TheAwesomePossum
Banned
I'm no scummier than the scum in-between your teeth.why didn't I think to ask this?
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Archer [Mafia] |OT| Wait, I Had Something For This
- Thread starter Ourobolus
- Start date
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
Morning, gang!!
Lots of posts, I see! Yaaaay
Havent caught up, but skimmed through and I am so so so sorry Razmos, if I seemed like I wanted to prod activity out of you ;___; I was just, I thought it may had some merits to hear from the voices that I hardly hear because yesterday's situation was a clusterfuck that my mind was struggling to cope with...
Really, it was just a ping. Like I was quite pleased to hear from QB even if it just to indicate that he will come back with more thoughtful response at a later time.
Cuz I just think.... I donno .... we're really swinging into D2 and despite Seath and ER stuff yesterday.... I feel like we have yet to yield solid leads for our D2 lynch candidate? Is it just me? x____x
And I feel sometimes I have thought about a thing over and over and over and over again and then I lose perspective.... then it's usually nice to hear the point of view from someone totally different :>
But, yesh, apologies. I didin't mean to push that hard ;____;
Anyway! Hope things will smooth over for you Razmos and thank you for participating so far :>
SO. I will return with a proper reply once I caught up, but I would really like us to start to get some good bearing on our lynch candidate for D2 if possible
Also, WELCOME POSSUM~ \o/
Lots of posts, I see! Yaaaay
Havent caught up, but skimmed through and I am so so so sorry Razmos, if I seemed like I wanted to prod activity out of you ;___; I was just, I thought it may had some merits to hear from the voices that I hardly hear because yesterday's situation was a clusterfuck that my mind was struggling to cope with...
Really, it was just a ping. Like I was quite pleased to hear from QB even if it just to indicate that he will come back with more thoughtful response at a later time.
Cuz I just think.... I donno .... we're really swinging into D2 and despite Seath and ER stuff yesterday.... I feel like we have yet to yield solid leads for our D2 lynch candidate? Is it just me? x____x
And I feel sometimes I have thought about a thing over and over and over and over again and then I lose perspective.... then it's usually nice to hear the point of view from someone totally different :>
But, yesh, apologies. I didin't mean to push that hard ;____;
Anyway! Hope things will smooth over for you Razmos and thank you for participating so far :>
SO. I will return with a proper reply once I caught up, but I would really like us to start to get some good bearing on our lynch candidate for D2 if possible
Also, WELCOME POSSUM~ \o/
Morning, gang!!
Lots of posts, I see! Yaaaay
Havent caught up, but skimmed through and I am so so so sorry Razmos, if I seemed like I wanted to prod activity out of you ;___; I was just, I thought it may had some merits to hear from the voices that I hardly hear because yesterday's situation was a clusterfuck that my mind was struggling to cope with...
Really, it was just a ping. Like I was quite pleased to hear from QB even if it just to indicate that he will come back with more thoughtful response at a later time.
Cuz I just think.... I donno .... we're really swinging into D2 and despite Seath and ER stuff yesterday.... I feel like we have yet to yield solid leads for our D2 lynch candidate? Is it just me? x____x
And I feel sometimes I have thought about a thing over and over and over and over again and then I lose perspective.... then it's usually nice to hear the point of view from someone totally different :>
But, yesh, apologies. I didin't mean to push that hard ;____;
Anyway! Hope things will smooth over for you Razmos and thank you for participating so far :>
SO. I will return with a proper reply once I caught up, but I would really like us to start to get some good bearing on our lynch candidate for D2 if possible
Also, WELCOME POSSUM~ \o/
if you feel like you're losing perspective you can try starting over from the beginning, I find that it usually helps me to feel really confident about making a huge mistake.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
Yeah. I tried that ... And it made me simultaneously more convinced and more confused of some people's potential alignments... :x
But. Points taken! I will try to refrain from prodding.
EzekelRAGE
Member
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
i wasn't making any points. I was just trying to be helpful
but you aaaarrrrrrrreeeee <3 you are helpful!!! ^____^ VERY!
i love it when my posts are challenged or criticized.... idk. i think it's the only way i can sort of catch a more complete picture of things. for example, i was theorizing HARD on my own about Ezekel's claim
these were the thingies that went through my head:
- as it unfolded, ezekel claims he cant be killed at night unless by the honeypot. the first thought that popped in my head was: "............ hey, wouldn't that be a convenient cover for scum? cuz they do not die at nights!!! HO HO HO EZEKEL! YOU HADE MADE YOUR MATCH!"
- then i saw darryl's exchange with roytheone and palmer, and they were like, timing of his response does not denote that it was feasible for him to put on this story, 35 minutes after the day started. To which palmer replied, that's operating on the assumption that the mafia only got to know the results of the night's action when the day started. .... but what if they got their PMs earlier???
- ...
then my brain was like halp
oh, also palmer made a really good point on that mafia would like to have one member at every mission chat and that ER's roleclaim would have made a perfect story to get him into the mission every night.
But anyway, ER had volunteered fast and he didn't really need other people's help to get into the mission roll. This indicates, to me, that he was consistent with his thought processes and that he was genuine. In his mind, it was important to safeguard his spot in there, for 1) keeping himself alive just in case they send the honeypot in N2, and 2) to maximise the town's benefit for information in terms of sniffing out the honeypot if he does get killed.
So. All in all. I'm just going round and round in circles in my head. But reading you guys' post and soundboard in the thread.... really help. REALLY.
tl;dr ER is likely legit? and.... just ignore ynnny as she confuses herself further.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
Okay. I've caught up.
Thingies:
1. I'm verily not opposed to sending only two players to mission for N2. Will unvolunteer if required.
2. cabbeh and arkos are likely vanilla townies.
3. It was coincidental so bizarre like whoa when Ezekel claimed Archer role (with vulnerability only against the HoneyPot role) then reminded us that there was someone with a 'honeypot'-themed avatar (#1241)... and not long after, said avatar person revealed that he was indeed the 'honeypot'? My mind is pretty curly on the additional knowledge that I was the one that was using that avatar previously. (the fact that a lot of y'all refers to the honeypot as a she did not pass me by, either!)
(its not me! im too bitter to be honey-pot!) (i swear~)
For now I will leave the whole Archer / HoneyPot / ER / Seath / roleclaiming clusterfuck to the side. It hurts my brain.
4. My vote for the time being:
Vote: Mike_Hawk689
Reason:
Mike and Septimus are probably the two participants who has never offered reads on the game, even when squidy listed some names and he asked us to give him some perspectives on them. Everyone else had posted their reads of the other participants at different points of the game ... even newjoiner Darryl.
I got on Septimus case early on because I think he has been unresponsive when engaged, but I am pretty resigned on him for the time being. For now, I want to see if Mike will give me more than Septimus did.
Thingies:
1. I'm verily not opposed to sending only two players to mission for N2. Will unvolunteer if required.
2. cabbeh and arkos are likely vanilla townies.
3. It was coincidental so bizarre like whoa when Ezekel claimed Archer role (with vulnerability only against the HoneyPot role) then reminded us that there was someone with a 'honeypot'-themed avatar (#1241)... and not long after, said avatar person revealed that he was indeed the 'honeypot'? My mind is pretty curly on the additional knowledge that I was the one that was using that avatar previously. (the fact that a lot of y'all refers to the honeypot as a she did not pass me by, either!)
(its not me! im too bitter to be honey-pot!) (i swear~)
For now I will leave the whole Archer / HoneyPot / ER / Seath / roleclaiming clusterfuck to the side. It hurts my brain.
4. My vote for the time being:
Vote: Mike_Hawk689
Reason:
Mike and Septimus are probably the two participants who has never offered reads on the game, even when squidy listed some names and he asked us to give him some perspectives on them. Everyone else had posted their reads of the other participants at different points of the game ... even newjoiner Darryl.
I got on Septimus case early on because I think he has been unresponsive when engaged, but I am pretty resigned on him for the time being. For now, I want to see if Mike will give me more than Septimus did.
QuantumBro
Banned
Here are my thoughts on today:
Concerning Visualante2: Yeah I fucked up there with my accusation, but I honestly didnt think anything would come of it until it was too late. With that said, I dont think I can blame squidy for leading the charge against him since it would be kinda hypocritical, so Im not going to accuse him or Darryl of being KGB without further evidence.
With that said Unvote: Darryl
Concerning EzekelRAGE: Well that was a pretty big role claim. After reading through his posts, I think hes telling the truth, since it doesnt contradict any of the information we know and perfectly explains how there were no deaths the night before. However, I dont think the role claim was the smartest idea for reasons Ill get to later.
One point Ezekel brought up that I thought was good, was pointing out the people who were thinking that his role makes the town overpowered. I went back to the Star Wars game because I remembered hearing the same complaints after I role claimed as the second armorer. I looked at all the people who complained, and in fact one of them was a Hutt. Im not saying its the case here, but its an interesting thing to note. The complainers were
El Topo
roytheone
Burbeting
Concerning Seath: I dont know what to make of his actions, but I feel pretty confident saying hes not KGB. Im thinking some sort of neutral role. Someone should definitely keep an eye on him though.
Concerning Honeypot: Assuming that Ezekel isnt lying about his role (which I believe), then we know the power of one of the KGB agents. Now, we know that Ezekel was targeted by the KGB, but not by Honeypot, so Im thinking there are a few possibilities
1. KGB has a really good reason not to kill with Honeypot. Someone brought up that there could be a penalty for Honeypot, which would explain this.
2. Honeypot wasnt able to target Ezekel, because they were on a mission. This is what Im thinking happened. Remember that Ezekel said that his plan was to always volunteer to go on the missions, which makes sense since youll have the most protection and if you do end up dying, people will have three targets to choose from. With all that in mind, it also makes sense for Honeypot to want to go on every mission. The mission chat gives them a pretty good opportunity to figure out who Archer is, and if theyre really good, get Archer to role-claim. Mafia is still able to kill every night and able to let the Honeypot player kill if they figure it out.
So yeah, Im convinced that Honeypot is among the four members who went on the mission.
Again, here are the people who went on the mission:
Mazre
Palmer_v1
Arkos
Darryl
Of those, Mazre and Palmer are the only ones who volunteered again today, so I wouldnt suspect either Arkos or Darryl for the role of Honeypot.
However, what if Honeypot messed up and wasnt able to volunteer in time? Lets look at the backup list
Haly
Squidyj
El Topo
YesNOnoNOYes
Out of those four, there are two who also volunteered today; El Topo and YesNOnoNOYes.
So, I think the four most likely people to be Honeypot are
Mazre
Palmer_v1
El Topo
YesNOnoNOYes
I have a good idea who Honeypot is out of those four; but before I say who, I want some other people to discuss the theory and choose who first, especially after yesterday.
Concerning the game: Im think about asking for a replacement, since I dont know if I can keep up with everyone else in posting, with work and all. Im going to play out the rest of this day and see how I feel about it, but I thought I would give everyone a heads up first.
With all that said, Ill be back tomorrow.
Concerning Visualante2: Yeah I fucked up there with my accusation, but I honestly didnt think anything would come of it until it was too late. With that said, I dont think I can blame squidy for leading the charge against him since it would be kinda hypocritical, so Im not going to accuse him or Darryl of being KGB without further evidence.
With that said Unvote: Darryl
Concerning EzekelRAGE: Well that was a pretty big role claim. After reading through his posts, I think hes telling the truth, since it doesnt contradict any of the information we know and perfectly explains how there were no deaths the night before. However, I dont think the role claim was the smartest idea for reasons Ill get to later.
One point Ezekel brought up that I thought was good, was pointing out the people who were thinking that his role makes the town overpowered. I went back to the Star Wars game because I remembered hearing the same complaints after I role claimed as the second armorer. I looked at all the people who complained, and in fact one of them was a Hutt. Im not saying its the case here, but its an interesting thing to note. The complainers were
El Topo
roytheone
Burbeting
Concerning Seath: I dont know what to make of his actions, but I feel pretty confident saying hes not KGB. Im thinking some sort of neutral role. Someone should definitely keep an eye on him though.
Concerning Honeypot: Assuming that Ezekel isnt lying about his role (which I believe), then we know the power of one of the KGB agents. Now, we know that Ezekel was targeted by the KGB, but not by Honeypot, so Im thinking there are a few possibilities
1. KGB has a really good reason not to kill with Honeypot. Someone brought up that there could be a penalty for Honeypot, which would explain this.
2. Honeypot wasnt able to target Ezekel, because they were on a mission. This is what Im thinking happened. Remember that Ezekel said that his plan was to always volunteer to go on the missions, which makes sense since youll have the most protection and if you do end up dying, people will have three targets to choose from. With all that in mind, it also makes sense for Honeypot to want to go on every mission. The mission chat gives them a pretty good opportunity to figure out who Archer is, and if theyre really good, get Archer to role-claim. Mafia is still able to kill every night and able to let the Honeypot player kill if they figure it out.
So yeah, Im convinced that Honeypot is among the four members who went on the mission.
Again, here are the people who went on the mission:
Mazre
Palmer_v1
Arkos
Darryl
Of those, Mazre and Palmer are the only ones who volunteered again today, so I wouldnt suspect either Arkos or Darryl for the role of Honeypot.
However, what if Honeypot messed up and wasnt able to volunteer in time? Lets look at the backup list
Haly
Squidyj
El Topo
YesNOnoNOYes
Out of those four, there are two who also volunteered today; El Topo and YesNOnoNOYes.
So, I think the four most likely people to be Honeypot are
Mazre
Palmer_v1
El Topo
YesNOnoNOYes
I have a good idea who Honeypot is out of those four; but before I say who, I want some other people to discuss the theory and choose who first, especially after yesterday.
Concerning the game: Im think about asking for a replacement, since I dont know if I can keep up with everyone else in posting, with work and all. Im going to play out the rest of this day and see how I feel about it, but I thought I would give everyone a heads up first.
With all that said, Ill be back tomorrow.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
>___<
I spectacularly failed as a townie in SW... I was dazzled by Palmer's aura and I never ever suspected him as a baddie~
... Uh link is at the first page of the mafia recruitment thread, I think.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
QB! Yay, long post OF QUALITY CONTENTS <3
On your first point that the complainers in SW may give us some indication on how mafia behaves in this game........ I think it's a stretch. But the three names that came up are actually interesting. I will keep my eye on these three.
On your second point about the HoneyPot. I think some other players have covered this theory with regards to HoneyPot's likelihood being in a mission or wanting to get on a mission. I believe you have valid points but if I'm not mistaken, it is not quite a thorough approach to whittle down the honeypot-suspect-pool into such a lil pool. But, I do admit that the logic path to your deductions follows.
I'm still not quite sure myself, but as my posts above yours stated:
As for me: I totes don't mind unvolunteering if it will raise the likelihood that our Sterling is kept safe :>
On your availability: RL will always have to come first! But in my opinion, you don't have to be a high-activity poster if that's not your style. Quality > quantity ! But if you think the game is overwhelming, then I understand. I hope you will continue to play though ! SW graduates gotta stick together
.... In any case, keep us posted on this front, but whatever comes, thanks for playing with us so far
OF QUALITY CONTENTS <3On your first point that the complainers in SW may give us some indication on how mafia behaves in this game........ I think it's a stretch. But the three names that came up are actually interesting. I will keep my eye on these three.
On your second point about the HoneyPot. I think some other players have covered this theory with regards to HoneyPot's likelihood being in a mission or wanting to get on a mission. I believe you have valid points but if I'm not mistaken, it is not quite a thorough approach to whittle down the honeypot-suspect-pool into such a lil pool. But, I do admit that the logic path to your deductions follows.
I'm still not quite sure myself, but as my posts above yours stated:
As for me: I totes don't mind unvolunteering if it will raise the likelihood that our Sterling is kept safe :>
On your availability: RL will always have to come first! But in my opinion, you don't have to be a high-activity poster if that's not your style. Quality > quantity ! But if you think the game is overwhelming, then I understand. I hope you will continue to play though ! SW graduates gotta stick together
against Palmer
If mafia had a cross-kill role, someone who targeted outside of their normal pool (ie they can only target mission people if they aren't on the mission) then that's who you'd want on the mission. Nobody can be sure such a role exists so if people are scum reading you you can point to the fact that you were on the mission and couldn't have sent the kill (would work better in the late game). IF such a role exists then that is who you would get to send the kill if you didn't know who archer was.
As for septimus.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTp27BJwxx8
We had so many people making mistakes yesterday earlier on in the game that by the time Septimus came around with his whoppers we had sort of established the idea that we didn't think mafia wouldn't know how the rules worked, they had an extra couple days and some number of people in a chat room to figure this shit out so they wouldn't make those kinds of mistakes. Then, later on septimus keeps making mistake after mistake and I think it might be because he thought it would be read as town, because during the day it had previously been read as sort of town.
Vote: Septimus Prime
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTp27BJwxx8
We had so many people making mistakes yesterday earlier on in the game that by the time Septimus came around with his whoppers we had sort of established the idea that we didn't think mafia wouldn't know how the rules worked, they had an extra couple days and some number of people in a chat room to figure this shit out so they wouldn't make those kinds of mistakes. Then, later on septimus keeps making mistake after mistake and I think it might be because he thought it would be read as town, because during the day it had previously been read as sort of town.
Vote: Septimus Prime
Alright, my El Topo read, from Day 1:
Early volunteer but not quite fast enough. Hints at mission related powers.
More possible hints about a role.
I don't disagree with the sentiment, but he has yet to say anything of value himself at this point.
I concur, for fun's sake, that it's kinda fucked up to Day 1/Night 1 kill certain players.
Fair enough but he still hasn't posted anything concrete.
Fluff post, but I don't judge people based on just these.
Doing something finally.
Early volunteer but not quite fast enough. Hints at mission related powers.
More possible hints about a role.
I don't disagree with the sentiment, but he has yet to say anything of value himself at this point.
I concur, for fun's sake, that it's kinda fucked up to Day 1/Night 1 kill certain players.
Fair enough but he still hasn't posted anything concrete.
Fluff post, but I don't judge people based on just these.
Doing something finally.
Yes. Because you have. And you threw Vis in yesterday until we killed him. And I find it suspicious that you keep wanting to target the 3 of us. You've referred to them as "the company keep." Again, I will make it pointedly clear: Outside of explaining everything I've done to you and Akros, in detail, and a few pleasantries to new players/Star Wars vets, I haven't kept any "company." I have no idea where this comes from; I still want to know how you gathered this "information," if it's even based in anything outside of you making up reasons to suspect us. It just feels like you're swarming us.
People were convinced on your bandwagon against Vis, which I admitted was sound. I'm talking about stuff like the aforementioned "company he keeps" thing. Or when you "put [Haly] at the top of [your] scum list" simply because he didn't understand the power of the Mission mechanic. Plus, I know we've beaten the "soaked" horse to death, but unless there's some flavor text that only you were privy to, that was totally a made-up argument you tried to pass. Other than Darryl and maybe Akros, no one else seems to be backing you up. And I'm not going to lie, I'm starting to get suspicious of Darryl. Especially since you went so far out of your way to save his alter ego, Darol, yesterday.
I already explained this to Akros and Haly, so I don't know what you think you'll get this time around. But although yes, my vote led to Vis' destruction, I both A.) didn't want to cause a tie, and B.) wanted to vote for the player I was more suspicious of. I was only somewhat suspicious of Vis, but I was definitely suspicious of you, both then and now. I wanted to make a vote I felt comfortable with. At that point, it could've broken the tie in favor of Vis, Tiger, Darryl, Darrylene, or whatever. I just made the vote I felt was safe. Not to sound rude, but explaining this again just sounds monotonous.
You never answered the actual question, either: Why do you think Septimus is "weak," and why do you think we're in cahoots about anything despite not interacting up until this point.
Fake Edit: And your new post doesn't explain anything other than "Septimus thought the Mafia wouldn't make mistakes and then he did lol." What mistake are you even going on about?
I can agree with you for the most part. Even if the Honeypot has a penalty of some sort, though, I don't see it being catastrophic for the KGB. Assume Ezekal's telling the truth, (s)he already knows where to shoot tonight, and we don't know which player the Honeypot is to kill him/her during the day. I do agree that one of those 4 has a good chance of being the Honeypot, though. I'm not really suspicious of any of them at the moment, but you make a good point; the Honeypot would be raring to follow Archer onto a mission.
What's your reason for voting for me, exactly? Maybe I'm just old fashioned, but I'd like to know why I'm being accused first, rather than just getting the tip.
you realize when I was doing that I was talking to palmer, right? I wasn't saying he was scum. I was saying look at what's going on around you.
Day 2 El Top read now! Hint: It doesn't improve my opinion.
No real opinion about this, but it does mean he's one of the few who did try to get onto both missions so far. Yes, I'm aware that list includes me.
Fluff
Contribution, but not much.
Sorry it's taken so long.
So remember his last post from yesterday? Where we were all fools for not voting Roytheone? Totally seems to have forgotten it. He also specifically said that he doesn't like people who don't have a vote in play, so where is his?
Contributing.
No real comments on that set of posts. They're all sort of contributing, but not really helping us find Mafia. A lot of us were doing the same thing.
I agree. Problem is I think the problem is either El Topo or Mazre.
Fluff
Contribution.
Taking a stance on something is progress.
More of the semi-idle game speculation we were all doing.
Look forward to seeing what he comes up with. I do wonder if this is being done under duress since I've been after him today.
Leaves out himself, who tried to get on the first mission. Maybe Mafia was too slow the first time around?
fluff
There was plenty of reason to lynch a neutral in this case.
Contribution in that he wants a chance to defend himself, which is perfectly reasonable.
This goes beyond El Topo, but all of the Honeypot being on the mission assumptions are ridiculous. Anyone not named ER could be the Honeypot.
More of the idle-speculation posts. I don't count these either way.
Oh shit, he remembered roy, the guy he has barely mentioned today after calling all of us out yesterday.
Look forward to the list.
Oh, it's just today's post counts. Not super useful, but it's something.
Fluff
Contributing a theory that Seath is actually Neutral based on apparently using the word unaligned.
More speculation.
Anyway, like I said at the top, all this did was reinforce my belief that's Mafia.
No real opinion about this, but it does mean he's one of the few who did try to get onto both missions so far. Yes, I'm aware that list includes me.
Fluff
Contribution, but not much.
Sorry it's taken so long.
So remember his last post from yesterday? Where we were all fools for not voting Roytheone? Totally seems to have forgotten it. He also specifically said that he doesn't like people who don't have a vote in play, so where is his?
Contributing.
No real comments on that set of posts. They're all sort of contributing, but not really helping us find Mafia. A lot of us were doing the same thing.
I agree. Problem is I think the problem is either El Topo or Mazre.
Fluff
Contribution.
Taking a stance on something is progress.
More of the semi-idle game speculation we were all doing.
Look forward to seeing what he comes up with. I do wonder if this is being done under duress since I've been after him today.
Leaves out himself, who tried to get on the first mission. Maybe Mafia was too slow the first time around?
fluff
There was plenty of reason to lynch a neutral in this case.
Contribution in that he wants a chance to defend himself, which is perfectly reasonable.
This goes beyond El Topo, but all of the Honeypot being on the mission assumptions are ridiculous. Anyone not named ER could be the Honeypot.
More of the idle-speculation posts. I don't count these either way.
Oh shit, he remembered roy, the guy he has barely mentioned today after calling all of us out yesterday.
Look forward to the list.
Oh, it's just today's post counts. Not super useful, but it's something.
Fluff
Contributing a theory that Seath is actually Neutral based on apparently using the word unaligned.
More speculation.
Anyway, like I said at the top, all this did was reinforce my belief that's Mafia.
May have been covered, but I feel like she's been more proactive and helpful in this game compared to Star Wars.
Welcome to the game Possum, and it's too bad you had to leave Razmos.
I'm going to ignore the Seath/Ezekel stuff. I am as convinced of Ezekel's claim as I was yesterday and Seath is playing a game beyond my meagre imagination. Sorry for yelling at you, though. I was very angry there for a minute.
I find it difficult to read the volunteering. The reasoning "I just want to survive another night" is pretty much universally town, so there's nothing there to read.
If the chat was as silent as everyone said then my guess seemed to be right: It is, in practice, as useful as the gossip chats. The real purpose is to hide away Town and force KGB to expose themselves at some point by killing on the mission. Locking it up is just impractical as a long term strategy and I'm disinclined to say Mazre/Palmer/Ezekel are all KGB together. Maybe 1 at the most, but it's a long shot.
TheGoddamn was actually first to point fingers at Zubz, who's now trying to throw suspicion onto squidy. Septimus also joined in on this. Goddamn really stepped up after he was called out on his inactivity and even if he isn't posting a hundred times per day he's still contributing every time. Cabbeh's also picked up the pace and is more convincingly town now. Rapid player growth reads town more than scum.
roytheone, I think he tunnelvisions a lot but he's not particularly scummy. It was the mission in day 1 and Ezekel's power in day 2.
Burbeting and Squidy. Not much to say here. Squidy is posting less but given the mislynch he lead it's no a surprise. I know that feel. It's also nice to see Burbeting posting more and throwing the weight of his experience around.
Darryl is a jerk, don't be fooled by his civility! It's just a mask for the raging beast that hides within. (I'm giving him a blank slate, or trying to.)
Enker/Mike/Cooljeanius: Need to see a lot more these guys to form an opinion.
I agree with Arkos' reasoning that YesNo's playstyle can very easily be used to mask scummy behavior. That's not to say I think she's scum, but it's a thought that occured to me. Basically, one would contribute from time to time, and then throw up a song-and-dance the rest of the time. If someone gets suspicious, the roleplayer can play it off as silliness. Still, her contributions aren't bad so far and I'm not interested in denying her her fun as long as it's not disruptive.
QuantumBro: I was uncomfortable with his silence at first but he's coming out with stuff now so I'm mollified. For his honeypot reasoning, I'm more inclined to think it's 1, that there is some risk to her if she hits Archer.
What if the penalty was just dying along with Archer? That's a very straightforward and simple reason not to kill with her. Day 1 is just far too early to lose a mafia. It would be a variant on the Bomb role. So this wouldn't be Bulletproof so much as Limited Bomb. Remember, it's much worse for Mafia to lose one player than for Town to lose one player. Every Mafia that dies necessitates 2-3 more mislynches IIRC. If I'm right, it's still very biased against her but it can be balanced out by giving her some other abilities.
I'm still interested in cooljeanius by the way. He's only had a single post in day 2.
I'm going to ignore the Seath/Ezekel stuff. I am as convinced of Ezekel's claim as I was yesterday and Seath is playing a game beyond my meagre imagination. Sorry for yelling at you, though. I was very angry there for a minute.
I find it difficult to read the volunteering. The reasoning "I just want to survive another night" is pretty much universally town, so there's nothing there to read.
If the chat was as silent as everyone said then my guess seemed to be right: It is, in practice, as useful as the gossip chats. The real purpose is to hide away Town and force KGB to expose themselves at some point by killing on the mission. Locking it up is just impractical as a long term strategy and I'm disinclined to say Mazre/Palmer/Ezekel are all KGB together. Maybe 1 at the most, but it's a long shot.
TheGoddamn was actually first to point fingers at Zubz, who's now trying to throw suspicion onto squidy. Septimus also joined in on this. Goddamn really stepped up after he was called out on his inactivity and even if he isn't posting a hundred times per day he's still contributing every time. Cabbeh's also picked up the pace and is more convincingly town now. Rapid player growth reads town more than scum.
roytheone, I think he tunnelvisions a lot but he's not particularly scummy. It was the mission in day 1 and Ezekel's power in day 2.
Burbeting and Squidy. Not much to say here. Squidy is posting less but given the mislynch he lead it's no a surprise. I know that feel. It's also nice to see Burbeting posting more and throwing the weight of his experience around.
Darryl is a jerk, don't be fooled by his civility! It's just a mask for the raging beast that hides within. (I'm giving him a blank slate, or trying to.)
Enker/Mike/Cooljeanius: Need to see a lot more these guys to form an opinion.
I agree with Arkos' reasoning that YesNo's playstyle can very easily be used to mask scummy behavior. That's not to say I think she's scum, but it's a thought that occured to me. Basically, one would contribute from time to time, and then throw up a song-and-dance the rest of the time. If someone gets suspicious, the roleplayer can play it off as silliness. Still, her contributions aren't bad so far and I'm not interested in denying her her fun as long as it's not disruptive.
QuantumBro: I was uncomfortable with his silence at first but he's coming out with stuff now so I'm mollified. For his honeypot reasoning, I'm more inclined to think it's 1, that there is some risk to her if she hits Archer.
What if the penalty was just dying along with Archer? That's a very straightforward and simple reason not to kill with her. Day 1 is just far too early to lose a mafia. It would be a variant on the Bomb role. So this wouldn't be Bulletproof so much as Limited Bomb. Remember, it's much worse for Mafia to lose one player than for Town to lose one player. Every Mafia that dies necessitates 2-3 more mislynches IIRC. If I'm right, it's still very biased against her but it can be balanced out by giving her some other abilities.
I'm still interested in cooljeanius by the way. He's only had a single post in day 2.
Oh. Sorry 'bout that, then!
... When? I literally sifted through all of your posts. Your only post close to an explanation was this one, which I explained:
There were 10 minutes left, and I didn't want to vote for either player causing that tie. I kept a close eye on the game on the off-chance I was needed to be a tiebreaker again, but I didn't really want to vote for Vis or Tiger, and I don't think that being the tiebreaker should've been my responsibility. Again, I don't want to sound rude, but I thought that was all pretty sound.
I mean, it really seems like he hasn't contributed too-too much. He's definitely said a lot despite meaning little, though, and he is one of the possible Honeypots, following QB's train of thought. But I dunno, I don't think it's enough. I was called "fluffy" until those last 30 minutes yesterday, too.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
CURRENT VOTE TALLY:
Seath (1)
roytheone
YesNOnoNOYes
Mazre
Seath
Palmer_v1
EzekelRAGE
Haly
Darryl
cabbeh
squidyj (3)
Zubz
Septimus Prime
Seath
cooljeanius (1)
Haly
cabbeh
Haly
Darryl (1)
QuantumBro
QuantumBro
El Topo (1)
Palmer_v1
Palmer_v1
Septimus Prime (2)
cabbeh
squidyj
Zubz (1)
Darryl
Mike_Hawk689 (1)
YesNOnoNOYes
No D2 Active Vote
Arkos
Burbeting
cooljeanius
El Topo
Enker
TheGoddamn
Hobohodo
Mike_Hawk689
Razmos
roytheone (last vote was: unvote)
EzekelRAGE (last vote was: unvote)
Seath (1)
Mazre
squidyj (3)
Zubz
Septimus Prime
Seath
cooljeanius (1)
Haly
Darryl (1)
QuantumBro
El Topo (1)
Palmer_v1
Septimus Prime (2)
cabbeh
squidyj
Zubz (1)
Darryl
Mike_Hawk689 (1)
YesNOnoNOYes
No D2 Active Vote
Arkos
Burbeting
cooljeanius
El Topo
Enker
TheGoddamn
Hobohodo
Mike_Hawk689
Razmos
roytheone (last vote was: unvote)
EzekelRAGE (last vote was: unvote)
Mike_Hawk689
Member
Again not much to say about who I'd like to vote but I do have a couple of choices.
1. Squidyj
First of all, the voting from D1 is still lingering in my head. Vis getting voted out like that feels orchestrated. The whole day, squidyj posted many many many time, which gave a scent of a townie who's looking for the interest of the town. He was starting conversation, making people participate, he was giving life to this game (almost tied for first in posts, trailing by 2 under Palmer). To be honest, I even thought he was a townie because of the way he acted. After seeing the results on day 1 votes, I feel that he betrayed us by driving that train onto Vis. Now that Day 2 started, I'm seeing a steep drop in posts by Squidyj. Trying to lay low to let the heat disappear, after saving buddy GLT?
2. Seath
Wtf is with the mindfuck? I'm sure the mind game keeps going. Are you faking a fake role claim? Making that a legit role claim. If so, I don't see any reason why we should keep Seath in as it goes against, the Duchess. Seath explained in his 'fake' role claim that he only wins if Archer gets voted out, what if that's a ruse to make sure he stays alive to actually fulfill his endgame by killing him during the night or twilight? Yes, he could've been silent and not role claim to stay alive and kill archer at night without anyone knowing, but he already had some votes on him yesterday, so he had to be sure to stay alive to win.
3. EzekelRage
I currently believe what he says as it does make sense with the no-kill night, but I think there is more to your role that you haven't explained. What I'm saying is Sterling Archer is the main character of the show, you must have a power role that you can use during the night. Being unable to be killed during night, except by HP or maybe Conway (referring to previous point) plus a power role seems plausible for the turtle neck wearing spy.
1. Squidyj
First of all, the voting from D1 is still lingering in my head. Vis getting voted out like that feels orchestrated. The whole day, squidyj posted many many many time, which gave a scent of a townie who's looking for the interest of the town. He was starting conversation, making people participate, he was giving life to this game (almost tied for first in posts, trailing by 2 under Palmer). To be honest, I even thought he was a townie because of the way he acted. After seeing the results on day 1 votes, I feel that he betrayed us by driving that train onto Vis. Now that Day 2 started, I'm seeing a steep drop in posts by Squidyj. Trying to lay low to let the heat disappear, after saving buddy GLT?
2. Seath
Wtf is with the mindfuck? I'm sure the mind game keeps going. Are you faking a fake role claim? Making that a legit role claim. If so, I don't see any reason why we should keep Seath in as it goes against, the Duchess. Seath explained in his 'fake' role claim that he only wins if Archer gets voted out, what if that's a ruse to make sure he stays alive to actually fulfill his endgame by killing him during the night or twilight? Yes, he could've been silent and not role claim to stay alive and kill archer at night without anyone knowing, but he already had some votes on him yesterday, so he had to be sure to stay alive to win.
3. EzekelRage
I currently believe what he says as it does make sense with the no-kill night, but I think there is more to your role that you haven't explained. What I'm saying is Sterling Archer is the main character of the show, you must have a power role that you can use during the night. Being unable to be killed during night, except by HP or maybe Conway (referring to previous point) plus a power role seems plausible for the turtle neck wearing spy.
TheAwesomePossum
Banned
Seath's fake role claim has me suspicious as hell.
VOTE: Seath
VOTE: Seath
Okay so here's my first vote of the day:
Vote: Seath
Because of reasons I said earlier. His stunt is pretty anti-town action in my eyes, since if he is town, he shouldn't almost make us waste a complete day on him. It's a high possibility that he is at least a neutral, and town's goal is to get rid of both mafia and the neutrals.
That said, this is my first vote of the day, so it's subject to change.
Vote: Seath
Because of reasons I said earlier. His stunt is pretty anti-town action in my eyes, since if he is town, he shouldn't almost make us waste a complete day on him. It's a high possibility that he is at least a neutral, and town's goal is to get rid of both mafia and the neutrals.
That said, this is my first vote of the day, so it's subject to change.
I have had my eye on el topo for a while now, currently for two main reasons:
-his almost complete focus on voting for me day 1, without giving reasons. Sure, day one is kind of a gamble and following your gut is fine, but at least show some posts that contributed on your bad feeling about me. He never gave a single letter of explanation.
- yesterday when instead of reading the new posts, he counted them. And then he gave his read about seath while clearly having missed the fact that seath actually already withdrawn his role claim, making his read outdated and not very useful.
These kind of posts allow him to look like he is contributing, but at the same time don't say a lot or only say things that are already outdated. He is on my scum hotlist.
Fair enough on that point, I retract. It was only the most recent reason, I'm still quite suspicious of you
Very good post, thanks Palmer.
I've mentioned previously here (and possibly as a throwaway in the GAFia thread) that I was very suspicious of El Topo during the D1 voting (and mocked his crisis of confidence mid voting drama). I knew the majority of his posts had been fluff up until that point, but that was when I went from harmless to scummy.
I didn't see the contrast between D1 and the D2 Visualante hate train until you pointed out, also being very suspicious behaviour. Even more rich considering his behaviour at the end of D1.
I'd also like to add this exchange, in response to my list of opinions on everyone:
I'm not sure if his response implies he was going to directly respond to my call out, but I read it as that, and he's continued to post fairly frequently over the day, but not in response to my suspicions. He then deflects onto the mission members.
My current lynch list is looking like this : Septimus Prime, Mazre, El Topo, Seath
Zubz is flirting with the fire by defending a vote on El Topo and some other posts, I'm going to go through them in a bit more detail tonight to get some clarity.
I'd just like to briefly bring up Septimus' recent posts:
I don't know about you guys, but they all seem like reasonably solid logic and some decent insights. Definitely a far cry from the man who couldn't understand reasonably simple rules on D1.
I don't know about you guys, but they all seem like reasonably solid logic and some decent insights. Definitely a far cry from the man who couldn't understand reasonably simple rules on D1.
There is a hand fucking full of useless posters this game. Why does this Squidyj/GLT bandwagon have any traction whatsoever? Why not tear apart the vote list or something? You know why you're not? Because you really don't care. You're picking on who you think is easy because your life isn't on the line and it's obvious.
Useless Fucking Posters:
Zubz
Septimus
Royistheone
Useless Fucking Posters:
Zubz
Septimus
Royistheone
I had planned to get work done yesterday evening, but decided to postpone it. If absolutely necessary I'd be willing to PM Ouro details regarding this, but I assure you that I would not lie about outside stuff to gain an advantage in the game.
I will answer Palmer in my next post.
I didn't expect the game to start early, so I was too late to volunteer. I don't see how I am hinting at anything, I was (and still am) simply wondering if there are powers related to a game mechanic. That seems like a no-brainer.
Again, no hint. I wanted to contribute/start a debate about missions and their role in this game, which ultimately never happened.
As I have expressed repeatedly, I consider most debate on the first day pointless and misleading, as it most often leads to lynching someone based on nothing that could be called evidence. I don't know what was "discussed" at the time, but I'm sure it will be considered utterly pointless in hindsight.
After this game is over we will look over the posts on the first day and find out that virtually none of them were useful or concrete.
No. I really don't like lying about real world stuff and I will generally believe any real world explanation.
It's the first day. What could he possibly (and realistically) have told us to change my mind? I have expressed quite often how little I think of posts on the first day.
Eh. I've expressed earlier that someone has to die and I also made it clear I didn't care much about who we would lynch. Worst case I expected we might force a power role to reveal and ultimately it turned out worse.
That said, I subsequently voted without being told by anyone, something which you neglected to mention the very next post.
When I began to post/vote, he still seemed in competition. I thought about voting for Visualante2, but decided that it would seem even more suspicious of me to follow the winning team.
I'm sorry, are you implying we didn't fuck up when we lynched a player without defending himself*, which turned out to be the doctor? It's a semi-serious post about how we screwed up and how lynching roy, who I accused for no tangible reason earlier (which I have also been very open about), would have been better.
Evidence? Again, what evidence could I have on the very first day? Be so kind to elaborate. You keep talking about concrete posts and evidence, yet - with all due respect - base your own theories on the flimsiest of evidence.
*For the record, I didn't realize that until after he had been lynched, so I'm not off the hook there either. We definitely shouldn't have lynched anyone without allowing him to defend himself.
I have explained thoroughly what I think of posts on the first day. I think claiming that I posted just "enough to escape attention" is also dishonest and I'm not sure how someone could reasonably come to that conclusion, especially in comparison with other players.
If anything I was honest and consistent the first day. I will answer your Day 2 analysis in the next post.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
Thanks for the reads, Mike... but why did you begin your post that way? Like, you are obviously aware that there is this pattern you've gotten into.... so much so that you prefaced it with "Again not much to say about who I'd like to vote but I do have a couple of choices"....
Why is it "again not much to say" about who you'd like to vote? It sort of reads flimsy to me now :< Your take on these three people are basically:
1. squidy - you think he is baddie for D1 mislynch
2. seath - basically: "guys, i dont understand seath"
3. ezekel - ability fishing ... MUST he have a night ability? MUST he?
Sorry :< But I'm not quite satisfied with this reply >___<
In D1 you only voted for cooljeanius (#930), giving reason that he seemed as if he wanted to got on Enker's case, .... but cooljeanius never actually lit that fire under Enker's seat. Instead, the people he voted for in D1 were: squidy, QuantumBro and EzekelRAGE. If you had said that you doubted him because he bandwagonned squidy's vote, I'd have given more weight to your vote! Because he did got on the squidy vote (#718) right after Arkos did so (#712)... (though to be fair, the one that started that squidy vote was Mazre with his infamous first post after the game started).
I mean people say their scumreads from time to time, but ... yeah idk though, your reasoning behind your voting for cooljeanius does not really sell me at the moment.
I'm going to keep my vote on you for now. But I'm all ears! Give me them words!
I've bolded numbering in your quotes to refer to each point
1) Palmer has covered that no abilities happen on the mission (this was day 2 mind, so you should've read and understood it!), no one on the mission has contested the point. That to me proves there's nothing to be discussed regarding them anymore. There was also some discussion on the missions and their potential abilities in Day 1, but nothing useful is posted in Day 1, right? So you obviously flogged it. Missing Palmer's clarification on the mission is suspect, and not the only suspect thing you've said.
2) Don't agree at all, there were lessons learned from Day 1 that contradicts your point that everything there is useless. Suspicious behaviour from Mazre, Septimus' rules slip up, Seath's fluff, squidy's prodding, Haly's points on how to play. How are these useless? This is good information, the very idea of you discounting this makes no sense..
3) Your previous point makes even less sense with this answer, you've picked roy at random, you now say nothing he said would have changed your mind, yet you're moaning about how we fucked up because Visualante never had a chance to defend himself? But it's Day 1, by your logic we should ignore anything anyone says and just go with gut feeling. Squidy's gut was visualante, why is his choice any worse than yours based on the logic you're displaying here?
4) I'm beating the nail with the same hammer here, but your logic can be applied across the whole slate, which is showing how flawed it is. Why would your voting behaviour be viewed as suspicious? nothing useful and concrete to be taken from Day 1, after all. Nothing to worry about here.
5) What happens if roy was/is a power role and we lynched him under your 'reasoning' would that be considered a fuck up? or would you say well my gut said so and nothing on Day 1 matters so what the hey. Visualante was bad luck, it wasn't a fuckup. He had made a good lynch case for himself through his actions, and didn't attempt to resolve that before the voting time was up. It was dumb luck that he was a power role and we lynched him. It was bad play that he didn't even hint at it once and failed to be there for the deadline without actually warning anyone.
I'm surprised my quote even appeared in this post to be honest, I thought NeoGAF would be coded with the universal rule that Day 1 Mafia is a bogey game. Fuck it, right?
Also, I don't know why you mentioned real life in response to my post, I wasn't implying you were hiding behind it. On the contrary you said you were not going to be available and then proceeded to post quite a lot afterwards. My point was more you seemed to ignore my accusation and continued on, it wasn't anything to do with your stipulation that you would be busy IRL.
As I have said, I am willing to step down if necessary.
Ah, no problem. I've posted way too much. Didn't expect such a thorough exam.
I wrote that I have a problem with people that don't vote. Having a vote "in play" at all times seems pointless. I also made it quite clear that the first day is fundamentally different. We have no information whatsoever the first day, other than role information (such as "You win if player XYZ survives") or class information (mafia members), which is completely different from the second day, where it turned out that e.g. Ezzi was (supposedly) attacked during the night.
How does discussing how no one got killed not help us, especially given that Ezzi came forward later and claimed he got attacked? How is it not helpful to discuss whether Ezzi is telling the truth and what Honeypot might be able to do/who he or she might be.
I was referring to the original mission members. As I explained later, you pointed that out, I was mistaken about him having been on a mission.
Not really.
My post is about who could be mafia, so of course I'm leaving myself out.
Other than potentially lying about his role I don't think so. Neutral is neutral. Unless the role harms town, there is no reason to lynch him.
Eh, maybe.
No need to vote for roy at this point. No need to vote for anyone at this point, unless someone doesn't believe Ezzi, Seath or the subtle "I might be a drone" guys. Or me, if you believe Palmer.
Well, I meant the post-counting list.
Learning that Seath used post counts to accuse Visualante2, I would urge all of you to not accuse someone solely based on post counts, at least not without giving the player a chance to defend himself/herself.
I'm very proud of that theory.
Seems more like you decided on me being a scapegoat and subsequently tried to come up with a (shaky) narrative based on flimsy evidence. I'm not even sure if you're mafia, if you're really accusing me, or if you're just trying to squeeze information out of me.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
Palmer, I just saw this and I want to say if it was a toss up between you or me to go to a Night mission with already 2 of the goers are people you dont really trust, I rather than you go than me. I'm still noob at the game and I wouldnt be able to read them as well as you.
Not speaking for the other back-up volunteers, obvs.
Unless you think I'm ready for my first FIELD MISSION :3
Also, I still like the idea of sending only 2 of us for N2 mission, just to keep dear Sterling as safe as houses :>
I missed that. Care to show me the post where he said that no one used their ability and the evidence that would make any of us believe this rather weird claim? Or are you saying that abilities cannot be used on missions, which would seem contradictory to what I remember reading.
Please elaborate on that.
If you consider that (beyond general "How to play" advice) good information, I don't even know what to tell you. It was utterly useless on the first day, it may at best be used as soft evidence (hopefully in addition to hard evidence) later.
The kind of information I consider good is e.g. information on whether someone died, what someone did, who switched who and so on, all not available on the first day (and maybe not until much later). Tangible information that does not rely on vaguely interpreting posts. Information from Day 1 is useless by itself (and thus for quite some time).
Unless someone hints at or reveals his role, there is nothing (on the first day) one could say that could count as tangible evidence. I said that without said evidence, there is no way to tell on who to lynch, so we should just pick anyone.
It should be evident that if roy had been a power role, he would have role claimed at the last moment and we all would've unvoted him, see e.g. (starting #927) when I accused RobotNinjaHornets in the very first Gafia game (although in that case it turned out RNH was playing us).
Just because I am convinced nothing useful and concrete can be taken from Day 1 (at least *on* Day 1), doesn't mean others can't be convinced of the opposite. Again, I am not even ruling out that once tangible evidence is presented one can in addition analyze the first day, but by itself it's pretty useless.
Of course it would be a fuck up. That doesn't mean that I would necessarily be suspicious, but it would be a fuck up nonetheless.
No, it was a fuck-up. We shouldn't have lynched anyone without letting that person defend himself. It's not bad luck, it's bad play (from all involved). I didn't notice it earlier and obviously Visualante2 is not blameless, he should've done something earlier, but it is nonetheless a fuck-up. We are all to blame for that.
Day 1 is not completely pointless, but it is very pointless until additional evidence presents itself.
Ah, okay, nevermind then. I was just trying to explain why I decided to post despite originally saying that I would be busy.
Oh I see there's a slightly different meaning. I'm referring to the mission itself has no special abilities for the volunteers, but palmer's post certainly points to nothing else being different aside from the rule of abilities only being able to be used on other volunteers/non-volunteers.