Alcoholikaust
Member
oh man I wish
Dat Halo 1997 footage "only on Mac". ruthless
edit
r was is 98? either way: awesome
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"PC is decimating console, just through price" - Romero
- Thread starter Poetic.Injustice
- Start date
Dat Halo 1997 footage "only on Mac". ruthless
edit
r was is 98? either way: awesomeI don't like you.
freenudemacusers
Member
best time to lurk macrumors, only beaten by the intel betrayaloh man I wish
Dat Halo 1997 footage "only on Mac". ruthless
edit
Aw that's a shame. Well I guess I better go back to those free 2 plays with crappy graphicses
mhee I've been playing the beta, not feelling it... I don't apreaciate its carrot on a stick aproach to pretty much everything it does. Never been a fan of grinding.
DOWN
Banned
I can't remember the last time I paid more than $40 for a new console title. Best Buy GCU = 20% off new games + $10-20 reward for preorder. Wolfenstein was $25 day one for me on PS4 via Best Buy launch promos. And my PS4 was $400.
I just can't imagine that I can get better visuals than PS4 for less money overall. I like my games day one and I don't want a PC if I can't get guaranteed improvement over PS4 on everything. Otherwise no point.
Cool but I don't know that it's better looking than PS4's BF4 and I don't know that I could grab a PC cheaper. And I haven't assumed, I've asked and been given that consensus by (non-Gaf) PC gamers.
lukeskymac
Member
It's also gonna cost more, mean more force-bruting instead of careful programming, and be a less consistent experience.
I have been a primarily PC gamer since always, but this mustard raec shit is going over people's heads. AAA sales are still console-driven, PC growth is primarily due to LoL+DotA, most Steam users have computers vastily inferior to those "puny" consoles, and custom rigs are still niche (that I'm part of). Those are facts.
Consoles and handhelds are specialist hardware. It's PC and mobile that are the jack-of-all-trades devices. Consoles and handhelds are designed primarily for playing video games. The issues consoles have is that people are building their own gaming hardware and using PC as their basis. Note that sales of prebuilt PCs are going down, but sales of PC components are going up. People are building their own PCs rather than buying prebuilt ones.
I don't get why this is a PC v Console argument. He mentions it obviously but the base argument is that Free to play is going to be the dominant business model. He then extrapolates that to=pc is better for some reason when consoles will have free to play games. You can see developers experimenting with free to play on consoles now. World of tanks on 360, warframe on ps4, xb1, War thunder ps4, Blacklight retribution ps4. The goal of a free to play game is to have the biggest audience. They will expand to other audiences and markets and find success (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=811150&highlight=warframe+revenue) as well as a stated focus on free to play from sony.
The industry is evolving and consoles along with it. The argument that "I can make a super PC just by throwing in a new card and boom ps4 sucks" is irrelevant when his base argument is that PC is better due to free to play when by that logic the order should go XB1<PS4<PC<Iphone
The industry is evolving and consoles along with it. The argument that "I can make a super PC just by throwing in a new card and boom ps4 sucks" is irrelevant when his base argument is that PC is better due to free to play when by that logic the order should go XB1<PS4<PC<Iphone
ShinMaruku
Member
Dr Amazon MD
Member
Late to the discussion, but after reading Romero's comments I just wanted to point out that some publishers do still provide short demos for free. I would like it to be a more common practice. And I agree that the market will eventually push the more sensible, consumer friendly implementations of the freemium model to the top, while the predatory/abusive ones will likely go away or exist mostly on the Apple and Google Play stores.
njean777
Member
A lot of people in this thread didn't get that. If anything consoles will be getting these games more and more and the market for this games will grow. Nothing is stopping a developer from putting their games on consoles anymore. If a pc maker really wants kb/m on console they have the ability to do so.
No, you can only play what is most popular at anytime and never enjoy anything else!
I guess if the big exclusives mean nothing to you then yeah, PC is where it's at. Maybe Romero never played The Last of Us, Mario, Gears of War, Zelda, Halo, Uncharted, Wipeout, Metroid, etc.
So tired of the fanboy shit from all sides. There's no more competition. Everyone is enjoying success these days. Consumers win most of all because they have choices, and lots of them.
Also, free to play is a fad.
So tired of the fanboy shit from all sides. There's no more competition. Everyone is enjoying success these days. Consumers win most of all because they have choices, and lots of them.
Also, free to play is a fad.
Oh you can.
This has been somewhat beaten to death at this point, but again here is an increasingly dated article: http://www.gamespot.com/articles/can-we-build-a-gaming-pc-on-a-console-budget/1100-6418829/
They built a couple of PCs that both substantially outperform the PS4 for $550, but they paid way too much even there. They pay $70-$100 for a Windows copy. Go to the Reddit software exchange and get a legitimate key for around $15. They also paid tax. Order online and you won't unless shipping to California, Indiana, New Jersey or Tennesse. They also added things that up the price without upping the performance that much, but that's not too important. Just bringing down tax and OS to realistic levels and you get around a $400 system.
As I also mentioned that article is getting more and more dated. It was published going on 4 months ago now. Prices of PC components tend to constantly drop, which means you can shave even more off that price now. Of course you're not limited to getting a system that can just outperform your PS4. This is the first time ever you can build a PC on a console budget that outperforms said consoles this close to launch. Sony has already stated they're now turning a profit on each unit of hardware sold. That's good for them, but the reason they're able to do that so quickly is that they launched with what amounted to low end PC hardware. This is unprecedented. Keep in mind this graph of PC vs console performance from previous gens (also please notice the scale of the y axis):
Obviously I'm not suggesting you go anywhere near a Titan. The price there is pretty silly, but it's just amazing how low consoles set the bar this generation. I don't think many people realize this. Incidentally I didn't even realize it until I picked up what I thought was modest PC for work and it ended up ramming out 60FPS on games next gen consoles still struggle with. I was just running some games on it for a curiosity benchmark - I certainly didn't expect that. It was a bit of an ah "Ah hah" moment.
Yeah BF4 looks better on my old brother´s computer than in a PS4. Unlike the ps4 version that old PC is running BF4 at true 1080p 60fps high settings.
Nowadays you can build a $700 PC to do that, granted is more money than a PS4 but you get so much more, not just visuals: You get a open ecosystem, Distribution platforms that actually respect their costumers (steam, gog, gmg), bunch of free to play, indie, strategy games, mods, developer tools, true gameplay diversity.
Plus you can even get creative and do somenthing else with your PC; I'm a webdev building a small 2d game with C# and the Monogame framework as a hobby.
I mean sorry if I sound too passionate about PCs, but ohh well fuck it, I'm.. Personal Computers are awesome.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
I like how that graph shows a slight downward trend. Reminds me of the doodle GIF from sales age. It makes sense but is also not 100% accurate. Nice to look at though.
Schweinehund
Member
This is tag worthy.
LUFTRAUSER
Banned
Well you see, that is probably because Minecraft is out on the Xbox 360, the PS3, the PS4, and the Xbox One. According to Wikipedia, those consoles all together have sold over 175 million units.
The Nintendo Wii release is irrelevant; it is no longer a popular console. Nintendo doesn't even support the mediocre online features it has any longer, and the Wii U? Hah!
Something that is common knowledge but which the Nintendo sycophants will never admit is that Nintedo's target demo doesn't give a flying fuck about it, and Nintendo is too inward-focused to change. I don't think Iwata even knows about Minecraft.
Tidus_Great
Banned
does the PC have last of us remastered?
lukeskymac
Member
Even assuming what you did doesn't invalidate any comparisons, do you expect every console-only customer to do that?
I think one should consider the ongoing cost of software while comparing PC to console. Even sticking with used, physical games for consoles, one should be able to save a substantial amount of money annually purchasing PC versions of games - even if only using Steam (ignoring Humble Bundles, other digital distribution platforms, etc). I have no dog or investment in that fight, BTW, just wanted to point that out.
Shareware, Romero says. No demos, if you wanted to play the game you had to spend $50 blind, huh? Jeff Minter has something to say about your version of "shareware." Crippleware is more accurate.
fluffydelusions
Member
Does PS4 have _insert PC only game here_
don't do this, its shit like this that make us console guy's look like retards.
Dr Amazon MD
Member
"Insert PC only game here" didn't win over 50 game of the year awards did it?
I'm just kidding, I love gaming on PC and all the consoles
LUFTRAUSER
Banned
I just want to point something out. If you think it is funny when the console people get salty over a $400 machine, you don't want to taunt the PC gamers. We have probably spent more, maybe even spent a lot more, than that on our machines.
Most of us are past the point about caring about exclusives.
Marauder Shields
Member
In the business this is what we call a gg no re.
LUFTRAUSER
Banned
Consider that PC is the reason Minecraft ever existed. I played Minecraft years ago, back when the beta phase had just started. It was PC only then, and it was actually fun to play too because it wasn't full of bullshit RPG "features" and the servers weren't full of tweens! The PC version made Minecraft popular!
No shit it sold better on consoles; by then, it was popular.
Dr Amazon MD
Member
You tell people not to taunt the PC gamers, and then in the next post you start taunting the console gamers. Haha
I don't think so really.
If you had a limited budget, game price and mandatory fees just to play online would kill it on consoles. If the console break you got limited warranties (lifetime warranties yo, not so long ago a 580 became a 760 sc thanks evga) The games you pay all have a premium of at least 10 to 15$ at release and even more if you watch for deals and used games is over 20$ after like 6 months, add that up to the monthly fees you pay on a console and you end up with it being cheaper on PC and getting a better experience while gaming.
Add that to the less flexible gaming experience because of the forced input and the limited game experience. As a platform in general, streaming, editing, web browsing, multitasking, multimedia is simply 10 times better on pc. It also adopt new tech way faster.
Plus the library you get on a console is stuck in the past and won't carry over other platform and tech wise (no mods, flat resolution and framerate)
I still don't get why consoles exist today, there is literally no reason for them to exist, the only reason you would buy them is to get exclusives and those games would be a better experience on pc anyway. The ease of use of the pc is different then from the 90's and anyone who can do legos can build one withing 2 hours. Installing windows is like installing a game on a console and picking parts is as simple as following 2-3 guilds to know what you are doing.
PC gamers don't re-pay for the same game at a higher res because they don't ever need to.
LUFTRAUSER
Banned
I'm not taunting the console gamers. I am taunting one particular console gamer. In fact, consoles are actually more fun to use than PCs; one of the reasons Steam is so popular is that it has added a lot of console features, like friends, achievements, and a unified UI, to PC gaming. This added accessibility has brought a lot of new people into the PC gaming space; I was one such person, in fact. And besides, I was only mentioning the Wii U, not one of the more relevant consoles.
The weird thing about this thread is that people are conflating better sales with superiority; that isn't actually always the case. The Sony Betamax tape format was way better than the VHS format, but the VHS format won out.
Why?
Because it was cheaper and an open platform.
lukeskymac
Member
I would love to re-pay for a Homeworld with better models, textures, and native support for widescreen.
Wait a sec, that's exactly what's going to happen! The more you know.
Stick a FYP in your post when you're going to make up quotes from a user, or even better - don't do it.
And no I don't. People say the cost of a PS4 is $400. The more realistic scenario for most enthusiasts is going to be more like: $400 + $60 game * 2 + $60 extra controller + $50 online access + $50 warranty/tax +$50 PSN/Live points. That's pushing towards $800. I certainly don't expect them to just give all that up and go pick up a new gaming device because they realized it's a better deal.
However, I do believe that knowledge is power. The user I was responding to said he couldn't imagine setting up a PC that outperforms his PS4 for a comparable price. Well now he can. I think one reason the consoles launched with such middling hardware this generation is because the companies knew they could. I certainly had no idea they did and I thought $400 was a perfectly reasonable price for the PS4, for instance. If consumers as a whole were more educated it'd obligate companies to provide better value to obtain their patronage, which is ultimately better for everybody.
njean777
Member
What enthusiast is going to buy the warranty? Most people won't buy an extra controller when they purchase the console or until they absolutely need one, and most will not purchase the live/psn credit. Nor will they likely spend 60$ on 2 games. I could just throw out that 800$ for a pc (that will last 4 years) plus another 100$ for a decent kb/m, plus a monitor if you are not using your TV. I mean we can play the list game all you want but it just doesn't work. A ps4 is cheaper at this point then building a comparable pc. I believe the last build I saw was 550$ to get the comparable power of the new consoles. Prices could have went down by now, but I wouldn't know as I haven't been keeping up with PC part prices for awhile now.
Schweinehund
Member
Last of Us is pretty good, but its not even close to Dota 2.
Freeman
Banned
As someone who has been a PC gamer my entire life, I feel like I'm moving away from PC gaming or at least investing way less on it.
The best PC games for me aren't very demanding and for as much as people talk about graphics, etc, in the end the games with the best production value tend to be console exclusives/ports anyway. Is there even a really demanding game for PC that is great and isn't a port to justify all the focus on hardware? Usually what I see are people posting screenshots of Crysis 3 and ignoring the fact that the game isn't any good.
I really feel like the lack of a flagship game like an hypothetical HL³ and the overall drop in quality(very often consolization) of many traditional PC devs (Bioware, Blizzard, Bethesda, id,Irrational Games, etc).
In the past I felt like there was something different about PC games and today, outside of strategy games, I just don't see it very much. I hope that Oculus Rift is able to shake things up.
A lot of the things that I use to see as disadvantages for consoles today are things I value.
*I really dislike free-to-play.
The best PC games for me aren't very demanding and for as much as people talk about graphics, etc, in the end the games with the best production value tend to be console exclusives/ports anyway. Is there even a really demanding game for PC that is great and isn't a port to justify all the focus on hardware? Usually what I see are people posting screenshots of Crysis 3 and ignoring the fact that the game isn't any good.
I really feel like the lack of a flagship game like an hypothetical HL³ and the overall drop in quality(very often consolization) of many traditional PC devs (Bioware, Blizzard, Bethesda, id,Irrational Games, etc).
In the past I felt like there was something different about PC games and today, outside of strategy games, I just don't see it very much. I hope that Oculus Rift is able to shake things up.
A lot of the things that I use to see as disadvantages for consoles today are things I value.
*I really dislike free-to-play.
Halo saved FPS? Kill me.
njean777
Member
two very different games, plus one doesn't have a toxic community telling you that you are a human piece of garbage 24/7.
Xisiqomelir
Member
I am remedying the dearth of this quote on page 3.
fluffydelusions
Member
Don't really see that a lot in DOTA. Now LoL...
phoenix296
Member
That's hardly fair to compare a game that came out almost 15 years ago to one that came out last year.
Any ways I'm excited to be playing the upcoming Grim Fandago remaster.
Crimsonclaw111
Member
njean777
Member
I will admit it is not as bad on Dota, but I have seen it get just as bad as LOL on Dota before. The community for both games is terrible and really brings down newcomers to the games. It comes with the territory I suppose, but still it isn't justified nor should it be put up with.
Schweinehund
Member
I'm not much of a single player gamer, but apparently Skyrim is still extremely popular with PC mod support on Steam.
I place a much high value on gameplay so PC naturally speaks to me with games focused on multiplayer and socializing.
Probably ones that don't make money.
Aarglefarg
Member
Just for accuracy, it's not out on the PS4 or Xbox One yet.
Also, how many PCs have been sold? How many phones that Minecraft can run on? Much more than 175 million.
Not sure about Iwata, but:
"Shigeru Miyamoto and Shinya Takahashi, heads of Nintendo's internal development teams, said to Kotaku that they believe Mojang's popular crafting game would be a good fit on the 3DS and Wii U."
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/nintendo-thinking-about-minecraft-on-wii-u-3ds/1100-6420643/