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$300 8" tablets: Thin+light, fast web browsing w/Flash, 8-10 hours...and Steam

dLMN8R

Member
Note: Sorry if this sounds sales pitchy, but stick through it since there are some genuine negatives in what I like about it and how I wouldn't recommend those things to "average people". The stuff it's intended to do, it does extremely well, and as a nerd, I love what I can also get it to do after a couple hours of tweaking even if it's not meant to do those things.


I've bought and have been playing around with the Dell Venue 8 Pro for a few days now and am pretty impressed. It's decidedly faster than the Surface 2, yet it also has full Desktop support including many games on Steam which work decently (though not necessarily simply)

For example, there's GestureWorks Gameplay which just released 1.0 and a bit hoakey for now, but it shows promise for simpler, not so fast-paced games. It's designed for crowd-sourced suggestions and user-configurable touch screen overlays. A bluetooth keyboard case might also work well for some games.

The ASUS T100 is a larger device with similar internal specs. Some videos are here showing performance of a bunch of games: http://www.youtube.com/user/th3drow/videos?view=0&flow=grid

These Bay Trail tablets, while Atom, are far faster than what "Atom" used to mean. It's not a Core i Intel chip, but it's a helluva lot better than the netbooks of a few years ago.


For tabletey stuff though, this thing flies. It's a beast, surprisingly so:
  • While lower-res at 1280x800, the screen is still beautiful, bright, with great viewing angles, etc.
  • Web pages load faster on it than any other tablet I've used (iPad 4, Nexus 7 2013, Surface 2 - only thing I haven't used is the iPad Air)
  • Full Flash support so you're not limited to what web pages you can view
  • Want Chrome instead of IE? Go for it. It's an unrestricted x86 device
  • Want to use VLC and literally any video codec out there? Do that too
  • Emulators of all sorts? I haven't tried N64 (probably too ambitious for this device) but SNES/GBA/etc. all work flawlessly
  • Still lasts 8-10 hours in my experience for non-gaming activities
  • Comfortable to hold in one hand in either landscape or portrait

For touch gaming, it's nowhere near iPad or Android tablets of course, but there are games starting to show up on the Windows Store like Halo: Spartan Assault and the usual Angry Birds / Where's My Water fodder. And of course, you can play Hearthstone, and even Flash games like Card Hunter.


I've only used the Dell, but Lenovo has one too with identical internal specs. It's slightly lighter and thinner than the dell, nearing iPad Mini proportions. I've included iPad Mini dimensions and weight at the bottom for comparison.

Dell Venue 8 Pro (alternate link)

71CQlob%2B4KL._SL1500_.jpg

Dimensions
Thickness: 0.35” (9mm)
Width: 5.12” (130mm)
Length: 8.50” (216mm)

Weight
Starting at 395g / 0.87lb


Lenovo Miix2 (alternate link)


Dimensions
Thickness: 0.31” (7.87mm)
Width: 5.19” (132mm)
Length: 8.46” (215mm)

Weight
Starting at 349g / 0.77lb


iPad Mini dimensions and weight for comparison
Thickness: 0.29" (7.5mm)
Width: 5.3" (134.7mm)
Length: 7.87" (200mm)

Weight: 331g / 0.73lb



Other stuff
  • Storage: This is full Windows 8.1, and despite it being a Dell there was still no bloatware installed at all. Even without bloatware, the 32GB device I got came with only around 14GB available. I moved the recovery partition to a USB stick which bumped that up to around 21 or 22GB.
  • There's an SD card slot which can be used for anything - installing applications, media + libraries, etc. The free space is enough for me, but probably not for others. The 64GB version is $50 more.
  • Touch on the Desktop: You can easily avoid the Desktop entirely if you want to purely use it as a tablet, but if you do choose to use the Desktop it's obviously fairly difficult to use on a touch device. Explorer is OK for tasks like moving files thanks to the Ribbon which works well with touch, but third-party applications tend to be a problem. You get the upside of full x86 support, but the downside of needing to occasionally use peripherals to take advantage of them like Steam and some games.
  • I could get around Steam fine exclusively using touch, but once I launched some games that expect a mouse/keyboard to be there, I got stuck. Needed to do [win+power] to force-close the thing through task manager
 

Guy.brush

Member
I read of experiences with AT100 bay trail that cried foul about its alleged performance...sadly...
They still seem slower than something like a C2D 1.5 Ghz Lowvoltage chip from like 6 years ago. So this stuff is still not ready to be a notebook replacement.

If you want to do anything else other than Facebooking, Youtubing or twitter on stuff like this you still need to shell out like 850bucks for a Dell Venue 11 Pro with an i5 Core...

I was also looking forward to Bay Trail but would not pick that option for a Dell Venue 11 Pro and am now unsure if I really want to shell out like 1k for a Dell Venue 11 Pro with keyboard dock...
 

dLMN8R

Member
I read of experiences with AT100 bay trail that cried foul about its alleged performance...sadly...
They still seem slower than something like a C2D 1.5 Ghz Lowvoltage chip from like 6 years ago. So this stuff is still not ready to be a notebook replacement.

If you want to do anything else other than Facebooking, Youtubing or twitter on stuff like this you still need to shell out like 850bucks for a Dell Venue 11 Pro with an i5 Core...

I was also looking forward to Bay Trail but would not pick that option for a Dell Venue 11 Pro and am now unsure if I really want to shell out like 1k for a Dell Venue 11 Pro with keyboard dock...
I don't know, I've done a ton of stuff on this thing so far and all of it has run far faster than I would have expected. Obviously something that's nearly 3x as expensive is going to be a lot better :)
 

Azih

Member
We do need a review site to put these tablets through their paces. 300 bux for a full Windows tablet is amazing, but HOW ARE TEH GAMES ON IT?
 

dLMN8R

Member
We do need a review site to put these tablets through their paces. 300 bux for a full Windows tablet is amazing, but HOW ARE TEH GAMES ON IT?

The shipping for both of these devices has been a clusterfuck so far. People in this thread who preordered the thing weeks ago are seeing their orders delayed, while others are receiving it right away. Seems like the only reliable thing right now is to order it from Amazon. Same thing with Lenovo. I don't understand how these companies have been in business for so long when they can't get such basic shipping stuff right.

I'm sure sites will start reviewing it, but right now they're probably just having a hard enough time getting their hands on them...

Paul Thurrott has some observations for now:
What Dell got right
What's missing


If there's any stuff you want me to try on it, lemme know.
 

Azih

Member
The shipping for both of these devices has been a clusterfuck so far. People in this thread who preordered the thing weeks ago are seeing their orders delayed, while others are receiving it right away. Seems like the only reliable thing right now is to order it from Amazon. Same thing with Lenovo. I don't understand how these companies have been in business for so long when they can't get such basic shipping stuff right.

I'm sure sites will start reviewing it, but right now they're probably just having a hard enough time getting their hands on them...

Paul Thurrott has some observations for now:
What Dell got right
What's missing


If there's any stuff you want me to try on it, lemme know.

Other than Crysis 1? I'd actually like to know how it handles Fallout: New Vegas as I'm playing that now and say, Assasins' Creed 2: Brotherhood.
 

Guy.brush

Member
The CPU in the DELL Venue 8 is this one here:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7314/intel-baytrail-preview-intel-atom-z3770-tested

Here is a snippet about its graphics performance:
Rather than 16 EUs in the Ivy Bridge GT2 configuration (HD 4000), Bay Trail’s HD Graphics core ships with 4. The 4 EUs are otherwise effectively identical to what we found in Ivy Bridge. The GPU can dynamically scale frequency and share power between itself and the CPU cores. Minimum GPU frequency on Bay Trail is 311MHz and a max GPU frequency of 667MHz (or 688MHz for the DDR3L SKUs).

That is a forth of HD4000 which itself is not earning high praise.
I would be surprised if any PS360 game runs on this with proper framerate.
Maybe something like NOLF 2 from 2002 ? Could be a nice mobile oldschool games RTTP machine.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The CPU in the DELL Venue 8 is this one here:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7314/intel-baytrail-preview-intel-atom-z3770-tested

Here is a snippet about its graphics performance:


That is a forth of HD4000 which itself is not earning high praise.
I would be surprised if any PS360 game runs on this with proper framerate.
Maybe something like NOLF 2 from 2002 ? Could be a nice mobile oldschool games RTTP machine.

I have no clue why anyone would legitimately expect an 8" tablet to run PS360 games.
 

maeh2k

Member
there are some genuine negatives and reasons why I wouldn't recommend these to "average people".

Good job, Microsoft :)
Everyone's selling boatloads of cheap Android tablets and Apple's selling millions of iPads and there aren't even any Windows tablets you can recommend to 'average people'...
 

plasmasd

Member
I have a Iconia w3 - horrid screen and just got a Dell Venue Pro 8.

The VP8 is much faster. It will run Left 4 Dead at 1280x800 with default settings at 24-35fps (sometimes higher if pointed at a wall)

Actually I dont know the fps, feels like low 20s, but it will run far cry 3 blood dragon at 800x600

I've been a fan of UMPCs for a long time. Still have my Asus R2H from early 2007.

Also if you get a Venue Pro 8, be sure to follow these directions to double the speed of your internal mmc
http://forum.tabletpcreview.com/dell/59202-venue-8-pro-owner-s-lounge-135.html
 

dLMN8R

Member
Good job, Microsoft :)
Everyone's selling boatloads of cheap Android tablets and Apple's selling millions of iPads and there aren't even any Windows tablets you can recommend to 'average people'...

I didn't phrase that too well :) That's not what I intended. I meant that stuff like GestureWorks and getting Desktop games to work on it is difficult. Stuff it wasn't intended to do.

The stuff it was intended to do, which I also list, it does extremely well, even for "average people".
 

plasmasd

Member
Also I didn't mention that using genymotion you can run an opengl accelerated virtual machine of Android 4.2.2 and it will run epic citadel at 23fps. basically as fast as a tegra 2.

You can even snap the screen and run windows and android side by side. reeally useful for testing purposes all on one device.

I need to hackintosh it next to freak people out. dv8p has optional secure boot so ypu can boot off of the external sdhc
 

dLMN8R

Member
I can't believe it's 2013 and Flash web browsing is still viewed as a plus.

There are many video sites that still have shitty HTML5 implementations, instead requiring you to use dedicated apps that at times makes things far more difficult than simply viewing something on a web site.

Also: Card Hunter.
 

Khaz

Member
I'm interested by these. I'm still looking for a replacement for my ageing Asus Eee901 but I can't get any ARM device, I need my x86 compatibility. I looked a bit at the Acer products but their naming convention is horrendous and there are so many products I can't find anything.

I guess I'll wait a bit to see what the superior <10" tablet/laptop convertible will be.
 

Mirk

Member
Can anyone try minecraft with one of these? If this thing can run it better then my old netbook I'll buy it right now lol.
 

Mirk

Member
Minecraft is available for all tablets FYI.

Minecraft pe blows. So I went out and picked up the dell a bit ago. They only had the 32gb, sucks but I got a 64 sd so heres hoping thats enough. will post some impressions after I can see what can all be done with this.
 
Minecraft pe blows. So I went out and picked up the dell a bit ago. They only had the 32gb, sucks but I got a 64 sd so heres hoping thats enough. will post some impressions after I can see what can all be done with this.

64gb version coming out this Friday. I ordered 64gb one when Amazon had it for $324.00, I also got 32gb one for my wife since she is not going to be installing anything and will probably just use it mainly to browse the web. Microsoft really need to patch the Metro IE and let you force mobile mode.

I really like it so far and the ability to play Hearthstone on the go still blown me away. (Along with steam). So how does the SD card work? You can install program etc on it like a 2nd drive?
 

tino

Banned
Until there is 8' keyboard (that has a touchpad on it like the Tablet 2) I am not going to consider these tablets. As a matter of fact I just order a 3G iPad mini 1 refub for $360.

I should be able to get free 200MB TMobile data working on it.
 
I saw a youtube video of the ASUS tablet running Crysis and Bioshock on lowest settings. It looked like shit, but it was there. I'd probably only want steam for my 2D/indie collection on the road. Can't be any worse than pllaying Mark of the Ninja on my gf's shitty laptop from 2009.

I wanted to buy one last week, but the only place in my area that carries it is microcenter, and they're sold out.
 

VanMardigan

has calmed down a bit.
I wanted the dell, but the lack of HDMI video out killed the excitement for me. Plus I would need a Bluetooth mouse and keyboard to get the most out of it. And a stylus for desktop use. I just picked up a nexus 7 instead. I would've preferred windows, but the costs would've been much higher after the costs related to the accessories I would want. Doesn't look like the lenovo has HDMI mini out either.

I'm still not sure I made the right choice :'(
 
I wanted the dell, but the lack of HDMI video out killed the excitement for me. Plus I would need a Bluetooth mouse and keyboard to get the most out of it. And a stylus for desktop use. I just picked up a nexus 7 instead. I would've preferred windows, but the costs would've been much higher after the costs related to the accessories I would want. Doesn't look like the lenovo has HDMI mini out either.

I'm still not sure I made the right choice :'(
I would have sold you my nexus for really cheap. 8" is perfect size, 7" is just too small. I love the Dell and with some refinement they could have a bug hit on their hands. I will take a solid full OS any days over the limited function tablets like Nexus and iOS. Multitasking on this tablet is awesome.

you can get Bluetooth mouse and keyboard for about 22$ each on Amazon. Now that I am able to play GoG and Steam and Battlenet make me not care for whatever games iOS has to offer. I wish we can get x86 running Windows Phone Phablet.
 
I wanted the dell, but the lack of HDMI video out killed the excitement for me. Plus I would need a Bluetooth mouse and keyboard to get the most out of it. And a stylus for desktop use. I just picked up a nexus 7 instead. I would've preferred windows, but the costs would've been much higher after the costs related to the accessories I would want. Doesn't look like the lenovo has HDMI mini out either.

I'm still not sure I made the right choice :'(

So the T100 (10.1")was a bit too big for you?
 
Comparison of the Dell Venue Pro 8" and the Lenovo Ideatab Miix 8" (both available on Amazon for $299):

http://www.surfacegeeks.net/forums/index.php?/topic/878-dell-venue-pro-8-vs-lenovo-miix-2-8/

BYe8mW_CUAAqzbN.jpg


Basically the Lenovo Miix has slightly better cameras (2MP vs. 1.2MP | 8MP vs. 5MP) and better placement of the Windows key on the front. He claims the Lenovo display is slightly sharper. The Lenovo is marginally slimmer and lighter though the devices are basically the same size. The Dell has a better grippy texture on the back. The Lenovo has much more bloatware, but it can be easily uninstalled. The Dell sounds like it might have a better stylus option than the Lenovo which could be the deciding factor for some people.


Lenovo Miix unboxing video

Dell Venue Pro unboxing video
 
I was pretty dead set on a Retina iPad mini, but these have me interested. Is there one that's less than $500, has a high rez screen, and good performance (with 4-8gb of ram)? Would also need to be ~8inches or so. A 10 inch device would be too big for what I want.
 

zou

Member
Welcome to the basis of every unboxing video ever.

So unboxing videos are concerned with the box, not the content? I seriously doubt that. And in any case, spending two minutes describing the outside of the box is retarded whether it's common or not.
 
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