GoonerTRON
Banned
They look great, but come on. Polyphony will push for some crazy cutting edge car models.
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Polyphony needs to step up their game with GT7
- Thread starter Jibbed
- Start date
They look great, but come on. Polyphony will push for some crazy cutting edge car models.
paradise_circus
Member
We got a really great simulator which is despite all the nagging of some "sim-fans" great. PD can even market this aspect with great success in their annual acadamy series.
We got highly great modeled tracks which are even FIA proved now and the even better thing that we got was a really great dynamic lighting and weather system (not for all tracks though). The photomode is extremely good. We can drive with 16 cars. The premium cars are extremely well modeled, especially in the photomode.
Vision GT is rad.
Despite all the bitching, the AI is absolutely not worse than the competion and they can react.
The loading time are fixed in very smart way.
The carreer and special events are also great. Especially the videos for the licenses. Who knew that you should not use the ideal line when the surface is wet on the Nürburg Ring?
The points in the OP mentioned are aside from the engine sound very minor probs... at least for me.
We got highly great modeled tracks which are even FIA proved now and the even better thing that we got was a really great dynamic lighting and weather system (not for all tracks though). The photomode is extremely good. We can drive with 16 cars. The premium cars are extremely well modeled, especially in the photomode.
Vision GT is rad.
Despite all the bitching, the AI is absolutely not worse than the competion and they can react.
The loading time are fixed in very smart way.
The carreer and special events are also great. Especially the videos for the licenses. Who knew that you should not use the ideal line when the surface is wet on the Nürburg Ring?
The points in the OP mentioned are aside from the engine sound very minor probs... at least for me.
The full poly versions which are currently only available in photo mode are more then enough especially running with decent AA, as is they take insane man hours to do a single car and starting again would be an awful idea.
Same for me, it felt so sterile and bland that I stopped playing very fast and never looked back to the series.
I think I liked GT3 A-Spec best, but that is 14 years ago...
Things GT7 needs to bring to the table(imo):
-Complete overhaul of sounds- Hopefully they nail this with the T10 guy they have on board. Engines are tyre squeals on the ps3 games are horrific.
-UI overhaul, they improved it with GT6 but it still wasn't great, hugely subjective, but I wasn't a fan of the jazzy music in the menu's, so for me that would go. Apparently they have one of the ui guys from Driveclub on board so hopefully that gets sorted.
-Improve the AI. Gave up on GT6 as career was just a procession, start from the back of the grid and work your way past the AI, got real old real quick. Ideally have a quick qualifying session for each race where the AI will actually be competitive.
-Keep the standard cars, but don't implement them in career, maybe have a setting so they don't show in the garage at all if people aren't interested in using them. I personally would like them to stay in this capacity if there's a car i really want to drive that hasn't been premiumified.
Graphical upgrades are a given, no doubt GT7 will look stunning, but hopefully there's no screen tearing.
-Complete overhaul of sounds- Hopefully they nail this with the T10 guy they have on board. Engines are tyre squeals on the ps3 games are horrific.
-UI overhaul, they improved it with GT6 but it still wasn't great, hugely subjective, but I wasn't a fan of the jazzy music in the menu's, so for me that would go. Apparently they have one of the ui guys from Driveclub on board so hopefully that gets sorted.
-Improve the AI. Gave up on GT6 as career was just a procession, start from the back of the grid and work your way past the AI, got real old real quick. Ideally have a quick qualifying session for each race where the AI will actually be competitive.
-Keep the standard cars, but don't implement them in career, maybe have a setting so they don't show in the garage at all if people aren't interested in using them. I personally would like them to stay in this capacity if there's a car i really want to drive that hasn't been premiumified.
Graphical upgrades are a given, no doubt GT7 will look stunning, but hopefully there's no screen tearing.
Pretty much agree with everything in the OP. The quantity over quality thing annoys me the most. Do we really need 800 standard cars and 200 premium? Just have 300-400 normal cars (meaning no 2 types of quality) and call it a day. Its really jarring having HDed PS2 model cars in the game.
I have high expectations for GT7.
what we learned that polyphony hired the former audio lead of forza, thats sweet music to my ears too.
I think GT7 is going to show something at E3 and be looking fantastic.
I hope it will have a date too though.
I also hope that kaz doesnt shoot for the moon of endor. keep it real/feasible and deliver.
what we learned that polyphony hired the former audio lead of forza, thats sweet music to my ears too.
I think GT7 is going to show something at E3 and be looking fantastic.
I hope it will have a date too though.
I also hope that kaz doesnt shoot for the moon of endor. keep it real/feasible and deliver.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
No to this. The lounge and jazz music gives GT this classy, upmarket identity. It's like walking into a classy store. Rock or pop or electronic music in menus is awful.
Auto-Reply
Member
5 completely killed my interest in the series, but it was mostly the update process on the PS3 that was responsible for that. Still my interest is gone, they need to have Morpheus compatibility in 7 to make me glance at them again.
Gran Turismo 6 is amazing compared to 5, and I cannot tell you why this is, even though I will admit that there's little technical improvement, as OP says, between the two.
I'd be happy if GT7 was just GT6 at 1080p with super long draw distance and great antialiasing.
I'd love if for once they gave us the japanese soundtrack too. Moon over the Castle for starters, but GT2 had some amazing music by the guitar player from the band that composed Guile's theme.
I forced most of it back with custom soundtracks. Hope there is support for them in GT7 too.
I'd be happy if GT7 was just GT6 at 1080p with super long draw distance and great antialiasing.
I'd love if for once they gave us the japanese soundtrack too. Moon over the Castle for starters, but GT2 had some amazing music by the guitar player from the band that composed Guile's theme.
I forced most of it back with custom soundtracks. Hope there is support for them in GT7 too.
Ted
Member
I think GT5 and GT6 get a bit of undue criticism for simply doing what the GT series has always done and not really iterating at the pace expected by racing fans these days whilst not getting enough credit for just what they achieved at a technical level on PS3.
That said, there is a lot of things I would personally like to see improve in GTnext in all areas, some of which align directly with your thoughts OP.
Please excuse the following wall of text, I have posted similar before but hey, I love the GT series and really want to see it doing the things it should do right properly and at the same time really excelling in the multiplayer lobby system as they already have a more flexibility for hosts to create interesting, competitive lobbies than most console racers.
General (inc. presentation and UI)
1) Continued enhancements in physics - I don't expect full PC levels of simulation but PD needs to continue to push on in this area and P:Cars appears to prove that console specs need not limit how deep you delve into the complexity of your driving model. GT6 felt significantly better than GT5 but still had too many flaws and odd peculiarities.
2) Enhanced mechanical damage - Imagine changing down early too many times and losing second entirely or abusing the rev-limiter so much the pit crew implement a lower RPM limit to save the engine in an endurance race, this is the kind of thing that should be simulated in the "Real" driving simulator.
3) Archiving standard cars - Don't remove them and don't confuse the dealerships by adding them there (a la GT6), instead add a museum archive of these cars and allow people to buy (or perhaps just borrow) them from here.
4) Improve load times all around - Nothing further needs to be added to explain this!
5) Garage List Presentation - Keep the garage list for selecting cars pretty basic (as per GT6) but add an enhanced garage view more like GT5 where I can see decent sized thumbnails of my cars. Also add a warehouse (ever expanding like warehouse 13!) so I can wander around my stored cars (or a small sample of them at least), that would be fantastic given the vast variety of cars included.
6) Garage List Sorting - Additional sorting of your own garage list - GT6 removed sorting by miles for example. This needs to come back as well as sorting by such things as displacement or cylinders. Also add user customisable garage sets/selections so if I want a favourites tab for race cars, a favourites tab for street legal cars and a favourites tab for tuned online cars as well I can. I could use hundreds but at least half a dozen definable tabs would be great (select from a drop down if screen real estate becomes an issue).
7) Fix the incorrect details in the car blurbs - If you want to be "encyclopedia Gran Turismo" proof read your data!
8) Rationalised menu navigation - Seriously, why do I still have to leave a lobby to change oil!
9) Better tuning tips - I want to learn, so tell me how it works in more details if I want it.
10) Aero should effect PP - Why this changed in GT6 I don't know, it's tantamount to saying "our physics model doesn't take this into account".
11) Tune-share - I want to be able to share tunes with friends and have friends share their tunes with me so I can get some hints where I am going wrong or so I can learn from them and compare with my own attempts.
12) Basic livery editor and associated livery-share functionality - I'm not too bothered how deep this is as long as it is varied enough to mean when I line up in spec races with friends all of our cars don't look the same.
Single Player Structure
For this I'm going to assume that PD don't want to radically change the type of progression system/career that has existed in every full GT release. This means they'll still have the usual groupings of events and I have to dream within a pretty defined and rigid structure:
Novice
National B
National A
International B
International A
Super
That in mind I'd like to see:
1) License Tests - The return of three mandatory license tests as a prologue to each step up into a new class (one before Novice, one before the National events and a third before the International events).
These would try to show the player the types of skills they would need to compete in each class: basic skills and understanding corner layouts and cornering techniques before novice; overtaking safely and reading your opponent at national leve;l and advanced techniques such as defensive drving lines and different pit strategies before the international level events.
2) AI Race-Craft - AI that increases in race craft abilities as we move up each class and that is themed to the class that we are racing.
AI opponents in Novice will make mistakes often and these would be mistakes that a novice racer would make, for example braking too late into a turn and under-steering wide or getting on the throttle too early on exit, losing grip and speed. I'd also be keen that these racers, though far more likely to make mistakes, will also be far more wary of damaging their vehicles excessively, remember these opponents are novice racers, most likely in a car they paid for themselves. They'd give you more room on the track, rarely go for overtakes and largely just stick to their own, sub-optimal and often inconsistent, line.
AI opponents in the two National classes would be more aggressive and generally faster but would still make mistakes and would still have inconsistencies in their line choice. As these opponents are more aggressive more of these errors would relate to racing incidents that lead to bent metal such as putting it up the inside for an overtake and not being able to quite reign in the speed, sending the car through the apex and washing wide. As the following car you would then need to actually consider what other cars are doing on track (teaching race craft to the user) and, for example, come off the gas a little early into the corner, let the overtaking car slew wide in front of you, run a tighter line through the turn and then sneak through at the exit.
AI opponents in the International classes would be seasoned racers who unless pressured by the player will rarely make mistakes and will know and use the optimal racing, defensive and overtaking lines. They will take measured risks to get in front or keep the following car behind. Defensive driving will be a thing and the car in front will move off the time trial line in order to protect their place, for example moving to the inside approaching turn 1 at Nurburgring GP/F. Equally, the car behind will genuinely try to overtake with a little bit of guile and forethought, for example taking a slightly wider line through turn 3 at GP/F in order to get a faster exit out of turn 4 leading to a drag down the straight and a possible opportunity on the inside at turn 5.
3) Event Classification - A rationalisation and better categorisation of the events within each class.
In GT6 [ignoring coffee break stuff] there are really only a couple of race types. There are those with a defined field of roughly equal cars and there are those with various cars with as much as 100-200pp in performance differences which really feel like an auto-cross type event but one where multiple cars are sharing the same track.
I understand the desire from PD to keep the chase the rabbit like events in order to use more cars from the substantial and varied car list but I think these events can be better thought out or better dressed at least.
I'd like to see 7 types of events:
- Race weekend events - These would be proper race events with cars that are closely matched and all meet stringent regulations with regards to weight, power, PP, aero and drivetrain requirements. They would include practise (skippable), qualification (skippable) and race elements. They would also include incident flags (and the associated rules) and penalties. They would all include tyre wear, the length of the races could be selected from a number of options and tyre wear could be accelerated to mean even in some short race events players would be required to have a pit strategy.
Some race events could be setup as multi-weekend championships and some advanced versions of these championships could even include some kind of weight/power ballasting to keep the player vaguely competitive even if they were super fast/super slow in the previous race(s).
- Chase the rabbit events - These would have a points based scoring system with the possibility of hugely varied fields of opponents. They would be structured largely like the Sierra challenges with the aim being to score the highest points total through a combination of extending your time left, overtaking cars and possibly hitting apexes correctly or controlled drifting. Points received for overtakes could even be weighted by the equivalent speed of the car so you'll get a point for overtaking the lower half of the field and maybe two points for overtaking each of the faster cars in the field. The combo elements of the Sierra events could be refined or alternatively, forget the combo aspect and just add and remove points for overtakes/collisions/drifts/apex hitting. Grid 2 does these types of events pretty well for reference (you only get points for overtakes however) though in this there is one type of car (lots of the same) to be overtaken so visually it is less exciting.
- Autocross time trial events - Simply set a time on a crowded or empty track. Three hot laps with the fastest counting. These times could be weighted by PP to ensure a wide variety of cars are competitive.
- Head to head challenges - One on one events where you only have one opponent and car choice and tuning is heavily regulated by weight/power/PP/drivetrain. You set a lap time in your car of choice first of all, this time is then added to a global leaderboard and your opponent in the head to head element is based on someone n places above you on that list.
This system could of course be cheesed but so what, "you're only cheating yourself".
Each time you try the event again your previous result is taken into account and an opponent is selected further up the leaderboard. Lap times could be reset by the user if they wish to do the event again from scratch.
- Regularity rally events - These events would not be based on outright speed but on the ability to remain consistent (an undervalued skill in racing). Give players a target time or average speed and they have to complete three to five laps and get as close to this target time/average speed as possible. The worst lap would be removed and then the players score is derived from working down from a "perfect" score of 100.
- Drift events - standard drift events with no real change from what we already have except that angle of drift as well as speed and line would be taken into account properly.
- Crowd pleasers - Events that are just for fun. These could include knocking over cones, smashing through conveniently placed piles of boxes, accurate donuts and j-turns, obstacle courses (don't knock over the cones/priceless ming vases!), demolition derby and that kind of silly fun.
4) Event Car Selection - Race weekend event car selection revisions including a difficulty slider with better AI car selection tighter restrictions.
I'd like to see around three difficulty levels for events in the form of regulations essentially related to the PP of the field you face and the car and upgrades you can can choose. These might be something like:
- New racer - The race has a PP limit of 500PP and a tyre limit of sports soft. Opponents have cars between 450 - 480pp and the same tyres.
- Experienced racer - The race has a PP limit of 500PP and a tyre limit of sports soft. Opponents have cars between 480 - 520pp and the same tyres.
- I am Ayrton Senna - The race has a PP limit of 500PP and a tyre limit of sports hard. Opponents have cars between 500 - 520pp and sports medium/soft tyres.
5) Enhanced visual and mechanical damage alongside an increased feel of ownership - Damage is retained post race and has a cost to fix, full and partial (botch) fixes are available and have consequences on your future performance. For example you can choose to replace a front wing or get a panel beater to put it roughly back into shape.
Mileage and wear continue to affect body rigidity and engine wear but in a more transparent way.
Mechanical and cosmetic fixes are available from the options mid-championship though if you prang your car in practise your qualification may suffer through having limited time on track (due to the mechanics working to get your car working) and if you prang your car in qualification or are otherwise unable to set a time, expect to start from the pit lane.
Online Multiplayer
1) Lobby Functionality
Good lobby racing is an absolute blast, I made so many good friends by hosting and playing in clean racing lobbies in GT5 but GT6 didn't expand on this functionality enough.
Regulations:
Hosts should be able to customise a lobby extensively in terms of entry regulations. The bare minimum expectations from me would be for the host to be able to:
- Set max limits for PP, HP, weight together;
- Specify a class and/or make and/or model and/or drivetrain;
- Specify a vehicle age;
- Specify exactly what can and can't be tuned (e.g. suspension tuning allowed, transmission and power tuning disallowed or vice versa);
- Specify whether ballast and/or power limiting can be used;
- Set a specific car or selection of cars that can be used in the lobby from either the entire stock car selection or from the host's own garage (e.g. everyone races in a car/selection of cars that I have personally tuned for ~equal lap times);
- Write a lobby title and description that is available for viewing from the lobby browsing list that is longer so we can adequately describe what behavior and racing type is expected from the lobby. Sometimes "Stock/SH/clean or kick" simply isn't enough!
Post Race Review:
- A lobby theatre mode should be added where everyone in the lobby can watch a replay of the race together (host controlled) after the race with chat enabled in order to highlight incidents to the host.
- Post race data should be available in the the lobby after the race is complete. This should include at least overall race time, fastest lap, tyre choice, car selection, PP/HP/weight/drivetrain, split times etc.
- Host applied player penalties - these could include ballast or power limitations, a drive through penalty in the next race, a sin bin period (I don't want to boot some people, just give them some time to calm down after a fraught race). All of these need to be transparent and allow the host to explain the reason for these sanctions.
- Race director/steward(s) role - Lobbies should be allowed to have one or more players who are not racing but are simply viewing the race, according to settings defined by the host these virtual stewards could have the ability to put out flagged cautions, call players in for a drive through penalty, simply kick a disruptive/otherwise non-conforming punter or simply highlight any issues for the host to address during the post race review. As an ex-regular host, having to leave a race in order to kick an idiot is very frustrating. These steward players should NOT count against the overall lobby size.
Finding a lobby:
The lobby list needs to be more customisable, as someone looking for a lobby I should be able to:
- See only tracks I want to see. A simple drop down allowing me to choose one track is not enough, maybe instead a number of check boxes or simply allow the use of AND/OR/NOT in my criteria;
- See only lobbies that fit my tuning requirements. Tuning allowed, stock cars, limited tuning for example;
- See only lobbies that fit my PP/HP/weight/make/model requirements;
- Check a more details page which shows me the full regulations for a lobby before joining it;
- Select a car first, then click "see which lobbies allow for the car I am in" button, user sees a returned list of appropriate lobbies.
2) Club Support
Regular racers should be able to join together to form clubs. These don't need to serve any purpose beyond an organisational hub but even this has useful competitive purposes:
- Asynchronous user/club owner definable time events in order to sort clubs into competitive leagues. For example: "Run GP/F in a Lotus with the attached tune. Your best time in ten full laps will be used to add you in the appropriate position in the club league.
- Multi-stage events either run through a single play session or multiple play sessions tied directly into the above league structure so similarly quick players compete against others in the same skill bracket. These should allow club organisers to apply win/loss ballast/performance differentials.
Anything else is gravy.
3) Online Quick Race Functionality
- Add a slightly wider range of car types and have each "quick race" actually be a series of three short races at different tracks. Maybe five general themes where the specifics can be changed up (see below). Something like 400 - 500 pp street cars, 500 - 600pp street cars, 500 - 600pp race cars (GT3/GT5/TC), 600+ race cars (LMP, open-wheel) and a final "specials" categories for classics/muscle/beetle racing/karts.
- Add an SRF off/SRF on (beginner/expert) option for each type rather than just randomly applying this to some events.
- Rotate/change these events regularly (at least monthly).
- Fill empty spots with AI racers to ensure a full grid and that there's someone for everyone to compete with.
4) Miscellaneous Online Improvements
- BRING BACK SHUFFLE RACING!!!!
- Lag reduction - Improve net code to reduce the amount of incompatibility issues and lag encountered in lobbies even when everyone has taken appropriate preparatory steps (caches cleared, routers re-booted, ports open etc. etc.)
- Player rating - I'm not necessarily asking for an i-racing type player safety rating but some additional stat tracking might make it easier for hosts to give the benefit of the doubt (or not) to people who appear to be playing dirty in their lobbies.
- BRING BACK SHUFFLE RACING!!!!
I could go on forever but PD will do whatever PD will do so this is no more than academic! Anyone who made it this far, you deserve more than what you got. I'm sorry.
tl;dr - more stuff please PD.
That said, there is a lot of things I would personally like to see improve in GTnext in all areas, some of which align directly with your thoughts OP.
Please excuse the following wall of text, I have posted similar before but hey, I love the GT series and really want to see it doing the things it should do right properly and at the same time really excelling in the multiplayer lobby system as they already have a more flexibility for hosts to create interesting, competitive lobbies than most console racers.
General (inc. presentation and UI)
1) Continued enhancements in physics - I don't expect full PC levels of simulation but PD needs to continue to push on in this area and P:Cars appears to prove that console specs need not limit how deep you delve into the complexity of your driving model. GT6 felt significantly better than GT5 but still had too many flaws and odd peculiarities.
2) Enhanced mechanical damage - Imagine changing down early too many times and losing second entirely or abusing the rev-limiter so much the pit crew implement a lower RPM limit to save the engine in an endurance race, this is the kind of thing that should be simulated in the "Real" driving simulator.
3) Archiving standard cars - Don't remove them and don't confuse the dealerships by adding them there (a la GT6), instead add a museum archive of these cars and allow people to buy (or perhaps just borrow) them from here.
4) Improve load times all around - Nothing further needs to be added to explain this!
5) Garage List Presentation - Keep the garage list for selecting cars pretty basic (as per GT6) but add an enhanced garage view more like GT5 where I can see decent sized thumbnails of my cars. Also add a warehouse (ever expanding like warehouse 13!) so I can wander around my stored cars (or a small sample of them at least), that would be fantastic given the vast variety of cars included.
6) Garage List Sorting - Additional sorting of your own garage list - GT6 removed sorting by miles for example. This needs to come back as well as sorting by such things as displacement or cylinders. Also add user customisable garage sets/selections so if I want a favourites tab for race cars, a favourites tab for street legal cars and a favourites tab for tuned online cars as well I can. I could use hundreds but at least half a dozen definable tabs would be great (select from a drop down if screen real estate becomes an issue).
7) Fix the incorrect details in the car blurbs - If you want to be "encyclopedia Gran Turismo" proof read your data!
8) Rationalised menu navigation - Seriously, why do I still have to leave a lobby to change oil!
9) Better tuning tips - I want to learn, so tell me how it works in more details if I want it.
10) Aero should effect PP - Why this changed in GT6 I don't know, it's tantamount to saying "our physics model doesn't take this into account".
11) Tune-share - I want to be able to share tunes with friends and have friends share their tunes with me so I can get some hints where I am going wrong or so I can learn from them and compare with my own attempts.
12) Basic livery editor and associated livery-share functionality - I'm not too bothered how deep this is as long as it is varied enough to mean when I line up in spec races with friends all of our cars don't look the same.
Single Player Structure
For this I'm going to assume that PD don't want to radically change the type of progression system/career that has existed in every full GT release. This means they'll still have the usual groupings of events and I have to dream within a pretty defined and rigid structure:
Novice
National B
National A
International B
International A
Super
That in mind I'd like to see:
1) License Tests - The return of three mandatory license tests as a prologue to each step up into a new class (one before Novice, one before the National events and a third before the International events).
These would try to show the player the types of skills they would need to compete in each class: basic skills and understanding corner layouts and cornering techniques before novice; overtaking safely and reading your opponent at national leve;l and advanced techniques such as defensive drving lines and different pit strategies before the international level events.
2) AI Race-Craft - AI that increases in race craft abilities as we move up each class and that is themed to the class that we are racing.
AI opponents in Novice will make mistakes often and these would be mistakes that a novice racer would make, for example braking too late into a turn and under-steering wide or getting on the throttle too early on exit, losing grip and speed. I'd also be keen that these racers, though far more likely to make mistakes, will also be far more wary of damaging their vehicles excessively, remember these opponents are novice racers, most likely in a car they paid for themselves. They'd give you more room on the track, rarely go for overtakes and largely just stick to their own, sub-optimal and often inconsistent, line.
AI opponents in the two National classes would be more aggressive and generally faster but would still make mistakes and would still have inconsistencies in their line choice. As these opponents are more aggressive more of these errors would relate to racing incidents that lead to bent metal such as putting it up the inside for an overtake and not being able to quite reign in the speed, sending the car through the apex and washing wide. As the following car you would then need to actually consider what other cars are doing on track (teaching race craft to the user) and, for example, come off the gas a little early into the corner, let the overtaking car slew wide in front of you, run a tighter line through the turn and then sneak through at the exit.
AI opponents in the International classes would be seasoned racers who unless pressured by the player will rarely make mistakes and will know and use the optimal racing, defensive and overtaking lines. They will take measured risks to get in front or keep the following car behind. Defensive driving will be a thing and the car in front will move off the time trial line in order to protect their place, for example moving to the inside approaching turn 1 at Nurburgring GP/F. Equally, the car behind will genuinely try to overtake with a little bit of guile and forethought, for example taking a slightly wider line through turn 3 at GP/F in order to get a faster exit out of turn 4 leading to a drag down the straight and a possible opportunity on the inside at turn 5.
3) Event Classification - A rationalisation and better categorisation of the events within each class.
In GT6 [ignoring coffee break stuff] there are really only a couple of race types. There are those with a defined field of roughly equal cars and there are those with various cars with as much as 100-200pp in performance differences which really feel like an auto-cross type event but one where multiple cars are sharing the same track.
I understand the desire from PD to keep the chase the rabbit like events in order to use more cars from the substantial and varied car list but I think these events can be better thought out or better dressed at least.
I'd like to see 7 types of events:
- Race weekend events - These would be proper race events with cars that are closely matched and all meet stringent regulations with regards to weight, power, PP, aero and drivetrain requirements. They would include practise (skippable), qualification (skippable) and race elements. They would also include incident flags (and the associated rules) and penalties. They would all include tyre wear, the length of the races could be selected from a number of options and tyre wear could be accelerated to mean even in some short race events players would be required to have a pit strategy.
Some race events could be setup as multi-weekend championships and some advanced versions of these championships could even include some kind of weight/power ballasting to keep the player vaguely competitive even if they were super fast/super slow in the previous race(s).
- Chase the rabbit events - These would have a points based scoring system with the possibility of hugely varied fields of opponents. They would be structured largely like the Sierra challenges with the aim being to score the highest points total through a combination of extending your time left, overtaking cars and possibly hitting apexes correctly or controlled drifting. Points received for overtakes could even be weighted by the equivalent speed of the car so you'll get a point for overtaking the lower half of the field and maybe two points for overtaking each of the faster cars in the field. The combo elements of the Sierra events could be refined or alternatively, forget the combo aspect and just add and remove points for overtakes/collisions/drifts/apex hitting. Grid 2 does these types of events pretty well for reference (you only get points for overtakes however) though in this there is one type of car (lots of the same) to be overtaken so visually it is less exciting.
- Autocross time trial events - Simply set a time on a crowded or empty track. Three hot laps with the fastest counting. These times could be weighted by PP to ensure a wide variety of cars are competitive.
- Head to head challenges - One on one events where you only have one opponent and car choice and tuning is heavily regulated by weight/power/PP/drivetrain. You set a lap time in your car of choice first of all, this time is then added to a global leaderboard and your opponent in the head to head element is based on someone n places above you on that list.
This system could of course be cheesed but so what, "you're only cheating yourself".
Each time you try the event again your previous result is taken into account and an opponent is selected further up the leaderboard. Lap times could be reset by the user if they wish to do the event again from scratch.
- Regularity rally events - These events would not be based on outright speed but on the ability to remain consistent (an undervalued skill in racing). Give players a target time or average speed and they have to complete three to five laps and get as close to this target time/average speed as possible. The worst lap would be removed and then the players score is derived from working down from a "perfect" score of 100.
- Drift events - standard drift events with no real change from what we already have except that angle of drift as well as speed and line would be taken into account properly.
- Crowd pleasers - Events that are just for fun. These could include knocking over cones, smashing through conveniently placed piles of boxes, accurate donuts and j-turns, obstacle courses (don't knock over the cones/priceless ming vases!), demolition derby and that kind of silly fun.
4) Event Car Selection - Race weekend event car selection revisions including a difficulty slider with better AI car selection tighter restrictions.
I'd like to see around three difficulty levels for events in the form of regulations essentially related to the PP of the field you face and the car and upgrades you can can choose. These might be something like:
- New racer - The race has a PP limit of 500PP and a tyre limit of sports soft. Opponents have cars between 450 - 480pp and the same tyres.
- Experienced racer - The race has a PP limit of 500PP and a tyre limit of sports soft. Opponents have cars between 480 - 520pp and the same tyres.
- I am Ayrton Senna - The race has a PP limit of 500PP and a tyre limit of sports hard. Opponents have cars between 500 - 520pp and sports medium/soft tyres.
5) Enhanced visual and mechanical damage alongside an increased feel of ownership - Damage is retained post race and has a cost to fix, full and partial (botch) fixes are available and have consequences on your future performance. For example you can choose to replace a front wing or get a panel beater to put it roughly back into shape.
Mileage and wear continue to affect body rigidity and engine wear but in a more transparent way.
Mechanical and cosmetic fixes are available from the options mid-championship though if you prang your car in practise your qualification may suffer through having limited time on track (due to the mechanics working to get your car working) and if you prang your car in qualification or are otherwise unable to set a time, expect to start from the pit lane.
Online Multiplayer
1) Lobby Functionality
Good lobby racing is an absolute blast, I made so many good friends by hosting and playing in clean racing lobbies in GT5 but GT6 didn't expand on this functionality enough.
Regulations:
Hosts should be able to customise a lobby extensively in terms of entry regulations. The bare minimum expectations from me would be for the host to be able to:
- Set max limits for PP, HP, weight together;
- Specify a class and/or make and/or model and/or drivetrain;
- Specify a vehicle age;
- Specify exactly what can and can't be tuned (e.g. suspension tuning allowed, transmission and power tuning disallowed or vice versa);
- Specify whether ballast and/or power limiting can be used;
- Set a specific car or selection of cars that can be used in the lobby from either the entire stock car selection or from the host's own garage (e.g. everyone races in a car/selection of cars that I have personally tuned for ~equal lap times);
- Write a lobby title and description that is available for viewing from the lobby browsing list that is longer so we can adequately describe what behavior and racing type is expected from the lobby. Sometimes "Stock/SH/clean or kick" simply isn't enough!
Post Race Review:
- A lobby theatre mode should be added where everyone in the lobby can watch a replay of the race together (host controlled) after the race with chat enabled in order to highlight incidents to the host.
- Post race data should be available in the the lobby after the race is complete. This should include at least overall race time, fastest lap, tyre choice, car selection, PP/HP/weight/drivetrain, split times etc.
- Host applied player penalties - these could include ballast or power limitations, a drive through penalty in the next race, a sin bin period (I don't want to boot some people, just give them some time to calm down after a fraught race). All of these need to be transparent and allow the host to explain the reason for these sanctions.
- Race director/steward(s) role - Lobbies should be allowed to have one or more players who are not racing but are simply viewing the race, according to settings defined by the host these virtual stewards could have the ability to put out flagged cautions, call players in for a drive through penalty, simply kick a disruptive/otherwise non-conforming punter or simply highlight any issues for the host to address during the post race review. As an ex-regular host, having to leave a race in order to kick an idiot is very frustrating. These steward players should NOT count against the overall lobby size.
Finding a lobby:
The lobby list needs to be more customisable, as someone looking for a lobby I should be able to:
- See only tracks I want to see. A simple drop down allowing me to choose one track is not enough, maybe instead a number of check boxes or simply allow the use of AND/OR/NOT in my criteria;
- See only lobbies that fit my tuning requirements. Tuning allowed, stock cars, limited tuning for example;
- See only lobbies that fit my PP/HP/weight/make/model requirements;
- Check a more details page which shows me the full regulations for a lobby before joining it;
- Select a car first, then click "see which lobbies allow for the car I am in" button, user sees a returned list of appropriate lobbies.
2) Club Support
Regular racers should be able to join together to form clubs. These don't need to serve any purpose beyond an organisational hub but even this has useful competitive purposes:
- Asynchronous user/club owner definable time events in order to sort clubs into competitive leagues. For example: "Run GP/F in a Lotus with the attached tune. Your best time in ten full laps will be used to add you in the appropriate position in the club league.
- Multi-stage events either run through a single play session or multiple play sessions tied directly into the above league structure so similarly quick players compete against others in the same skill bracket. These should allow club organisers to apply win/loss ballast/performance differentials.
Anything else is gravy.
3) Online Quick Race Functionality
- Add a slightly wider range of car types and have each "quick race" actually be a series of three short races at different tracks. Maybe five general themes where the specifics can be changed up (see below). Something like 400 - 500 pp street cars, 500 - 600pp street cars, 500 - 600pp race cars (GT3/GT5/TC), 600+ race cars (LMP, open-wheel) and a final "specials" categories for classics/muscle/beetle racing/karts.
- Add an SRF off/SRF on (beginner/expert) option for each type rather than just randomly applying this to some events.
- Rotate/change these events regularly (at least monthly).
- Fill empty spots with AI racers to ensure a full grid and that there's someone for everyone to compete with.
4) Miscellaneous Online Improvements
- BRING BACK SHUFFLE RACING!!!!
- Lag reduction - Improve net code to reduce the amount of incompatibility issues and lag encountered in lobbies even when everyone has taken appropriate preparatory steps (caches cleared, routers re-booted, ports open etc. etc.)
- Player rating - I'm not necessarily asking for an i-racing type player safety rating but some additional stat tracking might make it easier for hosts to give the benefit of the doubt (or not) to people who appear to be playing dirty in their lobbies.
- BRING BACK SHUFFLE RACING!!!!
I could go on forever but PD will do whatever PD will do so this is no more than academic! Anyone who made it this far, you deserve more than what you got. I'm sorry.
tl;dr - more stuff please PD.
Louis Cyphre
Banned
With new hardware comes new challenges so i'm guessing one of three things will occur. We will get a Prologue release first and not the full instalment (don't like this approach), or the game will come out with few advancements and not many new gen modelled cars, or the game will take its sweet time getting here (late 2016 at the earliest.
The last scenario is the best option but the wait will be painful. I bought and still have GT5 not GT6 so it's been awhile to get excited for the franchise again.
The last scenario is the best option but the wait will be painful. I bought and still have GT5 not GT6 so it's been awhile to get excited for the franchise again.
Various Artists
Banned
I don't think it would be a major surprise to find out this would be the first major Morpheus title. The car models in photo mode are already incredible. All they need to do is have about 12 of them on the track and optimize it for VR.
TylerDurden4321
Member
Before I bought Project CARS I went back to GT6 after half a year or so. I remembered it as this "stuck in the PS2, at some points even stuck in the PS1 era" game... I mean, just look at the menu design/music/load-times.
But going back to it and expecting almost nothing, you have to give PD credit where credit are due:
- Day/Night cycle with time-slider, manually switch between low- and high-beam lights
- dynamic weather
- snow and dirt surface tracks
- racing-licenses with challenges that actually give you insight into car physics and cornering strategies (they could explain some things better though)
- car encyclopedia
- audio source independently selectable from the set view
- driving line can be turned on/off during gameplay and features multiple brake points (it doesn't make you faster, but it gives you insight in how to best approach a corner)
- 10 levels of traction control
Looking then at the graphics, physics and how smooth it runs on this completely outdated hardware, PD did a fantastic job.
Do me a favor and compare some far-away, downsampled shots of cars on a track (maybe heli-cam from replays in a 320pixel pic) where there isn't a lot of trackside stuff visible to more modern racing games running on way better hardware. The lighting in GT6 is spot on and - at least for me - those downsampled shots are easier to be mistaken for a real foto than pretty much any other racing game.
--------------
That being said, the physics need an update (pretty much everywhere, static and dynamic weight distribution, torque steer off the line, more suspension and tyre-flexing movement, simulate more modern car systems like hydraulic, computer assisted suspensions, active diffusor tech and generally more visible and tactile feedback to the player). That is where I have faith in PD to make a great GT7, this they are great at, this they can do.
Sound design in general, from music, menu and race sound-effects as well as engine sounds need to change to a completely new philosophy. I think they understood this and are on a good way there. This will be a big step, I have faith in them regarding this point.
Where I lose my faith is in content updating. This gen it won't be enough to take your old track and car models (and interiors, that looked crappy even on PS3) and give them a tiny make-over. They need to redo all of that and the only way to do it is to start more or less from scratch... and this time do it based on new, high-detail laserscanned data so it will be future-proof to a high degree when systems move to higher poly-count and better shaders. This can only be done by decreasing the number of cars and tracks significantly, which PD is too "people love these models, they are still great, we can't go from 1200 cars to only 200, so many cars and tracks will be missed, the community will be blablabla" for to pull it of.
If they would just do what they are good at, go for very high, polished quality in everything physics-, realism- and overall gameplay-related ...and just forget about having shitloads of considerably lower-quality content, they could claim the crown of console racing games again within maybe 2 games and 5 years, but I really don't have faith.
nowheretorun
Member
And I still fucked off with the shitty practice of closing the GT5 servers to 'force' some people who chose to buy GT6 because of this. Bastards!
Oh yes!
Agreed. I'm thinking mainly a physics/graphic/effects thing. The driving is fine. I hope they spend less time on the physics of driving (though obviously they can improve this if they want) but give us more of what will make it seem like a leap forward.
Tricky one this. He deserves the benefit of doubt for me but just ONE more time. If GT7 sucks balls and we have to deal with the same kind of shit, then yeah, binned!
You can blame GTplanet fans for that. PD actually updated the chase cam to feel less rigid in a GT5 update and it was a little more like GT3, only to remove it after the backlash and GTplanet people requesting to restore the old version.
One of the biggest gripes I had with GT5 was the lack of fucking options. I enjoyed the more shaky cam and then it get reduced cos others didn't like it? wtf is wrong with an option ffs...
Yeah agreed. A lack of direction in to what a mass market of what gamers want to see and what Kaz's vision is and what he thinks people want blur this.
My list:-
Ai
Ai variety. Surprise me. A focus on the 'world physics' on things such as tyre barriers/metal barriers, damaged cars/parts on the road, 'rare' oil slips/puddles and Ai variety to these things will help with this. I don't mind the Ai which follows a 'racing line' too much but let's give some of them a personality which may or may not lead to us disliking a particular driver for example...See later notes on perhaps certain livery edited motif's could determine a particular driver...
Damage
Visual Damage/Crash Physics. Come the fuck on PD. I remember the advert for GT5 and where we were told damage will occur 'even to the last nut/bolt'. Really fucking irritated me when we got fuck all. I understand there are license issues with this but we should be getting Visual Damage AT LEAST in SOME FORM which is now a generation beyond what we've seen.
Better/Different sounds as you hit the car in front or the world around us. Hitting a metal barrier should make a particular sound which is totally the opposite to hitting a barrier of tyres for example.
Have this in the SINGLE PLAYER part of the game AT LEAST. This would help with making the game fun for a lot of casuals and perhaps the difficulty with the hardcore if it included Performance Damage too. THESE COULD BE OPTIONS. So Single Player on casual difficulty would have Visual Damage and on hardcore difficulty, Performance Damage too.
In Time Trials these could have options too, or if Kaz felt it was more about the driving experience so he didn't want to have damage here, then just give us the options for ALL ON, ALL OFF or whatever the fuck we want. Do Time Trial leaderboards which would reflect the different options people wanted to do.This could be the same for Online Racing too.
If you don't want to race in a lobby with Damage, Visual or Performance, then you wouldn't. All the dicks for example who just want to ram each other, drive the wrong way and see shit blow up or crash can do. There could be different levels for those who want Visual Damage but not Performance as accidents do happen when people bump you but you don't want your back/front end ruining the race. It could be just a Visual Damage where it physically alters none concerned or Visual Damage where it has 'levels' or 'Realism'. So Realism Level 1 bump from behind, gives you a nudge/slight loss of control for a moment to the guy being hit/hitting, whereas Realism Level 2 is more extreme and Level 3 is full on 'you bastard! as he waives' as he drives past you. Same Realism Levels could be there for Performance too. They could do what DriveClub now does where if there is a big pile up, the car goes 'ghost' type so the race isn't fucked.
So options could be for 3 main Modes as: Level 1- 3 on Visual - Physics - Performance.
What's wrong with options?
To appease the Car Manufacturers, PD could tone it down obviously but ffs, to have a fucking 'doink' and nothing, is taking the piss and imo, one of the main factors the game is becoming stale/removed from a casual-mid-core audience.
Single Player Part Of Game
For me, GT3, which was my first GT game, was the best and it's been downhill since then. Yes, GT4 had slightly nicer graphics and more tracks but the formula of GT3 needed to be changed slightly imo. For a person who competed it 100% and spent hours and hours on ghost cars competing with a mate of mine, something fresh was needed to make a person want to compete the game. Love licenses. I think a better way of progression of the single player game should be a very important aspect of the next GT game. It needs to be accessible for casuals who will feel the success of progression but have the depth the hardcore desire. A great combination of both so even the hardcore will feel progression would be perfect imo. Let's see...
Perhaps using my Levels On Visual/Physics/Performance and Ai is an easy way for people to understand and make an informed choice. Perhaps if a race was too difficult and you couldn't progress, you could be given the option to reduce your Physics Level because you kept getting bumped up the arse in a RW drive car and you skidded the fuck out all the time. Even more annoying is it was the fucker '????' in the Red Chevrolet with the Livery Edited Motif (unique to that 'guy/gal' who drove up your arse from 8 races ago in a
Obviously, all these would determine your Level Of Performance/Rank/Stars etc. Only the Elite mother fuckas who completed the game on Level 3 Visual/Physics/Performance/Ai could be bowed down to. Incidently, rewards should be relevant to how a person has perfromed. Doing a Level 3 on all things gives you a VERY nice car, doing a Level 0, gives you a paint job and access to the next race. All the in betweens depending on the permutation of how you chose to race, gives you just reward. You can always go back at a later date to compete if you chose. Again, options. Perhaps even Licenses could be an 'option' for a Race where you get another reward for those that want them.
The Single Player should have the structure similar of previous GT's in terms of it's general racing but streamline them so we get more variety/races but with options to replay them differently, if we choose AND the Categorised Types.
So; General Racing All Car Types:American/Japanese/European/Rear Wheel/Front Wheel/1970's-2010's etc...on all of the tracks, other than those which only lend to the Specific Category. To simplify the progress, have the Track as the Event as opposed the the Car Type/Variation as the Event
- Touring Cars
- F1
- Daytona
- Rally Circuit
- Rally Point-To-Point (randomly generated)
- Dirt Racing
- Karts
- Drag
This needs simplifying to satisfy casuals and their progression. The understanding of your progression needs simplifying too. So for example, if Tracks were based as your way to understand progression as opposed to the Car Type, most would find that easier to understand. You know, what you've unlocked so far in the game and where you're at.
PD could easily implement a system like this BUT as they are designing a game, I'm sure they would still want to make sure we race certain cars on certain tracks/parts of tracks for example. They could do this by having a 'Challenge Unlocked' category. So as we progress through the game, these Challenges become unlocked that we can go back to but if we want, we can still continue on with the Single Player 'Story' part if you like, it could just be the next 'Category'. If we're stuck, we can always do a License or a Challenge Unlocked . Let's say I've just competed Trail Mountain with a 4 Wheel Drive and come first with a Level 3 on Visual/Physics/Performance/Ai, PD give me a 'Challenge Unlocked' to complete this with a Rear Wheel Drive or a car from 1970's or whatever or a combination of many things. Keeping the Single Player 'Story' and it's progression with additional bits imo makes it easier/more appealing as opposed to 'have' to do a race on Time Trial Mountain with the similar kind of car 'but' one that is now German as opposed to the Japanese car I did it with before.
I suppose it looks like I'm talking nonsense here/I'm struggling to get my point across. To summarise=
- Structure a SINGLE PLAYER WITH VARIETY, EASE OF UNDERSTANDING, CONSTANT PROGRESSION.
It can be made as simple or difficult as you chose with rewards/cars/extra's etc as the prize, depending on the Levels you chose for Visual/Physics/Performance/Ai). Make this a tight, exciting experience so it feels like a game which is orchestrated/controlled by it's developer to exude emotion/frustration/joy/satisfaction, that appears to keep moving forward, like many a great game are.
- OPTIONS OF CHALLENGES UNLOCKED.
For Completionists/Hardcore/Those who want to get certain extra's. These could be Races, Times Trials Full/Part Tracks, Licenses, Own Tracks, Online etc...
For me these are the 3 main areas I think PD should concentrate on to produce a great
'game' and take the series forward that appeal to both the Casual & Core Racer.
Obviously there are many many more with things I'd like to see happen and still happen from previous GT games;
- TRACKS TRACKS TRACKS.
Give me them ALL. Complex D. The lot. Classics and New. I'll pay more if I have to. Upgrade them ALL to the ps4 standard. £5 a track for Classics done correct. Cheaper if bought in bundles or Season Pass. Let me share them online so not everyone has to buy them if they don't want to. I'm fine with that.
- Get fucking rid of Standard Fucking Cars.
Get Rid. Get Rid. If this means to reduce the amount of cars and start again, then do it. Sell the others as DLC. Have a team dedicated to selling these 'classics'.
No matter how hard they try, there will always be someone who won't get the car they want. So PD, choose the cars wisely. Have variety and not 3000 japanese cars but different fucking years.
If you want this game to be global, then American and EU and Japanese cars need to be supported equally. Wtf am I supposed to do if I normally race inside car and then I get a standard that I MUST use for a race and then its just black inside. Get the fuck outta here PD. GTFO.
Options. IF you must include Standard Cars and obviously there are people who do want them. Then put them in but keep them out of the Single Player Game - period! Do not force me to use one to complete the game but then not give me an option of a similar car that I can use in Premium. Give the option on Online so if I don't want to see any ugly ass Standard Cars, I'll chose not too. If I really want to use an ugly ass Standard Car online, let me have the option knowing that others might not want to race against me.
VERY IMPORTANT if you do use Standard Cars, that you ensure there is no confusion and that you Market it correctly within the game, otherwise, the whole thing will only bring negative press to the game. Imo, its best to be left out but I can surely understand why others want them in. Remember, options are a good thing but this is a tricky area to say the least...
- 1080p/60 fps.
- Track Editor.
- Rally Circuits And Random Point To Point.
- Extensive List of Racing Categories (F1, Touring, Rally, Karts, Daytona, etc...)
- Online Challenges.
- Online Servers.
Which don't get shut off so we buy the next game. Just dlc us and continue to improve the game like DriveClub. More tracks, cars etc. Maybe call it Gran Turismo and not GT7
- Small Details Emphasis
Water spray from car in front, dirt flicked onto screen in real-time, leaves getting caught in your windscreen wipers, heavy dirt/grime build up on windscreen, real-time car windscreen wash, car parts smashed into windscreen from crash in front/parts on road, tyres/wheels coming off, rubber of split tyres left on road, divots/pot holes in road that fuck you up, a crowd that reacts to you almost driving in to them, puddles splashing onto sides of car windows, etc etc..
- World Physics Emphasis.
As explained in Damage note earlier so it feels like you're driving within a space that reacts to what you do, as opposed to the invisible walls we keep getting. Let us bash tyre barriers so they spread all over the place and are reflected on the next lap or barriers which have been dented etc...
- Effects (dynamic weather/time of day, others?)
- OPTIONS OPTIONS OPTIONS.
Camera View Options so I can have the Windscreen even closer if I want like in DriveClub but even more, so I can go closer just to show the Inside Car Frame. Camera Shake Options. If I want it to look like an Earthquake or like a Picture, give me the option. Sparks. If I want to see sparks fly past my face, then let me. Don't tone it down because some think it looks over the top. Audio Options. Let me have the outside sounds whilst racing inside if I want. Let me increase/decrease the engine sounds or the damage sounds or sound of other cars.
- Livery Editor. Can be used to give the game personality including the Ai...Personally, I'm not that bothered and like to race/look cars with factory colours, but where's the harm. DriveClub is tasteful and again, could give Ai personality which could help with the 'game'.
- Is 'B' Spec really needed?
- Better Garage. Think an Airport Hangar that I could walk around
- Car Setup Sharing, especially could be helpful for a particular online lobby, if wanted.
- Quicker Load Times and UI Set Up Easier To Use.
- Legacy Wheel Support.
- Improved FFB and perhaps something like a Buttkicker made for purely for GT support...
- Morpheus Support, even in a simpler/shorter form.
**** me, PD have got a job and a half on their hands. Best give us a 'concept' version first!
10-20 Tracks, 50-100 Cars should do it! Although, this is perhaps not a good idea as it will distract from the main game?....
Roberto Larcos
Member
They'll show it, definitely.
Not because it's ready, but because Microsoft will likely be demoing Forza 6, and they'll want to throw some doubt into the undecided minds who may be swayed by Turn 10's game - get them to stall on any potential purchase.
Regarding old models, all I really need is an option - 'turn off old models' - similar to how you can turn off user liveries in Forza Horizon 2. Maybe some classes would be lacking in variety of cars to choose from then, but I'd rather that than have the immersion-breaking old models driving around me.
Also, better AI please. One area where Forza is better hands-down right now.
UnluckyKate
Member
Can't wait to see what witchcraft they can do on PS4
M1ch04c4n0
Banned
I agree with you OP. I did about 5 races before deciding it was more fun to wait in a real life waiting room at your local dealership.
Amen to that. The guy has no vision where to take its series to.
Something also worth mentioning is the VERY poor netcode and online mode in the game. GT4 was supposed to be playable online (they cancelled it at the last minute...)...10 years later, their online game is a total mess, stuck in 2004...
...and the way PD handles communication with the community (should I say NO-communication?) is a shame. They just absolutly ignore their fans. Zero sharing.
PCars destroys GT in so many aspects (FFB is a huge one)... I am sure PD won't be able to come back: GT7 will destroy the competition technically, but the game will be the same mess. Kaz dropped the ball big time...and someone else picked it.
Roberto Larcos
Member
It says a lot that in just a couple short years, the best console for racing games switched over from PlayStation to Xbox. I know a lot more Forza fans than Gran Turismo. That was unthinkable 10 years ago - and really serves to demonstrate your point.
Ruf must have gotten so much exposure thanks to Porsche's EA exclusivity. Absolute lunacy from Porsche - hopefully this practice doesn't become more widespread.
The Artisan
Member
it didn't have an online play though, right around the time where it should've.
TylerDurden4321
Member
no, please throw ALL of them away, every car needs a complete overhaul.
If I see a car without a cockpit or a car with a premium cockpit from PS3, I don't think, I'm gonna invest more than 20 bucks for this game. I'd much rather have 100 very accurately modeled cars (visually and setup-/parts-wise) than a ton of cars with just a selection of 30 paramaters setup differently, low exterior poly-count and an ugly as fuck low-res/-poly cockpit.
Don't get me wrong, it's great to actually find cars that you have driven or a friend or neighbor is driving and then take them to a trackday at the virtual Nurburgring Nordschleife, but if they are less accurately modeled (track and car) as cars in Forza or Project CARS or Assetto Corsa then I DON'T feel like I'm taking that car to a trackday, then I just feel like I'm playing a video game! (as in "a more arcad'ish video game").
Throw the old models A-WAAY!! (or update them to a degree, they seem like they're done from scratch)
I just want to be able to launch my car into space again :3
I prefer Assetto Corsa for the actual driving part.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Again, the PS3 cars were made to a much higher fidelity than the PS3 could handle and then scaled down. The PS4 versions would be higher LOD than the PS3 versions, but still be the same models. Why would you get rid of that?
funkystudent
Member
My biggest fear for GT7 is they go balls deep with VR and essentially the game is just GT6 with VR.
I think PD was heavily inspired by the show Best Motoring back in the 90's. Just regular common street cars racing on circuits. No crazy liveries, weather effects or visual car mods. The game has its own style and I kind of like it that way.
Best Motoring samples
https://youtu.be/V13b95jGZ0M?t=50s
https://youtu.be/Uhiag_Ldggg?t=5m40s
https://youtu.be/WFDG2ZYXg1M?t=1m44s
Best Motoring samples
https://youtu.be/V13b95jGZ0M?t=50s
https://youtu.be/Uhiag_Ldggg?t=5m40s
https://youtu.be/WFDG2ZYXg1M?t=1m44s
gundamkyoukai
Member
No i enjoy driving in those cars and since i don't drive in cockpit mode why should i lose them.
The best thing would be for all of them to become premium but that going to take a while so they can update them every game.
People talking about how great certain games are forgetting that if they don't have the cars you want to drive it don't matter .
EmptySpace
Banned
that's how people who only look at the game, react.
i play at bumper cam, and a lot of standard cars are even better to drive than the premium cars.
so no, don't throw away standards just because some people are whining about how they see the game visually.
throwing away something that could give players way more value through gameplay and experience all because it doesn't look as good as the other cars. seriously pathetic. it isn't like the standards look way worse. they don't, and their looks even matter less when in motion.
blacklabel93
Neo Member
Polyphony only problem is their car sounds. Gt5 and 6 where solid racers
Duxxy3
Member
It seems like every Gran Turismo past 3 gets caught in development hell. I think a lot of that is Polyphony's singular focus on numbers. GT3 was the peak of the series, in terms of sales, and it had less than 200 cars in it. That ballooned with each iteration and has become a huge weight on the series. The number of tracks also continues to grow and grow.
Turn 10 smartly realized that pure numbers were not feasible in next gen development and cut down from 400/500 down to 200. That's still a shitload of cars. Project cars has less than 100 cars.
Gran Turismo has turned from a racing franchise into a racing archive. That was feasible during the PS2 era. Development costs were a lot lower and demand for premium car models didn't exist. In the HD era though... developers need to learn when to cut back. 1000 cars and 100 tracks is insane. Even half of that is ridiculous.
EmptySpace
Banned
Most things listed in this thread honestly aren't as bad as they seem. Especially the AI complaining. The AI actually pretty good and I played tons of games with AI a shitload worse.
What I would really like for a SIM racing to actually do is the make their game truly realistic. And for this they would need to ditch the fucking car manifacturers. I mean, we could have an extremely realistic games with true to life consequences. Having extremely realistic car with the brand removed without be much a letdown compare to what this liberty would bring.
But all racing games maker are shaking in their pants to even try. Sad world.
I mean, seriously, did anybody doubt that this was a Veyron here? And no car manifacturer did sue Rockstar afterall...
What I would really like for a SIM racing to actually do is the make their game truly realistic. And for this they would need to ditch the fucking car manifacturers. I mean, we could have an extremely realistic games with true to life consequences. Having extremely realistic car with the brand removed without be much a letdown compare to what this liberty would bring.
But all racing games maker are shaking in their pants to even try. Sad world.
I mean, seriously, did anybody doubt that this was a Veyron here? And no car manifacturer did sue Rockstar afterall...
You must be kidding. The AI in GT5 and 6 is absolutly terrible...terrible terrible terrible...
Other games have bad IA too? Sure. But that does not make GT's less terrible though...
Melfice7
Member
The AI is well aware of whats going on if you drive at a slow "civilized" pace as if it was a track day, but it's never competitive.
One of my big complains is the grind.. locking car content behind massive ammounts of grind just doesnt do it for me anymore, i still did it on GT5 and got every car in a legit way, but in GT6 i did the mercedes launch glitch because i couldnt handle spending 20 freaking million for one car for example, especially a car i already had in GT5.
So i hope they realize most people that buy the game probably never get to use 10% of the content they spend years creating..
Would be great if all the cars were unlocked and the career mode is a series of compelling events and competitions featuring those cars instead of grinding that one special race for 20 times to buy 2 cars
One of my big complains is the grind.. locking car content behind massive ammounts of grind just doesnt do it for me anymore, i still did it on GT5 and got every car in a legit way, but in GT6 i did the mercedes launch glitch because i couldnt handle spending 20 freaking million for one car for example, especially a car i already had in GT5.
So i hope they realize most people that buy the game probably never get to use 10% of the content they spend years creating..
Would be great if all the cars were unlocked and the career mode is a series of compelling events and competitions featuring those cars instead of grinding that one special race for 20 times to buy 2 cars
TylerDurden4321
Member
I'm happy not to be alone with my opinion!
...but I will try to be happy for everyone else who likes the giant car collection and thinks the visuals and handling nuances are just fine. After all there are enough other racing games on the market.
Edit:
I think it's probably for the best in a game like Project CARS to have everythin unlocked from the start considering their target audience, but... having played PCARS and Driveclub as well as GT5 and FM5, I feel car-pokemon has it's place in the world of Forza and GT, just make the economy more approachable (the prices in GT are just ridiculous if you didn't exploit the Mercedes Vision glitch before the patch). FM5 had it down after the patches in my opinion except for the racing-series(non-production/road-legal) cars, who should work via sponsorship like in PCARS. The challenges from DC and the racing-licenses from GT6 should be there too, but I don't want progression based car-tier unlocks like in DC.
gundamkyoukai
Member
The handling has nothing to do with the gfx , that is base on the physics engine.
Funny thing is if GT got rid of it's old cars it would still have 5 to 7 times the amount of car PCars or DC have.
Either way when your games sells million up million you can't please everyone .
Canis lupus
Member
Most of this is trivial stuff. The only things I want GT to have from FM are the sounds and maybe the damage models.
They should focus all their attention in getting better audio and deleting the ps2 cars.
Green Yoshi
Member
I would like to see a new career mode, better AI and more variety in the events.
But I think they will do GT6 Remastered first.
But I think they will do GT6 Remastered first.
Roberto Larcos
Member
If there's one game that really doesn't need a remaster, it's
I mean, they could, but it already looks great on old-gen, and PS4 gamers have Project CARS to tide them over until Gran Turismo 7 (prologue?) anyway. More people would be pissed at the delay than happy about the re-release. PlayStation Now means people will be able to play it if they want to anyway.