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AM2R and Poke Uranium Both Removed From the Game Awards "Best Fan Creation" Category
- Thread starter dancrane212
- Start date
guybrushfreeman
Unconfirmed Member
Discussing them at an awards show is not murky water in any way. My point is giving them an award is totally legal. It's truly not murky at all. Nintendo might not like it but that shouldn't matter if their intention was to be impartial in the first place
guybrushfreeman
Unconfirmed Member
I will acknowledge this point. It's certainly possible, however I don't find it likely. They would've been aware of this before publishing the original list. It isn't new news. I'm more inclined to believe something changed their minds after the list but published. Thank you for the discussion though.
This is actually true.
Well, that wasn't exactly hard this time around.
Kirby (in the same genre-ish) was a better game, imo.
infinitys_7th
Member
Twitch Plays Pokemon is arguably more illegal than AM2R. It is essentially an unaltered ROM vs some reused assets and general gameplay outline on IP.
Did anyone make money off Twitch Plays Pokemon? That would also set it apart.
Nintendo is just in turbo salty-mode because almost no one wanted Federation Force compared to a real Metroid game like AM2R.
shadowstar
Member
If they were deemed worthy enough to be nominated, they should keep them in. What does the award even mean if two games their "judges" found worthy get removed by the producers because money?
While i agree, Kirby Planet Robobot comes very very close.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
You mean the things corporations abuse to get people to cave because they know the poor schmucks could never stand against the onslaught of their corporate lawyers?
Yeah, those no contests really mean so much in our fucked up legal system with our fucked up IP laws!
I actually couldn't remember if there were ads or not. Wonder if anyone else can remember.
DecoReturns
Member
Fire Emblem Conquest was great.
Yes, the stream accepts donations and subs. The streamer used the money to buy a better computer about a year ago to support newer games and right now the stream is playing Pokemon Sun. The first run had ads during the last five days or so, but before then there was nothing.
Not sure where the money goes now, but people who donate have more perks.
mcwizardry
Member
AM2R was awesome, I was hoping for the team to get some recognition.
Starwolf_UK
Member
This isn't making it better you know. Are winners allowed to give speeches? If so I'd love every single speech to be about why these nominees were removed. That would really make the whole thing egg on face more than a game you have to find an unofficial mirror for winning.
Twitch is paying out double for ads right now. This time of year has the biggest spend on advertising.
Movalpolos
Banned
Exactly this. It's funny how certain people keep trying to spin the discussion in another way.
Comfort Jones
Banned
And on the other side of the fence...
Brutal DOOM 64 is a modification of the fan port/remake of DOOM 64 to PCs that was released for free a couple years ago.
It is so inane how people claim Nintendo have to shut down fan projects to "defend the ip". The fuck they do.
LordRaptor
Member
You might believe that there is some scenario where Pokemon Uranium or Another Metroid 2 Remake are not clear cut derivative works of Pokemon or Metroid, but I don't.
infinitys_7th
Member
Twitch Plays Pokemon is also a derivative work of Pokemon, which is a much more valuable IP than Metroid. People were literally playing a Pokemon game free online. And the people who violated IP made money off of it. That constitutes a larger threat to IP than a remake of an old game that borrowed some assets.
People are questioning why Nintendo has chosen to suppress AM2R rather than if they are able to. Motivation versus ability. Right now Nintendo just seems salty that Federation Force flopped into the bargain bin.
So, the companies should be pushing the Game Awards in a certain direction instead? Nintendo had a right to take the games down, but they have no right to erase them from existence. They probably threatened the Game Awards in some way to make this happen in the first place.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
And in the context of recognizing their existence at this event, that's largely irrelevant. Especially when Nintendo has already allowed properties they have ownership in to receive awards in this category.
Yup. That award actually seems worse if the dude made money from it to buy a new computer.
Nintendo seems like they're trying to do something because of M:FF, either that or TPC didn't care about Twitch Plays Pokemon, which I find very hard to buy.
Theanine3D
Member
No need to be patronizing, I'm well aware of what the law is. That's not the issue here, everyone here knows it's illegal to use copyrighted work that isn't yours. The issue is that it's an asshole move to go after your fans, regardless of the law. There are cases where allowing it builds goodwill from your fanbase, and in some cases even makes you money (see: Valve and Black Mesa). When Sega embraced romhacks, sales of their Mega Drive / Genesis games suddenly skyrocketed on Steam.
Yeah, I don't disagree with that. It occurred to me that the award could be money, and that would count as financial gain. But as far as I know it's just a trophy from the Game Awards. I doubt it's worth much. This isn't the Grammy's.
Nintendo also gets exposure from AM2R winning. Metroid is their property. In this case the exposure is now negative, because of this move. It could have been positive if they'd allowed it.
I'll always be the first to defend Nintendo when it's a case of a fan trying to profit off their work. Making money from someone else's hard work without their permission is despicable and deplorable. But as far as I know, neither of those two fangames' creators did this. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong on that.
I hope that whoever wins either:
-Refuses to accept the award on the basis that competition was unfairly axed
-Spends at least 1 minute of their acceptance speech talking about what an incredible game AM2R is, and how everyone should check it out. Like, (s)he should literally give out the URL to download AM2R and tell everyone it's free.
-Refuses to accept the award on the basis that competition was unfairly axed
-Spends at least 1 minute of their acceptance speech talking about what an incredible game AM2R is, and how everyone should check it out. Like, (s)he should literally give out the URL to download AM2R and tell everyone it's free.
Lionel Richie
Member
I take it you're a lawyer who specializes in this very specific subject, so what if Nintendo games got played in a more morally ambiguous award/convention/whatever, they would have no power over it?
In this context, AM2R is a really fantastic game and the TGA is by all accounts a very reputable award. But what if it was a more contentious use of their intelectual property and/or a more questionable award?
Then we'd cross that bridge when we got there.
As it is, fan mods and fan games are almost as old as the industry itself and widely ACCEPTED by many, many other developers and publishers, while many others - like Nintendo - are overzealous in ensuring nobody but they can use their IPs in any meaningful way, even if it falls under fair use.
For one person's "Red vs. Blue" you have another person's "AM2R".
But let's not pretend that Nintendo couldn't readily accept the fan game - even PROMOTE it like some publishers and developers - instead of going out of their way to nuke it from orbit and reap the constant stream of bad PR by doing so.
infinitys_7th
Member
You don't have to be a lawyer to say anyone can give an award to anything.
Awards have no legal weight to them. Anyone has the right to say Twitch Plays Pokemon or AM2R is great and give it an award - Nintendo can certainly sue someone for saying that, but it would get laughed out of court just like any other frivolity.
The main thing Nintendo CAN do is intimidate someone by saying "We will sue you and cost you money/time in court fees". That is within the boundary of the legal system too, unfortunately.
I wasn't saying what companies should do but what they most likely would. Even though the Awards are financed indepently they still depent from the support of the industry.
I just wanted to say I doubt the Awards are in the position to go against a publisher like you proposed.
Lionel Richie
Member
Thing is, I kind of agree with you here. It's awful PR by Nintendo and especially shitty considering how great AM2R is. I think people are overplaying how bad they are a bit because they did allow the game to go online and you have to know they knew that once that happened there was no going back. And while the guy who created it sure deserved better for the tremendous work he's done, I do believe he knew from the start that this was the likely outcome and that something like at least raises notoriety around his game. Not 100% draconian like some people are making it out to be.
I'm not sure that's the case considering TGA is a big event that makes some (a lot of?) money. I don't think awarding what is essentially to the letter a case of intellectual property theft (and I say that loving the game and the effort, so it's not my opinion on it) would go completely without consequence.
Generalpsyduck
Banned
Nintendo is fucking ridiculous.
Hot Coldman
Banned
Geoff's on Twitch talking about TGAs, and yeah, he's saying Nintendo weren't cool with these two games being in the show. Didn't give them the heads up beforehand (nor did he tip off the creators), said the show would be at risk if he didn't pull them, so yeah, they went.
Pretty obvious, but hey, he's said it now himself and he said it's a bummer. Which it is!
Pretty obvious, but hey, he's said it now himself and he said it's a bummer. Which it is!
AcademicSaucer
Member
dancrane212
Member
Thanks for the update. I'll include it in the OP.
Needlecrash
Member
The fans are doing what Nintendon't/Nintendwon't. What a shame. Geoff was in a hard place so I understand that he had to make that call. Yet, Nintendo is being shit again because a fan game eclipsed their recent Metroid game releases. AM2R is sick and deserves the recognition period.
Needlecrash
Member
Agreed.
NaDannMaGoGo
Member
Thanks to this affair I checked out and just finished AM2R and damn, what an amazing game. Just a superb, modern re-imagining of Metroid 2. Game was better designed than anticipated and I honestly prefer it over the other 2D Metroids I've played. The non-metroid boss encounters were particularly good and even the different Metroid types got some nice mechanics to them.
Visually the game managed to take most of those very old, low-pixel designs and turn them into modern renditions that retain their weird, alien designs while still fitting the worlds look. Background art was was excellent, too and together with the nice creature design it made for a really interesting world.
Soundtrack was pretty good overall but doesn't feel quite up to par with everything else.
In that regard, the first complaint i'd have is the Metroid encounter track that simply lacks the tension of the original one. In addition, the Alpha Metroid design is unfortunately one of the only designs, if not the actually the sole, that I'm not fond of it. So whereas the original Metroid 2 had occasions where I was instilled with dread when the music went bananas and I encountered one of the the nasty-looking Metroids, this hardly happened here even though the fights are more demanding.
However, all in all, damn good stuff. Good thing Nintendo goes as far as preventing a god damn fricking fan game award nomination for this. Unbelievable.
Visually the game managed to take most of those very old, low-pixel designs and turn them into modern renditions that retain their weird, alien designs while still fitting the worlds look. Background art was was excellent, too and together with the nice creature design it made for a really interesting world.
Soundtrack was pretty good overall but doesn't feel quite up to par with everything else.
In that regard, the first complaint i'd have is the Metroid encounter track that simply lacks the tension of the original one. In addition, the Alpha Metroid design is unfortunately one of the only designs, if not the actually the sole, that I'm not fond of it. So whereas the original Metroid 2 had occasions where I was instilled with dread when the music went bananas and I encountered one of the the nasty-looking Metroids, this hardly happened here even though the fights are more demanding.
However, all in all, damn good stuff. Good thing Nintendo goes as far as preventing a god damn fricking fan game award nomination for this. Unbelievable.