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[ElBoxyBrown]

"They were going, you can't have a black person on the cover, and you can't have a woman. And you want a black woman. And I was like, yes, I do, because it's about be whatever hero you want. No. It's a white guy. That's just the way it is. We know what sells and that's fucking it. Stop the arguing. I was like, fuck you! That was a huge fight.

"They said, what's the most unsuccessful Disney film? I was like, I don't know. They went, Princess and the Frog. Work it out. I was like fuck you, man. I hated it.

"I was screaming at them in conference calls. I lost it at that point, because they just weren't getting the game. Especially because we were the first ever game that had gay marriage, we were about breaking down walls. It was meant to be funny and mature. They just took none of it and just did the usual white guy with a sword on the front. Damn it! You missed the point!"

What the fuck MS

fucking hell.

That's what happens when the majority of your console's successful exclusive games are dudebro shooters.

Uhhh, is this the same MS that published a Halo 5 where 75%+ of the game is spent playing from a black character's vantage point and women are heavily featured in the story and plot?

What the hell?

Times have changed since MS hit rock bottom with the Xbox One and they are now trying to be a little more diverse in their games. I say a little more cuz, well, Halo 5 and Gears 4 are just the only examples now.

 

[Lil'DigiOp]

"They were going, you can't have a black person on the cover, and you can't have a woman. And you want a black woman. And I was like, yes, I do, because it's about be whatever hero you want. No. It's a white guy. That's just the way it is. We know what sells and that's fucking it. Stop the arguing. I was like, fuck you! That was a huge fight.

"They said, what's the most unsuccessful Disney film? I was like, I don't know. They went, Princess and the Frog. Work it out. I was like fuck you, man. I hated it.

"I was screaming at them in conference calls. I lost it at that point, because they just weren't getting the game. Especially because we were the first ever game that had gay marriage, we were about breaking down walls. It was meant to be funny and mature. They just took none of it and just did the usual white guy with a sword on the front. Damn it! You missed the point!"

And people wonder why gaming is so stuck in a rut

 

[justsomeguy]

I think you mean, if only Phil Harrison wasn't so busy pushing the Games as a Service mentality.

.

 

[TaterTots]

I bet if they had 4 years of development and good funding it could of been pretty good. What is wrong with MS?

 

[fabricated backlash]

Uhhh, is this the same MS that published a Halo 5 where 75%+ of the game is spent playing from a black character's vantage point and women are heavily featured in the story and plot?

What the hell?

As long as he isn't on the cover. It also helps that he can hold a gun, and hide his Black face beneath a helmet.
Also women as side characters are fine.

Bit off topic but back in Halo 1 i actually imagined MC to be Black.

 

[Jay Seven]

These were the kind of decisions Phil was in charge of making before he became the "good guy".

 

[DerZuhälter]

I'd have canned that too.

Me, too as shitty as it may sound.

Could have alienated the small as it may be Fable player base, and the IP would probably turn off too many others. It sounds interesting to say the least, but I wouldn't have attached it to that franchise.

 

[Unfriendly TimeTraveler]

That idea sounded cool but already was kinda turned off in the Industrial Age in fable 3 so don't think the new setting will do anything for me. Dark and gritty never seemed like a tone for just fable, sure it had its moments but the rest were always in a funny mood and had some decent humor. Seems just so tied down and lacks its own creatively. Should of done a prequel to one and just go even more enchanted and the stuff that made fable 1 and 2 great.

So all and all kinda understand why it was rejected, wish legends could of been touched up a bit on the game play side so it wasn't such a bore to play, then maybe people would of wanted to play it more.

 

[LordRaptor]

I don't think Fable needed to be dark and edgy, and I'm not sure I'd trust the judgement to make a good Fable to those who do, but:

"They said, what's the most unsuccessful Disney film? I was like, I don't know. They went, Princess and the Frog. Work it out.

WHITE DUDE WITH A SWORD HOW CAN IT FAIL?

 

[jem0208]

Ehhh...

Dark and gritty Fable? That doesn't sound like what I'd want out of a Fable 4.

 

[Figments]

Times have changed since MS hit rock bottom with the Xbox One and they are now trying to be a little more diverse in their games. I say a little more cuz, well, Halo 5 and Gears 4 are just the only examples now.

I mean, I could go into pointless list wars to refute your point, but the vast majority of people wouldn't give a shit, so why bother.

 

[Effect]

That sounds insanely frustrating to go through. I loved the progression from Fable 1 to 3. I can easily imagine what a Fable 4 as described would look like after it was run through the Fable filter. Dark and gritty is one thing. Fable dark and gritty is something else I believe. Sucks they didn't get a chance to make it.

Now the franchise is very likely dead as a result of this BS. Over the top expectations and a desire to chase after the new shiny at the expense of the customers you did have and could have been expanded not only resulted in a game not being made, one being canceled but also the killing off a studio and franchise. Good job Microsoft.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Hmm this part sounds weird "Since it wasn't as profitable as Microsoft's one or two other properties, tension was high"

So are they saying essentially since fable wasn't racking up what I assume to be halo and gears profits they weren't happy with it?

Wouldn't MS' self-publishing ventures this gen make this transparently obvious?

 

[JumPeRJumPzZ]

Wow just wow

This sounded awesome. We probably would have Fable 4 by now and Lionhead would probably still be a well going Studio...

 

[DedValve]

That's what happens when the majority of your console's successful exclusive games are dudebro shooters.

Actually thats what happens when the majority of people in power are white males who only care about catering to other white males.

 

[Branniganz Love]

Even if Peter M. wasn't involved, Fable as a series has been known to under-deliver. Yeah, the pitch sounds great but getting that into a game is the hard part. Looking at what could have been is fun but in the end it was still just a pitch. Maybe MS didn't have faith that they could actually deliver on that proposal, MS were obviously not impressed by Fable Legends so what makes everyone think they could deliver that vision for Fable 4.

 

[diffusionx]

The pitch for Fable 4 sounds amazing.

But that's the thing with Fable, right? It always sounds way better than it turns out.

 

[Lime Blockade]

Oh is that who it came from? I thought it would of stemmed from Don at the time.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=507717

I might be a bit wrong, I'm not exactly sure if he's just parroting Mattrick's ideologies or if he himself was the one pushing this ideology for the European studios that Microsoft owned.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

I mean, I could go into pointless list wars to refute your point, but the vast majority of people wouldn't give a shit, so why bother.

If there's more I wouldn't mind being proven wrong.

 

[paulogy]

"Nah, you've had three shots and you've only tripled the money. It's not good enough. Fuck off."

A harsh reminder that the art we love is also a business. I hope most developers don't find themselves up against such demanding terms, as some of the best games ever made (ICO, Shadow of the Colossus and many others) were not particularly commercially viable, and were never deliberately designed to be.

 

[Heshinsi]

God the stuff I hate from Mattrick era Xbox just keeps piling up.

Christ how could they not fund this yet have the fucking balls to fund Fable Legends?

You do know who was in charge of Microsoft Game Studios at the time right? The Golden Boy himself, Phil Spencer.

 

[Turin Turambar]

Uhhh, is this the same MS that published a Halo 5 where 75%+ of the game is spent playing from a black character's vantage point and women are heavily featured in the story and plot?

What the hell?

But was the black guy on the cover?

 

[Mass Effect]

"They were going, you can't have a black person on the cover, and you can't have a woman. And you want a black woman. And I was like, yes, I do, because it's about be whatever hero you want. No. It's a white guy. That's just the way it is. We know what sells and that's fucking it. Stop the arguing. I was like, fuck you! That was a huge fight.

"They said, what's the most unsuccessful Disney film? I was like, I don't know. They went, Princess and the Frog. Work it out. I was like fuck you, man. I hated it.

"I was screaming at them in conference calls. I lost it at that point, because they just weren't getting the game. Especially because we were the first ever game that had gay marriage, we were about breaking down walls. It was meant to be funny and mature. They just took none of it and just did the usual white guy with a sword on the front. Damn it! You missed the point!"

Holy fucking shit, Microsoft. What the fuck.

I really don't know what to say to this.

But was the black guy on the cover?

In full armor, yes, where you can't tell he's black.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Actually thats what happens when the majority of people in power are white males who only care about catering to other white males.

Also true.

 

[Simbabbad]

What a boring, unimaginative pitch.

 

[The_Lump]

Ehhh...

Dark and gritty Fable? That doesn't sound like what I'd want out of a Fable 4.

Also doesn't sound like what they were proposing...

 

[etta]

...
...
This sounds amazing...

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

Wouldn't MS' self-publishing ventures this gen make this transparently obvious?

Lol fair enough just wanted to be sure. That sucks

 

[jelly]

These were the kind of decisions Phil was in charge of making before he became the "good guy".

True, head of Microsoft Studios I'm sure. Future looks bright.....

 

[jem0208]

But was the black guy on the cover?

Technically yeah, he was in armour though.

 

[Brazil]

Fable always sounded awesome in concept, but failed at execution.

This would've been just one more case of that.

 

[munroe]

Remember all of the claims made about previous fable games and how it very rarely met those claims, this would have likely been the same. Thanks to Peter Molyneux always hyping the games up and then when they actually arrived, they weren't close to what was claimed

 

[Spring Drive]

I would have played the shit out of that game

 

[Infernostew]

Not a fan of the Fable series but that sounded amazing. Real shame.

 

[WaffleTaco]

Well I'm glad that didn't happen. That wasn't what fable was about. That could have been a side quest. Honestly I wish they would have just wrapped up the story in DLC. I had been waiting six years for it. I guess considering what would happened, in glad I didn't get a Fable 4.

 

[Nirolak]

"They were going, you can't have a black person on the cover, and you can't have a woman. And you want a black woman. And I was like, yes, I do, because it's about be whatever hero you want. No. It's a white guy. That's just the way it is. We know what sells and that's fucking it. Stop the arguing. I was like, fuck you! That was a huge fight.

"They said, what's the most unsuccessful Disney film? I was like, I don't know. They went, Princess and the Frog. Work it out. I was like fuck you, man. I hated it.

"I was screaming at them in conference calls. I lost it at that point, because they just weren't getting the game. Especially because we were the first ever game that had gay marriage, we were about breaking down walls. It was meant to be funny and mature. They just took none of it and just did the usual white guy with a sword on the front. Damn it! You missed the point!"

This confuses me because the lead in says it's about Fable 2, but Fable 2 released in 2008 and Princess and the Frog was a 2009 movie.

 

[Strootman]

On paper every game sounds fantastic, then you have to develop it. And I'm actually glad they stopped making fable, never liked the series. Better developing new IPs.

But more important, I'm reading that Fable Legends development cost was $75 milion. What the actual fuck. How can you spend all those moneys for that game...

 

[dark10x]

Well, not everyone. The pitch was rejected because Lionhead had to switch to making games as a service.

That makes me unbelievably angry as someone who never EVER plays any games which fit this model. I will continue to reject and ignore every one of them.

But more important, I'm reading that Fable Legends development cost was $75 milion. What the actual fuck. How can you spend all those moneys for that game...

I admit, I would never have played it. I hated the idea.

BUT with so much money invested, surely it would have made sense to just go ahead and finish it up. Try to get SOMETHING back at least.

 

[Simbabbad]

Also doesn't sound like what they were proposing...

Uh, yes, it exactly was?

 

[jem0208]

Also doesn't sound like what they were proposing...

"And that was going to be Fable 4, and it would be darker and grittier"

Sounds like it to me.

I love Fable because of how light hearted and just silly it is, that sounds like a regression IMO.

 

[ironcreed]

Christ, Microsoft.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

When did Peter leave Lionhead?

 

[dc89]

God damn it. That sounds a fantastic concept.
Say what you want about Fable but I think it had some interesting towns and cities. Especially in 2. I loved the start of that game and the city

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

As long as he isn't on the cover. It also helps that he can hold a gun, and hide his Black face beneath a helmet.
Also women as side characters are fine.

Bit off topic but back in Halo 1 i actually imagined MC to be Black.

Ehh, that's a bit of a wash as MC's face isn't shown either and Fireteam Osiris spend a hell of a lot of time out of their helmets in the game.

Either way, it's a good thing MS 2012/2013 suffered the backlash it did and was restructured, because these guys (Mattrick and co.) were going to run the entire ship aground.

 

[The_Lump]

Actually thats what happens when the majority of people in power are white males who only care about catering to other white males.

Not strictly true. I think, from a purely business perspective, it doesn't matter if it's white males in charge or not - the main problem is that the people in charge think the audience are mostly white males and that said audience will only identify with other white males.

 

[prwxv3]

MS can do what they want it's their right but geting mad because Fable was not bringing Halo profits is really idiotic. Eventually Halo profits won't be enough because of its steady decline (it still makes a tone of money now though).

 

[BTHR Zero X]

that sounds awesome for Fable 4 damn WTF Microsoft why did you screw us like this.

 

[Always-honest]

That sounded like a good pitch but if anything Lionhead is known for is: great pitches.

Haha, indeed. If only they would walk the talk.

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

I'm starting to dislike Microsoft again, why the hell is their management of first party studios still shitty? I thought Phil Spencer was supposed to be the "man" or whatever? What happened to him being cool? Halo has been mismanaged to death, Gears looks like well... Gears(although we won't get another halo 4 situation, we aren't getting anything revolutionary either. Something tells me that the collation took on Gears so they could avoid the chopping block of their new IP wasn't the next "halo"), Forza is well.... Forza. These guys really sucks when it comes to their managing their studios and marketing Xbox outside of the US. Ugh.

 

[GHG]

"They were going, you can't have a black person on the cover, and you can't have a woman. And you want a black woman. And I was like, yes, I do, because it's about be whatever hero you want. No. It's a white guy. That's just the way it is. We know what sells and that's fucking it. Stop the arguing. I was like, fuck you! That was a huge fight.

"They said, what's the most unsuccessful Disney film? I was like, I don't know. They went, Princess and the Frog. Work it out. I was like fuck you, man. I hated it.

"I was screaming at them in conference calls. I lost it at that point, because they just weren't getting the game. Especially because we were the first ever game that had gay marriage, we were about breaking down walls. It was meant to be funny and mature. They just took none of it and just did the usual white guy with a sword on the front. Damn it! You missed the point!"

Microsoft are fucking idiots. Fucking hell.