The thing is I don't think there will be a Destiny 3. Destiny 2 will continue to evolve on PC as normal MMOs do, while the only update to the console versions will either be a collection of the expansions or a new version for the next generation of systems. Think of it as Destiny's version of A Realm Reborn.
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To the "Destiny 2 looks like DLC" crowd. Why?
- Thread starter StalkerUKCG
- Start date
That's a bingo!
Now aren't you putting words in my mouth? I didn't say it was unacceptable at all. My big dumb brain likes seeing larger numbers. I see a gigantic number 2, I suddenly expect more than number 1. It matters because all that added new content would have been that much more fulfilling with the content we currently had. The Earth, Moon, Mars, Venus and Dreadnaught with all the changes we've heard about would make it feel less like a reset and more like hm... a continuation?
static jam said:
When people were throwing the whole "10 year plan" around this is exactly as I saw it. Which makes D2 being a hard reset all the more mystifying.
duhmetree
Member
As a company would you want to spend time/resources porting old material to the new client or developing new material?
It's been mentioned that the Live team might be bringing back the old planets/areas over time.
I was talking about your obvious overall concern when I said that, obviously!
They're not simply building on top of D1, they're rebuilding everything. If that means we get familiar areas at launch then that's fine because they had to rebuild them, as long as they're content rich and the areas are varied etc..., it won't matter if there's 4 planets or 40.
Huh, I don't recall the alpha being so polarizing.
It didn't devolve into the full on shitshow we have now, but there was a definite amount of "this isn't the game I thought it was" in it. People still haven't let those expectations go three years later.
As a consumer, I'd want both. I'm also not suggesting that they'll never bring it back, I'm just saying it's a shame it isn't there.
I was talking about your obvious overall concern when I said that, obviously!
They're not simply building on top of D1, they're rebuilding everything. If that means we get familiar areas at launch then that's fine because they had to rebuild them, as long as they're content rich and the areas are varied etc..., it won't matter if there's 4 planets or 40.
I've come to terms with them rebuilding everything which is what I meant when I called it a reset. I'll just continue referring to it as Destiny (2017).
Well damn. I guess I wasn't really checking out Destiny threads at that time. The beta, however, was when I noticed the gaf threads.
Man, I still remember the last day of the beta. My friend and I just chilled next to Xur's place and talked about what we thought Destiny was going to be about based on the cards. Lord were we wrong lol.
I still think they should explore the history more. There was so much lore in those cards that should've been in the actual game.
mullet2000
Member
One thing I do think fairly influences this is that before the reveal Bungie was talking up how they needed to do a big reset, characters from Destiny 1 couldn't carry forward, etc, and then...the game looks very similar. They set themselves up for people to have bigger expectations.
Refer to it however you want. If it turns out to be good or even great game, we'll both probably be playing it and enjoying it regardless.
They meant the game systems and foundation, and it was always clear they meant that.
This was never going to be a monumental shift of any kind.
Orthogonal
Member
This seems like a lot of arguing over semantics. It's a massive new content drop no matter how you slice it. It comes with numerous QoL improvements we have asked for ages so I am overall happy with the current offering. The length of the vanilla release and the variety of missions is really the only thing we have left to discover and so far it looks promising.
I completely agree and I'm sure those referring to this as an expansion feel the same.
Read the post I replied to. Was a direct Legion - D2 comparison.
I kinda get why they started the gameplay reveal with that gigantic 2 for everyone to see.
They obviously wanted to make sure people didn't think we were watching a final expansion to D1 or something.
Or just compensating cause they know that it isn't much of a 2, actually.
Crap double post
They obviously wanted to make sure people didn't think we were watching a final expansion to D1 or something.
Or just compensating cause they know that it isn't much of a 2, actually.
Crap double post
Which were set by Bungie when they said they were taking all your shit to completely rework things.
"They did a gear reset, therefore this game should have outer space dogfighting and twelve new planets!"
Correct
Aztechnology
Member
Yea. It's perfectly reasonable they needed to reset. The Meta has to move forward, weapons cannot continue to live on indefinitely, armor the types of abilities etc. So that makes sense because like any game with evolving content you have to phase thing in and out. Think about collectible card games, MMO's. Diablo with seasons. Just expansions in general.
The problem is that usually it happens so it can completely change the dynamic of the game through new mechanics, new characters and classes, new enemies etc.
Those things aren't really present. It's a reset to a new game for no apparent reason.
The Alpha was one of the greatest "glimpses" into a game I've ever experienced. At least at that time. I was absolutely sold on Destiny, right then and there. The thing that fucked it all up, was that the alpha, ended up being the final game, so to speak.
I expected so much more out of the final game, but it just didn't seem like enough. I loved it still, but i expected that sense of wonder and exploration to be 10x bigger in the final game. It just didn't happen. Maybe I expected too much? Possibly.
I'm sure Bungie has taken all the feedback, good or bad, to heart. The reveal just doesn't express that exactly in the way a lot of people would expect from a sequel. But, more info needed, Bungie holding things back, ect. are valid arguments that we really don't know exactly what we are getting with Destiny 2.
MAX PAYMENT
Member
Only 4 new locations?
gutter_trash
Banned
only 4 locations. fixed
For Crucible reasons alone you can't let all the old weapons stick around. Then there's the issue of what will happen to Special Weapons, now that there are only primary and heavy weapons.
Exotic Armor pieces have their perks tied to abilities that no longer exist. If you keep old stuff around people will expect to be able to infuse it, so then the game has to be balanced around perks that were too overpowered.
yanipheonu
Member
I'm starting to realize this is mostly a failure of the reveal to really sell the game to new players or returning players on the fence.
And to be fair, this was the presentation filled with Destiny YouTubers who are clearly already fans, and seemed to be positioned as for the hardcore fans.
Which explains some of the misses with some people. I suspect E3 sees a wider appeal with its showing there.
But it doesn't delegitmize the feelings of some of the people in here. They should have gone deeper into, say, how much bigger a map is, or how Deep Sectors work. But maybe they didn't have that ready yet.
And to be fair, this was the presentation filled with Destiny YouTubers who are clearly already fans, and seemed to be positioned as for the hardcore fans.
Which explains some of the misses with some people. I suspect E3 sees a wider appeal with its showing there.
But it doesn't delegitmize the feelings of some of the people in here. They should have gone deeper into, say, how much bigger a map is, or how Deep Sectors work. But maybe they didn't have that ready yet.
Unless you're someone that specifically want a multitude of different kinds of settings, of course. The descriptions they themselves gave made it clear that each location has a very specific setting/feel.
So yes, the locations might be large but also, yes there are only 4 new locations. Looking for lots of varied types of environments? Destiny 2 isn't your game.
If that is the big difference between D1 and D2, why were we only shown the stuff that is really close to D1? I said before they should have shown the new Adventures and Lost Sectors. A vid of a guardian dropping on planet doing a few mins of exploring then running an Adventure and a Lost Sector would have done a lot do get rid of the "this is an expansion" stuff. Show the new stuff. We have all seen their structure for regular missions and strikes, no need to show them again.
They probably should have, but they didn't. It does exist, though.
How good it will all be is obviously still up for debate and speculation.
But four planets could have a multitude of different settings. It won't matter if they're presented as four planets with 10 areas each, or 10 with 4. The end result will be the same.
As long as the areas themselves are varied and content rich, the overall number of planets won't matter.
Aztechnology
Member
Right MMO's like WoW have done a good job of this with seasons as have the other examples I gave. It's necessary to move on. Was it necessary to have it be an entirely new game versus an expansion though? I don't know. Maybe it's just a limitation of not having a digital client which were installing all of this onto like WoW or something is. But it still just feels kind of wasted (from what we've seen so far I mean, I just don't see anything that required a completely new game yet).
You didn't read what I wrote.
It's already been made clear that each location will have a very specific look and feel. Just like Destiny 1 and many other games.
You're not wrong, but the alternative is alienating the diehard fanbase and community that they've built up over the last three years.
IMO they have addressed the three major complaints of Vanilla Destiny as their thesis for Destiny 2; add a story and campaign were in was sorely lacking before, drop old consoles and the old engine where it was holding them back, and make the world bigger and full of content so that theres more to see and do and discover instead of lifeless patrol zones.
Im sure theres a lot more to share, and I hope people are open to it. Its cool they were eager to share this game with fans, they seem pretty proud of it.
You're saying Destiny 2 isn't the game if you want more varied locations because there are only four planets, but if these four planets have lots of variety within them it won't matter.
ByWatterson
Member
No. I wrote: "Looking for lots of varied types of environments? Destiny 2 isn't your game."
Which still applies. so you DIDNT read what I wrote then.
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
I think the biggest thing for me is that the classes aren't radically different/new/expanded upon
"There won't be a lot of NPC camps and towns" somehow translates to "our game world will be neither vibrant nor interesting."
No he doesn't... he talks about civilisations, not the environments...
What?
Environments are are part of locations and inherent to everything when I say "variety".
Each planet could have tonnes of variety in environments, just like, you know... Earth.
the complete removal of 3 subclasses instantly rendering all of those exotics worthless and making current game activities that basically required shit like titan bubble obsolete is a pretty good reason to have a new client. removes clutter in defunct items, lets them start fresh not having to balance end game around defenders, and massively lowers the entry barrier for new players, especially when expanding into the pc market. pretty simple logic to follow. things might be different if this were an mmo and expansion ad infinitum were the goal but destiny 1, regardless of the expansions, would always be hamstrung by the tech that made it run on older hardware, so it was time to move on.
DeaDPo0L84
Member
How in the world do you take that quote and come to the conclusion you did? You can only do that if you are attempting to shit on the game without reason.
You're still not reading, my god.
People looking for varied -types- of environments. Not varied environements.
Like you can have lots of different stuff happening on that gloomy, misty forest planet, but it will still be that gloomy misty forest.
And you can have abunch of different cool bases on that all-buildings-on-water-planet, but once again it will be the same type of environment. The same setting.
And if you are looking for many different -types- of environment, Destiny 2 isn't your game.
And EARTH has varied TYPES of environments. Like, right now in reality.
So why couldn't four planets?
You do realise the planets themselves don't have to be all one type of environment, right? Even D1 had desert and snow on one planet.
3 of the 4 launch planets in the first game had varied environments, though. venus had the desert/hotsprings area in the winter's run strike, the jungle overgrowth in the academy and research areas and then the vex structures with massive interior sections. the moon was pretty samey, sure, but it's the moon. there was still pretty decent variation between surface and hive interior areas.
0ptimusPayne
Member
After watching some of the videos on the story mission and strike, its still pretty puzzling that they didn't bother adding in another class to the mix. I get that they've changed sub class abilities around and such, but its just weird that an entirely different game didn't bother adding another class or two to the mix.
Please for the love of god take of the fanboy blindfold for just a second.
You know how this works. Thats not a Destiny thing, it's a games thing. Movies too, tbh.
All the dungeons, raids, patrols, whatever in the gloomy misty forest will be gloomy misty forest. Destiny 2 will be the same, mark my words.
Indoor areas with the same type of setting is still the same type of setting. I played through all of D1 btw. The concept applied in 99/100 cases. Especialyl with Vex/Moon.
From a labor/workrate standpoint, reworking the existing 3 classes would be substantial that going for a fourth would probably strain things.
funkystudent
Member
On paper it just seems like more Destiny 1. Thats fine for people who didnt feel jilted by Destiny 1 but its not gonna win back the people they lost.
Here his my take away from the D2 reveal and how it tackles Destiny 1s problems.
Lack of content. Too few environments / planets.
Destiny 2 has exactly the same number of locations as base Destiny 1.
No real side quests.
They added "Adventures" Lets just hope they are side quests and not just slightly more shiny patrols. Would love it if the factions had a mini story quest for example.
The story was non existent and shite.
Destiny 1 DLC was already a step up and D2 seems to continue that. So +1 Bungie.
Getting into raids for near impossible for first time raiders without 5 other friends.
The seem to have fixed that. Not full matchmaking and we dont know how picky the community will be so I guess we can wait and see.
"if it aint broke dont fix it. Heck dont even touch it. Leave it be"
The UI and overall presentation is exactly the same.
Gunplay is exactly the same.
Same enemies
Same classes
It just looks like the same game. Like you can tell they had that "lets just upgrade the same game for 10 years "MMO plan and that fell apart but it still totally looks like in another timeline D2 would have just plugged into D1 and all the minor graphical upgrades would have come too as a result of 360/ps3 being dropped giving them more room to flex.
Here his my take away from the D2 reveal and how it tackles Destiny 1s problems.
Lack of content. Too few environments / planets.
Destiny 2 has exactly the same number of locations as base Destiny 1.
No real side quests.
They added "Adventures" Lets just hope they are side quests and not just slightly more shiny patrols. Would love it if the factions had a mini story quest for example.
The story was non existent and shite.
Destiny 1 DLC was already a step up and D2 seems to continue that. So +1 Bungie.
Getting into raids for near impossible for first time raiders without 5 other friends.
The seem to have fixed that. Not full matchmaking and we dont know how picky the community will be so I guess we can wait and see.
"if it aint broke dont fix it. Heck dont even touch it. Leave it be"
The UI and overall presentation is exactly the same.
Gunplay is exactly the same.
Same enemies
Same classes
It just looks like the same game. Like you can tell they had that "lets just upgrade the same game for 10 years "MMO plan and that fell apart but it still totally looks like in another timeline D2 would have just plugged into D1 and all the minor graphical upgrades would have come too as a result of 360/ps3 being dropped giving them more room to flex.
Haha, ok Horp. Let's leave it there.