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The $5/gallon gas race for a real electric car, a survey of upcoming electric cars

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SteveMeister

Hang out with Steve.
You still haven't added the VentureOne to the original post, so I'll mention it again, this time with a picture:


Click the pic for info.
 

Phoenix

Member
SteveMeister said:
You still haven't added the VentureOne to the original post, so I'll mention it again, this time with a picture:


Click the pic for info.


Have they actually produced any of the Venture One?
 
The Volt is a joke, imho. Just GM trying to short-change progress, yet again. I still don't understand how the Volt can under-perform a car released 12 years ago and still cost $40K+.
 
_leech_ said:
The Volt is a joke, imho. Just GM trying to short-change progress, yet again. I still don't understand how the Volt can under-perform a car released 12 years ago and still cost $40K+.
I presume you are talking about the EV-1?

The Volt does not under-perform the EV-1 . . . it under-performs in 1 spec (pure EV range) but blows it away in just about every other specs.

Code:
How does the Chevy Volt Concept compare to the GM EV1? Here is the run-down:

                      EV1                    Volt 
Battery type:     Lead Acid           LiIon 
Battery volume: 300L                   100L 
Charging voltage: 220V                110V/while driving 
Charging Time: 8 hours                6-6.5 hours 
QuickCharge Capable NO               YES 
Passenger capacity: 2 passengers   4 passengers 
Acceleration (0-60) 8-9 sec             8-8.5 sec 
Top speed: 80 mph                        120+ mph 
Pure EV Range: 60-90 miles           40 miles 
Total Range 60-90 miles               640 miles 
Curb weight: 3084 lbs                  3140 lbs

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/01/07/detroit-auto-show-chevy-volt-vs-gm-ev1-by-the-numbers/
 
speculawyer said:
I presume you are talking about the EV-1?

The Volt does not under-perform the EV-1 . . . it under-performs in 1 spec (pure EV range) but blows it away in just about every other specs.

Code:
How does the Chevy Volt Concept compare to the GM EV1? Here is the run-down:

                      EV1                    Volt 
Battery type:     Lead Acid           LiIon 
Battery volume: 300L                   100L 
Charging voltage: 220V                110V/while driving 
Charging Time: 8 hours                6-6.5 hours 
QuickCharge Capable NO               YES 
Passenger capacity: 2 passengers   4 passengers 
Acceleration (0-60) 8-9 sec             8-8.5 sec 
Top speed: 80 mph                        120+ mph 
Pure EV Range: 60-90 miles           40 miles 
Total Range 60-90 miles               640 miles 
Curb weight: 3084 lbs                  3140 lbs

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/01/07/detroit-auto-show-chevy-volt-vs-gm-ev1-by-the-numbers/

Doesn't really blow it away. Pure EV range is important too. I can understand if it weighed alot more because of it being 4 passanger but it only ways 100 pounds more. Its 12 years too. Look how much technology has advanced in 12 years, remmber your computer in 1996?
 
speculawyer said:
I presume you are talking about the EV-1?

The Volt does not under-perform the EV-1 . . . it under-performs in 1 spec (pure EV range) but blows it away in just about every other specs.

Code:
How does the Chevy Volt Concept compare to the GM EV1? Here is the run-down:

                      EV1                    Volt 
Battery type:     Lead Acid           LiIon 
Battery volume: 300L                   100L 
Charging voltage: 220V                110V/while driving 
Charging Time: 8 hours                6-6.5 hours 
QuickCharge Capable NO               YES 
Passenger capacity: 2 passengers   4 passengers 
Acceleration (0-60) 8-9 sec             8-8.5 sec 
Top speed: 80 mph                        120+ mph 
Pure EV Range: 60-90 miles           40 miles 
Total Range 60-90 miles               640 miles 
Curb weight: 3084 lbs                  3140 lbs

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/01/07/detroit-auto-show-chevy-volt-vs-gm-ev1-by-the-numbers/

Not saying it hasn't improved over the EV1 in some areas, but do you really see 12 years of progress there? The Volt's improvements are minimal at best (2 hours less for charging, a gas engine to improve range, faster top speed) and that's disappointing.

Personally, I think the next generation Prius (going to be announced in early 09, iirc) is going to trounce all over the Volt, plug-in or not.
 
Straightballin said:
Doesn't really blow it away. Pure EV range is important too. I can understand if it weighed alot more because of it being 4 passanger but it only ways 100 pounds more. Its 12 years too.
I'd like it to be more than 40 miles on electric-only, but those batteries are the most expensive part.

I'd like a cost comparison but you can't give one because they never sold the EV-1 so no one knows how much it costs. That whole program was a big money loser for GM. It was estimated that the batteries alone on the EV-1 cost in the range of $20K to $30K . . . so I'd assume that EV-1 probably cost at least $40K too.

Straightballin said:
Look how much technology has advanced in 12 years, remmber your computer in 1996?
Lol. How much has football, beer, construction, etc. changed in the last 12 years? Nothing has changed like computers so that is a really bad comparison. The laws of physics haven't changed since 1996 and those are the the things that really affect cars.

But for all you Volt haters . . . can you point to anything better?
The Tesla is awesome but ridiculously expensive.
The Prius continues to burn lots of gas
The Th!nk is kinda interesting . . . but very small and a bit slow.
The Aptera is cool . . . but a 2 seater and a freaky design that will scare away many.
Most of the rest of them are $100K+ sports cars or really small 1 seaters.
 
speculawyer said:
Lol. How much has football, beer, construction, etc. changed in the last 12 years? Nothing has changed like computers so that is a really bad comparison. The laws of physics haven't changed since 1996 and those are the the things that really affect cars.


Those things dont have to advanced though. Batteries have advanced in those 12 years and so has power efficency.

Edit: Better said that there is no high demand for advancments in those areas but in batteries and power efficency there has.
 

SteveMeister

Hang out with Steve.
speculawyer said:
I'd it it to be more 40 miles on electric-only, but those batteries are the most expensive part.

I'd like a cost comparison but you can't give one because they never sold the EV-1 so no one knows how much it costs. That whole program was a big money loser for GM.


Lol. How much has football, beer, construction, etc. changed in the last 12 years? Nothing has changed like computers so that is a really bad comparison. The laws of physics haven't changed since 1996 and those are the the things that really affect cars.

But for all you Volt haters . . . can you point to anything better?
The Tesla is awesome but ridiculously expensive.
The Prius continues to burn lots of gas
The Th!nk is kinda interesting . . . but very small and a bit slow.
The Aptera is cool . . . but a 2 seater and a freaky design that will scare away many.
Most of the rest of them are $100K+ sports cars or really small 1 seaters.

By the way, the Venture One is a two seater -- the passenger sits behind the driver, and you can order a child safety seat adapter. The Aptera actually has a child safety seat bracket behind the two front seats. As far as the Aptera scaring people away, sure, some will be turned off by its aerodynamic styling, but consider the case of the Prius. Here's a car that used to be just a hybrid version of the Echo, but nobody bought them until they turned it into a more futuristic looking shape. Hybrid versions of other cars have been poor sellers, too. It seems that the people who want green cars want them to LOOK green. Now, that's obviously going to be less of a factor in the face of $5+ gasoline, but I still believe that Aptera isn't going to have any trouble selling every vehicle they make.

And Phoenix no, they haven't produced any of the Venture One vehicles yet, but it is based on an existing non-electric/non-hybrid vehicle, the Carver One.
 
_leech_ said:
Not saying it hasn't improved over the EV1 in some areas, but do you really see 12 years of progress there? The Volt's improvements are minimal at best (2 hours less for charging, a gas engine to improve range, faster top speed) and that's disappointing.

Personally, I think the next generation Prius (going to be announced in early 09, iirc) is going to trounce all over the Volt, plug-in or not.

Considering the EV1 project was abandoned for years, I'm surprised GM has even achieved something close to the Volt. All things considered, you overestimate the original EV1's performance (both power and efficiency). Don't let movies cloud your perception of reality :p

GM's only issue is if Toyota can meet their tech and launch it at a better price ($40,000 right now based on Bob Lutz's latest comments).
 
Oil settles over $142 a barrel today.

I live in Texas and my dad is considering getting our land surveyed for oil. Of course it could backfire for us because the government has mineral rights to all land and then they could use imminant domain to take our land and use the oil for themselves while leaving us out on the streets with no place to live. Gotta love government intervention.
 
SteveMeister said:
By the way, the Venture One is a two seater -- the passenger sits behind the driver, and you can order a child safety seat adapter..

I'll add the Venture One to the OP when I have time. I also found out that ZENN is entering the real car market with a new entry called the CityZenn that does 80mph and has huge range.

Holy crap . . . if those numbers are real, EEStor may have hit the proverbial gold mine. They should call up John McCain (actually Cindy) and ask for their $300 million.

The cityZENN is planned to be a fully certified, highway capable vehicle with a top speed of 125 KPH/ 80 MPH and a range or 400 kilometres/250 miles. Powered by EEStor, the cityZENN will be rechargeable in less than 5 minutes, feature operating costs 1/10th of a typical internal combustion engine vehicle and be 100% emission-free! The Zero-Emission, No-Noise cityZENN will be designed to meet the transportation requirements of a large percentage of drivers worldwide.

"EEStor's game-changing energy storage technology is in the advanced stages of commercialization", stated Ian Clifford, Chief Executive Officer. "EEStor has publicly committed to commercialization in 2008 and their first production line will be used to supply ZENN Motor Company."

http://www.marketwire.com/mw/release.do?id=837653
 
perfectchaos007 said:
Oil settles over $142 a barrel today.

I live in Texas and my dad is considering getting our land surveyed for oil. Of course it could backfire for us because the government has mineral rights to all land and then they could use imminant domain to take our land and use the oil for themselves while leaving us out on the streets with no place to live. Gotta love government intervention.

Why do you conservatives hate America so much? (Or at least are so paranoid.)

Don't worry, the constitution explicitly protects you and you will not lose your land without just compensation as the constitution guarantees it. Most of the complaints about losing property rights are just whining rich people that over state their cases and have big megaphones they use to access the courts and media. People are almost never treated unfairly (although it does happen at times) . . . people are more likely to get a better deal than the deserve.
 
perfectchaos007 said:
Of course it could backfire for us because the government has mineral rights to all land and then they could use imminant domain to take our land and use the oil for themselves while leaving us out on the streets with no place to live. Gotta love government intervention.
Even that phrasing is a very funny Fruedian slip of your paranoia. :lol

It is 'eminent domain' . . . not 'imminent domain'. They have a legal right to take anything (eminent domain) as long as they provide just compensation . . . it is not something likely to happen soon (immiment).
 
speculawyer said:
Even that phrasing is a very funny Fruedian slip of your paranoia. :lol

It is 'eminent domain' . . . not 'imminent domain'. They have a legal right to take anything (eminent domain) as long as they provide just compensation . . . it is not something likely to happen soon (immiment).

You give the government way too much credit.
 
SteveMeister said:
You still haven't added the VentureOne to the original post, so I'll mention it again, this time with a picture:


Click the pic for info.
I remember being interested in the CarverOne back when that first got press, but since it's still not in the US, that interest has obviously waned.

But since this will be produced in the US... hell, I want to buy one today. I want practically dissapointed they weren't taking deposits on their "Pre-register" page.

_leech_ said:
Not saying it hasn't improved over the EV1 in some areas, but do you really see 12 years of progress there? The Volt's improvements are minimal at best (2 hours less for charging, a gas engine to improve range, faster top speed) and that's disappointing.
Huh?
_leech_ said:
I still don't understand how the Volt can under-perform a car released 12 years ago and still cost $40K+.
Ok, I guess you've got enough weasel words in there to kinda, sorta be right. But you really ought to choose your words more carefully if you're going to backpedal that fast, because you certainly said that had not improved.
 
Squirrel Killer said:
Ok, I guess you've got enough weasel words in there to kinda, sorta be right. But you really ought to choose your words more carefully if you're going to backpedal that fast, because you certainly said that had not improved.

Yeah, I said "under-performed" when I should have said "minor or insignificant improvements" over the EV1 in 12+ years. Fine, you got me. Happy? HAPPY?!

:p
 
perfectchaos007 said:
You give the government way too much credit.
I'd give the government credit . . . I give the American people credit. They make up the juries that decide the outcome of lawsuits filed under the 'just compensation' clause of the constitution.

Why do you hate America?
 
God's Beard said:
The Aptera may be the first car I buy.
A lot of people on the apteraforum.com boards have said that. The first new car I ever bought was a hyrbid. A lame one though . . . the Ford Escape hybrid. I no longer have it. But at least it was a step in the right direction for a US car company.
 

Formless

Member
_leech_ said:
Not saying it hasn't improved over the EV1 in some areas, but do you really see 12 years of progress there? The Volt's improvements are minimal at best (2 hours less for charging, a gas engine to improve range, faster top speed) and that's disappointing.

Personally, I think the next generation Prius (going to be announced in early 09, iirc) is going to trounce all over the Volt, plug-in or not.
Well considering that they basically just started their electric program again after fully ditching it, I'd say it's OK. It's expensive because it's not being mass produced.
 

robot

Member
I'm sure it's been said before, but the Aptera looks like a car straight out of Ridge Racer. Thats a good thing imo.
 
robot said:
I'm sure it's been said before, but the Aptera looks like a car straight out of Ridge Racer. Thats a good thing imo.
I'd like to see a lot of Apteras on the road to get people to become more accepting of more aerodynamic designs.

My father is a mechanical engineer and when I was a kid I remember once marveling over some cool somewhat-aerodynamically designed sports car in some show room. My father said . . . just look underneath it . . . they make the tops of these cars look aerodynamic but the underneath they are aerodynamic nightmares. That stuck with me . . . and it seems pretty much true of every car (including the Prius) until the Aptera.

I guess the theory is that assume so little air goes under cars that they don't bother with the bottom, just the top & sides.

Edit: The OP has been updated by adding some cars and removing some.
 
SapientWolf said:
That is the car that consumers should really be excited about.
Yeah . . . 50MPG is awesome. Toyota has truly stomped on everyone else by persistently working on the Prius and making it better and better. They certainly earned the right to become the biggest car company on the planet by looking ahead and building/improving the Prius.

But I still think that pure-electric or series hybrid is really interesting for its zero gas usage ability (if you drive within the electric-only range). No gas, much lower maintenance costs, reduced CO2 emissions (even counting the burned coal at electric plant), reduced pollution, etc. Even at 50mpg, it costs more per mile than electrics. However, the electrics have a bigger upfront cost due to much bigger batteries.
 
If I get a car for myself one day, I'd like a purely electric car like the Aptera or that blue pill shaped car. Something futuristic looking, out there, but still cool, ya know?

Perhaps they could released add-ons for the Aptera in case you wanna take 4 or 5 people along for the ride, though...
 

SapientWolf

Trucker Sexologist
speculawyer said:
Yeah . . . 50MPG is awesome. Toyota has truly stomped on everyone else by persistently working on the Prius and making it better and better. They certainly earned the right to become the biggest car company on the planet by looking ahead and building/improving the Prius.

But I still think that pure-electric or series hybrid is really interesting for its zero gas usage ability (if you drive within the electric-only range). No gas, much lower maintenance costs, reduced CO2 emissions (even counting the burned coal at electric plant), reduced pollution, etc. Even at 50mpg, it costs more per mile than electrics. However, the electrics have a bigger upfront cost due to much bigger batteries.
From what I understand, the current prototype for the Prius plug in can only run for 7 miles in the all-electric mode, and they're targeting 10-15. But they need to get that to at least 40 before it can allow the majority of commuters to stop using gas on a daily basis. The EV1 could run for over 100 miles on electricity but Chevron now owns the rights to that NiMH battery technology, so Toyota might have to wait for li-ion to mature to get those kinds of numbers.
 
SapientWolf said:
The EV1 could run for over 100 miles on electricity but Chevron now owns the rights to that NiMH battery technology, so Toyota might have to wait for li-ion to mature to get those kinds of numbers.


What? Why?
 

Neo C.

Member
speculawyer said:
Oil hits record near $143 on rising investor flows

Holy crap. This thread becomes more relevant by the day.

I find that really scary but with a little silver lining. The shit is hitting the fan but some things to help protect us from the flying feces are on their way to market.

And they can't get here soon enough.
It would be funny to see the USA becoming a country full of hybrid and small cars.

Though I think the even slower market would be the airlines. Boeing 787 and Airbus 380 can't come soon enough.
 
FlightOfHeaven said:
If I get a car for myself one day, I'd like a purely electric car like the Aptera or that blue pill shaped car. Something futuristic looking, out there, but still cool, ya know?

Perhaps they could released add-ons for the Aptera in case you wanna take 4 or 5 people along for the ride, though...
Aptera is working on a 2nd model (Protect X) that is largely assumed to be a more full-sized (4 person) vehicle.


Regarding Chevron owning the battery technology, I wouldn't read that much into it. There other better battery technologies and there is a good chance those patents are unenforceabe or easy to design around. A lot of people tend to jump on the 'the oil companies are screwing us by buying up alternate technolgies, man!' meme but it reality doesn't fit. If someone gets some great technology, they'll exploit it . . . better to kill your own product than have someone else do it.
 

Suikoguy

I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
I'm hoping Aptera comes to Florida.. but i'm wondering how it's AC will work in this temperature/humidity.
 
Suikoguy said:
I'm hoping Aptera comes to Florida.. but i'm wondering how it's AC will work in this temperature/humidity.
It is a heat pump, so they use the same circuitry for heating and cooling. Heat pumps are pretty efficient. But AC is definitely a power consumption heavy activity that is harder to do without an engine provide 'free' rotary energy.
 

Suikoguy

I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
speculawyer said:
It is a heat pump, so they use the same circuitry for heating and cooling. Heat pumps are pretty efficient. But AC is definitely a power consumption heavy activity that is harder to do without an engine provide 'free' rotary energy.

I'm looking at the hybrid version right now, which is being advertised at 300MPG, i'd be happy with 100.
 

Phoenix

Member
FlightOfHeaven said:
What? Why?


You don't honestly think these guys aren't investing in the rest of the energy sector and the futures. Hell you look at solar and hydrogen and its a who's who of energy companies and their investors. Someway or another, you'll be paying these guys for years to come.
 
Electric scooters and motorcycles are big here in Beijing. If I could take one of their models back home, I sure damn would. They are so damn convenient.

As for energy companies investing in alternate energy, I don't mind. I don't mind paying them. I just want clean energy.
 
Someone came up with a render of the Volt without the camo tape. Still looks pretty good but not as macho as the original.

voltmodeluncovereduk3.jpg
 
Former Intel CEO Andy Grove becomes a electric car proponent.

AP Interview: Ex-Intel head pushes electric cars By KEN THOMAS, Associated Press Writer
Sun Jun 29, 1:51 PM ET

WASHINGTON - Former Intel Corp. Chairman Andy Grove has a knack for sensing when circumstances should force changes at a company or an industry — and how to respond.

He even has coined a term for it: the "strategic inflection point." Now the retired chairman of the world's largest computer chip maker thinks the term applies to energy and transportation, where record-high gasoline and oil prices have spurred interest in alternative energy sources and next-generation vehicles.

During the past year and a half, Grove has created his own crash course in electric power, plug-in hybrid vehicles and finding ways of shifting the nation's fleet of vehicles from gasoline. His goal: To draw more attention to electric vehicles.

"The most important thing I would like to do is light that almost half-assumed truth up in neon lights: Electricity in transportation has to be done. It is urgent. It is important that everything else is secondary," Grove said in a recent interview with The Associated Press.

"The drumbeat of the electrical transportation is accelerating like nothing I've ever seen in my life," he said.

Grove, 71, who was Time Magazine's Man of the Year in 1997, is the latest industry and government heavyweight to push plug-in hybrids and electric cars. Former CIA director James Woolsey, former Secretary of State George Schultz and Google Inc.'s philanthropic arm, Google.org, have touted the benefits of cars that could plug into a standard wall outlet to recharge the battery.

Several automakers are testing plug-in prototypes that would allow the vehicle to run on electric power for the first 40 miles. The technology hinges on the development of advanced lithium-ion batteries and companies such as General Motors Corp. and Toyota Motor Corp. hope to have an extended range plug-in available in limited quantities by 2010.

In the latest edition of The American, published by the American Enterprise Institute, Grove writes that the beauty of electric power is its ability to be produced through multiple sources such as coal, wind and nuclear, and its "stickiness" — it can be transported only over land.

Oil, by contrast, "flows to the highest bidder," making the United States more susceptible to price increases caused by voracious demand for petroleum from growing economies such as China.

While car makers have been developing plug-ins, Grove says the nation should consider ways of retrofitting the 80 million low-mileage pickups, sport utility vehicles and vans on the road to make them capable of running on both gasoline and electric power.

Giving these vehicles "dual fuel" functions would be similar to changes made in other technologies. DVD players, for example, were often combined with VCR tape players when they were first introduced to help consumers make the transition.

To push the technology along, Grove suggests tax incentives to take the risk out of battery development and help offset the costs of conversion kits. Utilities, he says, could subsidize the early adopters of plug-ins by providing free electric power to the vehicles for the first year to 18 months.

"I think it is a legitimate place for the government to fund, to accelerate it," he said.


Automakers have urged the government to provide more consumer tax incentives and research aid to develop advanced batteries, but they have questioned efforts to retrofit the vehicles.

Any changes to the engine would void the warranty, and the alterations could undermine the vehicle's reliability and safety functions, automakers say.

"We strongly discourage consumers from retrofitting vehicles," said GM spokesman Greg Martin.

Grove says the fledgling plug-in hybrid movement offers parallels to the Homebrew Computer Club from the mid-1970s that helped electronic hobbyists in Northern California set the stage for personal computers. Plug-in hybrid conversion shops could spread the technology in similar ways.

"The personal computer ... went to individuals first before it went to corporations. The conversion goes to individuals," Grove said. "Electric cars ... the corporations are sitting, wishing this whole friggin' thing to go away. Which is exactly what the computer companies' attitude was to personal computers."

Grove has battled Parkinson's disease and devoted millions of dollars and work to support research into the disorder. He has taken to alternative energy issues with a similar intensity, tapping into a network of plug-in enthusiasts and experts. Grove says he even bought a textbook on electric and hybrid vehicles written by a University of Akron professor.

"They are all enthusiastically tutoring me," he said.

Grove co-teaches a Stanford University business school seminar and will devote the class next fall to examining ways of making the electric car possible.

He acknowledges that the shift to electric transportation will be a daunting challenge, but he notes that President Franklin Roosevelt worked with Detroit's automakers during World War II to quickly retool their plants to supply the war effort. At a time of gas prices that exceed $4 a gallon and with the dangers of oil politics, those lessons shouldn't be lost, he said.

"I think technologically it's doable. I think the logic is pretty compelling," Grove said. "Somebody better drive it and play Roosevelt.
"
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080629/ap_on_hi_te/grove_plug_ins;_ylt=AlhHavJ89yn_BTGIgDXS_9Ks0NUE
 
This really isn't funny.

Oil prices rise to record highs above $144
Wednesday July 2, 3:57 pm ET
By Adam Schreck, AP Business Writer
Oil prices advance to new highs above $144 after report shows supplies fell more than expected
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080702/oil_prices.html

Damn . . . Tesla, Aptera, and Th!nk better step up and start rolling out some cars. They've all got completed designs (from what I can tell) and just need to get factories up and running. Tesla has delivered a grand total of 5 Roadsters.

C'mon . . . get to it. This is your chance. I believe Th!nk has a functioning production line . . . c'mon guys, create a 2nd shift. Now.
 
We need more small, efficient cars like these. Lots more. Hopefully this will keep all the SUVs and other bullshit off the road, but it will take years for most people's feeble minds to realize that looking "cool" should be the least important factor when it comes to buying a new vehicle.
 

SteveMeister

Hang out with Steve.
What we REALLY need is for the US government to offer subsidies to companies who make CONVERSIONS for existing vehicles, and tax credits for people who buy them.

All the new electric & high mileage hybrids in the world aren't going to help anyone if nobody can buy them because they're upside-down on their current vehicle.

If I could pay $2500 or so and have an electric assist system (or something similar to improve MPG) added to my F-150, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. And so would a lot of people.

And then in a few years when these cars are available and everyone's paid down their SUV & truck notes, they can trade them in for the newer tech.
 
SteveMeister said:
What we REALLY need is for the US government to offer subsidies to companies who make CONVERSIONS for existing vehicles, and tax credits for people who buy them.

All the new electric & high mileage hybrids in the world aren't going to help anyone if nobody can buy them because they're upside-down on their current vehicle.

If I could pay $2500 or so and have an electric assist system (or something similar to improve MPG) added to my F-150, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. And so would a lot of people.

And then in a few years when these cars are available and everyone's paid down their SUV & truck notes, they can trade them in for the newer tech.

It is a nice thought, but I just don't see it as practical unless gas costs REALLY go up.

The cost of retro-fit kits and cost installing such kits would really probably outweigh any benefit.

Even the http://calcars.org/ people that do that sort of thing admit that there real goal is to get the major auto-makers pumping out stock plug-in hybrids.

Edit: Even the people that don't get electric cars will greatly benefit from the electric cars . . . every electric car is one less gas car competing for the same gasoline. If a lot of electrics hit the road, the cost of gas could drop due to decreased demand for gas.
 

cynlix

Member
I bought this last week and am now biking 20 miles a day to and from work.

08-RA_Prestige-f


And if I need to drive, I have a miata. ~30+ mpg ftw!:lol

But anyways, back on topic. My co-worker test drove a zap xebra a few weeks ago. He hated it because of the range and size, so he bought a motorcycle instead. I myself can't wait for when we are not depended on gasoline anymore.
 
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