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*They pick a Widow or Hanzo*
- Thread starter TheSpoiler
- Start date
SgtWiggles
Member
Game sense is such a rarity apparently, even in Masters/Grandmasters.
This week most of my losses have been from uncontested heroes carrying an otherwise beatable team (Lots of Pharahs and Winstons). My teammates will bitch and moan about them but they refuse to swap and just deal with it themselves, and the moment the "Defeat" screen pops up they whine about never being able to reach their next rank.
I really don't get the logic, I just don't get it at all. Especially when theres usually someone mid match saying exactly what we need, or players like me willing to Hero/Role Swap often to make the comp work.
Hanzo feels like magic sometimes.
I started playing him for fun and because I loved the feeling that a headshot with him gives you. Now I've played more than 20 hours with him and the joke is over.
I don't want to be a Hanjo main.
Sometimes I pick him just so that guys like OP rage. Only QuickPlay though. I am not an ass.
I started playing him for fun and because I loved the feeling that a headshot with him gives you. Now I've played more than 20 hours with him and the joke is over.
I don't want to be a Hanjo main.
Sometimes I pick him just so that guys like OP rage. Only QuickPlay though. I am not an ass.
TheSkullPrince
Member
I haven't played Overwatch in a long ass time, so what's the meta exactly?
Johannsson
Member
I love widowmaker, and got both achievements with her on PS4.
2-2-2 or Dive comp. Triple Tank is still viable once in a while. Pretty diverse with Dive comp is getting more and more popular.
Dreams-Visions
Member
most matches that end in loss are almost always a rein or a mercy switch away from being able to be a win. but people trust their ______ (fill in the hero) to the bitter end instead of switching to what is needed.
that's not exclusive to sniper classes.
In the end, you'll win if you're good enough to carry yourself to a win. The moment you start placing blame on others is the moment you stop advancing in the game. You can carry a mediocre/bad _________ (fill in the hero) through most ranks if you're decent.
That's the ugly truth most players don't want to deal with: they aren't as good as they think they are and resort to blaming others instead of figuring out what they could have done better.
icecold1983
Member
rein, soldier, ana, lucio, hog, zaria
Adam_Roman
Member
Not Ana anymore. She got a few damage nerfs and Mercy's invuln while ulting makes her a much more reliable pick. If I had to come up with a default meta comp it would probably be Soldier/Pharah, Reinhardt/Zarya, Mercy/Lucio.
TheSkullPrince
Member
So if anyone detracts from this line-up, they get yelled at?
SgtWiggles
Member
Very true, this is why I'm mostly relegated to Healing/Tanking as its one less factor to worry about, but even then you just end up in a whole different world of problems. My biggest one lately is the insistence of running Symmetra+A Solo healer for some reason, the whole setup is just way too finicky and has cost me more games than its won.
icecold1983
Member
no but when you pick characters from the absolute bottom tier who have no reason EVER being played if winning is the objective, then yes.
edit - in competitive
I will never understand the mindset of trying to dictate how others play the game. This community effort to try and shame people out of playing certain characters is baffling to me. If you cared that much what other people were playing, why on earth would you be playing with randoms at all?
chillybright
Banned
Their league counterpart:
SgtWiggles
Member
Because especially in ranked its extremely hard to find 5 other people to play with constantly who also happen to be around your skill rank. And even if you did, you'd get placed against other 5-6 man teams that are likely extremely coordinated and on occasion smurf accounts for pro players.
Its why I never run 6 mans anymore and only do 2-3 player groups. Every single match back to back felt like we were always batting at or above our average, while atleast with randoms theres some variance
In Quick Play you should be free to play whatever you want, and honestly it should be expected up to maybe Platinum rank competitive, but once you hit Diamond or Masters its not fair to your teammates to intentionally or unintentionally throw a match because you refuse to play more than 1 Hero when matches often require swapping.
Fonster Mox
Member
If I play Hanzo for a week and just make a supercut of every 1hk and every half decent killstreak I get its gonna make it look like Hanzo is amazing... Even if I'm a detriment to my team the other 95% of the time.
If I'm proficient with my character then no that is not the problem. You guys make it a problem.
icecold1983
Member
Then you should try it for once and be amazed.
SgtWiggles
Member
The problem is too many people think they are proficient when they arent or could easily be more with someone else.
I'd rather have a Soldier or Tracer in the frontlines and who have an Ultimate with killing power than a Widow in back who more than likely is constantly having to reposition and whose ult is damn near useless even in the best situation, especially on open maps
finalflame
Member
As long as you're being effective, I don't give a shit what you play, even if it's Torb on attack. Make it happen.
If you're some kind of novelty/main that's trash at a hero that's not suited for the situation we're in and are not contributing, then please be flexible and open to trying other things, or else you're just ruining the game for others.
All of the above only applies in Competitive. Do not give a shit what people decide to play outside of comp, obviously.
If you're some kind of novelty/main that's trash at a hero that's not suited for the situation we're in and are not contributing, then please be flexible and open to trying other things, or else you're just ruining the game for others.
All of the above only applies in Competitive. Do not give a shit what people decide to play outside of comp, obviously.
Exactly this.
Head.spawn
Junior Member
I have no problems with Hanzo either way, but something about picking Widow during Attack phase just seems wrong. I've never said anything to anyone though and honestly I've seen an occasion or two where that person fucking delivered.. that's a bit rare though. But on the other hand, maybe that is who they're comfortable with or they're trying to learn to be better with... telling someone to pick another character puts the assumption that they're better with another character up and I wouldn't assume as much.
With Hanzo you could probably be playing someone more useful but I don't mind seeing him on my team, there are a decent number of people that are good with him.
Widow though I consider to be basically a throw on consoles unless you are a GM or something. Still, at best I will politely ask someone to change if it isn't working, ain't no point raging about it.
Widow though I consider to be basically a throw on consoles unless you are a GM or something. Still, at best I will politely ask someone to change if it isn't working, ain't no point raging about it.
finalflame
Member
Widow is generally better on attack -- the defending team is at a disadvantage for losing players, as the run back from the defense spawn is generally longer than the attack spawn. If a Widow on attack can get those 1-2 surprise picks right at the beginning of the team fight, it significantly skews the fight to the attack's favor. After the pick she just needs to deliver some DPS to help the rest of the team to clear out the defending team.
On defense she's alright, but getting picks aren't as crucial and you usually want more long-term sustained and reliable DPS.
FieryBalrog
Member
Triple tank is still quite viable, I've seen it run at many points in both the APEX and Carbon series.
FieryBalrog
Member
This is completely false, it's not a bad "safe" team comp on certain maps but it's not even remotely "the meta". This team is legitimately garbage in some maps too, like Oasis Gardens.
Do you actually watch GM games? Not even talking tournaments here, just high level ladder play, just watch some actual games before spouting off.
Man, this is why Gold and Plat can be so toxic. What people don't realize is that it's often (but not always) better to have people play what they're good at than it is to force someone to switch to make you feel better about hero "tier".
This is something GM and Masters player do MUCH better from when I see streamers on twitch (myself, I'm not at that level). They accomodate off-meta mains. There are quite a few off-meta one-tricks in GM and even in top 500 (e.g. SteveoO is a Symm one-trick who's consistently been in top 500, KolorBastion is a Bastion one-trick, Codey isn't a one-trick but he mains Sombra, Kephrii mains Widowmaker...)
They realize that making Kephrii play Reinhardt is usually an idiotic idea, and instead they accomodate his Widow play because he's a really freaking good Widowmaker. And he's flexible enough that he will switch off Widow in situations where it's really necessary.
rochellepaws
Member
I'm usually quite open as to who I want to play and will switch early in the game if it isn't working out, however if somebody asks me to switch I will lock into that character regardless for the rest of the game. I get people who ask for another tank, healer or are worried by too many snipers or whatever but singling one person out is rude and disrespectful.
icecold1983
Member
no thx. i can get plenty of bad players by solo queuing
youre a gold/platinum player? nuff said
finalflame
Member
I generally agree with what you're saying, and yes, forcing people to change from something hey are good at is often a bad idea, but the difference between gold/plat one-tricks and GM/Top 500 one-tricks is that the GM/Top 500 one-tricks are actually good at the game. I, too, watch a ton of streamers in GM+ and see that there's generally far, far less tilting due to hero picks, but also for the most part people pick sensible comps and are actually generally good at the game and their hero.
Gold/plat players who "main" a generally subpar hero are usually trash not only at that hero, but also at the game (bad awareness, positioning, teamwork, etc), and oftentimes make excuses as to why they are 'actually" contributing or how they can "play the game however they want", with no regards to actually getting better at the game. I don't give a shit if a Junkrat main has 3 golds on attack of we're not winning, he's not delivering the needed sustained and targeted DPS to get the kills needed to win team fights.
SgtWiggles
Member
Widow just feels pretty throw on console period, even at GM/Top 500. I seen plenty of them last season getting absolutely hard countered by Winstons/D.Va and still refusing to swap. If I see a Widow, I go Winston and make sure her life is short and filled with electricity and gorilla punches and that her team is constantly in a 5v6 situation.
I don't see how anyone could defend someone using her in a team comp, especially if said team is lacking another Healer or Tank because of her being picked.
FieryBalrog
Member
I make more money than you do so I'm good thanks. I'll spend my time watching actually good players.
Feel free to link your stream
The Maverick
Member
At Master level, those players are likely good with the listed heroes and they are willing to switch if necessary. Neither of those things apply to most snipers in Platinum and below. They will ignore team composition, ignore staying on the objective, and often turn the match into a 5v6. Overwatch is a team game. If you aren't going to pick what's in the best interest of the team, just stick to quick play.
On another note, if I see a Widow/Hanzo/Sombra on the other team, I get excited. Easy win.
legendofjelda
Member
I feel it's okay to pick whatever you want to play in Quick Play. It's not like it's impossible to win with snipers on attack. Stranger things have happened. Quick Play is the place for me to experiment and just pick whatever I feel like playing too (though I'm personally not really into snipers). Usually I end up with a somewhat balanced group setup one way or another. It tends to happen organically.
In Ranked, where winning matters a lot more, I do expect people to think a bit more about a suitable pick, but people should ideally stick to what they feel comfortable playing. I personally only have a few characters that I feel I play well, so I would ignore pleas to pick Reinhardt specifically or whatever, because I can't do shit with him. I'll go for another tank if that's the role that we're sorely missing.
And when people rage or are rude concerning my character pick or even someone else's, I block them. A lot better for my sanity. That toxicity and lack of flexibility has no place in my play time.
In Ranked, where winning matters a lot more, I do expect people to think a bit more about a suitable pick, but people should ideally stick to what they feel comfortable playing. I personally only have a few characters that I feel I play well, so I would ignore pleas to pick Reinhardt specifically or whatever, because I can't do shit with him. I'll go for another tank if that's the role that we're sorely missing.
And when people rage or are rude concerning my character pick or even someone else's, I block them. A lot better for my sanity. That toxicity and lack of flexibility has no place in my play time.
icecold1983
Member
I make more money than you do so I'm good thanks. I'll spend my time watching actually good players.
Feel free to link your stream
i hope you enjoy watching because you wont be spending any of your time actually being a good player. oh and the heroes i listed are the most played mains in grandmaster. only one i missed was mercy
No god damn it. You win games by letting people play what they are good at. As long as everyone can play at their best it's fine. Urgh, toxic.
Edit: Oh shit you are one of these toxic eltist players in Overwatch. Don't mind my post.
Agent_ShortBus
Member
Who gives a shit?? People can play what they want its just a game plus they paid for it so who am I to tell them who or how to play.
Ah I see, you're one of those judgmental persons. Without having tried something first. That's ok, but don't talk shit then.
Every Time I Die
Banned
It's only a problem if they're getting absolutely nothing going and they refuse to change. It's uniquely deflating to watch your Hanzo either get consistently rocked or stay locked on him while the other team runs a deeply unfavorable team comp.
Since both characters are distinctly aim reliant, it isn't uncommon to watch people who lock them struggle from game to game as maintaining that caliber of aim from match to match is rather difficult (and both heroes offer very little outside of their ability to just outright frag).
Since both characters are distinctly aim reliant, it isn't uncommon to watch people who lock them struggle from game to game as maintaining that caliber of aim from match to match is rather difficult (and both heroes offer very little outside of their ability to just outright frag).
FieryBalrog
Member
I do enjoy watching good players. That's why I watch teams like Lunatic Hai or Rogue run over people with Winston/Genji/Tracer/Zen. I forgot, what was the meta again?
I'd love to see a show match between your team and Rogue, can we get one scheduled?
I mean if we're going to talk about ladder scrubs playing, could you at least duo with Emongg or someone?
SgtWiggles
Member
Like others said this depends on the rank. Gold or Platinum, sure whatever, you are likely placed where you need to be anyway.
Diamond+? You should realistically be able to play more than one hero (Or a hero from each role) at the same level, otherwise I feel they should be considered a hindrance to the team. What if your main gets locked out by someone else, you are just gonna be sub-par/shit the rest of the match? What if we desperately need a different DPS/Tank and you are the only one who can swap because the others are staples/hard counters, you gonna let us lose because we can't afford to lose someone elses hero?
I can play Reaper, Soldier, Mei, Reinhardt, Zarya, Roadhog, Winston, Mercy, and Zen well enough that I realistically couldn't say I have a single main (Though that would probably fall between Zarya and Zen), and I understand the mechanics/usage of the rest of the cast. I consider anyone in the Diamond+ range who cannot play more than one hero well a bad player, period. (Unless you are literally a Tournament/Top Tier Pro player, who I still assume have multiple heroes under their belt despite having a preference)
FieryBalrog
Member
I mean I agree that players who are just useless should switch and that's good, though it's easier to catch flies with honey and a nice request or suggestion goes a long way. That said, if someone's in Plat with 100 hours on Hanzo and 0 on anyone else, he's a Plat Hanzo and he belongs on your team about as much as anyone, as frustrating as it might be at times, he's also making enough of a difference on average that it's ok.
The real bullsht is players legit throwing , I.e. They're not picking Hanzo because that's the only thing they're good at, they're picking Hanzo because they're having a temper tantrum. That's legit toxic and hopefully the reporting system gets better to deal with that.
But I mean that behavior isn't any different from running around intentionally feeding on any character.
You should always be able to play at least one character in every category else you didn't understand Overwatch itself. But what I wanted to say is that I don't want to push someone, in my SR 3982 currently, to play a character which whom they are really not good. At least I will let them play their pick then and I or others will gladly change as long as the person communicated that. As you said, so I agree with you.
Why would I push someone to play Ana when they can only play Mercy, but Mercy is already picked and his next best character is McCree and not Soldier?
I give a shit when someone acts like you in your post. Playing competitive you want to play. If you wouldn't want to win, why even bother being such useless weight for your teammates and waste their time? People that act like seriously waste other peoples life time. It's not fun. It's another story in QP where you expect that and where people train, but in comp I would hunt you down on the internet after such a shit comment. Don't waste peoples time.
SgtWiggles
Member
I agree with this, I'm more so referring to the players I see that literally have like 50+ hours with one hero, and cannot play anyone else to save their life (Which seems to be the case with most of these "Mainers"). I can understand if a player can play maybe 3 or 4 heroes but not the one needed for a specific situation, that can be worked around with multiple players swapping roles. But if you have 1 person perma locked to a hero, your team comp is getting screwed right off the bat.
I know personally I suck terribly as Ana, and I can be much more useful as Mercy or Zen than as Lucio so I'll tell my team that and rarely if ever will anybody get upset. So I would never do that to someone else if they are actively trying to make the team comp work. Its just those people who don't give a shit and refuse to be versatile who annoy me.
People like you in competitive are the reason I completely stopped playing OW.
But you might not be at fault as much as Blizzard, who are utterly incapable of identifying the good team players to put them properly together.
Trickster
Member
Some people are beasts on those heroes, others a poop. For me it depends mostly on the situation whether I mind people picking them or not.
For instance, do we have a decently well rounded team? Feel free to pick hanzo or widow. Just please be willing to switch if it becomes clear you're not really doing well with them
Do we already have a sniper and it's lijang tower? Please don't pick another sniper
For instance, do we have a decently well rounded team? Feel free to pick hanzo or widow. Just please be willing to switch if it becomes clear you're not really doing well with them
Do we already have a sniper and it's lijang tower? Please don't pick another sniper