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vg247-PS4: new kits shipping now, AMD A10 used as base, final version next summer

D

Durante

Member
gofreak said:
The two things I remember from sweetvar's last post were

1) that the Durango project was 'a bigger deal' at AMD, with more resources

2) that Sony's schedule had slipped 6 months, but that they had already received first silicon and was preparing to spin their second rev, while Microsoft were just preparing to receive their first silicon

I don't recall that he directly compared the systems's performance levels or in particular GPU, but I can't be sure of that. His comments, between the required resources and silicon schedule, fitted with the suggestion that Microsoft was using less of a 'stock' approach to CPU.

Been trying, but can't remember anything else. I think he made a couple of references to internal codenames on chips for both.
Click to expand...
Wasn't this also the guy who was referring to something similar to Samsung's little.BIG architecture? Or am I remembering this wrongly? That would be really interesting. (Eg. something like N Jaguar cores + N Steamroller cores)
 
I

i-Lo

Member
GopherD said:
Essentially that Sony further along in manufacturing, weaker than Durango, uses Apu only and around 1.8 tf, anti-used games, toolsets were crappy, likely to wait until 2014 when tech has matured. MS more powerful and encompassing an all in one win8 solution and launching first.
Click to expand...

That... is underwhelming news. Sounds like Sony wants to go the route of Nintendo, i.e. seeking to become irrelevant to third parties.
 
S

Shikoro

Member
gofreak said:
The two things I remember from sweetvar's last post were

1) that the Durango project was 'a bigger deal' at AMD, with more resources

2) that Sony's schedule had slipped 6 months, but that they had already received first silicon and was preparing to spin their second rev, while Microsoft were just preparing to receive their first silicon

I don't recall that he directly compared the systems's performance levels or in particular GPU, but I can't be sure of that. His comments, between the required resources and silicon schedule, fitted with the suggestion that Microsoft was using less of a 'stock' approach to CPU.

Been trying, but can't remember anything else. I think he made a couple of references to internal codenames on chips for both.
Click to expand...
Yeah, something along those lines. Now watch your posts getting deleted after some time. :p

i-Lo said:
That... is underwhelming news. Sounds like Sony wants to go the route of Nintendo, i.e. seeking to become irrelevant to third parties.
Click to expand...
If it's true that Sony are targeting 1080p60 and 3D, no way it's going to be a weak-sauce machine. I don't think that there's any reason for us to worry about PS4's specs. :)
 
A

AstroNut325

Member
i-Lo said:
That... is underwhelming news. Sounds like Sony wants to go the route of Nintendo, i.e. seeking to become irrelevant to third parties.
Click to expand...

Yup. That's what it starting to sound like. No Sony console for me next gen. If MS delivers the power house that's where I'll exclusively go.
 
P

Proxy

Member
z0m3le said:
You can take it as a repeat of this generation from Microsoft's perspective. If you want the definitive version of all of these games, XB720 is the console to buy, at least unless you own a high powered PC.

It likely means that they will then port (sort of as an afterthought) to PS4, which means an extension of your experience with the PS3.

Also he is likely referring to the 8 core rumor from before, which means PS4 might have a hard time getting ports if CPU is intensively used... A lot of this is unclear but these consoles might not be much like each other. Especially if Microsoft is going with 8 cores at 1.6GHz and 16 threads, while PS4 is going with a quad core with 4 threads (AMD's designs limit them to 1 thread per core) But if they really do stick with A10, they could at least have possibly more powerful cores.

We will likely know a lot more soon, I've been starting to hear rumors of announcements coming, there is CES soon, and that could be a place where they announce their consoles, GDC is not too far beyond that, but for certain by E3 we should know a lot more than we did about Wii U last year at that time.
Click to expand...

If we're believing Sweetvar26 then MS is using an AMD CPU as well. So....
 
P

Psychotext

Member
Shikoro said:
If it's true that Sony are targeting 1080p60 and 3D, no way it's going to be a weak-sauce machine. I don't think that there's any reason for us to worry about PS4's specs. :)
Click to expand...

Doesn't really take an amazing amount of power to achieve that. 4x PS3 would probably do it.
 
S

Sid

Member
phosphor112 said:
That Sweetvar post was removed from Google cache for this site.
Confirmed.
Click to expand...
So what did that post look like if u read it earlier? this

GopherD said:
Essentially that Sony further along in manufacturing, weaker than Durango, uses Apu only and around 1.8 tf, anti-used games, toolsets were crappy, likely to wait until 2014 when tech has matured. MS more powerful and encompassing an all in one win8 solution and launching first.
Click to expand...


or this?

gofreak said:
The two things I remember from sweetvar's last post were

1) that the Durango project was 'a bigger deal' at AMD, with more resources

2) that Sony's schedule had slipped 6 months, but that they had already received first silicon and was preparing to spin their second rev, while Microsoft were just preparing to receive their first silicon

I don't recall that he directly compared the systems's performance levels or in particular GPU, but I can't be sure of that. His comments, between the required resources and silicon schedule, fitted with the suggestion that Microsoft was using less of a 'stock' approach to CPU.

Been trying, but can't remember anything else. I think he made a couple of references to internal codenames on chips for both.
Click to expand...
 
I

i-Lo

Member
AstroNut325 said:
Yup. That's what it starting to sound like. No Sony console for me next gen. If MS delivers the power house that's where I'll exclusively go.
Click to expand...

Yea. Honestly, if I wasn't a fan of certain Sony's first party IPs, I'd not be planning to buy the PS4. Plus, really dislike paying for Live so that's another reason why I want a PS4.

That said, I'd still would like to know if the PS4 can be what PS3 is to 360 when it comes Xbox 360 with regards to third party titles, i.e. either on par or inferior (framerate).
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
I'm not at all sure sweetvar said all that GopherD is crediting with him...although I really only (vaguely) recall his last post about this. Are we sure the stuff about used games or win8 and all that isn't mixing in other rumours? I thought his posts were very silicon/amd-centric, not general.

The 2014 thing, or Sony waiting, also...I think in his last 'update' he in fact said that both consoles were expected in around the same time? I'm not totally sure, but that's what I kind of remember.
 
G

Gemüsepizza

Member
i-Lo said:
That... is underwhelming news. Sounds like Sony wants to go the route of Nintendo, i.e. seeking to become irrelevant to third parties.
Click to expand...

It was very vague from what I can remember, and only about the CPU.

AstroNut325 said:
Yup. That's what it starting to sound like. No Sony console for me next gen. If MS delivers the power house that's where I'll exclusively go.
Click to expand...

Amazing how people react to some rumors. I somehow doubt that there are many persons who can really judge how powerful these parts are compared to each other - don't they develop them separately at AMD?
 
P

Pranay

Member
Amazing how people react to some rumors.
Click to expand...

I think he came in to troll

@Gpfreak
That used game was from someone else.

It will only make sense if they are planning to start rental system on consoles
 
G

GopherD

Member
gofreak said:
I'm not at all sure sweetvar said all that GopherD is crediting with him...although I really only (vaguely) recall his last post about this. Are we sure the stuff about used games and all that isn't mixing in other rumours?

The 2014 thing, or Sony waiting, also...I think in his last 'update' he in fact said that both consoles were expected in around the same time? I'm not totally sure, but that's what I kind of remember.
Click to expand...

to be honest, you may be right. I remember a lot of info being bombarded that week, as it was around that time that the VG247 rumor surfaced. I may have mixed up who said what. Getting older and the memory ain't what it used to be.
 
N

NemesisPrime

Banned
i-Lo said:
That... is underwhelming news. Sounds like Sony wants to go the route of Nintendo, i.e. seeking to become irrelevant to third parties.
Click to expand...

How so?

Especially with the WiiU also in the game and more scalable engines, I expect third parties to port to all consoles. If the PS4 is (a lot) weaker than 720 that would still not cost them third party devs. Only if it sold really badly would third party support be in trouble.

Me personally I think Sony should go the way of Nintendo and leave the high end performance to MS this round. They need to make some good profit.
 
A

AstroNut325

Member
Gemüsepizza;45053725 said:
It was very vague from what I can remember, and only about the CPU.



Amazing how people react to some rumors. I somehow doubt that there are many persons who can really judge how powerful these parts are compared to each other - don't they develop them separately?
Click to expand...

My point is that if Sony follows Nintendo in hardware philosophy they won't get any money from me. No one should be questioning if particular components are more advanced than PS3.
 
G

Graphics Horse

Member
If you chose a ps3 because it had the 'POWER OF TEH CELL!' you'll probably want Microsofts box this time, yeah.
He seems to be saying the gpus are the same or similar, something like 7700-7800
 
G

Gemüsepizza

Member
AstroNut325 said:
My point is that if Sony follows Nintendo in hardware philosophy they won't get any money from me.
Click to expand...

Then they would have released a console right now, and not in 2013 to compete with a Nextgen Xbox. I don't think the PS4 will be much less powerful than the Xbox 3, but I guess Microsoft maybe wants a special solution for their media center strategy with an additional ARM CPU etc., which may be the cause for the delay.
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
Sweetvar26 Info was also from 2010 and was really old among other things .
He was talking about Sony targeting a version of OpenGL or CL (can't remember which one ) that was way outdated .
Also it made no sense that the his friend would have good info on both since i am sure both teams have very strict NDAs .
 
N

NemesisPrime

Banned
tapedeck said:
Please God no.
Click to expand...

Would this somehow destroy your experience gaming?

If you look at it from a pure logical point of view the next xbox will be the more powerful next gen console. You can actually agrue that xbox1 and 360 have always been the most powerful consoles of their generation TBH (but let's not).

They are a hardware company first as always.
Click to expand...

That has nothing to do with power. Just with good and cost effective design.
 
I

i-Lo

Member
The question is, in which universe does releasing a platform after your competitor bodes well especially if:

  • Your platform's hardware is not as capable as your competitor
  • You can't garner same third party support compared to your competitor
  • You want to continue the tradition of letting your install base play inferior versions of multiplatform title

Those along with the rumours that latest dev kits show that Sony may be including as much RAM as MS if not slightly less, I'm wondering if PS4 will indeed be a weakling compared to XB3...

NemesisPrime said:
Me personally I think Sony should go the way of Nintendo and leave the high end performance to MS this round. They need to make some good profit.
Click to expand...

*__*

They are competing for the same market as MS.
 
N

NemesisPrime

Banned
i-Lo said:
They are competing for the same market as MS.
Click to expand...

A market that is not really dictated by hardware power, but by software (as the Vita has found out.... Sony will look at that and have some reservations IMHO about launching a power-console). I think they will go for cheap and elegant with some "interesting" features.

Since MS has a lot of loyal(?) PC developers using their tools I think they will go for a more power console to make sure they get the support of the PC gang (like me).

Both consoles will have excellent media capabilities anyway. You don't need uber power for that.
 
P

phosphor112

Banned
i-Lo said:
The question is, in which universe does releasing a platform after your competitor bodes well especially if:

  • Your platform's hardware is not as capable as your competitor
  • You can't garner same third party support compared to your competitor
  • You want to continue the tradition of letting your install base play inferior versions of multiplatform title

Those along with the rumours that latest dev kits show that Sony may be including as much RAM as MS if not slightly less, I'm wondering if PS4 will indeed be a weakling compared to XB3...



*__*

They are competing for the same market as MS.
Click to expand...
You guys are overreacting for absolutely no reason.
 
E

Elios83

Member
IMO both consoles will end up being pretty much the same.
They're targeting the same release date, they're using the same technologies, it's unlikely that one of them want to go with a much higher price than the other and be the new PS3 at launch, they'll both be priced the same or with a 50$ difference, also both Sony and Microosft know that the traditional business model of high budget AAA games can only be sustained if both the products are successful and developers can use their userbase combined, there is a common power baseline that developers are dictating to be able to make next gen games on those platforms and both companies have to deliver on that.
 
I

i-Lo

Member
NemesisPrime said:
A market that is not really dictated by hardware power, but by software (as the Vita has found out.... Sony will look at that and have some reservations IMHO about launching a power-console). I think they will go for cheap and elegant with some "interesting" features.

Since MS has a lot of loyal(?) PC developers using their tools I think they will go for a more power console to make sure they get the support of the PC gang (like me).

Both consoles will have excellent media capabilities anyway. You don't need uber power for that.
Click to expand...

Really! Honestly we have had this conversation before as how big of a logic gap there has to be to think third parties will support Sony if it mocks the WiiU and comes over after a year of the nintendo console.

I don't know if it's insecurity but I have seen quite a few nintendo fans here who wish that MS and Sony didn't build a more powerful machine.

Fucking lol.
 
M

Mrbob

Member
Elios83 said:
IMO both consoles will end up being pretty much the same.
They're targeting the same release date, they're using the same technologies, it's unlikely that one of them want to go with a much higher price than the other and be the new PS3 at launch, they'll both be priced the same or with a 50$ difference, also both Sony and Microosft know that the traditional business model of high budget AAA games can only be sustained if both the products are successful and developers can use their userbase combined, there is a common power baseline that developers are dictating to be able to make next gen games on those platforms and both companies have to deliver on that.
Click to expand...

Listen to this man.
 
G

Gemüsepizza

Member
Elios83 said:
IMO both consoles will end up being pretty much the same.
They're targeting the same release date, they're using the same technologies, it's unlikely that one of them want to go with a much higher price than the other and be the new PS3 at launch, they'll both be priced the same or with a 50$ difference, also both Sony and Microosft know that the traditional business model of high budget AAA games can only be sustained if both the products are successful and developers can use their userbase combined, there is a common power baseline that developers are dictating to be able to make next gen games on those platforms and both companies have to deliver on that.
Click to expand...

This. I think the only "big" difference will be additional features like this media center thing which Microsoft is pursuing. I guess Sony just went to AMD and asked for a good gaming processor, which is not difficult to produce, and Microsoft wanted to have a good gaming processor with maybe an additional ARM CPU integrated, which probably is a little bit more difficult to produce compared to what Sony wanted. I don't think there is any reason to worry.
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
phosphor112 said:
Considering the google cache for those posts were specifically removed, I'd say it's a big deal.
Click to expand...

Maybe he ask to take them down cause he got his friend in trouble .
Also it make no sense that Sony would being targeting Open CL 1.0 when 1.1 came out since 2010.
He also said the info might be old and outdated .

As i said it make no sense that 1 person knows a good amount of info from both teams the NDAs should be strict as hell .
Sony and MS would sue AMD to hell if it was that easy .
 
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