-Pyromaniac-
Member
losing support of 3rd parties? lol is this 2009 or something.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
vg247-PS4: new kits shipping now, AMD A10 used as base, final version next summer
- Thread starter Globox_82
- Start date
Isn't development time for launch title for next gen consoles going to be longer given not only the new hardware but also the lack of finality of the specs which would cause delays here and there?
TLoU, Beyond Two Souls and what's the third one?
TLoU, Beyond Two Souls and what's the third one?
-Pyromaniac-
Member
puppeteer
pharmboy044
Member
Puppeteer.
edit:beaten
Seriously, unless the PS4 is incredibly underpowered Sony has strong third party support. There are a lot more long term players on the PS3 than on 360, judging by playtime statistics. They may sell more copies on 360 initially but they tend to build stronger fanbases and have a bigger market for DLC on PS3. I know for sure Battlefield is this way, and several other devs have said similar things without naming titles.
This gen going on for too long probably gave normally rushed launch titles alot of time in the oven...
Graphics Horse
Member
Also Rain, possibly. (Supposedly making use of some Last Guardian code/concepts)
pharmboy044
Member
That's a PSN game.
Graphics Horse
Member
Is it not an exclusive first party PS3 game that's a new IP?
There's no difference between PSN games and retail games apart from how they're released. Journey ended up having a retail copy.
I think what he means is the recent rumour we've hearing about Sony being poor when communicating with third parties about their hardware. The reason why MS won such support last gen primarily had to do with how good they were at communicating with the third parties, actively seeking feedbacks and designing dev friendly dev kits (and console).
Ah, yea. Thanks guys.
What we know in terms of what studios are available:
Developers who haven't released a game for a while
Naughty Dogg - Uncharted 3 team (last of us team is another team)
Santa Monica - GoW3 team (Ascention is another team)
Sucker Punch
MediaMolecule (they have another team that ain't doing Tearaway)
Polyphonic (lol)
So PS4 can have a good start
Developers who haven't released a game for a while
Naughty Dogg - Uncharted 3 team (last of us team is another team)
Santa Monica - GoW3 team (Ascention is another team)
Sucker Punch
MediaMolecule (they have another team that ain't doing Tearaway)
Polyphonic (lol)
So PS4 can have a good start
Probably because BF3 DLC launches first on PS3.
I imagine if we flip it and look at CoD which launches all DLC first on 360 first it's probably the other way round.
Microsoft's tools for their upcoming 8th gen console are reportedly much better than Sony's or Nintendo's efforts. I bet if you were to ask some developers off the record, they'd tell you they are most excited about Microsoft's console out of all 3. That said, I don't know how far ahead (or behind) either Sony or MS are with their tools - nor would I. But it shouldn't surprise anyone that MS' software tools are a boon compared to anyone else. That was the case this generation as well, after all.
Yea, this is what I was alluding to.
I mean c'mon, should this be even an issue after 7 years into a console generation that began with the same complaint from the third parties? Does it anything to do with hardware finalization and the indecisions by the management that may be cause for blame?
pharmboy044
Member
Yes, you are absolutely correct. I was just looking at the retail releases that have been announced.
If we are looking at just exclusives then there also is Until Dawn.
Graphics Horse
Member
mm, good point, the amount of new PS3 titles they're bringing out next year seems quite big, even if they're not all big titles.
pharmboy044
Member
Are you getting your info from Aegies or is this from personal conversations with third party developers?
I'm just curious.
Proelite
Member
This passes for news? There is no proof that the review is real.
Metalmurphy
Member
Only Kotaku to run with that.
I like how he says they're not appealing to the casual market, but they gotta focus on the core gamer.
I like how he says they're not appealing to the casual market, but they gotta focus on the core gamer.
BlockheadBrown
Member
I've already seen this rumored. They're allegedly going to release new IPs as well. That said, I'm still happier with the different direction Sony is taking in general with games. There's really creative and risky (in a good way) stuff they're doing. I'm more inclined to believe that Sony will continue in the positive direction they've been going (as far as games are concerned). I'm admittedly more skeptical of Microsoft. The tools may be awesome, but if it's just going to be more Halo, Gears and Forza stuff, I'm less inclined to get a Microsoft console. Sony's recent history has a bevy of new IPs and gameplay ideas. MS's has mainly been shooters, racing and Kinect based.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
although that's probably 100% true, Sony mustered up a ton of 3rd party support this gen with their lack of great tools and complex architecture and whatever other BS they had going on.
Next gen shouldn't be a problem since a lot of stuff will be rectified on that front just by changing architecture alone. IMO it seems like it'll be a negligible difference in the end. If the PS4 sells it will make no difference if MS communication and tools are awesome. They'll both get a lot of support.
BlockheadBrown
Member
It passes for Kotaku, whose legitimacy has been seemingly slipping.
1st Course
Member
Microsoft being an American company means that they don't have to deal with the whole yen/usd exchange rate thing, so yeah them having an advantage when it comes to hardware cost seems like just stating the obvious.
What's so demanding about this game? Is it just the player count (I read it can go up to 2000 players, is that true?) and big levels? Because the graphics look good but not that good.
Vincent Alexander
Member
This all sounds good to me. I'm still content with current gen systems, so any leap in tech will make me happy. Just get some damn games on it so I can stop playing a system that charges me for online.
phosphor112
Banned
Long draw distances, deferred lighting engine, lots of polys, and yes, 2000 player counts are costly on a CPU.
Evolution_1ne
Banned
I highly doubt the CPU in the PS4 will be weak or even just adequate, you don't just throw away an entire generation of design philosophy like that, especially when the benefits far outweigh the potential negatives
the fact that Planetside 2 is a potential launch game to me confirms the ps4 is going to have a monster of a CPU, but what? Could that be the reason for the delay?
the fact that Planetside 2 is a potential launch game to me confirms the ps4 is going to have a monster of a CPU, but what? Could that be the reason for the delay?
Truespeed
Member
Whose doubting it? The Cell is still the most powerful CPU in game console history.
Personal conversations, off the record, etc etc, as well as piecing together some of what we read like you guys have. I've just heard that MS' tools were better.
I was speaking more of third parties
In some areas. In others it is weak.
Floating point performance is fantastic, while it is not very good with general purpose code.
That was the case with the PPE in general, including the version inside the 360. Both share the same terrible IPC, which these newer AMD CPUs will fare better at. They will not, however, be as good at floating point. But that's where a GCN GPU comes in. Especially if there's a small, low power GPU inside the APU that could be used for such "gpgpu" matters along with a separate GPU for rendering your game visuals.
In either case, third parties are going to be much happier with Sony than they were during the 7th generation - even if they're happier with Microsoft in general (hardware and tools wise).
-Pyromaniac-
Member
which is what I was saying. If they mustered up all the support this gen with all the baggage the console had, next-gen should be a breeze relatively speaking. All sony needs to do is worry about sales.
pharmboy044
Member
Ah, okay. Is it possible with developer feedback the tools can improve? Or is Sony not able to offer friendlier tools because it's not in their DNA?
It has to do with literally decades of experience in the field of software development tools, compared to just a few years. And the simple fact that tools are one of the (some would say few) areas where Microsoft is genuinely ahead of pretty much everyone else.
Seriously, it's not in any way surprising or unusual for MS' tools to be significantly better. Every other situation regarding that would be. The question is whether Sony's tools will be good enough (which they certainly weren't when PS3 was released). I think they will be.
Dark_AnNiaLatOr
Member
I guess it wouldn't be necessary, but it would be even more useful. Then for Planetside 2, they could use a beefy CPU for the player count and all that, while both GPUs are used for visuals and a frame buffer, I think that's what it's called.
Of course, it's impossible to get even a somewhat modern GPU that does not allow for general purpose computation. Why do you think the Wii U supports it?
That depends on whether you just want prettier games or also more gameplay possibilities. Also, how hard you want to make it for developers. If your CPU is so weak that everything FP-intensive has to be moved to the GPU then that really doesn't make development easier.
Can't see how any CPU any console maker chooses would cause that problem. Also they may go the route of extra dedicated units this time, such as DSP's for audio ect. Would have been a wise choice for their current gen consoles actually.
Personal conversations? Lol, You fake bastard. You don't speak to anyone, nor do you know anyone that has info. Your info is what you gathered at this site and other sites like B3D. Would be nice if you stopped pretending. Been seeing your posts about next gen since early 2011. You know nothing.
You are welcome to believe anything you'd like, as you are welcome to disregard everything I say, or even put me on the ignore list. Or even go through my post history for some interesting (and often accurate) nuggets, even back from 2011. I'm not on GAF to make real life friends, just discuss the industry and games.
Up to you. No need to make a personal attack in a thread, though. I have *actually* spoken to some folks that would know more than I would that to me indicated Microsoft is more on the ball in regards to tools for their console. This shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. All I've ever attested to is third hand information (and piecing such together), and that's exactly what this is. Not a repost of B3D material in the least.
If you'd like to ask some other folks privately on this forum that would also be able to verify the fact that MS' tools are more mature (without breaking an NDA), feel free. I don't think it's really necessary.
Could you be anymore callous? Is it because the information is putting MS in a good position versus Sony? Even then, he also states Sony isn't that far behind anyways.
Kung Fu Grip
Banned
Didn't get laid last week huh?
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Could have been more tactful with the response but you're right.
funkystudent
Member
Sounds about what I would expect to hear from a manager in SCEA.
the "old guard" of upper executives in SCEA are almost as out of touch and reluctant to change as the top level Japanese brass from what I gather.
Tretton and other old timers needs to go.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
New PS4 PC Watch article. Not sure if thread worthy because Google translate is bad.
http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/column/kaigai/20121225_580059.html
http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/column/kaigai/20121225_580059.html
Kazuma Kiryu
Member
jesus, even if he does or does not know, is it really necessary to start throwing mud at each other?
Haha we need new info. The wait is taking its toll.