The DLC hype is too strong as Heath's sanity finally begins to slip, he now refers to himself in third person, or thinks he's somebody else.
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Smash Wii U & 3DS Downloadable Characters Discussion and Information on Smash Ballot
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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The DLC hype is too strong as Heath's sanity finally begins to slip, he now refers to himself in third person, or thinks he's somebody else.
In fairness, Luigi and Jigglypuff may have only made the cut as second franchise representatives due to the ease of cloning them from Mario and Kirby; and Wario was explicitly excluded from Melee due to the belief that resigning him to the fate of being a clone forever was less than he deserved, as opposed to obscure, unpopular characters with no moveset potential such as Ganondorf.
Weird that it's Hyrule Castle he targets and not Peach's Castle - the former is fairly close to the OoT design, especially considering it was created with early materials as a reference, while the latter is much less faithful, even including the original only as a backdrop. A shame that it was never revisited with a PM-esque update at any point...
It's also nice to have some context for this.
I think MaskedMan had a post on his blog saying this was actually an inaccurate assumption, or at least he couldn't find any sources for it.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
"Sakurai doesn't like Hyrule Castle 64 because it's not an accurate portrayal of Ocarina of Time"
!!!
It's the best stage in the fucking game.
Hell, some of the worst stages in Smash's history are the worst stages in Smash's history because they adhere too closely to the source material.
!!!
It's the best stage in the fucking game.
Hell, some of the worst stages in Smash's history are the worst stages in Smash's history because they adhere too closely to the source material.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
Sakurai saying Hyrule Castle 64 isn't accurate is kinda funny. Since he holds on to inaccurate Ganondorf.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Pokefloats is an accurate portrayal of the Pokemon Series.
A vaguely Jungle Beat style scrolling stage is totally accurate.
Hyrule Castle is one of the least abstract stages in Smash 64 lol. This same game had a random unrelated generic level sitting in front of a blurry sprite of Peach's Castle and called it a proper Mario stage.
A vaguely Jungle Beat style scrolling stage is totally accurate.
Hyrule Castle is one of the least abstract stages in Smash 64 lol. This same game had a random unrelated generic level sitting in front of a blurry sprite of Peach's Castle and called it a proper Mario stage.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
He might change his mind during Melee development phase since he said that right after smash 64 got released.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
I really like this portion:
Miyamoto is so averse to a lot of ideas. I'm glad Iwata stuck to his guns here.
edit: here is what he actually says about Hyrule Castle
Miyamoto is so averse to a lot of ideas. I'm glad Iwata stuck to his guns here.
edit: here is what he actually says about Hyrule Castle
I think that makes more sense than him hating it because of the layout or whatever.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I just saw that. I was like we almost didn't get our smash franchise so I'm glad that Iwata stuck to his guns too.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
he actually acknowledges that part, and the reason why he could budge is due to people who ARE used to Falcondorf
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
Uh...someone explain this to me?
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
PushDustIn
Member
"pepsi-man" was the in-house nickname (Just like "Smash" was originally the in-house nickname for Nintendo All Stars! Super Smash Brothers!). It' s probably because the characters in Dragon King: The Fighting Game look like Pepsi-Man.
In the original ride, you rode on a raft down a dark cave. It's like the Small World ride but with Pirates. and the Caribbean. The movie was actually based off of this ride.
In the original ride, you rode on a raft down a dark cave. It's like the Small World ride but with Pirates. and the Caribbean. The movie was actually based off of this ride.
That's interesting; did you happen to have the post on hand? I wonder where the myth came from if not from an official source; the purported rationale for Wario and Dedede's exclusion from Melee has been fairly consistent for a while.
Between that and his last-minute work on Melee, Iwata seems to have had a surprisingly direct influence on the development of the Smash series. Ten years from now, I expect it to have been revealed that he implemented tripping in Brawl and was responsible for the Zero Suit Samus alternate costumes in 4; using the ingenious pseudonym of Female Designer.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I wonder if I should just buy the 5USD version of the character, then use the unused code as a trading bargain.
Oh man, this is proof positive that the only other style that would do Smash characters justice in terms of character is the hyper cartoony Strikers style. I remember when I wanted the next Smash to look like Xrd crossed with this art style and play up the manic side of things more. :lol
balladofwindfishes
Member
I wonder if it bothers Iwata a lot that he can't just sit down and start coding the games he wants to make anymore.
It's nice Nintendo has such a passionate engineer as a leader, but at the same time he seemed to really like doing the grunt work of game design.
It's nice Nintendo has such a passionate engineer as a leader, but at the same time he seemed to really like doing the grunt work of game design.
PushDustIn
Member
First point: Masked Man and I both write for Source Gaming. The Wario and Dedede myth debunking was done though my research, and Masked Man helped confirm my translations. You can see my up-to-date unused character list here
Iwata was also the reason we got Brawl, and possibly Smash 4/ DLC for Smash 4. He's one of the original programmers of the 64 version, and overall is quite invested in the series from both a personal level and a business perspective.
DrROBschiz
Member
As long as they keep supporting and updating smash as well as putting some much though and work into each character (the balance update and the balancing of Mewtwo I thought were fantastic) I will continue to buy everything they put out
This is one of the few series that me and my friends have gone back to and played constantly over the past 15 years lol
This is one of the few series that me and my friends have gone back to and played constantly over the past 15 years lol
Iwata is a huge Sakurai fanboy. I think there's a part of the Iwata Asks for Kid Icarus Uprising where he just gushes about what a genius Sakurai is and Sakurai responds with "uh, thanks." It's awesome.
Nah. Western EarthBound fans are known for being obsessed, and Japanese gamers consider EarthBound to be one of the best Nintendo games ever.
Nah. Western EarthBound fans are known for being obsessed, and Japanese gamers consider EarthBound to be one of the best Nintendo games ever.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
balladofwindfishes
Member
Bowser is identical to how he's always been besides like 3 standard attacks...
Ganondorf himself has gotten more changes than Bowser lol
A new idle animation and an actual proper run animation aren't a total redo of a character. Incidentally, Ganondrof himself got a new idle animation and run animation in Brawl.
We've never had a total redo. Even when they did scrap an entire character and redo them, they didn't really that much (Young Link to Toon Link).
Ganondorf himself has gotten more changes than Bowser lol
A new idle animation and an actual proper run animation aren't a total redo of a character. Incidentally, Ganondrof himself got a new idle animation and run animation in Brawl.
We've never had a total redo. Even when they did scrap an entire character and redo them, they didn't really that much (Young Link to Toon Link).
Pit received the most substantial changes in the game by far (three new special moves, a new Final Smash, some reanimated standard attacks), but people always forget about him. A few new special moves and standard attacks would do wonders for Ganondorf. He doesn't need to be totally redone.
Thanks for that; I had no idea the theory was completely unsupported. I can kind of see how the myth originated from the comments he did make, though.
Also, the alleged Cacpcom-esque non-answer for Takamaru in Brawl was kind of funny. Sakurai might have the perfect mindset to oversee a Mega Man revival...
Earthbound's popularity in Japan may have been relatively assured, but a large portion of that obsessive international fanbase probably can trace their relationship to the series back to Smash Bros. - especially for those in PAL regions.
If only Ganondorf could get a proper run animation in the next game - I'd find his Smash incarnation a lot less offensive without the senile waddle.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I wouldn't mind if he hovered while running, since he hovers in Ocarina of Time.
Other than that, he doesn't really run in his games. He just sort of walks on over to Link, using a similar walk that he already has in Smash.
His neutral and side specials are fine. Warlock punch is too iconic, I feel, to really get rid of. And his Dark Choke is more or less unique and Ganoncide is too fun. Wizard's Foot and whatever his up special is called can easily change.
What they really need to change are his crazy flip kicks and stuff like that stolen from Falcon. They look goofy on him and are super jarring with his slow and powerful unique animation attacks like his tilts and forward air. I'd love a new forward Smash animation too, it's a bread and butter kill move for him and it's completely Falcon's animation.
Maybe. There are also a lot of people who try the games to just figure out what all the fuss is about. Obsessed fans make the fanbase spread. As for the ones who learned of the series through Smash, I'm still fairly sure that most of them have actually went on to play EarthBound and enjoy them. Ness isn't Captain Falcon.
Anyway, I found that Iwata gushing quote. It was actually from Smash Bros Brawl:
Iwata Asks said:
Oh, and I think that Famitsu poll is interesting in terms of the Smash roster as well. Removing all of the series that have characters represented in the Smash series (as well as the Smash series itself), we're left with just a few games:
Banjo and Ayumi Tachibana from the Famicom Detective Club games were mentioned by Sakurai as character considerations. Sukapon from Joy Mech Fight was mentioned as a potential item.
I think Famicom Mukashi-banashi is Shin Onigashima, or at least from the same series. We have Shin Onigashima music in Brawl.
Code:
12. Famicom Mukashi-banashi Famicom-DiscDrive
14. Famicom Tantei Club Part II Famicom-DiscDrive
32. Magical Vacation GBA
35. Joy Mech Fight NES
42. Volley Ball Famicom-DiscDrive
44. Banjo-Tooie N64
45. Baseball NES
46. Famicom Tantei Club Famicom-DiscDriveBanjo and Ayumi Tachibana from the Famicom Detective Club games were mentioned by Sakurai as character considerations. Sukapon from Joy Mech Fight was mentioned as a potential item.
I think Famicom Mukashi-banashi is Shin Onigashima, or at least from the same series. We have Shin Onigashima music in Brawl.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
he already got that in Brawl
dangeraaron10
Unconfirmed Member
I've been thinking about it, but how would you guys feel if they decided to not make another Smash game, but instead opt to make Smash 4 a platform for DLC? This would certainly allow the team to not hold anything back, going all out with characters, stages, modes and more. But then there's the NX, which Nintendo mentioned if only to quell fears of Nintendo going full mobile...
I wouldn't mind either at this point. I think Smash, with a few more characters, stages, and modes has reached perfection at this point and how much more can we really add? For me, modes are the big sell here. Tournament and Adventure being the most requested. Smash Run for Wii U would be awesome as well, especially if we could set the parameters. Unlikely as it's the 'thing' of the 3DS, but we'll see.
I wouldn't mind either at this point. I think Smash, with a few more characters, stages, and modes has reached perfection at this point and how much more can we really add? For me, modes are the big sell here. Tournament and Adventure being the most requested. Smash Run for Wii U would be awesome as well, especially if we could set the parameters. Unlikely as it's the 'thing' of the 3DS, but we'll see.
Nocturnowl
Member
Partly I'm entertaining the thought that the base of Smash 4 is going to be one that may well stick around for Nintendo's next console, you know flung out as the "complete" remastered edition with all DLC and maybe one or two new characters when that time comes.
Meanwhile the next true smash sequel will come later on and revamp the series in a much more major way focusing more on the gameplay and not so much of content.
So basically like other various fighting game series in a sense.
Or maybe this is just what I want to see, Smash 4 is loaded as it is and it's only set to get more, there arguably comes a point where a true sequel will need to try a different angle to impress.
Meanwhile the next true smash sequel will come later on and revamp the series in a much more major way focusing more on the gameplay and not so much of content.
So basically like other various fighting game series in a sense.
Or maybe this is just what I want to see, Smash 4 is loaded as it is and it's only set to get more, there arguably comes a point where a true sequel will need to try a different angle to impress.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I want a "Smash Tournament Edition" or whatever for the new system as a launch title that includes all the DLC entirely integrated into the game (customs, Palutena's guidance, and for some of them, making them unlockable, plus fixing the CSS), and including Ice Climbers and maybe one other character they couldn't because of power (like Chorus Kids). Maybe throw in some vets they couldn't really justify as DLC either, like Pichu and Squirtle.
It'd be a nice release game for the new console, and it'd totally get me out there day 1.
Capcom gets away with it, Nintendo should maybe take a look at doing it, especially since it would give them more time and a budget to refine the DLC and Nintendo doesn't really do GOTY editions, so the minor DLC inconsistencies won't ever be addressed I feel, without an "Ultimate" edition type deal.
It'd be a nice release game for the new console, and it'd totally get me out there day 1.
Capcom gets away with it, Nintendo should maybe take a look at doing it, especially since it would give them more time and a budget to refine the DLC and Nintendo doesn't really do GOTY editions, so the minor DLC inconsistencies won't ever be addressed I feel, without an "Ultimate" edition type deal.
Oh, that's just Sakurai cosplaying as Julia from TekkenIt's also nice to have some context for this.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I thought it was that asian guy with red bandanna that I recall some gaffer using as an avatar before
balladofwindfishes
Member
What exactly can they do for Smash 5 except base it on Smash 4? Even if they make deep cuts to the roster, which I doubt they'd want to do, it's still pushing 50 characters. Just to hit 50 they'd have to cut all the DLC, plus one addition character. And that's still 50 characters to bring back and we've already gutted 6-7 characters!
With the roster probably pushing close to 60 at the end of Smash 4's life, I just don't see how Smash 5 could be anything but entirely based on Smash 4's work. It's just an impossible amount of characters at this point, with DLC making it even worse. Will they need to cut Mewtwo a second time? How bad would that be? Would there be a character strong enough in the roster to properly replace him, again? How can you go from 99% of the roster of all of the games finally together in a single game and then turn around and cut them again? That's just not going to sit well.
Is the majority of your time and resources being used to remake ~60 characters really worth doing instead of porting Smash 4 and using it as a base to work from? That's double the characters they brought back from Brawl (29) plus from Melee that had been cut from Brawl (1), not including DLC as that's not part of the original development. You can kind of see where the problem lies.
Even the stage count is becoming a serious issue, especially when we combine both versions of the game.
I'm not really sure what to make of Smash 5 at this point. It's obviously far away, but they've kind of backed themselves into this corner with this massive roster people will expect to return.
With the roster probably pushing close to 60 at the end of Smash 4's life, I just don't see how Smash 5 could be anything but entirely based on Smash 4's work. It's just an impossible amount of characters at this point, with DLC making it even worse. Will they need to cut Mewtwo a second time? How bad would that be? Would there be a character strong enough in the roster to properly replace him, again? How can you go from 99% of the roster of all of the games finally together in a single game and then turn around and cut them again? That's just not going to sit well.
Is the majority of your time and resources being used to remake ~60 characters really worth doing instead of porting Smash 4 and using it as a base to work from? That's double the characters they brought back from Brawl (29) plus from Melee that had been cut from Brawl (1), not including DLC as that's not part of the original development. You can kind of see where the problem lies.
Even the stage count is becoming a serious issue, especially when we combine both versions of the game.
I'm not really sure what to make of Smash 5 at this point. It's obviously far away, but they've kind of backed themselves into this corner with this massive roster people will expect to return.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
On subject of Bowser it really changed just about everything since Bowser feels faster and more fluid.
And I miss jab 1 pulling opponents toward you.
But if they made Ganon's run not stupid I would be happy.
I don't think we'll see a Smash Bros. 6 (not 5; Super Smash Bros. for Wii U is "Smash Bros. 5," according to Sakurai) for a long time. Maybe we'll end up getting an enhanced port of Super Smash Bros. for Wii U on Nintendo's next home console with some added characters and stages, but I wouldn't expect much else at this point, especially if Sakurai's not onboard again. Honestly, with DLC this time around, we really don't need a new Smash Bros. nearly as soon as before. I think Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS and Wii U both have a long life ahead of them.
Still wish if he kept his Brawl fair though. He'd easily be a Top 3 favorite incarnation of a character with just that.
astarisborn94
Member
I really hope so. He pretty much has to since transition from Street Fighter to Smash will definitely be considerably different.
I would be fine with this. A Smash 4 on NX with new modes, all DLC, plus Ice Climbers (and maybe Chorus Men) would be a beautiful way to put a bow on the franchise. I would be fine if we never saw another Smash game again if they did that.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Yeah, I think I actually post something like that in this thread or other thread. It's possible that we could get Smash 4 Port with several additional contents. I'm perfectly fine with it if they decided to go with that.
I'd love to see a rerelease on the next console that just gets updated forever with added content. once a generation they can remaster the graphics a bit, and then just keep adding content.
I'd be SO happy with a once-a-gen content update that is as meaty as a core smash game, with a full dev cycle of nothing but added content.
RomanceDawn
Member
Finally someone is talking about this and others are responding!
This game's development just keeps going and going and going, like a big pink rabbit. I mean for goodness sakes the poll ends this October. Isn't that almost a full year after the initial release of the Wii U version?
So much work went into this game and with the install base as low as it is the game isn't going to ever see it's full potential in players. Well the Wii U version anyway. Next Nintendo gen can't be more than 2 or 3 years away and that is just too soon for development to start from scratch again. Now the transition from Smash 64 to Melee wasn't that long but that was a different time and a different world, things are not working like that again.
I think it's in everyone's best interest(players and Nintendo) to rerelease this on the NX as a launch title with all the bells and whistles. All DLC, brand new characters, stages and a few modes. Fine tune things a little more and I feel like that would satisfy casual Smash fans and players like me who want to get good at this game for years to come without having to switch over to an entirely new system of play within the next 3 or 4 years.
I mean with all this DLC at what point will they say enough is enough and take a break before the next inevitable Smash? The answer is that they won't. Doesn't matter if that Job listing for Smash 6 was intended to look like it's all for DLC, it's clear to me everything we have now will be upgraded into some super addition ready for the launch of the first NX device or very soon after it's release.
And you know what else? When the GameCube underperformed wasn't it obvious Nintendo was trying make sure all those games got a second life with the New Play Control series? I certainly hated it because I had both Pikmin titles and Mario Power Tennis but I think the same applies here. Nintendo is going it make sure all that initial Smash development is played by the masses!
This game's development just keeps going and going and going, like a big pink rabbit. I mean for goodness sakes the poll ends this October. Isn't that almost a full year after the initial release of the Wii U version?
So much work went into this game and with the install base as low as it is the game isn't going to ever see it's full potential in players. Well the Wii U version anyway. Next Nintendo gen can't be more than 2 or 3 years away and that is just too soon for development to start from scratch again. Now the transition from Smash 64 to Melee wasn't that long but that was a different time and a different world, things are not working like that again.
I think it's in everyone's best interest(players and Nintendo) to rerelease this on the NX as a launch title with all the bells and whistles. All DLC, brand new characters, stages and a few modes. Fine tune things a little more and I feel like that would satisfy casual Smash fans and players like me who want to get good at this game for years to come without having to switch over to an entirely new system of play within the next 3 or 4 years.
I mean with all this DLC at what point will they say enough is enough and take a break before the next inevitable Smash? The answer is that they won't. Doesn't matter if that Job listing for Smash 6 was intended to look like it's all for DLC, it's clear to me everything we have now will be upgraded into some super addition ready for the launch of the first NX device or very soon after it's release.
And you know what else? When the GameCube underperformed wasn't it obvious Nintendo was trying make sure all those games got a second life with the New Play Control series? I certainly hated it because I had both Pikmin titles and Mario Power Tennis but I think the same applies here. Nintendo is going it make sure all that initial Smash development is played by the masses!
MrSaturn99
Member
I suppose I wouldn't mind a next-gen update for Smash 4. I know Sakurai wants to move on and I know I'd definitely like to see him work on surprise hits like Kid Icarus: Uprising, but he's touched upon the potential roster issue as well and this would be a great way to get around that (at least for a while). Supposing there wouldn't be yet another handheld counterpart, there's also the potential of them bringing back the Ice Climbers and whatever ideas they had for a Rhythm Heaven rep (if it was indeed the Chorus Kids).
Oh, and RomanceDawn, I'm totally with you on more DK reps, but you gotta share that awesome DK/One Piece Miiverse drawing you did! Maybe we can start a campaign to get more non-DK Island Swing songs, too...
Oh, and RomanceDawn, I'm totally with you on more DK reps, but you gotta share that awesome DK/One Piece Miiverse drawing you did! Maybe we can start a campaign to get more non-DK Island Swing songs, too...
Troubled Bat
Member
I'd totally be down for Super Smash Bros. '? Edition' I think it would work perfectly well for Nintendo.
Also, I really hope that we don't get a "Retro" Ryu.
Also, I really hope that we don't get a "Retro" Ryu.
Y'know, I feel like the next Smash will probably be based on Sm4sh. It probably won't be a big jump either. I can see Smash Bros turning into a singular game in the future that'll receive constant updates and DLC. Less of a game and more of a platform.
I dunno, I don't really see how they can expand upon Sm4sh for a traditional sequel at this point.
Why thank you for the avvie sir.
As for the next Smash, I agree that its going to be incredibly difficult to add to the roster in terms of sheer numbers. And we all know how much we hate cuts. So I can definitely see the next Smash being built off of Smash 4.
Omega Kirby
Member
Man I would kill for a pichu dlc. Just make him a lot stronger than pickahu
KLatin Scelus
Member
Oh the irony if such a thing happened.
I agree with this.
SuperAngelo64
Banned
What's funnier is it's probably the most accurate stage in relation to it's source material in Smash 64.
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net...f_Time).png/revision/latest?cb=20100514234758
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