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PoliGAF 2017 |OT4| The leaks are coming from inside the white house

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N

nature boy

Member
Sahil Kapur‏Verified account @sahilkapur 17m17 minutes ago
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.@RandPaul says Senate health care bill "has to get more conservative" or it'll die. "Right now, the moderates have been given everything."
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WAT
 
A

aspiegamer

Member
12%?! Ebola has an approval rate higher than 12%. Conspiracy theories about mass shootings have a higher approval rate than 12%. Apparently any and all coverage of millions losing their health care is absolutely devastating. After all, the whole point of a health care bill is to suppose to give people fuck health care (is apparently what 88% of Americans believe or are undecided on). From how this looks, even 1 person losing coverage is probably an auto-DQ to most Americans.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Zolo said:
For what it's worth, 52% of Republicans are undecided. Only 17% oppose it.
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"Undecided"

nature boy said:
WAT
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kirblar said:
None of what Paul is saying actually makes sense, making me think he's actually looking at how this will blow up Kentucky and NOPE'ing out of there.
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This is what I was referring to the last couple of days. He wants to make it worse. He wants all subsidies/tax credits gone. There is zero chance he ever flips back.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Deuce Deuce said:
McConnell takes the savings in the CBO score and pays off the hold outs?
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What Collins and Heller want (and Paul I guess) is not just done by simply moving money around. They want the entire bill scrapped and started again.

Plinko said:
This is what I was referring to the last couple of days. He wants to make it worse. He wants all subsidies/tax credits gone. There is zero chance he ever flips back.
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It's interesting how quickly you seem to have flipped from "this is passing no matter what" to seeming like you don't think it'll pass at all anymore.

That article from last night about how bad McConnell did this entire thing get you?
 
P

Pryce

Member
It honestly amazes me that strict anti-government people (hardcore libertarians/far right economic conservatives, so someone like Paul) are given such credence in political thought. If an honest to God communist was elected people would flip their shit but you elect someone on the other end of the spectrum and it's fine.

FWIW, I consider both extremes to be ridiculous.
 
B

Blader

Member
kirblar said:
None of what Paul is saying actually makes sense, making me think he's actually looking at how this will blow up Kentucky and NOPE'ing out of there.
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Not a chance. Rand Paul is a principled moron. He knows what he wants (total repeal of the ACA, from end to end) and will oppose anything that isn't that. From his perspective, the bill as-is is too generous to the moderates. It's got nothing to do with 5D chess or, you know, concern for his constituents.

Pryce said:
It honestly amazes me that strict anti-government people (hardcore libertarians/far right economic conservatives) are given such credence in political thought. If an honest to God communist was elected people would flip their shit but you elect someone on the other end of the spectrum and it's fine.

FWIW, I consider both extremes to be ridiculous.
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Taxes and government are two boogeymen that many in this country love to hate, regardless of the net benefits on their own lives. So a libertarian has, on principle, more appeal than a communist, who just as many in this country have been trained since birth to hate on sight.
 
V

VendettaRed07

Member
Pryce said:
It honestly amazes me that strict anti-government people (hardcore libertarians/far right economic conservatives) are given such credence in political thought. If an honest to God communist was elected people would flip their shit but you elect someone on the other end of the spectrum and it's fine.

FWIW, I consider both extremes to be ridiculous.
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Well our country was basically founded on principals far more on anti-government, libertarian philosophy by men who wrote document after document of why people should be paranoid of government having too much power rather than the other so it's not really surprising why one is more palatable to voters than the others.
 
G

Gruco

Banned
It's encouraging that there's a blocking coalition from both the right and the "center" now. This was also true for the house, but in that case the far right had the hardest opposition, which I think is the opposite of the case here. The senate also doesn't have the luxury of saying "fuck it, not my problem" and rushing without a score.

In another universe, I'd hope that there's a lesson about the long term value of mindless opposition whilst ignoring all policy implications. Not holding my breath.

Joe Shlabotnik said:
Yeah I'm thinking this would be a pretty entertaining time to get a public option bill scored.
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Seriously. Democrats already have good plans which have already gotten good scores. Push the contrast.
 
S

Shadow Puppetry

Member
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump

The #AmazonWashingtonPost, sometimes referred to as the guardian of Amazon not paying internet taxes (which they should) is FAKE NEWS!

??????????
What does this mean?!
 
M

Maledict

Member
The rumour on Pod Save America was that McDonnel is working on the basis he has only 51 votes to start with. They've already completely written off Rand Paul entirely as he will never, ever vote for anything that isn't total and absolute repeal. He's clearly trying to burnish credentials for that next presidential run...
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Maledict said:
The rumour on Pod Save America was that McDonnel is working on the basis he has only 51 votes to start with. They've already completely written off Rand Paul entirely as he will never, ever vote for anything that isn't total and absolute repeal. He's clearly trying to burnish credentials for that next presidential run...
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Good luck then.

He probably would have been fine with Collins voting No if he could get everyone else in line. Heller ruined all of that by actually giving a shit about the political implications.

http://www.npr.org/2017/06/27/53460...base-as-independents-disapproval-grows?live=1

Trump's approval is at 37/51 in this Marist/NPR/PBS poll. Not only that but Democrats lead the generic ballot 48-38.
 
B

BoogieWoogie

Banned
Maledict said:
The rumour on Pod Save America was that McDonnel is working on the basis he has only 51 votes to start with. They've already completely written off Rand Paul entirely as he will never, ever vote for anything that isn't total and absolute repeal. He's clearly trying to burnish credentials for that next presidential run...
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But now like seven other Senators are saying no to the bill, and most of them have completely different views of what they want.
 
J

Joe Shlabotnik

Banned
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Luap said:
I Don’t Know How To Explain To You That You Should Care About Other People
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Again I think it comes back to the consciousness I was mentioning earlier, which says that adequately caring for people just isn't something that can be done so we just have to endure what is possible. People have bought into belief in a scarcity which no longer exists. They have to, or else they would have to confront that helping people is possible and how monstrous it is that we don't
 
S

Suikoguy

I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
What's required to get the CBO to evaluate a bill? Majority of a committee?
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
Plinko said:
I'm starting to feel as if a public option has a really good chance of being implemented in 2021 if things keep going as they have been. I still feel single-payer is a no-go due to a payroll tax and companies just pocketing extra money. That would destroy finances for millions of people. A public option, though, could be a breakthrough.
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Why would employers offer healthcare if there's a public option
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Maledict said:
The rumour on Pod Save America was that McDonnel is working on the basis he has only 51 votes to start with. They've already completely written off Rand Paul entirely as he will never, ever vote for anything that isn't total and absolute repeal. He's clearly trying to burnish credentials for that next presidential run...
Click to expand...

It's going to be next to impossible to pass this without Rand.
 
S

studyguy

Member
BoogieWoogie said:
DUHHH I DON'T KNOW WHAT MEDICAID IS
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How fucking dare you say that!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/880017678978736129
Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump)
Some of the Fake News Media likes to say that I am not totally engaged in healthcare. Wrong, I know the subject well & want victory for U.S.
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See he knows exactly what he's talking abo--

https://twitter.com/stephenfhayes/status/880031576997998592
Stephen Hayes (@stephenfhayes)
Sens say Trump has thin grasp of "the basic principles of the reforms & virtually no understanding of the details."
https://t.co/0TDypd081w
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P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
balladofwindfishes said:
It's interesting how quickly you seem to have flipped from "this is passing no matter what" to seeming like you don't think it'll pass at all anymore.

That article from last night about how bad McConnell did this entire thing get you?
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Has to do with how they need to get more moderate but don't seem to want to.


Spoiled Milk said:
Why would employers offer healthcare if there's a public option
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Tax credits? Work would have to be done. There would have to be a difference in plans. I like the idea of universal catastrophic coverage as well as smaller, more affordable plans through the government. If people want to take that route, they could.
 
T

tedrotheredro

Member
Maiden Voyage said:
The end results makes some of these theories hysterical in retrospect.

Edit: Lol @ "FBI discovered he has a stash of child pornography"
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I mean, sure, some of the theories were ridiculous, but I doubt we have the full story.

He goes from asking for votes in November, saying he'll have many more years on the oversight committee, to resigning in a short period of time because.....money? fame? Lots of room for theories, but I don't think we've seen the "end result".

In my mind, the most likely theory is that he knows Trump is toxic and he doesn't want to be seen as the oversight chair who looked the other way when shit hits the fan.
 
J

Joe Shlabotnik

Banned
tedrotheredro said:
I mean, sure, some of the theories were ridiculous, but I doubt we have the full story.

He goes from asking for votes in November, saying he'll have many more years on the oversight committee, to resigning in a short period of time because.....money? fame? Lots of room for theories, but I don't think we've seen the "end result".

In my mind, the most likely theory is that he knows Trump is toxic and he doesn't want to be seen as the oversight chair who looked the other way when shit hits the fan.
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It's more that he knows he couldn't look the other way and that's not how he imagined he'd be spending the next four years. He wanted to make Hillary's life miserable, not Trump's. Fuck, I wouldn't be surprised if he voted for Hillary.
 
Maiden Voyage

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
tedrotheredro said:
I mean, sure, some of the theories were ridiculous, but I doubt we have the full story.

He goes from asking for votes in November, saying he'll have many more years on the oversight committee, to resigning in a short period of time because.....money? fame? Lots of room for theories, but I don't think we've seen the "end result".

In my mind, the most likely theory is that he knows Trump is toxic and he doesn't want to be seen as the oversight chair who looked the other way when shit hits the fan.
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Russia, cheating with interns, closeted gay affairs, child porn, etc. Swap Chaffetz for Clinton and that thread reads like it came from Reddit.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Zolo said:
For what it's worth, 52% of Republicans are undecided. Only 17% oppose it.
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Because conservative media doesn't know how to defend it, they just ignore it, so republicans are only learning about it from sources they don't trust.

If conservative media does cover it, it's about how you can't trust things like the CBO.
 
S

skullmuffins

Banned
tedrotheredro said:
In my mind, the most likely theory is that he knows Trump is toxic and he doesn't want to be seen as the oversight chair who looked the other way when shit hits the fan.
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Yeah. He was pumped for the job when he thought he'd be investigating Hillary for years on end. It's much less fun when you need to go after dirty-as-fuck people in your own party.
 
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