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Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U DLC |OT2| Lucas comes out of Nowhere!

S

Spinosaurus

Member
Spinosaurus said:
Realized that Doc isn't totally outclassed by Mario and Luigi.

He's pretty mediocre compared to them, but he has several things going for him. A short hop game is a big one and why Doc is arguably better than Mario at some matchups. He also has the best OoS in the game in Up B, that makes Doc incredibly scary on shield since it kills early. He's also pretty incredible at destroying low recoveries between DAir and Tornado.

It's too bad his mobility and recovery are so shit though. What a wasted potential since his short hop game is so fun.
Click to expand...
Totally forgot to mention Doc's pretty great and consistent damage output compared to Mario and Luigi (outside of grabs in Luigi's case that is, but I guess it doesn't matter when Luigi has a stupid easy time getting those grabs.)

I feel like he's underrated. Definitely not low tier...just no reason to use him over Mario or Luigi who both cover each well enough already. Doc has some matchups he's better than Mario at, but you can just use Luigi there too and be more consistent. Not to mention Doc isn't particularly easy to use since there's little margin for error when using him.
 
O

Oidisco

Member
Spinosaurus said:
Totally forgot to mention Doc's pretty great and consistent damage output compared to Mario and Luigi (outside of grabs in Luigi's case that is, but I guess it doesn't matter when Luigi has a stupid easy time getting those grabs.)

I feel like he's underrated. Definitely not low tier...just no reason to use him over Mario or Luigi who both cover each well enough already. Doc has some matchups he's better than Mario at, but you can just use Luigi there too and be more consistent. Not to mention Doc isn't particularly easy to use since there's little margin for error when using him.
Click to expand...

Not sure if you saw it, but a couple months ago Zero uploaded an analysis of a match between his Doc and M2K's Diddy, with Zero winning the game. Might be worth taking a look at if you haven't already.
 
C

Captain Rage Quit 69

Banned
Spinosaurus said:
Realized that Doc isn't totally outclassed by Mario and Luigi.

He's pretty mediocre compared to them, but he has several things going for him. A short hop game is a big one and why Doc is arguably better than Mario at some matchups. He also has the best OoS in the game in Up B, that makes Doc incredibly scary on shield since it kills early. He's also pretty incredible at destroying low recoveries between DAir and Tornado.

It's too bad his mobility and recovery are so shit though. What a wasted potential since his short hop game is so fun.
Click to expand...

You could've just played me and figured out all that. ;)

Ever since I found out Doc vs. Ness is actually in Doc's favor, I've been playing him to excellent results. Plus, he feels a lot better to play with than Mario since he's not totally flowcharty and he can legit terrify your opponents with a killer utilt, fsmash, dsmash, fair, bair, down-b, and up-b. <3 The up-b especially has a deceptive range that, if it doesn't kill, still sends your opponent flying and gives you the advantage.

Also his pill game is good enough that I could fight Tipster's Mega Man using pills versus all of his shit. Granted I didn't do very well since I'm not used to that playstyle, but it's legit.

EDIT: His real issue is in neutral, characters like Luigi and Rosalina outclass him completely due to poor overall mobility and attacks that don't go as far as needed to beat out Luigi's crazy aerials and Luma. If it's Mario you're fighting, the moment you're off-stage you may as well say good bye to that stock.

This is all without customs by the way.
 
S

Spinosaurus

Member
Oidisco said:
Not sure if you saw it, but a couple months ago Zero uploaded an analysis of a match between his Doc and M2K's Diddy, with Zero winning the game. Might be worth taking a look at if you haven't already.
Click to expand...
Will check it out. Cheers
Captain Rage Quit 69 said:
Ever since I found out Doc vs. Ness is actually in Doc's favor, I've been playing him to excellent results. Plus, he feels a lot better to play with than Mario since he's not totally flowcharty and he can legit terrify your opponents with a killer utilt, fsmash, dsmash, fair, bair, down-b, and up-b. <3 The up-b especially has a deceptive range that, if it doesn't kill, still sends your opponent flying and gives you the advantage.
Click to expand...
Totally agreed. I love Doc, I just wish I had the dedication to learn him lol. Pretty occupied with Meta Knight (also super fun) and looking forward to Lucas now.

Also I feel Doc is better than Mario vs Yoshi. He doesn't beat him, but his short hop and damage output REALLY help here.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
Fandangox said:
That was amazing, was that custom fire kick?
Click to expand...
I think so.

TWILT said:
...Well. I've been trying different HSB set ups, but I didn't know you could flat out combo into it. Will practice this later tonight.

My apologies in advance if I land this on any of you.
Click to expand...
Mewtwo is apparently immune, so we are all good. :)

Robiin said:
This is the most beautiful thing I've ever seen.

Speaking of Falcon, did you guys see the new Trifroze combo video? Some amazing things in here.
https://youtu.be/kZFEcqo80h8
Click to expand...
Watching now!
 
O

Oidisco

Member
I'm really starting to see why Nairo said defensive playstyles are rough for ZSS. I'm having some trouble on For Glory against players who roll and shield a lot.
 
O

Oidisco

Member
Yea, this guy I'm fighting started off super aggresive and I won those games pretty easily, but now he's playing more defensive and I just can't win.
 
B

Beats

Member
Oidisco said:
Yea, this guy I'm fighting started off super aggresive and I won those games pretty easily, but now he's playing more defensive and I just can't win.
Click to expand...

yeah, ZSS can't do much against opponents that wait for her to do something and shield a lot. Her grab is slow and she doesn't really have any projectiles/moves that whittle down shields, so it becomes incredibly difficult to open up a very defensive player. There's not much the opponent has to fear when playing that way against her.
 
D

Dimitri LH

Member
Huh....was wondering why the thread dint update. Yay for being on my first legit Wall of Shame!

Good news: I got my lan adapter, hope to test it tonight. Maybe I can actually play 2v2 now.
 
O

Oidisco

Member
Beats said:
yeah, ZSS can't do much against opponents that wait for her to do something and shield a lot. Her grab is slow and she doesn't really have any projectiles/moves that whittle down shields, so it becomes incredibly difficult to open up a very defensive player. There's not much the opponent has to fear when playing that way against her.
Click to expand...

Really makes Nairo being able to pretty solidly beat Dabuz's Rosalina even more impressive
 
C

Cyberman65

Member
GGs, Nami. Something came up that I have to do. I really have to respect Kong Cyclone a bit more, but felt like I dealt with it pretty good.
 
N

NamikazeBurst

Member
Cyberman65 said:
GGs, Nami. Something came up that I have to do. I really have to respect Kong Cyclone a bit more, but felt like I dealt with it pretty good.
Click to expand...

Yeah, GGs. I don't know why Meta Knight isn't played more, he has insane combos and can kill lighter characters extremely early. At least I started catching on to when you would pivot grab me or get me out of a roll.

Anyone else want to play?
 
O

Oidisco

Member
I'll play for a little while. You'll now get to experience my day 1 ZSS!

Just give me 2 minutes and I'll be ready
 
K

Karsticles

Member
NamikazeBurst said:
Yeah, GGs. I don't know why Meta Knight isn't played more, he has insane combos and can kill lighter characters extremely early. At least I started catching on to when you would pivot grab me or get me out of a roll.

Anyone else want to play?
Click to expand...
I think you can say this for a lot of characters, and the answer is pretty much always "Oh yeah, look at who else they could pick". Metaknight is a strong character, but there are other characters that just do the job better.
 
O

Oidisco

Member
That was kinda awesome! And why are you sorry, it was my own mistake since I knew you had storm punch or whatever it's called. I should've been more careful!
 
O

Oidisco

Member
No worries dude, good games!

The more I use ZSS the more I really start to like her playstyle. I'm still not fully used to it, but she's a lot of fun to play.
 
O

Oidisco

Member
JulianImp said:
Did you get to make him FLY AWAY with DK's custom B? I laughed so hard when you just punched into thin air as I was jumping towards you and that alone was enough to score a KO.
Click to expand...

I used up-b out of shield right when he used storm-punch, it was a sight to behold
 
J

JulianImp

Member
Oidisco said:
I used up-b out of shield right when he used storm-punch, it was a sight to behold
Click to expand...

DK, bending dongs since 2014.

I remember one match where I also did a ridiculous gimp with the custom up B. It's like the wind hitboxes are an order of magnitude stronger than any other one in the game (gale boomerang, PSI magnet, G&W's dtilt, uair and upB, etc).
 
N

NamikazeBurst

Member
JulianImp said:
Did you get to make him FLY AWAY with DK's custom B? I laughed so hard when you just punched into thin air as I was jumping towards you and that alone was enough to score a KO.
Click to expand...

I made sure to use the "Fly Away!" taunt. My first day with DK against Karsticles was even funnier. Being able to die by being sent on a 70 degree angle to the roof is hilarious.
 
J

JulianImp

Member
I'm still really salty that we can't type taunt messages in Japanese, since you can't fit anything in English with 16 characters, but in Japanese...

My JP N3DS obviously takes advantage of that, but I wish there was a way for me to use my &#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364; taunt on WiiU.

Edit: By the way, I'm up for a couple of games if anyone wants to play. 2v2 would be cool if we could make it happen.
 
T

Thulius

Member
JulianImp said:
I'm still really salty that we can't type taunt messages in Japanese, since you can't fit anything in English with 16 characters, but in Japanese...

My JP N3DS obviously takes advantage of that, but I wish there was a way for me to use my &#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364;&#28961;&#39364; taunt on WiiU.

Edit: By the way, I'm up for a couple of games if anyone wants to play. 2v2 would be cool if we could make it happen.
Click to expand...

I'll play. Down for 2v2 if more people show up but I've only got ~40 minutes.
 
O

Oidisco

Member
I can try out some 2v2 but there'd probably be a lot of lag. I can do one game and if it's bad someone else could join

Also, I've literally never played teams in this game, so whoever ends on my team I pre-emptively apologise
 
S

Spinosaurus

Member
Karsticles said:
I think you can say this for a lot of characters, and the answer is pretty much always "Oh yeah, look at who else they could pick". Metaknight is a strong character, but there are other characters that just do the job better.
Click to expand...
Who are these characters? No other bait and punish character has the same rewards as Meta Knight. Falcon is the closest, but MK has the luxury of being able to reset to neutral easily and having one of the best edgeguarding, if not the best.

Look up Ito.
 
J

JulianImp

Member
Oh, so that was why you had crash run.

If a fourth player wants to join us, we can try a couple of 2v2s if things don't turn out to be too laggy.
 
MagiusNecros

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
NamikazeBurst said:
Yeah, GGs. I don't know why Meta Knight isn't played more, he has insane combos and can kill lighter characters extremely early. At least I started catching on to when you would pivot grab me or get me out of a roll.

Anyone else want to play?
Click to expand...

I occasionally pull out Meta Knight.

Though I usually stick to the Super Heavyweights.
 
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