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Retronauts: Strider 1, Not Understanding Strider 2, Ersatz Striders

GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/podcast.the1upnetwork.com/flat/Retronauts/R051911.mp3

It's a good show that covers the usual suspects, but I'm personally irked by them declaring Strider 2 mediocre. It's totally transformed when you try to get a good score, which is, you know, the point.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNSh5-Rt5wg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgjXbCnQC6k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xk65HMCxhuc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0GHM4APE_Y

or (worse, but neat)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xlsqo3AG-xI

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=25741820&postcount=366 I...I really like Strider 2.
 
D

dock

Member
I love Strider!!

(...and totally don't get Strider 2, sorry GhaleonQ. The gameplay, atmosphere and graphics were strange. Maybe there's hidden depth in the control, but it misses on a lot of other marks.)

Damn, I always miss the topics I'd love to call in about. I wonder whether they covered the weird Europe-only (?) Strider 2 from Ocean, where Strider turns into a robot.

AmigaRet2.jpg
 
GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
The fanbase is definitely still good, as these were by far the best callers. No one slowly mumbled through a bad anecdote and all of them sparked conversation.

And Sharkey totally does talk about it at the end. They didn't use the music in the podcast well, though. *sad face*
 
N

nckillthegrimace

Member
GhaleonQ said:
The fanbase is definitely still good, as these were by far the best callers. No one slowly mumbled through a bad anecdote and all of them sparked conversation.

And Sharkey totally does talk about it at the end. They didn't use the music in the podcast well, though. *sad face*
Click to expand...

Speaking of callers, I listened to the previous three episodes of Retronauts Live today, and, man, the last caller on the Mega Man X episodes was really...off is probably the polite way to put it. The callers on this and the Colecovision episode, however, were great. Clearly the more obscure the topic, the better the callers.
 
GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
Really, I'm just sad that Jeremy doesn't have a good counterweight when he knows the topic (strong Moon Diver recommendation aside). Scott doesn't have that strong an opinion on more obscure things he's played and Sam's too gracious. Is there a good IGN equivalent to Ray or Kat? Chris and Christian aren't always on hand.

Chacranajxy said:
Strider 2 is excellent. I need to finally buy the damn game.
Click to expand...

2 for 1! There's no excuse!

nckillthegrimace said:
Speaking of callers, I listened to the previous three episodes of Retronauts Live today, and, man, the last caller on the Mega Man X episodes was really...off is probably the polite way to put it. The callers on this and the Colecovision episode, however, were great. Clearly the more obscure the topic, the better the callers.
Click to expand...

Truth. ZELDA TIMELINE AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Xenon said:
Loved the original but never heard of this sequel.


This is what I think of when people say Strider 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVauEKPC9FA
Click to expand...

http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/strider/strider2.htm
 
D

dock

Member
I bought Strider 2 on PSone just for Strider 1 :3

I must have played Strider 2 only a couple of times. The graphics were pretty misguided though, IMO.

On the other hand, I'm strange because I don't like Moon Diver at all. I don't think it captures Strider at all, once again missing on atmosphere, graphics and level design.
 
Danny Dudekisser

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
GhaleonQ said:
Really, I'm just sad that Jeremy doesn't have a good counterweight when he knows the topic (strong Moon Diver recommendation aside). Scott doesn't have that strong an opinion on more obscure things he's played and Sam's too gracious. Is there a good IGN equivalent to Ray or Kat? Chris and Christian aren't always on hand.
Click to expand...

I know what you mean. I used to freelance for 1up for a bit and did some stuff for the Retronauts blog... maybe they could let me spout some nonsense about old games since I have near-Bettenhausen levels of trivia floating around my head!

... yeah :(
 
GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
dock said:
I bought Strider 2 on PSone just for Strider 1 :3

I must have played Strider 2 only a couple of times. The graphics were pretty misguided though, IMO.

On the other hand, I'm strange because I don't like Moon Diver at all. I don't think it captures Strider at all, once again missing on atmosphere, graphics and level design.
Click to expand...

That was the weird thing. I don't have a problem with disliking Strider 2 or liking Moon Diver, but it's weird that someone would strongly dislike 1 and strongly like the other. The reasons Jeremy disliked the way that he played Strider 2 (setpieces, game speed, box level design, mashing rather than hit-and-run) seem "worse" in Moon Diver, in fact.

Gomu Gomu said:
It's Retronauts LIVE dammit :p
Click to expand...

*sad face*

Chacranajxy said:
I know what you mean. I used to freelance for 1up for a bit and did some stuff for the Retronauts blog... maybe they could let me spout some nonsense about old games since I have near-Bettenhausen levels of trivia floating around my head!

... yeah :(
Click to expand...

Oh, cool, who were you?
 
S

Seraphinianus

Banned
Any talk of the nes game? If it was less buggy, it could've been pretty great. It's still just decent, even if it plays like crap. Triple jump in Egypt = the hardest platforming move ever when I was 9

Ill give strider 2 another shot...didn't realize it was score attack.
 
GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
Smision said:
Any talk of the nes game? If it was less buggy, it could've been pretty great. It's still just decent, even if it plays like crap. Triple jump in Egypt = the hardest platforming move ever when I was 9

Ill give strider 2 another shot...didn't realize it was score attack.
Click to expand...

With the exception of copies not made by Koichi Yotsui (see the Hardcore Gaming 101 article's last page), they cover cameos, mainline, fake entries, and same-developer copies well. And, yes, at least see if SS-ing 1 level is fun!
 
B

BudokaiMR2

Member
I believe I have the 2 disc ps1 games in my old CD book...

I remember when I really got into this game I started reading the manga as well. Hah I wonder if I still have that somewhere...
 
K

-KRS-

Member
My first contact with Strider was Strider 2 on the Mega Drive and I LOVED it!

And when I played the first one years later I didn't like it as much as the second game actually.
 
W

woodypop

Member
Any mention of Run Saber?

Man, I adored arcade and Genesis Strider back in the day. Haven't really dug into Strider 2 much, though I've had it for years.
 
D

Dark Octave

Banned
wondermega said:
did they discuss cannon dancer/OSman?

if you are any kind of a Strider fan you need to see this game

osman_%2813%29.png


cannodanss019301-0038.png
Click to expand...
I remember this game! I never played it but I remember seeing a picture of it and wanting to play it a long time ago.

As for Strider, the whole series has always been strange to me. But I liked all of them.
 
X

xir

Likely to be eaten by a grue
enjoyed the brief discussion of the mystery of the story of strider. reminds me of reading flavor text on magic cards and grasping at a greater narrative.
 
GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
Game Analyst said:
Is the PS2 version of "Strider" on "Capcom Classics Collection: Remixed" the best port of the game?
Click to expand...

I believe so.

Also, I just read that Yellow Magic Orchestra's song is the source for Ton Pu and the rest of their naming conventions.
 
B

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Strider on NES sucks, I have the cart... But I'm always fascinated by Japanese games that were never released in the home territory. (a la Legendary Wings, Startropics, etc)
 
G

GotchaForce

Member
It's Retronauts so I'm going to listen but I'm not looking forward to Strider 2 hating. I loved the game, probably because I played it before Strider 1 (on the PS1). Strider 1: really cool concept but just way too old-school hard for me. I also like Shinobi on PS2 and Shinobi 3 to the rest and Mega Man X over OG Mega Man.
 
W

woodypop

Member
BocoDragon said:
Strider on NES sucks, I have the cart... But I'm always fascinated by Japanese games that were never released in the home territory. (a la Legendary Wings, Startropics, etc)
Click to expand...
Wait, what? What an intriguing topic. Where can I find more info?
 
T

Tain

Member
1+2+Osman are on my "to clear some day" list. it's a very daunting list.

Strider 2 (arcade, going for 1cc as usual) always seemed solid to me. What were their complaints?

I was disappointed with the Moon Diver trial. Wasn't what I was hoping for.
 
B

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
woodypop said:
Wait, what? What an intriguing topic. Where can I find more info?
Click to expand...
I've been thinking about writing an article on this.. I haven't really seen a good write up anywhere:

Some examples off the top of my head:

-Kid Icarus: Of Myths and Monsters
-StarTropics
-Zoda's Revenge StarTropics II (never even released in PAL, so it's a North American game only)
-To The Earth
-Balloon Kid (as GhaleonQ mentioned)
-Legendary Wings (NES port.. no famicom release)
-Strider (NES - The history of which you can pick up on from Jeremy in the podcast.)

I'm sure there are many others.

Nintendo R&D3 (now IRD... they mostly do hardware designs) was specifically tasked to make games for the western market... games like StarTropics and Mike Tyson's Punch-out were intended for the west only. Its funny because they don't really make games, in general.

It's hilarous to think that at one point, a game like StarTropics would have been thought by Nintendo as having specific western appeal. Mike Jones = dudebro.

Mike Tyson's Punch-out actually did get a Famicom release, but it was packaged as if it were an import NES title from America, with the same English text and refernce to the USA Nintendo Fun Club left in. A manual of translations was included in the box. An early release of the Famciom version was even styled like a NES cart.

It's tricky because if a Japanese publisher outsources or publishes the work of a western developer, should that count? Perhaps not. There are numerous Nintendo-spearheaded sports titles only released in the west, etc, and those aren't maybe so interesting. Some were outsourced, some were made by NST, Nintendo's USA based dev house, etc.
 
GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
Tain said:
Strider 2 (arcade, going for 1cc as usual) always seemed solid to me. What were their complaints?
Click to expand...

I listed them above (same template, setpieces, speed, button-mashing), but I hope they show up here because I can't tell how they played. Jeremy was the only person who replayed it shortly before the show. From what I can tell, it wasn't as bad as Greg Sewart (who, I think, panned it in Electronic Gaming Monthly and the Player 1 Podcast because he could clear it with a D-ranking in 30 minutes because of unlimited continues). I do think it had something to do with the fact that the game doesn't force you to get good at it to beat it. You're supposed to challenge yourself to play it as its original arcade incarnation or for ranking. So, to him, it was an uninspired rehash.
 
T

Tain

Member
Ah, thanks, I missed that above.

It's always weird to me when people talking game history focus on a home port of an arcade game rather than the arcade game itself. And you would think a podcast about old games would recognize that home ports of arcade games clearly aren't intended for play with unlimited continues. :/
 
GhaleonQ

GhaleonQ

Member
Tain said:
Ah, thanks, I missed that above.

It's always weird to me when people talking game history focus on a home port of an arcade game rather than the arcade game itself. And you would think a podcast about old games would recognize that home ports of arcade games clearly aren't intended for play with unlimited continues. :/
Click to expand...

I can understand tweaking racing games or fighting games so that your arcade difficulty arc isn't the same as the home version. Shoot-'em-ups and action games like Strider depend on enemy placement, so you can't alter those without altering the game. At the very least, an informal credit limit's necessary to judge whether an arcade port was appropriately difficult.
 
wondermega

wondermega

Member
Finally listened to this podcast - very interesting.
It drove me to DL the trial of Moon Diver, which I approached with skepticism. I was right to, the game is junk :( They forgot to make it actually fun to play in that Stridery way.
 
eso76

eso76

Member
Strider 2 failed to capture the original atmosphere, characters, epicness. It didn't look like it was even set in the same universe. Levels broken idown into small areas, gone was the dynamic soundtrack with 3-5 different tracks for each chapter. Huge bosses, eagle and wolf power ups.
Plus going for 2.5d graphics wasn't a wise choice on psone hardware, since the game ended up looking worse than its bitmap prequel.
Gameplay was different too, with a bigger focus on score attack which i really didn't care for.
Strider 2 wasn't a bad game, but it wasn't the classic masterpiece Strider 1 was.

Speaking of ports, Psone version of the original is arcade perfect MINUS the soundtrack which is lacking musics for level 3 and 5.
Apparently, even Capcom used the incomplete romset emulators have been using for decades.
 
E

Enk

makes good threads.
I'll also jump in with my disappointment with Strider 2. While the character controlled great it lacked a lot of things that I loved about the first game. The art style was ugly, the atmosphere was severely lacking, no mid level music changes, and the level/enemy design wasn't nearly as creative. It can be fun at times but it didn't hold a candle to the orignal for me.
 
DCharlie

DCharlie

And even i am moderately surprised
did they discuss cannon dancer/OSman?
Click to expand...

cannon dancer is epic though it is of course extremely similar to Strider in parts in an almost Pulstar-to-Rtype way.

Internet gent extrodinaire Gaijinpunch translated an interview with Kouichi Yotsui over at Gamengai. Check it out :

http://www.gamengai.com/cmnt_inf.php?id=2313&type=translation&p=2

sigh , i stupidly sold my PCB a few years ago before it really spiked in value :/ Most regretted gaming decission i've made.
 
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