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[Mr_L]

Games aren't supposed to be about money. If people are upset they can't make art and get compensated for it, there are plenty of non-artistic jobs they can go work instead.

No, no, no. The assertion that any talent, whether it be artistic or otherwise, does not deserve to be paid in a world where currency is a necessary factor in survival is absolutely ridiculous. Hard work is hard work. When you imply that what any creator does is a hobby when they actually spend a majority of their time doing it, that's pretty disrespectful.

 

[Sorcerer Supreme]

nice

 

[dmr87]

It's a viable concept, but it should never have been retroactively implemented in Skyrim years after the fact in a massive disruption of a stable, healthy mod community.

This, I don't have anything against paid mods but just slapping it on Skyrim as a start was a terrible idea.

 

[HK-47]

It's a viable concept, but it should never have been retroactively implemented in Skyrim years after the fact in a massive disruption of a stable, healthy mod community. It should also probably be curated in some way and not a free for all of "*shrug*, send a DMCA takedown if someone steals your stuff" in a community where everyone's using everyone else's stuff since it had not been for profit. And the revenue split itself, while justifiable in a broad sense, just did not leave a good taste in anyone's mouth when it came to Bethesda in particular taking 50% away from the modders who fixed and kept relevant an otherwise broken game.

Well said overall. Especially about how they tried to change the status quo on Skyrim after years of the current system.

 

[alr1ght]

Good.

It's always amusing to see Valve fucking up in real time (last sale's gem thing).

All is well.

 

[desmax]

Nice, glad they listened

 

[MetroidPrimeRib]

Wow. What a week this was. Podcasts are gonna be fun.

 

[InfiniteNine]

Hopefully it gets revisited properly later since I do think modders should be able to get some money for their work if they wish for it.

 

[yuraya]

The biggest problem here was that Valve went after the biggest fish in the pond from the get go. They should have implemented this feature for an unknown (less popular) game that actually needs mods. Instead they dove right after the biggest most moddable game of all time. They wanted the entire buffet and got burned.

 

[Phrozenflame500]

That's pretty cool of them. I do love Valve's willingness to admit they fucked up from time to time, although it's better to not make the mistake in the first place.

I'm certainly on this side of "good idea, awful implementation". Much more curation would be needed, and more forethought on solving the problems that almost immediately sprung up after launch.

Now get back to working on HL3 ffs.

 

[Guess Who]

Games aren't supposed to be about money.

Alright game industry, you heard the man, work for nothing and give all your content away for free while simultaneously finding a way to survive in a capitalist economy

 

[nephilimdj]

"and we wanted that to happen organically for any mod maker who wanted to take a shot at it."

Thats why they emailed some mod makers 2months in advance and featured them? >.>
Its fantastic its pulled, hope it comes back in a much better way

 

[finley83]

No way, didn't see this coming.

As others have said, I think giving modders the option is a good idea, but the implementation here was clearly off the mark. You can bet your bottom dollar it'll be back for Fallout 4 though.

 

[Fox318]

If they were ever going to do something as big as this they shouldn't have done it on a weekend where they couldn't announce or discuss this.

Probably would have helped if the did this with a new game instead of an old game where users were getting locked out of content.

 

[draetenth]

This is hard for me to argue, and an idea I fully support. Just not the best way to start it. Dont launch shit like this with little context, knowing just how terrible it sounds.

Something good can come from this, but from the approach that was taken, this wasn't it.

It's a viable concept, but it should never have been retroactively implemented in Skyrim years after the fact in a massive disruption of a stable, healthy mod community. It should also probably be curated in some way and not a free for all of "*shrug*, send a DMCA takedown if someone steals your stuff" in a community where everyone's using everyone else's stuff since it had not been for profit. And the revenue split itself, while justifiable in a broad sense, just did not leave a good taste in anyone's mouth when it came to Bethesda in particular taking 50% away from the modders who fixed and kept relevant an otherwise broken game.

Pretty much, I liked the concept in theory, but the execution wasn't that good (and I don't care for the Steam Workshop for modding so they shouldn't have been locked in there...) It would have been best to try with a new game or if they really needed to test the waters.. use one that wasn't so active. Plus, it would help if you didn't have a stigma of having a broken game (like Skyrim where people felt you must have SkyUI).

Speaking of which.... I wonder if SkyUI is going to get updates now?

 

[tycoonheart]

Wow, they actually listened to the community.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Good.

It's always amusing to see Valve fucking up in real time (last sale's gem thing).

All is well.

they fuck up all the time though

they usually own it and fix things in the future

that's what happens when you're on the forefront of digital economies in video games

 

[Deified Data]

Trifling disagreements about execution aside, I still believe that creating an income model for mod creators is a good idea. Hopefully they take the complexity of the situation to heart and take the idea straight back to the drawing board.

 

[HariKari]

The biggest problem here was that Valve went after the biggest fish in the pond from the get go. They should have implemented this feature for an unknown (less popular) game that actually needs mods. Instead they dove right after the biggest most moddable game of all time. They wanted the entire buffet and got burned.

That, and it was a well established community. It was like throwing a hand grenade into the room. Almost instantly, things turned to chaos, as modders were swamped by the public and each other, trying to figure out this shitty implementation.

Do it for a new game from the start, with better terms. That would fix most complaints.

Wow, they actually listened to the community.

This is the most upset I've ever seen the community, and easily the most rage directed at Valve.

 

[cdyhybrid]

The biggest problem here was that Valve went after the biggest fish in the pond from the get go. They should have implemented this feature for an unknown (less popular) game that actually needs mods. Instead they dove right after the biggest most moddable game of all time. They wanted the entire buffet and got burned.

Err, Skyrim needs mods more than most games.

 

[Parakeetman]

Good.

 

[bonesmccoy]

Kudos to Valve for recognizing the error and listening to the community.

 

[Alucrid]

I never clicked on any of the other threads and now it's over.

 

[RK9039]

Fallout IV will have paid mods from the start.

I think most people would be okay with that if the system is implemented from the get go. Having this system come out from the blue on an already established community, that's literally keeping a 2011 game in the top 10 most played games on Steam (it's usually top 5 most days), was a bad move.

And that's putting aside all the other technical issues with Skyrim mods which is what my biggest problem was with it and not the actual concept of buying mods themselves.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Err, Skyrim needs mods more than most games.

Needs mods as in doesn't have them

 

[Zombie James]

We've done this because it's clear we didn't understand exactly what we were doing.

No shit.

 

[Dragoon En Regalia]

I didn't agree with Valve/Bethesda's implementation of the concept, but am glad the former can own up to a negative consensus and dial back.

 

[Gaz_RB]

Good to hear. It didn't work and its good they came to their senses instead of continuing it.

 

[Drkirby]

Wonder if we will see the idea revisited with a different game.

 

[Almighty]

We understand our own game's communities pretty well, but stepping into an established, years old modding community in Skyrim was probably not the right place to start iterating.

I could of told them that. Starting this in Skyrim was dumb as all hell and they would of caught less flack launching it with Fallout 4. Sometimes I think I need to figure out a way to become a video game consultant.

 

[aliengmr]

Wow! I admit I'm impressed. Surprised too. I thought this was a done deal.

 

[Sijil]

Well they listened, so have to give credit where credit is due, normally pleas would fall on deaf ears. Wonder who said ouch first tho, Valve or Bethesda?

In any case, I do hope a donation button is to be considered and implemented after all of this since clearly many modders feel that they deserve compensation for their hard work, and I stand with them that a man is entitled to the sweat of his own brow if he should ask.

Tho I do still believe that most people don't donate.

 

[DrForester]

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

Err, Skyrim needs mods more than most games.

well wwe2k15 comes out tomorrow.....

VALVE!!!!

 

[jmga]

Hooray, people can't get paid for their time and effort anymore!

I'm pretty sure donations are gonna have more attention now than ever before.

 

[Decado]

Now, just leave it the way it is (was?)?and add a donate feature. Simple.

Also...lol at developing mods full time as part of their reasoning. From 25% of the proceeds? Sure sure.

 

[Nintendojitsu]

Like mana from Heaven.

 

[ShyGuy0504]

We understand our own game's communities pretty well, but stepping into an established, years old modding community in Skyrim was probably not the right place to start iterating.

This was the only real problem I had with it.

If they do this with Fallout 4 or whatever game they release next they need to implement it as soon as the game launches.

 

[SliceSabre]

Knew it was a bad idea from the start.

 

[LiK]

We've done this because it's clear we didn't understand exactly what we were doing.

clearly

 

[Dunkley]

Okay now that's the Valve I know and love.

Spoiler

I'll still remain cautious of them tho.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Games aren't supposed to be about money. If people are upset they can't make art and get compensated for it, there are plenty of non-artistic jobs they can go work instead.

Poe's Law, I need you

 

[Valkrai]

So if I bought one of those mods, will I still be able to use that version and be refunded then? The page seems to be hidden.

 

[HariKari]

No shit.

Should put another dent in the "Valve can do no wrong/they know best" argument.

 

[ajb1888]

Oh my.... This entire thing has surprised me. From the initial announcement to this quick ending!

I approve!

 

[CountAntonius]

I think most people would be okay with that if the system is implemented from the get go. Having this system come out from the blue on an already established community, that's literally keeping a 2011 game in the top 10 most played games on Steam, was a bad move.

And that's putting aside all the other technical issues with Skyrim mods which is what my biggest problem was with it and not the actual concept of buying mods themselves.

No they won't. Don't confuse GAF with the internet at large. I really doubt many people outside of GAF were arguing percentages. They were arguing something that has always been free now being monetized. This will come up again even bigger when it's done from the begging.

 

[bounchfx]

Good on Valve for reacting, very commendable. Although I hope this doesn't prevent them from doing this on games that could benefit greatly from it, instead of a complex one that already has a massive community with lots of free content and strict expectations. The biggest issue with this whole thing was that they tried to do it with Skyrim IMO.

Also...lol at developing mods full time as part of their reasoning. From 25% of the proceeds? Sure sure.

ignorance is bliss, I guess. I suppose I'll be the first one to tell you - there are a lot of us that do this stuff full time from 25%, and are very grateful for the opportunity to do so.

 

[Nzyme32]

Wonder if we will see the idea revisited with a different game.

Definitely, but hopefully in a way that doesn't used an established game and community, and one where it is currated and managed by the developers to ensure valuable and supported content rather than completely open

 

[Aselith]

Wonder if we will see the idea revisited with a different game.

Hopefully. The hat program has been a good source of income for some people and it would be nice to see a possible livelihood spring up for modders. Nothing wrong with allowing people to do cool stuff fulltime!

Also it would be really neat to see developers react to flagging communities with better percentage rates to entice modders into doing mods for their game. It would be at least a very cool experiment to see if the modders being enticed into creating mods would then result in any sort of upswing in population. Before it just made sense to be where the people were.

 

[Wallach]

Trifling disagreements about execution aside, I still believe that creating an income model for mod creators is a good idea. Hopefully they take the complexity of the situation to heart and take the idea straight back to the drawing board.

Agreed. I don't see many publishers backing off the proposed split much, though. For the most part I expect to see this come back with only minor changes when it is paired with a more reasonable title.