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[Vigilant Gambit]

maybe they are pulling from both the HD and the Disc at the same time, even with the disc's low bandwidth thats still more bandwidth than would be there if everything were streaming off the HD alone. Maybe they optimized it specifically to be coming from both places at once. Just a guess, I have no clue what is on the play disc, but they would not warn people not to install it if it did not have a good reason to.

This. Some assets are more amenable to being loaded from a disc than a hard drive, but either way, you get simultaneous reading from both HDD and DVD/Blu-Ray, so the game benefits from having both on deck.

 

[News Bot]

What a stupidly vague warning.

 

[slicedmass]

take note. For optimal performance from my opinion. Install the 8GB to your xbox 360 internal drive and then do the play disk install to an external HDD or memory stick. That will give you the best performance and no DVD reads.

 

[nkarafo]

The disc drive not only generates too much noise, it also generates extra heat. This is an issue for a machine as well made as the 360 (sarcasm).

I don't want my console to melt so i will install both discs.

take note. For optimal performance from my opinion. Install the 8GB to your xbox 360 internal drive and then do the play disk install to an external HDD or memory stick. That will give you the best performance and no DVD reads.

Thanks for the tip.

 

[2San]

This. Some assets are more amenable to being loaded from a disc than a hard drive, but either way, you get simultaneous reading from both HDD and DVD/Blu-Ray, so the game benefits from having both on deck.

I doubt it, there still a GoD version coming out. This is more an oversight if anything.

 

[Winterfang]

Anything is better than the ME3 bullshit, when you change disks like 6 times in the course of the game.

 

[x-Lundz-x]

take note. For optimal performance from my opinion. Install the 8GB to your xbox 360 internal drive and then do the play disk install to an external HDD or memory stick. That will give you the best performance and no DVD reads.

Have you done this yourself to verify?

 

[FyreWulff]

I doubt it, there still a GoD version coming out. This is more an oversight if anything.

It's not an oversight to obey the laws of physics

 

[sixteen-bit]

What a stupidly vague warning.

No kidding.

 

[bryehn]

if you install it to a flash drive, wouldn't that be more optimal? (aren't the flash drive speeds usually faster than HD read speeds)

The problem here is that you're looking at 16 GB of data to install and I'm fairly sure 16GB is the 360's limit for usb drives, meaning 14.5-45 GB after formatting :/

 

[GrumpyOutlander]

Like others have said it may be worth installing both anyway if the issues are gamebreaking.

I can't handle the spin of the 360 disc drive.

 

[slicedmass]

Have you done this yourself to verify?

no dont have the game yet but when you install a game you are given the choice of where to place the data, it will def be faster to place the install disc on an external ~30MB/s drive (USB2 speeds) than the dvd drive. If im wrong then I guess i'm wrong but its a good idea for those who can to check and try as this would be much better loading/streaming then HDD/DVD.

Edit: flash drives are limited to 32GB so you could do the entire install to a flash drive. The only issue is does the game needs optimal bandwidth or latency? My guess is mainly B/W since they want the combined HDD/DVD bandwidth.

 

[madmook]

The problem here is that you're looking at 16 GB of data to install and I'm fairly sure 16GB is the 360's limit for usb drives, meaning 14.5-45 GB after formatting :/

They upped it to 32GB now.

 

[infinityBCRT]

I assume like GTA IV, this means things are somehow rendered at a slower speed on the HDD than ran from the disc.

No. GTA IV was slower when installed because it was created on a version of the XDK that had no knowledge of installing to hard drive. So the game was already caching stuff to the HDD, but since it was already on the HDD, the caching ended up slowing it down since it was caching to the same device.

For GTA V, I'm guessing they optimized the game so that its reading from both the HDD and the disc at the same time. So you get a little bit more bandwidth to load things than you do if you're just loading from the HDD.

But the HDD is still way way faster than the Disc on its own.

 

[FyreWulff]

The problem here is that you're looking at 16 GB of data to install and I'm fairly sure 16GB is the 360's limit for usb drives, meaning 14.5-45 GB after formatting :/

They upped it to 32 recently in an update

 

[ultron87]

Come on, Rockstar. This is just shoddy. 360s have been installing games for forever. I don't want to play with that much disc noise.

 

[tmarques]

Wait, it has an 8GB mandatory install on the 360? Doesn't MS still sell 4GB models?

 

[2San]

It's not an oversight to obey the laws of physics

What the hell are you talking about? There is a GoD version coming out. So the harddrive bandwith is enough to handle the game. It's just the way it's coded. You even explain it in your own post. Are you saying that version is using magix pixy dust? So it should be patchable.

 

[Marvel]

Wait, it has an 8GB mandatory install on the 360? Doesn't MS still sell 4GB models?

Yes they do :S

 

[Katori]

What the hell are you talking about? There is a GoD version coming out. Are you saying that version is using magix pixy dust? So it should be patchable.

Is the GoD version coming out the same day? It might be delayed because of this very issue.

Laws of physics say that installing both will equal less HDD throughput. Is it patchable? Yes. Is it patched at the moment? No. Anxious to see if it works with the flash drive + HDD idea.

 

[FyreWulff]

What the hell are you talking about? There is a GoD version coming out. So the harddrive bandwith is enough to handle the game. It's just the way it's coded. You even explain it in your own post. Are you saying that version is using magix pixy dust? So it should be patchable.

They still sell Halo 3 via GoD. It still has the same slower installed times.

 

[2San]

Laws of physics say that installing both will equal less HDD throughput. Is it patchable? Yes. Is it patched at the moment? No. Anxious to see if it works with the flash drive + HDD idea.

Why are you addressing stuff I never talked about? I never denied any of this.

Is the GoD version coming out the same day? It might be delayed because of this very issue.

GoD versions never come out the same day.

They still sell Halo 3 via GoD. It still has the same slower installed times.

Rockstar have announced wanting to release a digital GTAV well in advance.

 

[brokenbeans]

Thanks was thinking about this earlier.

 

[grkazan12]

So if all data is on the install disc, what is the purpose of the play disc then, just verification?

 

[Pjsprojects]

Starting to sound like this is best purchased for the PS3 if you have the choice.

Feel sorry for 4gb owners that don't read the packet....

 

[kittens]

Aww, shitty. My 360 is loud as hell when the disc is spinning.

 

[Bsigg12]

So if all data is on the install disc, what is the purpose of the play disc then, just verification?

No not all of the data, just half of it. The play disc still has 7gb of data on it.

I'm curious if the USB install of the play disc would actually work or finding a way to keep the install disc data off the same storage device as the play disc to retain performance and no disc spinning.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

Digital Foundry have added their two cents. Basically what others were saying: two pipes are better than one.

UPDATE: Digital Foundry, which has access to the Xbox 360 version of Grand Theft Auto 5, has offered an explanation for Rockstar's recommendation against installing the "play" disc.

"Rockstar recommends that you shouldn't install the GTA5 play disc on Xbox 360 and it's sound advice," Digital Foundry chief Richard Leadbetter said.

"When you first get the game, the first order of business is installing the mandatory content from disc one - this accounts for 7.7GB of data to install on your hard drive. Now, there's absolutely nothing stopping you installing disc two - the 'play' disc - onto the hard drive too, using the Xbox 360's dashboard to do so. It takes up an additional 7.8GB of storage. However, doing so impacts the game's ability to stream texture data, resulting in regular pop-in of in-game objects and textures.

"So what's the story here? Well, optimal streaming is achieved by making us of all the available bandwidth in the system. Why stream just from the hard drive when you can run in data simultaneously from both the disc and the HDD? Based on what we're seeing on the Xbox 360 version, perhaps running both DVD and HDD assets from just the one source slows down access times, impacting streaming performance. It's not game-breaking stuff, but it does take you out of the moment when it does manifest and for that reason we can't recommend installing the play disc.

"GTA5 isn't available for digital delivery on Xbox Live, but we are curious what the impact - if any - will be on the PS3 version, as that is available as a PSN download. The Digital Foundry Face-Off - due tomorrow morning at 11am - is based on comparison of the two retail disc versions of the game."

Like they say at the bottom it is going to be interesting if this affects the PSN download version, because the PS3 disc still has a mandatory 8GB install like 360 so would be using two data sources.

 

[popo]

I hope this is just a fuck up they can patch and not a design decision - I really don't want to hear that optical drive spinning away for 40 hours.

Edit : sounds like it was intentional. shame.

 

[Krusenstern]

Yeah, why do they say that if the game releases as digital download too?

 

[x-Lundz-x]

Digital Foundry have added their two cents. Basically what others were saying: two pipes are better than one.



Like they say at the bottom it is going to be interesting if this affects the PSN download version, because the PS3 disc still has a mandatory 8GB install like 360 so would be using two data sources.

This is why we need next gen consoles stat.

 

[FlyinJ]

Yeah, why do they say that if the game releases as digital download too?

They're implying that the digital download version will have the same issues, and they'll post their results tomorrow.

Like someone above said, Halo 3 had the same problems. And when MS released it digitally, they didn't fix the problem in that version... so the Halo 3 disc version is still superior.

 

[JackAubrey]

My copy arrived from Amazon this morning.

Followed the instructions and let the game install one disk. Then played the first mission until I could save. Went back to the dashboard and installed the play disk.

I didn't notice any problems playing the game that way - and my Xbox 360 was a heck of a quieter. I travelled a full circle around the map and didn't notice any performance problems at all.

I've just deleted the play disk install and am now installing the play disk on a USB stick, to see if there's any difference.

 

[mocoworm]

Added the DF update to the OP

 

[Dabanton]

Hmmm luckily my disk drive is very quiet, 360 Slim ftw.

So for now I'll just install the first disk.

 

[mocoworm]

My copy arrived from Amazon this morning.

Followed the instructions and let the game install one disk. Then played the first mission until I could save. Went back to the dashboard and installed the play disk. I didn't notice any problems playing the game that way - and my Xbox 360 was a heck of a quieter. I travelled a full circle around the map and didn't notice any performance problems at all.

I've just deleted the play disk install and am now installing the play disk on a USB stick, to see if there's any difference.

Awesome ... thanks for the testing. It's appreciated. Please post back with USB stick info.

 

[JackAubrey]

Awesome ... thanks for the testing. It's appreciated. Please post back with USB stick info.

Seems to be taking absolutely forever to install to USB flash drive. I've cancelled. So I'll try it on an external USB HD later. Same principle though - Install disk on the Xbox 360 itself, Play disk on the external drive.

 

[Artex]

So, if you buy the game digitally on 360, you'll get terrible frame rate? Is this an issue for the PS3 digital copy as well?

Sounds like Rockstar really dropped the ball.

Nothing to do with framerate. Pop-in from streaming assets. Framerate cannot be affected positively or negatively from an installation vs. playing off a disc. Completely unrelated.

 

[Ban Puncher]

Fuck you R*, you're not my mom!

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

F... Knew I should have waited for PC. So now I have to hear the disc spinning constantly or deal with pop in? Great...

 

[leakey]

Good thing I just bought this 16gb flashdrive to play GTAV! Hoo-boy! No, seriously, I don't even care I just wanna play.

 

[Jack cw]

Skyrim? I have Skyrim installed and I haven't noticed any issues..

You could install Skyrim on the 360 but the higher res textures wouldnt load because of a bug. It was fixed with a patch and I had to turn up my soundsystem because the DVD drive of the 360 went crazy

 

[abracadaver]

Damn, have to get a USB stick soon. For now I just leave the play disc installed.

 

[popo]

Good thing I just bought this 16gb flashdrive to play GTAV! Hoo-boy! No, seriously, I don't even care I just wanna play.

you would have needed 16gb anyway. Install is 8gb and 8gb drives have less than that available formatted.

 

[Loomba]

My disk drive is so loud, man this is disappointing.

 

[ambar_hitman]

At that PSN Download update, now I think why the pirates were saying PS3 version performs worst.

 

[Salmonbottle]

Really hope the HDD + Flash drive trick works. My 360's disc reading laser is really faulty and I need to install every game before I play it or I'll keep getting disc read errors.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

Video from DF:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0gPB0gdoOM

 

[Cheddahz]

I'm just going to install the second disc as well

 

[AkuMifune]

At that PSN Download update, now I think why the pirates were saying PS3 version performs worst.

Would make sense if they optimized for disc + HDD streaming that only using the HDD might impact performance.

Still it's the way I'm going. Fucking digital future.