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Danganronpa Mafia |OT| Grin and Bear It

C

CzarTim

Member
AbsolutBro said:
Reading the thread, it's interesting to see the new players diving in headfirst in a way that I wasn't capable of in my first game (WDiotL). Good stuff! Too bad I have to

vote: kingkitty

Even though you were kind enough not to jump on the "punish Absolutbro train" as you put it, in a field of "not much information", couple things seemed off:


Soft request for a role claim? I mean, I think most people realized what swamped was doing, and this:

Heretical Khornate scum? Not on my watch citizen!
Click to expand...

Dammit AB I already agree with you. Don't hurt me again :(

vote: kingkitty

Don't like the role fishing.
Terrabyte20xx said:
I was in the middle of typing when he posted his question. :/
Click to expand...

And yet you don't unvote? Do you feel like gosh's soft claim is fake? I agreed with your vote in that gosh's first post was bad, but I don't feel comfortable touching it now. What do you think of Corn bringing gosh's soft claim to the forefront of the conversation rather than letting it slide?

Makai said:
Oh, and...

http://i.imgur.com/nI2ol7A.png[IMG][/QUOTE]

come by and play mario kart with me!

That said, you need to vote for someone today. Not kidding when I say anyone who doesn't will be at the top of my suspect list.

(^^ you too salva)

[quote="kgtrep, post: 173901705"]Thanks everyone who answered my questionnaire. I know it's silly, but we can learn more about each other by engaging in these activities. If you haven't answered and want to, just say yes or no to the card that you choose.

(Plus, why should the mafia get to have all the fun by cornering us in doubt and paranoia on our first day? We should be messing with them instead.)[/QUOTE]

Point to a post where it actually contributed to the conversation rather than being distracting. That kind of stuff allows scum to appear to be contributing without actually doing anything.

--------------

would like to see more reads from everyone tbh. It's okay to be wrong as long as you explain your reasoning!
Click to expand...
 
K

kingkitty

Member
CzarTim said:
Dammit AB I already agree with you. Don't hurt me again :(

vote: kingkitty

Don't like the role fishing.
!
Click to expand...

It was a fluff comment, "role fishing" give me a break Czar. More often than not the person who is about to be lynched will role claim, and I was hoping it wouldn't be a role that was devastatingly important.

A simple fluff comment to make myself seem more active.
 
C

CzarTim

Member
kingkitty said:
It was a fluff comment, "role fishing" give me a break Czar. More often than not the person who is about to be lynched will role claim, and I was hoping it wouldn't be a role that was devastatingly important.

A simple fluff comment to make myself seem more active.
Click to expand...

uh, that's not helping your case, my friend. Do you mind giving me some alignment reads on some people?
 
C

CzarTim

Member
kingkitty said:
It was a fluff comment, "role fishing" give me a break Czar. More often than not the person who is about to be lynched will role claim, and I was hoping it wouldn't be a role that was devastatingly important.

A simple fluff comment to make myself seem more active.
Click to expand...

also why respond to my vote and not AB's?
 
C

CzarTim

Member
Sawneeks said:
I'm up for answering questions and giving you my best answer but, honestly, I don't know what else to say. With no information to go on everyone is moving blindly right now and I'm not really feeling confident on who to vote for and who not to vote for. I have my suspicions on some people but nothing that tells me 'hey they are PROBABLY despair'.
Click to expand...

Is anyone at least pinging you as probably town? What do you think of the people who want to no lynch?
 
K

kingkitty

Member
CzarTim said:
also why respond to my vote and not AB's?
Click to expand...

it was the first time in a bit that I looked at the thread, and your post was the first thing I saw. but everything I said can be applied to absolutbro.

CzarTim said:
uh, that's not helping your case, my friend. Do you mind giving me some alignment reads on some people?
Click to expand...

I could lie and say that post had some great pro-town reason for existing. But it doesn't. It's just fluff. Cotton candy.

Anyways, I don't know what else to say. It was just a "gee hope absolutbro isn't super important", and note that I wasn't exactly hot out of the gate on the idea of lynching him. Sure, he could still be mafia, but based on what little info we have, I think probability wise we should at least exclude him for day 1. Makai too.

I don't think anyone should be freely-deely roleclaiming at this point. We already potentially have one special role out in the open (whether it was intentional or not, could be some kind of clever despair play, I don't know).

Because it's early on, there's not a lot to look at in terms of role alignment, but I'll switch my vote from goshu to...

vote: ViviOggi

Only has two posts.

First post:
ViviOggi said:
Yoooooo
Click to expand...

This was before the game started.

Second post:
ViviOggi said:
Harsh, but I'll jump on this bandwagon as well. Let's see your defense, AB.

VOTE: AbsolutBro
Click to expand...

This was 24 hours ago, and nothing else since. If ViviviOggi was despair, he could be right now chilling in the back, knowing that the school will eat it's own on day 1. He gladly bandwagons for absolutbro's demise. Because it gives him the opportunity to push for the death of an innocent, while still fitting within the crowd of bandwagoners. And then he sits back, and lets the game stew. Post only as much as needed.

It's not based on strong information, but it's what I got right now.
 
F

franconp

Member
SalvaPot said:
Anyway, I am strongly Pro-No lynch on the first day, people who know me from the Animal Crossing game knows why, I believe there has to be an investigative role between hope and our chances of finding a despair player this early on the game is low low low, as low as Yamcha´s Ki. If we get a Hope aligned character on Day 1 and Dispair gets another one on Night 1, that is 2 members less that could have been useful to us.
Click to expand...

In the AC game the only investigative role was mine and I was HHA so don't get your hopes high with that. We don't know what roles are in play here.
 
V

ViviOggi

Member
kingkitty said:
Because it's early on, there's not a lot to look at in terms of role alignment, but I'll switch my vote from goshu to...

vote: ViviOggi

Only has two posts.

First post:


This was before the game started.

Second post:


This was 24 hours ago, and nothing else since. If ViviviOggi was despair, he could be right now chilling in the back, knowing that the school will eat it's own on day 1. He gladly bandwagons for absolutbro's demise. Because it gives him the opportunity to push for the death of an innocent, while still fitting within the crowd of bandwagoners. And then he sits back, and lets the game stew. Post only as much as needed.

It's not based on strong information, but it's what I got right now.
Click to expand...

?????

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=173857995&postcount=389
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=173861058&postcount=398

I can't really believe that anyone would make such a poor attempt at deflection, so I'd assume you simply skipped that page by accident. Then again you typed all of this, even emphasizing the post in question dating back 24 hours and specifically claiming I hadn't posted since, but couldn't bother going through four pages with Ctrl+F to back it up? Seems unlikely and rather fishy.

--------------

I'm just now catching up with the last couple of pages, some thoughts:

CzarTim could just be an experienced Hope player who wants to get people talking in order to gain information, but his recent posts have a slight taste of overly proactive scum trying to rile up Hope against itself. That's just a gut feeling though and I might be completely off-base, and it's not enough for me to justify a vote yet.

Speaking of voting, I explained my reasoning for jumping on swamped's bandwagon (whose follow-up posts seem genuine to me, by the way), and AbsolutBro's defense isn't much more than an appeal to trust but what else can he say at this early stage. I feel that it's fair enough and am retracting my vote for now.

UNVOTE: AbsolutBro
 
K

kingkitty

Member
ViviOggi said:
?????

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=173857995&postcount=389
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=173861058&postcount=398

I can't really believe that anyone would make such a poor attempt at deflection, so I'd assume you simply skipped that page by accident. Then again you typed all of this, even emphasizing the post in question dating back 24 hours and specifically claiming I hadn't posted since, but couldn't bother going through four pages with Ctrl+F to back it up? Seems unlikely and rather fishy.
Click to expand...

LOL my bad, I think I mistyped your name when ctrl-f'ing. I think it's a bit risky for despair to make such a big mistake, but hey maybe I'm just despair who isn't very careful. I don't mind if you vote for me in retaliation, I would too.
 
V

ViviOggi

Member
kingkitty said:
LOL my bad, I think I mistyped your name when ctrl-f'ing. I think it's a bit risky for despair to make such a big mistake, but hey maybe I'm just despair who isn't very careful. I don't mind if you vote for me in retaliation, I would too.
Click to expand...

No counter-vote yet, a simple typo does seem more likely than a Despair player being this careless. But I've got my eyes on you, especially since you're still sticking with your vote
anuxi_trees.gif
 
C

CzarTim

Member
Thanks for responding King, but I think I'll leave my vote where it is for now.

ViviOggi said:
CzarTim could just be an experienced Hope player who wants to get people talking in order to gain information, but his recent posts have a slight taste of overly proactive scum trying to rile up Hope against itself. That's just a gut feeling though and I might be completely off-base, and it's not enough for me to justify a vote yet.
Click to expand...
Yeah get used to me talking a lot and trying to generate discussion. I had more than a hundred posts more than anyone in SW mafia and I was town there. This does not mean I should be immune to suspicion at all, but I'm very used to the "he posts a lot therefore scum" argument, so please bring up specific posts if you have a problem. I'm happy to answer any questions!

Right now we have a lot of people not posting a lot in the way of opinions, so questions and voting are the best tools to generate momentum.
 
K

kingkitty

Member
kingkitty said:
LOL my bad, I think I mistyped your name when ctrl-f'ing. I think it's a bit risky for despair to make such a big mistake, but hey maybe I'm just despair who isn't very careful. I don't mind if you vote for me in retaliation, I would too.
Click to expand...

Well I mean, I would mind a little bit, but I would understand why.

Well then I guess I'll switch my vote back to goshujinsama, sorry goshujinsama.

I don't have much of a great read on anyone's potential despairness, but maybe goshujinsama should go. Why? He already outed his special role. What if in the next 24 or so hours, we end up with a few more players who will crack under pressure from the growing votes and role claim their special role as well?

By the end of Day 1, mafia might already have a small list of special role claims, without them even trying.

A switcher seems useful, but with goshujinsama as switcher, he could end up on defense this whole game. In fact, if mafia picks him to die tonight, he could self-switch with someone else, and potentially kill another student who has another awesome special role.

If we simply kill goshujinsama, we would take out this known quantity. And then despair would have to guess on who to kill tonight. They could potentially kill a useless, loser ordinary student instead. And of course, there's also the chance goshujinsama is a neutral, or a bluffing despair.

vote: goshujinsama

Now you're all free to say "kingkitty that's a horrible fucking idea". This isn't yet a locked in vote for goshujinsama. Things could change due to me being wishy washy, or if goshujinsama makes me feel bad.
 
K

kingkitty

Member
I suppose it'd be less suspicious to pick someone else that's not goshujinsama. But this is my play, and blood will be shed for the blood god. Whether it's mine, goshujinsama, or crab.
 
V

ViviOggi

Member
Actually thinking about it more, kingkitty, the nature of your mistake doesn't support you being Hope at all. You could have made that typo and not notice just as easily being Despair, perhaps a bit flustered after being accused of role fishing so early. You're the most suspicious player to me right now, and your most recent post aiming at the most likely special role isn't doing you any favors either. Assuming you're Despair lynching goshujinsama now is exactly what you'd want, as it's your best (even only) shot at taking out a strong role without any hassle. The chance of him self-switching with another role is much lower than the benefit of taking him out willy-nilly. So...

VOTE: kingkitty
 
S

*Splinter

Member
9f9.jpg


Well, I wasn't planning on voting today but KingKitty is making an... 'interesting' play. Seriously you're suggesting we lynch a possible town power role, you're going to have to explain your logic again
 
V

ViviOggi

Member
My last sentence is garbage, what I meant to say is that it's not worth risking to lynch a strong role only for the low chance that he'd self-switch with another of the few remaining roles.
 
K

kingkitty

Member
CornBurrito said:
Actually it's more about what you did before that post.
Click to expand...

ah yes, I could be despair who made a bad typo. It's not out of the realm of possibility.

anyways, if I check this thread 10 hours later and I'm getting extra votes, I'm not going to role claim (whether it's special or ordinary). Because there's a chance people will be like "oh we don't want to lynch hope players, lets switch our votes to someone else". And then we'll fall into another trap where mafia gets to know about various role claims early in the game for no good reason.

So while I rather not be destroyed tonight, I only just started this game, so I'm not quite invested yet to be completely devastated by what's happening. Ultimately, someone has to be Barryloche.
 
S

*Splinter

Member
I have been rereading it, I just can't see any way for this to be our best move. I was seriously hoping you could explain it again?
kingkitty said:
A switcher seems useful, but with goshujinsama as switcher, he could end up on defense this whole game. In fact, if mafia picks him to die tonight, he could self-switch with someone else, and potentially kill another student who has another awesome special role.

If we simply kill goshujinsama, we would take out this known quantity. And then despair would have to guess on who to kill tonight. They could potentially kill a useless, loser ordinary student instead. And of course, there's also the chance goshujinsama is a neutral, or a bluffing despair
Click to expand...
You say he might switch himself with another power role, but if we kill him now then the Mafia could just target another power role directly, how does that help us? On the other hand, he might switch himself with a mafia player and get them killed - Mafia are never going to target themselves intentionally so this would be a huge bonus to the town.

If I'm missing something please explain.

We shouldn't even be talking about town power roles day 1, this is so stupid
 
K

Kalor

Member
The idea of lynching a potential power role is interesting. I can understand Kingkittys point of view as we could lose an another power role if Goshu gets targeted tonight. Of course we don't know if this potential switcher is able to target themselves or not. I would assume they could but their role could of been adjusted in some way.

I do want to hear from Goshu first as for all we know they used switcher as an example and we're all jumping to conclusion. We still have about a day and a half left of this day phase so we have plenty of time to talk and determine what course of action we want to take.

I see SalvaPot has posted and the only reason I voted them was because they hadn't posted so I guess I'll lift my vote.

Unvote: SalvaPot
 
K

kgtrep

Member
kingkitty, why would we lynch goshujinsama whose claimed power we already know, especially if he may be Hope-aligned? If he is actually Despair, since he is playing for the first time, it'd make more sense that he would privately ask other Despair members for clarification.

The way I see it, the Despair will take care of goshujinsama one night or another, if he is Hope or neutral to begin with. We should be using our votes on someone else.
 
K

kingkitty

Member
CzarTim said:
ugh king come on man what are you doing? if you're town this isn't helpful.
Click to expand...

This is my plan.

Plan 1) This isn't a great plan, but I don't want to see day 1 devolve into needless role claims. It might not be "very helpful", but whatever, it's just a silly idea, people don't have to dig it.

Plan 2) My death

In the (seems like high) possibility people react negatively to my plan, which then leads to my own death. Well so be it. My death could "very helpful" for the town, maybe. Hopefully. It depends I guess. Then I can watch, stress free from the comfort of dead island, to see if my move actually paid off. Which there's a good chance it won't. But hey, it might.
 
C

CornBurrito

Member
Kalor said:
The idea of lynching a potential power role is interesting. I can understand Kingkittys point of view as we could lose an another power role if Goshu gets targeted tonight. Of course we don't know if this potential switcher is able to target themselves or not. I would assume they could but their role could of been adjusted in some way.
Click to expand...

Except this created a worst case scenario where we lose two power roles anyway because we punish goshu and then Despair gets lucky and targets a Hope power role.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Can we focus on Makai for a moment? I am not happy that he can make so many posts, half of which are fluff, and the rest conclude that he shouldn't have to make any firm conclusions. It is true that our odds of hitting Hope are higher than those of hitting Despair. This is also true of every single day the game goes on, given that if Hope and Despair are equal, Despair wins.

This is not a game about logical deduction. We do not win by waiting for the magical PRs to descend from the heavens and bestow upon us the almighty knowledge of who the scum is; if the game did work that way it would be a bad game. We win by being able to make gut reads, and our ability to make gut reads is severely impinged at the point a player does not commit to anything.

I want everyone to have a vote down at all times, and be defending that vote, and be listing potential other people they would be voting if it wasn't for the fact their current vote was better. What I don't want is people voting No Punishment, or even just not voting. Those people are bad, and I will vote them until they rectify the above situation. kingkitty has said his piece and he has thrown out a fairly poor defense, admittedly, but at least he has some ideas about the state of other players.

Makai has nothing.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Also, re: goshujinsama, that's fine, as long as only one PR has accidentally outed themselves, we can cope. I'm sure we have investigative roles of some sort and it is very likely we have specifically either a watcher or a doctor. Having a tracker stationed on people we consider highly likely to be town means that Despair will have to avoid those people, at least untl they've scouted a bit more carefully for other roles they could be activating by going for a too-obvious kill.
 
K

Kalor

Member
Crab said:
I want everyone to have a vote down at all times, and be defending that vote, and be listing potential other people they would be voting if it wasn't for the fact their current vote was better. What I don't want is people voting No Punishment, or even just not voting. Those people are bad, and I will vote them until they rectify the above situation. kingkitty has said his piece and he has thrown out a fairly poor defense, admittedly, but at least he has some ideas about the state of other players.

Makai has nothing.
Click to expand...

I do agree with you about everyone having a vote at all times. It gives us something to discuss and come back to on later days. I was curious and looked to see who hasn't voted at all yet and those people are:

ANuclearError
A Human Becoming
Hagi
Zippedpinhead

Right now I'm not sure on Makai as they've pushed themself into the spotlight by voting No Punishment. I feel like if someone was aligned with Despair then they would just vote for someone and stick with it, not voting for the controversial choice. The fact they were fine with someone voting for them also makes me lean towards them being not being Despair, at least for now.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
CornBurrito said:
I'm simply going to point you to post #457, and maybe you'll reach the same conclusion I did.
Click to expand...

#457 is exactly the post I find particularly scummy. This is not a game about PRs. The purest form of this game doesn't have PRs at all. This is about understanding people and reading emotions and looking for tells. We get all of those as a result of people putting forward concrete statements. "I am going to wait until someone tells me what to do", which is effectively what #457 says, tells us nothing.

Look at it this way. Option 1: he is Hope. He is now a free kill. If Despair kill him, what did we learn from his death? What were Despair trying to hide from us, keep from being exposed, what opinions are they afraid of? We don't know, because he didn't commit to any statements or make judgements about any others. Despair therefore have a free target they can kill that doesn't give Hope anything more to work with.

Option 2: he is Despair. We have nothing to pin him down with. When we find other Despair players later in the game, and are looking for links or shared logic or particular voting patterns or any of the other numerous tells that reveal mafia, we will find nothing (or at least, much less) from Makai because he's not willing to commit to what can be the most dangerous stage for Despair players - the early game, when it is unclear who the future threats will be and which players will need to be sucked up to.

No Punishment is either a) very bad town play, or b) indicative of Despair. It becomes even worse in either a) or b) at the point that someone is voting No Punishment not because they don't suspect anyone, but because they (apparently) have no suspicions at all.

We now have a number of posts from a number of players which should give at least enough information to argue that, even if it is not probable any given player is Despair, some of them are at least more probable than others. I want to hear those arguments. All I hear from Makai is fluff and vacuities.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
For what it's worth, I also am considering a vote for Zipped, but right now I'm keeping it on Makai until he gives me some kind of engagement.
 
C

CornBurrito

Member
Crab said:
#457 is exactly the post I find particularly scummy. This is not a game about PRs.

No Punishment is either a) very bad town play, or b) indicative of Despair. It becomes even worse in either a) or b) at the point that someone is voting No Punishment not because they don't suspect anyone, but because they (apparently) have no suspicions at all.
Click to expand...

For me, the point of interest is why he claims to want to do No Punishment. I agree No Punishment is a bad move for town though. However I'm thinking of a situation where I'd be Hope and want to do a No Punishment on Day, and that situation is what causes me to hesitate. For that reason I personally will not be voting for Makai on Day1. When Day2 comes around I'll see, but I am not comfortable making him the Day1 target because of my suspicions.
 
C

CzarTim

Member
Crabman, I agree with your sentiment on Mak but I was going to give him a chance to post some more since he said he is moving.

When you say king's response is bad, do you mean bad as in town-bad or scum-flailing-bad?
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
CzarTim said:
Crabman, I agree with your sentiment on Mak but I was going to give him a chance to post some more since he said he is moving.

When you say king's response is bad, do you mean bad as in town-bad or scum-flailing-bad?
Click to expand...

I read it as flailing. I mean, I've tried some pretty out-there strategies as a suspected mafia in the past, but suggesting to lynch the person everyone thinks is the town PR when you're top suspect for the day is a bit of a stretch even for me. Xanatos would be proud if I'm reading that wrong.
 
C

CzarTim

Member
Yeah I'm at that point to. It's just that in ONUW 2 king was on the wolf team and didn't even vote with his team so I had to pause for a moment and consider it a least a possibility.

vote: mak

Let's get some reads from our non-voting friends.
 
K

kingkitty

Member
CzarTim said:
Yeah I'm at that point to. It's just that in ONUW 2 king was on the wolf team and didn't even vote with his team so I had to pause for a moment and consider it a least a possibility.
.
Click to expand...

Czar I actually meant to vote for sawneeks, but I had a brain fart and voted for roytheone instead. They were both part of the fake conspiracy, got them mixed up. Didn't matter in the end though.
 
Z

Zippedpinhead

Member
Crab said:
#457 is exactly the post I find particularly scummy. This is not a game about PRs. The purest form of this game doesn't have PRs at all. This is about understanding people and reading emotions and looking for tells. We get all of those as a result of people putting forward concrete statements. "I am going to wait until someone tells me what to do", which is effectively what #457 says, tells us nothing.

No Punishment is either a) very bad town play, or b) indicative of Despair. It becomes even worse in either a) or b) at the point that someone is voting No Punishment not because they don't suspect anyone, but because they (apparently) have no suspicions at all.

We now have a number of posts from a number of players which should give at least enough information to argue that, even if it is not probable any given player is Despair, some of them are at least more probable than others. I want to hear those arguments. All I hear from Makai is fluff and vacuities.
Click to expand...


Makai's posts are very vague for how long they are (at least with my posts im trying to let you all know when I'll be voting and that I'm following the conversation.). I think a no vote at this point will not benefit us and even trying to push for that is suspect. So j agree with you crab.

CornBurrito said:
For me, the point of interest is why he claims to want to do No Punishment. I agree No Punishment is a bad move for town though. However I'm thinking of a situation where I'd be Hope and want to do a No Punishment on Day, and that situation is what causes me to hesitate. For that reason I personally will not be voting for Makai on Day1. When Day2 comes around I'll see, but I am not comfortable making him the Day1 target because of my suspicions.
Click to expand...

Every time we (as in mafia GAF has done a day no punishment it has hurt town, whether by letting a mafia to free, or by identifying a good power role that the scum just prepared to kill the next night.

I am all for punishing each day, even when it was me in SW mafia. Based on posts I'm leaning towards voting makai or kingkitty. I'll go with my gut and vote=makai


Crab said:
For what it's worth, I also am considering a vote for Zipped, but right now I'm keeping it on Makai until he gives me some kind of engagement.
Click to expand...

Don't say that crab, after all our time together....
 
C

CornBurrito

Member
Look I'm just going to say it outright then. I think Makai is the Hope player with the investigate power, because he seems so utterly confidant that we'll have useful information tomorrow.
 
C

CornBurrito

Member
*confident

And I am for punishing on Day1. I don't agree with Makai's reasoning at all. But I know that if I were the Hope investigator, I'd be pulling my hair out knowing that if everyone just waited one day I could gather some useful intel so we aren't all going in blind.

Alternatively he is Despair. But I am more suspicious of kingkitty than I am of Makai for right now.
 
K

kingkitty

Member
it seems like the school is not vibing to my idea.

so I'll

unvote: goshujinsama

I thought it was a great idea, the best idea. But I guess I'll have to change course. Hopefully the school doesn't turn into a role claim fest.

If you think I'm an incompetent despair (to be fair, I was a slightly lazy werewolf in another game) then fine. I'm a despair who mistyped "ViviOggi" into ctrl-f. I'm a despair who secretly "fished for roles". I'm a despair who targeted the only currently known power role for eviction, while at the time, being under suspicion by others.

Perhaps I'm a despair who is purposely looking incompetent. People can say "hey that person is acting incompetent, he can't possibly be despair!".

Anyways, I understand the blood god's need for blood. If you think I'm an incompetent despair who made some ill advised moves without even discussing it with the other despairs, then quench your blood thirst. If you think I'm purposely acting incompetent in order to avoid suspicion, quench your blood thirst. I can freely say this because because even in death, I will help lead this school to victory...or defeat, hopefully victory.
 
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