would i buy a console with motion controls if i hate motion controls?

"I DONT KNOW SOME GAMES DONT USE THEM BUY IT ANYWAY SDNSKBGSIGFIUSBGUSGSLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL"

Or maybe you could judge systems based on the games they offer instead of the system's features.

You know, like a reasonable person.

I'm not saying you should buy a DS just because. I'm saying that your reasoning is fucking stupid.

If you don't want it because you've looked at the library and it doesn't interest you, that's one thing.

If you don't want it because you immediately decided that dual screens and a touch screen were stupid the second it was announced, then didn't even bother looking at the games the system had to offer throughout its life, then sit here six years later still bitching about the dual screen and touch screen despite almost certainly having very limited experience with the system due to having not owned one, that's another thing.


But maybe it's just me. Maybe it's just because I don't understand this closed-minded stance that so many gamers seem to hold of absolutely refusing to try anything different or new. Like, I can understand seeing certain uses of touch or motion controls and saying, "Nah, that doesn't interest me." But the idea of completely writing off the entire concept of touch or motion controls entirely on concept, saying, "No, I will never ever be able to enjoy any touch or motion or whatever controls and will absolutely refuse to ever give such things a real chance," simply because they're different from what you're used to, absolutely boggles my mind.

What is so terrible about touch controls or a second screen that would absolutely ruin any and all enjoyment you could possibly gain from a game on the system? I'm honestly not even a huge fan of either, but I don't see how they in any way detract from anything I've played. There's been the occasional tacked on gimmicky feature in an otherwise good game, but when I come across those, you know who I blame? The developer, for making poor design decisions. not the system for offering those features.


You know what else? I'm not even a big fan of the DS. I think its library was extremely disappointing after the GBA, which was one of my favorite systems ever. I can perfectly understand if someone didn't buy one because they didn't see a lot of games they wanted. But absolutely none of the issues I have with the system come from the touch controls or second screen.

 

[CrisKre]

It just says the creatively decide not to go that route. You just stated how mainstream it is nowadays to get a good agency to provide competent voice acting. Would you say retro didn't voice samus for any other reason than a creative choice (most probably by decision on EAD)

 

[Colonel Mustard]

They're not that frequent. You might have been able to say that in regards to Mario Party, but those have died down now

I'm not bashing anyone for milking.

I'm saying I give no shit as long as the game is fun.

 

[Teknoman]

Guns blazing, AT ITS OWN HEAD! Amirite!

Also Graduate from pokemon to monster hunter?!

More like be held back a year, demoted and thrown out of your house >_>!

Nintendo also needs to push its 3dstore better, this week nothing was released on the 3dstore in Australia. NOTHING!

Also >.< the Nintendo video is a waste of bandwidth, stupid idea. Do a deal with Youtube for a 3ds channel app >_>;

Also as well, promote 3ds retail games better on the actual console. Why cant I see ingame 3d vids of star fox? Of all the games at retail? What about demos?! Nintendo, I love ya, but sometimes you seem so stuck in your own ways....

There are some decent in game 3D videos of Star Fox...but on the NA store. That new Nintendo Show 3D was pretty cool, much better than the Nintendo video channel.

3DS store with all its random buttons: It's nice to see new images every Thursday, but there really should be buttons that give you a direct list of VC games, videos, 3DStitles, 3Dware, and DSiware.

 

[Pachterballs]

This may force them to make a SSB game for the 3DS. .

SSB is a game that's only good on consoles because you're playing with people in the room (see also mario party).

 

[CrisKre]

I agree with the main thing is whether those franchises are fun. But they also have to be reasonably spaced, and by the way they sell decades after their original release I think is safe to say Nintendo knows when to put them out.

 

[Teknoman]

Force them to make one? They've already got a 3DS Smash Bros in the works.

EDIT: Damn it Nintendo, give NA Xenoblade -_-

 

[Laguna]

Anyone who thinks the 3DS is a sinking ship right now is completely delusional.

I think all the recent negativity is spawning from Vita fans who, after Tri G was announced, are very concerned about the future of their platform and are lashing out because of this

I think you are right. You just need to read their comments on PSvita to come to that conclusion. Basicaly 3DS "sinking ship" "teh doomed" PSvita "second coming of g*" "best lineup ever" completely ignoring that Capcom single-handedly outweights PSvitas until today known 3rd party support.

 

[Azure J]

SSB is a game that's only good on consoles because you're playing with people in the room (see also mario party).

Mario Kart says this game will work brilliantly both on a portable and console. The local multiplayer strength can't be downplayed with Smash, but I'm willing to bet the portable version is going to be very attractive once it hits.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

SSB is a game that's only good on consoles because you're playing with people in the room (see also mario party).

Didn't stop Capcom from releasing SFIV or Tecmo from releasing DOA on the 3DS, and they both seem to be selling fairly well.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

I think you are right. You just need to read their comments on PSvita to come to that conclusion. Basicaly 3DS "sinking ship" "teh doomed" PSvita "second coming of g*" "best lineup ever" completely ignoring that Capcom single-handedly outweights PSvitas until today known 3rd party support.

Y'know, it's always fun to dig up these old threads:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27468

 

[StevieP]

But maybe it's just me. Maybe it's just because I don't understand this closed-minded stance that so many gamers seem to hold of absolutely refusing to try anything different or new. Like, I can understand seeing certain uses of touch or motion controls and saying, "Nah, that doesn't interest me." But the idea of completely writing off the entire concept of touch or motion controls entirely on concept, saying, "No, I will never ever be able to enjoy any touch or motion or whatever controls and will absolutely refuse to ever give such things a real chance," simply because they're different from what you're used to, absolutely boggles my mind.

Have you read gaming sites in the past half decade?

 

[Teknoman]

At least Smash Bros will have decent online with the 3DS. Still cant see how most DS titles with online played smoother than TvC or Brawl on the Wii.

 

[Gotchaye]

I'm starting to come around on this thing. I've had an original DS since forever, and picked up a Wii shortly after launch, but the Wii didn't get nearly as much play as the 360 I bought a year later (though I've mostly ignored both since building a good PC). The DS was/is fantastic, though. All in all, I'd been souring on Nintendo; I enjoyed Galaxy but nothing else on the Wii really clicked (working on figuring out how to buy and play Xenoblade), and I haven't bought a new DS game in a long time.

I was expecting to pick up a Vita, but Nintendo's really impressed me with a lot of their damage control on the 3DS. If in the next year or so they can come out with a version that doesn't have the screen scratching problem, that maybe incorporates the second stick in a less awkward-looking way, and can get out a Zelda or an Advance Wars, I'll probably hold off on the Vita and grab a 3DS instead. I'm still very wait-and-see on the Wii U, though.

 

[dream]

If you don't want it because you immediately decided that dual screens and a touch screen were stupid the second it was announced, then didn't even bother looking at the games the system had to offer throughout its life, then sit here six years later still bitching about the dual screen and touch screen despite almost certainly having very limited experience with the system due to having not owned one, that's another thing.


But maybe it's just me. Maybe it's just because I don't understand this closed-minded stance that so many gamers seem to hold of absolutely refusing to try anything different or new. Like, I can understand seeing certain uses of touch or motion controls and saying, "Nah, that doesn't interest me." But the idea of completely writing off the entire concept of touch or motion controls entirely on concept, saying, "No, I will never ever be able to enjoy any touch or motion or whatever controls and will absolutely refuse to ever give such things a real chance," simply because they're different from what you're used to, absolutely boggles my mind.

What is so terrible about touch controls or a second screen that would absolutely ruin any and all enjoyment you could possibly gain from a game on the system? I'm honestly not even a huge fan of either, but I don't see how they in any way detract from anything I've played. There's been the occasional tacked on gimmicky feature in an otherwise good game, but when I come across those, you know who I blame? The developer, for making poor design decisions. not the system for offering those features.

I pretty much kept nodding in agreement as I read your post.

The irony is many DS/Wii enthusiasts are using the very same arguments to deride the iPad, iPhone, and iPod touch.

 

[Boney]

Didn't stop Capcom from releasing SFIV or Tecmo from releasing DOA on the 3DS, and they both seem to be selling fairly well.

hahahahahaha

 

[AbsoluteZero]

hahahahahaha

It's not? I thought it was selling reasonable numbers. Should've done my research.

 

[Sadist]

Didn't stop Capcom from releasing SFIV or Tecmo from releasing DOA on the 3DS, and they both seem to be selling fairly well.

Yeah... DOA kinda bombed.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

The industry needs Nintendo to keep things fresh and interesting.

They can't even be bothered to publish Last Story and Xenoblade in the US- late in the console's life, during a drought.

Other M was lame.

They're going the same direction with Kid Icarus- screwing up a sure thing.

I'm not even seeing what's fresh and interesting about what they do. It's safe, expected typical Nintendo.

 

[disappeared]

Guns blazing or not, Nintendo loaded the chambers with blanks.

 

[dream]

I think Other M sort of highlights Nintendo's problem. I can't believe they didn't have the self-awareness to objectively look at the game and realize, "hey, this just isn't very good and we probably shouldn't attach the Metroid brand to it."

 

[Sennorin]

I think Other M sort of highlights Nintendo's problem. I can't believe they didn't have the self-awareness to objectively look at the game and realize, "hey, this just isn't very good and we probably shouldn't attach the Metroid brand to it."

Sigh.
Other M was/is a great game. End of story.

 

[Penguin]

I pretty much kept nodding in agreement as I read your post.

The irony is many DS/Wii enthusiasts are using the very same arguments to deride the iPad, iPhone, and iPod touch.

Yeah we joked about this the other week on our podcast.

Its like their is a faction of gamers who thumb their nose at those "beneath" them.

PC Gamers do it to console gamers.

"Hardcore" console gamers do it to the "casuals"

Casual supporters do it to smartphone/Facebook gaming

And I really don't think anyone for them to thumb their nose at yet.

At the end of the day, HD gaming, motion gaming, smart phone gaming, even Facebook gaming offers various experiences. I've found enjoyable games on all of those areas and just avoid the stuff that doesn't interest me personally. Doesn't mean I talk down or bad about those who do enjoy it.

They can't even be bothered to publish Last Story and Xenoblade in the US- late in the console's life, during a drought.

Other M was lame.

They're going the same direction with Kid Icarus- screwing up a sure thing.

I'm not even seeing what's fresh and interesting about what they do. It's safe, expected typical Nintendo.

You list 4 games.
2 of them are brand new IPs. From what I've played of Xenoblade, its unlike a vast majority of jRPGs.

Kid Icarus seems to be trying new things with an old franchise.

And.. your complaint is they aren't doing fresh and interesting?

Am I missing something here?

I mean interesting is a matter of perspective, but can't deal they tried something fresh with all 4 of those games. If they succeeded or not, is again a matter of opinion.

 

[Boney]

I think Other M sort of highlights Nintendo's problem. I can't believe they didn't have the self-awareness to objectively look at the game and realize, "hey, this just isn't very good and we probably shouldn't attach the Metroid brand to it."

now it's personal

 

[GDGF]

Guns blazing or not, Nintendo loaded the chambers with blanks.

You're comparing Dragon Quest and Monster Hunter to blanks?


Honestly?

 

[[Nintex]]

Sigh.
Other M was/is a great game. End of story.

Have you played it?

 

[Sennorin]

Have you played it?

Finished with 100%. Fantastic, fun experience. Hoping for a sequel.

 

[dream]

now it's personal

Sorry, I'll rephrase it.

Other M had a lot of glaring problems, from the awkward controls to the embarrassing storyline, and I'm surprised someone didn't say "maybe we should try to fix some of these things" at some point during the development process.

 

[dream]

Yeah we joked about this the other week on our podcast.

Its like their is a faction of gamers who thumb their nose at those "beneath" them.

PC Gamers do it to console gamers.

"Hardcore" console gamers do it to the "casuals"

Casual supporters do it to smartphone/Facebook gaming

And I really don't think anyone for them to thumb their nose at yet.

At the end of the day, HD gaming, motion gaming, smart phone gaming, even Facebook gaming offers various experiences. I've found enjoyable games on all of those areas and just avoid the stuff that doesn't interest me personally. Doesn't mean I talk down or bad about those who do enjoy it.

I look at all those different types and subcultures of gaming as, I dunno, some sort of food chain, really. I like how you ranked them in descending order because it really does look like a pyramid if you diagram it out.

The thing is, the pyramid going from a narrow tip to a wide base represents each level of gaming's customer base and I don't think anyone would argue that it's not a good idea to target the widest possible range of customers when you're developing a game.

 

[disappeared]

You're comparing Dragon Quest and Monster Hunter to blanks?


Honestly?

I'm talking more the lifespan of the console in general. Indeed, they have fired a few good shots, but it's been largely spray n' pray.

 

[jeremy1456]

The event on the 13th and TGS will make or break the 3DS. I thought this was pretty much common knowledge by now.

People don't actually believe this, do they?

The only way the event on the 13th could 'break' the 3DS is if Nintendo announced it was being discontinued.

People are exaggerating Nintendo's 'troubled' situation to crazy levels.

EDIT: I know that Sony GAF gets absolutely insane just before the launch of new Sony hardware, but this is getting ridiculous.

 

[Boney]

Sorry, I'll rephrase it.

Other M had a lot of glaring problems, from the awkward controls to the embarrassing storyline, and I'm surprised someone didn't say "maybe we should try to fix some of these things" at some point during the development process.

I was already sharpening my knife. You've been spared.

 

[StevieP]

They can't even be bothered to publish Last Story and Xenoblade in the US- late in the console's life, during a drought.

Other M was lame.

They're going the same direction with Kid Icarus- screwing up a sure thing.

I'm not even seeing what's fresh and interesting about what they do. It's safe, expected typical Nintendo.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

You list 4 games.
2 of them are brand new IPs. From what I've played of Xenoblade, its unlike a vast majority of jRPGs.

Kid Icarus seems to be trying new things with an old franchise.

And.. your complaint is they aren't doing fresh and interesting?

Am I missing something here?

I mean interesting is a matter of perspective, but can't deal they tried something fresh with all 4 of those games. If they succeeded or not, is again a matter of opinion.

Technically they are doing something unexpected with Kid Icarus- but when it's that unappealing and completely off the mark of what we want, trying something different isn't that great of a thing.

Not publishing those 2 RPGs is a disgrace. That is just the worst bunch of bullshit I can imagine from a major publisher. I don't think I've ever seen anything like it. On top of everything else... if they couldn't even handle that, why even bother. There's plenty of great alternatives, and already not enough time.

 

[faridmon]

Don't care about Nintendo, but the thread title reminded me about how awesome Judas Priest's 'All Guns Blazing' is. Off to YouTube.

Thier best song after ''Pain Killer''

 

[Penguin]

I look at all those different types and subcultures of gaming as, I dunno, some sort of food chain, really. I like how you ranked them in descending order because it really does look like a pyramid if you diagram it out.

The thing is, the pyramid going from a narrow tip to a wide base represents each level of gaming's customer base and I don't think anyone would argue that it's not a good idea to target the widest possible range of customers when you're developing a game.

That's actually a fair way of putting it, I think we dubbed it something like the Hierarchy of Gaming.

As for the latter point, common sense would tell you, it makes no sense to focus your energies on the narrowest market share (see comic books), but I've spoken to gamers especially those who label themselves "hardcore" gamers, and I've had people tell me up front, they would rather developers focus their time, energy and money on just them.

Without getting into too much, I've heard everything from, others aren't real gamers, they don't respect the hobby, they were there first and a bunch of non-sense along those lines.

 

[BlackNMild2k1]

im always surprised by the amount of hate nintendo is able to muster in some people.

That's because Nintendo is like Family.
Sony & MS are more like Friends.

 

[fart town usa]

I don't think the 3DS will fail but it definitely won't be the success the DS was, at least not for a while. The 3DS doesn't need a 2nd stick, it's needs games. Mine has been dead and sitting on a shelf for about 2 months now.

As for the comment on Nintendo being the reason the industry is creative and whatnot?

Mmmmmmm, no. Motion controls are arguably a step back for gaming.

The things that have kept gaming fresh and quirky this gen are the XBLA/PSN/iOS games and companies like Atlus.