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[Nickle]

If comedians were only allowed to be politically correct, then there wouldn't be many comedians. It's very difficult to be funny, as is shown by NeoGAF threads, and it would be even harder to only rely on G rated jokes.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

it would be even harder to only rely on G rated jokes.

I wonder if there are parallel threads going on where people get these conclusions they make up.

 

[excelsiorlef]

I know exactly what you mean and it happened a lot with the Chapelle show and happens frequently with K&P too. You kind of learn things about people you didn't really want to know when they're quoting parts of the joke that aren't intended to be the punchline.

And Chris Rock said his famous routine was basically used by a ton of racist white people to claim they don't hate black people just the ones that act out the stereotype.

He's openly said he retired that bit because it was being used by racists.

 

[CarpeDeezNutz]

The rest of her shit is lame and old, but Mexcians working 100% comes off as praise. Someone tell me how it's offensive, like that we are slave workers 24/7?


Isn't hard working an American ideal?

 

[J10]

The rest of her shit is lame and old, but Mexcians working 100% comes off as praise. Someone tell me how it's offensive, like that we are slave workers 24/7?


Isn't hard working an American ideal?

There's no such thing as a positive stereotype. We're all individuals.

 

[CarpeDeezNutz]

There's no such thing as a positive stereotype. We're all individuals.

Ahh ok now I see.

 

[GorillaJu]

And Chris Rock said his famous routine was basically used by a ton of racist white people to claim they don't hate black people just the ones that act out the stereotype.

He's openly said he retired that bit because it was being used by racists.

Yeah I've sat through a few uncomfortable conversations with coworkers while they quoted black comedians and seemed to miss the point completely.

 

[King Cobra]

Can you back these false equivalences and misrepresentations up with some real life examples of this happening?

Can we just use your own post as an example to prove that this comic strip isn't far off?

I simply cannot understand how your brain isn't seeing the comical irony about a comic strip portraying people being way too sensitive and taking comedians way too serious and you asking the poster to show evidence or to back up said claims on a comic that 1. he did not create and 2. is meant to be just a humorous web comic.

It's people like you that comedians like Seinfeld talk about when they say our generation is ruining comedy.


As for this comedian, I am Mexican and I find the working joke as a compliment. The other one about consensual sex I don't understand but that could just be because she needs to work on her material more.

 

[Dryk]

I simply cannot understand how your brain isn't seeing the comical irony about a comic strip portraying people being way too sensitive and taking comedians way too serious and you asking the poster to show evidence or to back up said claims on a comic that 1. he did not create and 2. is meant to be just a humorous web comic.

If it's just meant to be a funny web comic that doesn't matter why are people in this thread pointing to it and saying "See, this is the shit I'm talking about!"? You can't have it both ways.

 

[King Cobra]

If it's just meant to be a funny web comic that doesn't matter why are people in this thread pointing to it and saying "See, this is the shit I'm talking about!"? You can't have it both ways.

That is how comedy works, some will get it some won't. Some will look into it for something more than just a joke.The problem is when people who don't get it ruin it for everyone else who enjoys said joke.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Can we just use your own post as an example to prove that this comic strip isn't far off?

I simply cannot understand how your brain isn't seeing the comical irony about a comic strip portraying people being way too sensitive and taking comedians way too serious and you asking the poster to show evidence or to back up said claims on a comic that 1. he did not create and 2. is meant to be just a humorous web comic.

It's people like you that comedians like Seinfeld talk about when they say our generation is ruining comedy.


As for this comedian, I am Mexican and I find the working joke as a compliment. The other one about consensual sex I don't understand but that could just be because she needs to work on her material more.

Hey, can you show me an example of when that strip happened?

 

[A Link to the Past]

She was actively playing on racist thoughts.

'Hey, black people talk loudly at the movies'. It's fucking lazy. Like, some bad sketch of what diet racists say when no minorities are around. Fuck out of here.

The worst part is that often, whether you're allowed to do it is based on whether you are popular (mind you, this is different from being -good- at this kind of humour).

This image doesn't get defended because people hate the author.

If comedians were only allowed to be politically correct, then there wouldn't be many comedians. It's very difficult to be funny, as is shown by NeoGAF threads, and it would be even harder to only rely on G rated jokes.

Y'know, this happens all the time in comedy. Every time it happens, people act like comedy is dying. Every time it happens, comedy doesn't die, it just adjusts to society. Every time it happens, people forget that comedy didn't die and then complain the next time comedy goes through a seismic shift that comedy is on its deathbed.

 

[King Cobra]

Hey, can you show me an example of when that strip happened?

I didn't make the comic strip, ask the artist.

 

[border]

I definitely see where you're coming from, and some of these lines wouldn't fly today. There's still a world of difference here between Chappelle exaggerating the stereotypes of his own race under extraordinary circumstances and the jokes about Mexicans Schumer tells, but both comedians are generally employing the "I'm playing dumb/a character" thing that makes the absurdity land in a way that worse comedians can't manage.

Maybe a big part of this is also that Chappelle is way more charismatic and has his heart on his sleeve while Schumer is still a bit too distant and guarded for most people to be able to relate to her and see where she's coming from. That's why her sex comedy lands more than her race jokes.

The difference is mostly just that Chappelle is black and that people will write off his material as a critique of some low-class segment of the black population, whereas white comedians doing similar material would just be considered racists. The shady part though is that his co-writer on the show was white, and many of those jokes revolving around black stereotypes are probably coming from him. It's my personal opinion, but I imagine that Chappelle just got tired of being their excuse to do flagrantly racist material. He probably rationalized it away by telling himself that "We're just making fun of low-class blacks, not all black people" but over time the mean spirited nature of it all just got to him.

Ignoring the politically correct angle, they went for the low-hanging fruit just as Schumer does -- jokes about Newport cigarettes, ribs, fried chicken, shooting dice, and bling seem just as hackneyed as her material about black people yelling in movie theatre or having weird names. It's something of a double standard that he can get away with it and she can't, but probably not the sort of double standard that's really worth getting furious about.

Hey, can you show me an example of when that strip happened?

It's a comic strip -- they are all about metaphor and hyperbole. You can't expect it to be a literal interpretation of actual events. Political cartoons rely on even more clumsy metaphor.

That said it is a little dumb to pretend that there won't be any jokes left to tell if all offensive material has to be cut.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

I didn't make the comic strip, ask the artist.

Is your argument that if people use someone else's work when trying to make a point, we can only question the original author and not the poster?

 

[CygnusXS]

Can we just use your own post as an example to prove that this comic strip isn't far off?

I simply cannot understand how your brain isn't seeing the comical irony about a comic strip portraying people being way too sensitive and taking comedians way too serious and you asking the poster to show evidence or to back up said claims on a comic that 1. he did not create and 2. is meant to be just a humorous web comic.

It's people like you that comedians like Seinfeld talk about when they say our generation is ruining comedy.


As for this comedian, I am Mexican and I find the working joke as a compliment. The other one about consensual sex I don't understand but that could just be because she needs to work on her material more.

Seinfeld's brand of humour could also just be out of date. *His* comedy might be "ruined" in the sense that it doesn't have the same mainstream appeal that it used to, but comedy is still producing viable material.

 

[border]

Seinfeld doesn't play colleges because you cannot charge $50-$100 per ticket at colleges. They are absolutely beneath him at this point. He isn't going to play your college for the same reason that Lady Gaga and the Rolling Stones aren't going to play your college - they don't have to.

He said "Some of my friends won't play colleges" and the outrage blogs turned it into "Seinfeld won't play colleges because they are too PC," as if the guy really has any problems writing clean humor.

 

[Nappuccino]

I don't really understand how that consensual joke is supposed to work as a joke. Something like, "I love having passionate sex with them. But now I prefer consensual" at least has a set up and punch line that builds from it.

Still not that funny.

I think her dumb character isn't obviously dumb enough to make it work.

 

[King Cobra]

Is your argument that if people use someone else's work when trying to make a point, we can only question the original author and not the poster?

I never used that comic to make a point, I used your post to make a point.

 

[border]

I don't really understand how that consensual joke is supposed to work as a joke. Something like, "I love their passionate love-making. But now I prefer consensual" at least has a set up and punch line that builds from it.

Still not that funny.

I think her dumb character isn't obviously dumb enough to make it work.

Have you seen a clip of the joke in context? I have to imagine that she has some material before or after that punchline that talks about how Hispanic guys have trouble taking no for an answer. Out of context, the joke doesn't really work because there's no pre-existing stereotype for the audience to draw from. Not that that really excuses the joke or anything.

 

[way more]

Have you seen a clip of the joke in context? I have to imagine that she has some material before or after that punchline that talks about how Hispanic guys have trouble taking no for an answer. Out of context, the joke doesn't really work because there's no pre-existing stereotype for the audience to draw from. Not that that really excuses the joke or anything.

No, jokes stand on their own. Also, I know nothing about comedy and don't really watch it because it just seems a pointless waste of time. But I will judge the two single quotes released and condemn her entirety. I can't really judge the joke because that's not my thing but it's just not nice to say.

She must've studied under Seinfeld, like Mr. Richards did.

 

[TAJ]

i always have issue with this sort of statement.

its old and tired to you, but its always new to SOMEONE.

That's Seth McFarlane's entire career right there.

 

[xandaca]

There's no such thing as a positive stereotype. We're all individuals.

Yes, we're all individuals.

 

[KPJZKC]

Quite a lot of people in here willing to accept stuff like the 'consensual' comment as comedy. It's a blanket remark insinuating that latinos are rapists - there's no joke to be found here.

 

[dh4niel]

I thought comedy was meant to be funny? Some of these racist jokes are so tired and played out it's gotten to a form of parody. Doesn't stop them being offensive though.

 

[Turin Turambar]

What about this joke?

I didn't find the construction worker joke funny, like it was too cliché and simple, but that's hilarious!

 

[Drewly]

Good jokes in OP, nothing wrong with them.

 

[BocoDragon]

I'm trying to figure out what kind of pain Schumer is working through and expressing catharsis about through her jokes on Hispanic people. Is Amy Schumer Hispanic?

Not Schumer's pain. The pain of racism, ethnicity, ethnic stereotypes. Whether you think they are true (i.e. comedy from 100 years ago), or lamentable (i.e. much of comedy now), there is a centre of pain to the topic.

All humour extends from pain, if you really break it down. Every joke is at the expense of someone or something in some way. Even slipping on a banana peel is predicated upon an unfortunate situation. The most celebrated comedians talk about the dark sides of relationships, family, aging... there is always something "negative" at the core of any joke.

“I've found out why people laugh. They laugh because it hurts so much . . . because it's the only thing that'll make it stop hurting.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, Stranger in a Strange Land

I support social criticism of comedy. Those are conversations we need to have and our societies progress through them. But ultimately, asking for all comedy to be scrubbed of "offence" is essentially to scrub comedy. Without the painful centre, you don't have a joke.

 

[uncelestial]

I don't like those jokes and I don't like her. But the solution is easy: I'm just gonna skip her shit.

That said, in her defense, I think she imagined "consensual" in a feminist way -- she might have experienced Latinos being sexually pushy, which is not okay. If that's true, then I think that makes the joke land a little more on the side of funny, but it's still a heavy penalty to pay (stereotyping an entire race) to get there, and even then it still isn't that funny, because it's not like "haha, finally someone speaking some truth in this world," it's like "wow, this person seems to really have a problem with Latinos and is hoping everyone else is going to back her up on it."

Pretty ugly stuff. There are plenty of awesome female comedians that manage to be a lot more witty and manage to convince me they're coming from a good place, so I simply don't need Schumer in my life. I always hated her on the roasts and wish someone else had gotten a shot at having a show that she got. The world doesn't need more smug white people being "edgy" about minorities, nevermind the horribly annoying "playing the dumb girl" approach to comedy, that Sarah Silverman dropped (and is better for doing so).

 

[A Link to the Past]

Not Schumer's pain. The pain of racism.

All humour extends from pain, if you really break it down. Every joke is at the expense of someone or something in some way. Even slipping on a banana peel is predicated upon an unfortunate situation. The most celebrated comedians talk about the dark sides of relationships, family, aging... there is always something "negative" at the core of any joke.

“I've found out why people laugh. They laugh because it hurts so much . . . because it's the only thing that'll make it stop hurting.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, Stranger in a Strange Land

I support social criticism of comedy. Those are conversations we need to have and our societies progress through them. But ultimately, asking for all comedy to be scrubbed of "offence" is essentially to scrub comedy. Without the painful centre, you don't have a joke.

The issue then becomes one of balance. Are jokes aimed at the most privileged groups as harsh as those aimed at less privileged ones? Generally, jokes about women are meaner and more common than jokes about men (in an industry dominated by men). What's with jokes about gay people being so common? There's hardly ever jokes about being straight, and usually when there are, it's jokes told by straight people. At that point it becomes a criticism of the fact that the offensive jokes most often go to easy/easier targets than it is a criticism of general offensiveness.

 

[lednerg]

"I go in and out of playing an irreverent idiot."

That's it exactly. The butt of these jokes is the person that the comic him/herself is portraying. They're mocking an insensitive jerk. If you don't get it, I don't know, maybe it would help if you imagined them saying "durrrr..." right before the insensitive comment. Comics play these kinds of characters constantly; what they say is not meant to be taken seriously. There are exceptions, but for the most part, modern comics are not being serious. Sarah Silverman is not being racist with her act, she's mocking a racist.

 

[Future]

I don't really understand how that consensual joke is supposed to work as a joke. Something like, "I love having passionate sex with them. But now I prefer consensual" at least has a set up and punch line that builds from it.

Still not that funny.

I think her dumb character isn't obviously dumb enough to make it work.

It's funny because of the misdirection. You don't see it coming. It's like comedy's version of the jump scare. The misdirection comes as a surprise and then once you digest what she said the offensiveness hits you. Your version is less funny actually

Seth does the same shit in Family Guy. Some people like it, some don't

 

[uncelestial]

This guy does it a hell of a lot better.

https://youtu.be/dw_mRaIHb-M

Not really. That's more of a rant, not a bit. It's an excellent point, but not exactly a funny one.

Interesting, I've had quite a bit of success in comedy by not telling shitty, insensitive jokes. Comedians that can't handle "PC fascists" putting their shticks on blast should probably re-evaluate how funny they actually are, and the kinds of audiences they want as their fans.

Actually, the issue is that "PC Fascists" (or better said, "the people who start campaigns against comedians") want to completely sidestep the performer/audience dynamic and use social media to amplify their objections so that it doesn't matter if they're funny and doesn't matter what kind of audience they want. The campaigners want that comedian's success to hinge on the outcome of some kind of weird trial-by-think-piece process, when really, this should all be self-regulating. If a performer is happy with the audience they get and the response they get from that audience, all is well, and if they aren't, they'll adjust on their own or quit. Twitter is not a necessary component, period.

 

[BocoDragon]

The issue then becomes one of balance. Are jokes aimed at the most privileged groups as harsh as those aimed at less privileged ones? Generally, jokes about women are meaner and more common than jokes about men (in an industry dominated by men). What's with jokes about gay people being so common? There's hardly ever jokes about being straight, and usually when there are, it's jokes told by straight people. At that point it becomes a criticism of the fact that the offensive jokes most often go to easy/easier targets than it is a criticism of general offensiveness.

Jokes definitely can/should/will change due to the changing zeitgeist.

But I'd argue they actually have changed. Audiences in the 2010s are inherently uncomfortable with jokes about race/gender/sexual orientation. Most jokes of the current era about these topics are essentially predicated on that discomfort, and that's why they're funny. "Racial" jokes of the current era are less funny because people think racial stereotypes are true, and they're actually funny because "that comedian shouldn't have said that, and I can't believe they did". "Racism" is actually the butt of so many "racist" jokes of the current era.

There are certainly outliers to that fact. But in the main, I don't think those outliers represent any kind of popular comedy.

Honestly, I don't need Schumer to tell me she's not racist. I know she isn't, because the construction of those jokes relies on being self aware about how racism is publicly taboo and she shouldn't be saying those things. The funny comes from saying what she knows she shouldn't.

 

[EloquentM]

Defense force really arguing that there's no difference between an offensive joke that's funny and one that isn't? The reason comedians get away with the stuff they say isnt solely because its said in jest, it actually has to be funny. That's the difference between a joke and a statement. If the statement is humorous the comedians stchick is believable. If not the illusion is gone then it just becomes a fucked up statement. That usually happens when you rehash jokes that have been stale for years. Louis CK would be absolutely shit on if he wasn't funny and Amy's "jokes" are innocent by comparison.

 

[Winter John]

Hmm, well, of course it's their job; but I can't honestly agree to that in the absolute sense kind of way. Told poorly, a "racist" or "bigoted" joke can create a situation where a racist audience will say, "see, see! I'm right!" instead of "huh, let me think about that for a moment." I don't know, I just don't see comedy as something that is so unique and separate from the world around us that it can be used to say whatever whichever anyone want just because.

Comedy is probably the last entertainment medium where people can say what they want. It absolutely needs to be protected from the tone police. If they'd had their way we'd never have had George Carlin, Richard Pryor, Lenny Bruce, Eddie Murphy, Bill Hicks. I could go on and on listing comedians who would have been muzzled if the cultural marxists and rabid rightwingers had had their way.

 

[Clefargle]

Honestly, to me it's pretty much either all all funny or it isn't. The only one exception being if your jokes are personal on the level of slander over and over. You might have gone too far, but as far as generalizing large ethnic and broad religious groups is a-ok in my book. Just give other groups the business regularly and it isn't an issue.

 

[boiled goose]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRp3DJqDfOw

Here is a sample of her racial comedy. What do you think?

Some of it was funny some of it wasnt.

The black name joke was not funny. It went on for too long, the names she chose werent funny ,and it's also kind of cliche. The Google Jennifer bit had potential but needed better setup and delivery and some clever commentary.
Black people have made up names is just meh.

The Mexicans work 100 percent of the time was funny. it pokes fun at The Exploitative power structure, it also goes against the lazy Hispanic sterotype, and came at a good timing.

 

[Battersea Power Station]

I don't understand this phenomenon of comics feeling the need to defense themselves. Controversy has always been around, and so have complaints.

Amy is enjoying ever-increasing success and rising prominence. It's ok that some people are offended and they misinterpret your jokes. Your comedy wouldn't be effective if they didn't! To paraphrase what Jerry told George, "not everyone has to like you."

 

[skybald]

Wow people are really pulling out two lines and condemning her when she has multiple hours of material? You can really tell the author was looking for a new, white person to chastise public ally if all they have are two sentences, one of which doesn't even make any sense outside of the presumed context of some larger joke.

Get with it guys. This is a non-story. Commenting on something with no backing information. Two sentences stripped of any context whatsoever.

 

[GorillaJu]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRp3DJqDfOw

Here is a sample of her racial comedy. What do you think?

Man okay if that's what people are talking about then that's some really, really light stuff. She's playing a character, you're meant to laugh at the absurdity of her racism, not actually think it's funny because "oh its true, isn't it." I mean she starts off the whole set with "I FINALLY slept with my high school crush," and the punchline is that he's still in high school. Also, he's like 3 years from graduation.

I am starting to think people are just completely oblivious to the subtext in comedy.

 

[OttomanScribe]

No rant involving the sincere utterance of the phrase 'trust me I'm not racist' has ever been good.

The narrative is always 'people are too sensitive' yet the response to a small critique was so clearly exactly that. The defensiveness in response to such a critique probably indicates how much it hits home.

 

[excelsiorlef]

This one single page of this thread has the following references"

Cultural marxists
PC Fascists
The Claim that comedy is somehow the last bastion of free speech (as if being able to say whatever you want without consequence is what free speech is actually about)

In response to some light critique in a single article (an article that also talked about how funny she is in other facets) of a comedian who has her own TV show that isn't get cancelled anytime soon.

Just let that sink in

Spoilers people it ain't the article that's histrionic.

 

[Huff]

I wonder if actually comedy clubs have been effected. Do people looking to be offended go watch these shows live or is it just online bluster

 

[OttomanScribe]

I wonder if actually comedy clubs have been effected. Do people looking to be offended go watch these shows live or is it just online bluster

'Because what good would white supremacy be if it did not confer upon the people who benefit from it the authority to be the final arbiters of what is and what isn’t racist? What use is a system of domination if it does not dictate the terms under which it can be criticised, and the form that that criticism is permitted to take?

Comments like this aren’t unique – they are classic examples of how white supremacy operates to quell legitimate concerns from people of colour. It is not enough that we suffer under white supremacy but we are also told that we trade in it, enjoy it: that we derive pleasure from witnessing and indeed living racism, in the way that only those who do not experience racism can say with such self-assuredness.

Our rage is viewed as a choice we make for some unidentified social gain, rather than for what it is: a raw and genuine response to lived experiences that we do not have the privilege to distance ourselves from emotionally.'

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...hants-sometimes-we-need-anger-just-to-survive

 

[adamsappel]

I don't really understand how that consensual joke is supposed to work as a joke. Something like, "I love having passionate sex with them. But now I prefer consensual" at least has a set up and punch line that builds from it.

Still not that funny.

I think her dumb character isn't obviously dumb enough to make it work.

Your rewrite actually makes the joke say, "I used to enjoy being raped, but now I don't."

 

[Vampire On Titus]

This image doesn't get defended because people hate the author.

I agree with your point to an extent but this image isn't a great example. I clicked the link of Amy Schumer's race jokes. Im not super familiar with her full routine... but going off the quote in the OP it seems like she transitions between more grounded material and a knowing exaggerated racist facade. That context alone softens the blow. Just knowing she doesn't actually believe the horrible shit she's saying.

With the joke in this strip there's no reason for me to assume the author doesn't genuinely buy into the mocking stereotype. I can see why people wouldn't be as quick to defend this.

Although, Amy Schumers jokes and the CAD strip were both miserably unfunny. Seriously I've noticed the hype surrounding Schumer and it might not be a fair assessment but I'm not impressed at all thus far.

 

[Fallout-NL]

This guy does it a hell of a lot better.

https://youtu.be/dw_mRaIHb-M

Excellent, very good.

 

[Clockwork5]

Some jokes are going to offend you, and that is okay. Some jokes offend me and I still see the humor in them. Some forms of humor are simply offensive and some people think that is funny, live and let live.

At the end of the day just find something that makes YOU laugh

 

[Vik]

I don't find her funny but in comedy, nothing is sacred and everything should be permitted.