Have a Nice Day
Member
https://whyisdenuvobad.github.io/
Dude, I've been seeing you in a lot of Denuvo threads and you've been shaming people that were rooting against it without knowing how does Denuvo work?
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R.I.P Denuvo - Tekken 7 and Dishonored 2 cracked
- Thread starter Elven_Star
- Start date
https://whyisdenuvobad.github.io/
Dude, I've been seeing you in a lot of Denuvo threads and you've been shaming people that were rooting against it without knowing how does Denuvo work?
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
You could always buy games when denuvo got removed.
If you still want to support the devs.
I know there where some people in gaf that did that for doom
#1 is wildly incorrect. If he's referring to chargebacks specifically, even that is off the mark as Valve stopped banning/disabling/suspending accounts all the way back in early 2011 in favour of implementing a restriction-based penalty system that just denies access to certain features and doesn't get in the way of library access at all. Additionally, in cases of a chargeback, full functionality is automatically restored after nine weeks (not my image):
The vast majority of Denuvo games won't get it removed though.
Although I didn't care about the connection on first run issue before, now I do, because Denuvo could in the near future go under and the server offline. Which could be catastrophic.
CecilRousso
Member
This.
Denuvo is, as I understand it, a relatively small company, that no big player in the market behind them. They could very much suddenly fold if business tank, or if they got caught doing something iffy or even illegal. And they could also get bought by another party, who might not keep business as usual.
It's not a good thing to give these guys the keys to the future of PC games.
#1 is wildly incorrect. If he's referring to chargebacks specifically, even that is off the mark as Valve stopped banning/disabling/suspending accounts all the way back in early 2011 in favour of implementing a restriction-based penalty system that just denies access to certain features and doesn't get in the way of library access at all. Additionally, in cases of a chargeback, full functionality is automatically restored after nine weeks (not my image):
So is #2, Denuvo doesn't prevent Wine supporting games. It's just that Wine needs to implement missing APIs. Not only that but Wine can launch a Denuvo game. So I guess you could claim every windows API is DRM. (Well it does prevent you using Linux
)Denuvo has strong ties to Securom (Sony)
CecilRousso
Member
Are those ties anything else then that Denuvo was "spawned" from Securom? If Denuvo find themselves in trouble, would Sony do anything to help them? Do they have that kind of interest in the company?
lucebuce12
Member
I think NieR:Automata just got cracked too.
Gamezone
Gold Member
GAF is really concerned about this on PC. But buying something digital on consoles, or when publishers release a physical disc with nothing on it on consoles, it doesn't seem to upset too many.
nope, that's been cracked for months.
What apparently just got cracked is Dragon Quest Heroes II
SaiyanRaoh
Member
Byyyyyyyyyyyye Denuvooo.....
Actually, CPY cracked Nier too, the previous crack was from some other guy.
The PSN being shut down is much less of a risk than Denuvo servers shutting down, the risk is also somewhat inherent to the platform itself unlike Denuvo which can be 100% avoided.
Add to that, console gamers don't even know it any different. These platforms have always operated the way they do, unlike on pc, where there's been many decades of games being drm free or using at least much less intrusive drm.
Somene please correct me but if Denuvo servers shut down game devs have to remove Denuvo anyway right? Unless they want a dysfunctional game on steam (which would probably be illegal) or remove the whole game.
So I'm not really seing the whole "but games could stop working completely" issue. Am I missing something?
So I'm not really seing the whole "but games could stop working completely" issue. Am I missing something?
Nier: Automata was "recracked" yesterday. The difference is that the previous release was a P2P release, meaning that it didn't adhere to the standard rules of a scene release. CPY's version is a proper scene release.
That being said, Nier was so ass on PC that I refunded it and got it for PS4. Performance isn't great sometimes, but it's a hell lot more consistent than on PC at least :/
Alexander DeLarge
Member
It sucks when it happens to consoles (can't think of any cases where I've got an empty disk with a PS4 purchase) but the PC has historically been the platform for longevity and Denuvo is a threat to that. Maybe consoles will be decent for longevity now that I assume they'll be X86-based going forward but usually consoles had the slate wiped clean when a new generation came out. I'd imagine the publishers get annoyed by the fact that only 2/3rds of the platforms they make games for buy their "remasters" and I foresee a Denuvo shutdown being a way to justify a re-release/remaster in the same way that Bulletstorm Full Clip "remaster" of a 6 year old game was extremely appealing to anyone that didn't want to bother with Games For Windows Live.
What scares me about Denuvo is how I'm starting to see consoles as the better of the two for content archiving purposes. I'd rather take the one I know I know I'll be able to pop in the disk and play in 10 years than the "maybe if Denuvo's auth server is still up" PC version at unlimited resolution/144FPS. In the case of Metal Gear Solid V The Phantom Pain, I figure it'll be easier to emulate a PS4 and play that than "crack" Denuvo and get it running after those auth servers go down. From what I understand, the bypass only tricks the authentication server but that Denuvo ticket generator that was created a couple weeks back might be our saving grace for the handful of games that don't get removals.
You are missing that the devs aren't legally obligated to remove Denuvo and only would have to stop selling the game if it happens.
All the people that bought the game prior to that tho will be forever unable to play it.
How complicated is it for devs to remove Denuvo?
Because if it's as simple as unchecking the "use Denuvo Yes/No" box why wouldn't they just do that instead of losing potential sales AND piss of people and risk their reputation as a developer/publisher?
Alexander DeLarge
Member
If Denuvo's auth server shut down, I'd imagine they'd have to stop selling it but there's still plenty of SecuROM (Denuvo's previous project) titles on Steam that stopped working on later versions of Windows because Microsoft forced it to stop working since it was essentially a rootkit/malware. What really sucks is there's a bunch of games that got releases with SecuROM/TAGES/GFWL removed and sold on GOG but they didn't bother distributing those builds to the millions of people who bought them on Steam. Chronicles of Riddick Assault on Dark Athena and Fallout 3 come to mind.
That's what I'm wondering. It's literally a ticking time bomb that is of no benefit to the publisher so why isn't it being removed in everything that has been bypassed? If they won't remove it now, why should anyone believe they'll remove it in the future?
Games that have been bypassed but haven't received Denuvo removals (just off the top of my head), these games are at risk despite a Denuvo bypass.
ABZU
Anno 2205
Battlefield 1
Dead Rising 4
Deus Ex Mankind Divided
Dishonored 2
Dragon Quest Heroes 2
FIFA 16/17
Far Cry Primal
God Eater 2
Just Cause 3
Lords of the Fallen
MGS5:TPP
Mad Max
Mass Effect Andromeda (both Denuvo v3/v4)
Mirror's Edge Catalyst
NieR Automata
PES 2017
Prey
Resident Evil 7
Rise of the Tomb Raider
Sniper Ghost Warrior 3
Tales of Berseria
Tekken 7
Total Warhammer
Warhammer 40K Dawn of War III
Watch Dogs 2
Bypassed but removed Denuvo. No longer at risk.
2Dark
ADR1FT
DOOM
HITMAN
Homefront The Revolution
INSIDE
RIME (ran significantly better after Denuvo removal)
Titanfall 2 (accidentally removed Denuvo for a free weekend, multiplayer only)
That's what I'm wondering. It's literally a ticking time bomb that is of no benefit to the publisher so why isn't it being removed in everything that has been bypassed? If they won't remove it now, why should anyone believe they'll remove it in the future?
Games that have been bypassed but haven't received Denuvo removals (just off the top of my head), these games are at risk despite a Denuvo bypass.
ABZU
Anno 2205
Battlefield 1
Dead Rising 4
Deus Ex Mankind Divided
Dishonored 2
Dragon Quest Heroes 2
FIFA 16/17
Far Cry Primal
God Eater 2
Just Cause 3
Lords of the Fallen
MGS5:TPP
Mad Max
Mass Effect Andromeda (both Denuvo v3/v4)
Mirror's Edge Catalyst
NieR Automata
PES 2017
Prey
Resident Evil 7
Rise of the Tomb Raider
Sniper Ghost Warrior 3
Tales of Berseria
Tekken 7
Total Warhammer
Warhammer 40K Dawn of War III
Watch Dogs 2
Bypassed but removed Denuvo. No longer at risk.
2Dark
ADR1FT
DOOM
HITMAN
Homefront The Revolution
INSIDE
RIME (ran significantly better after Denuvo removal)
Titanfall 2 (accidentally removed Denuvo for a free weekend, multiplayer only)
CecilRousso
Member
It's because with PC there are options available, and the negative feedback towards it does serm till have an effect.
Honestly, that is a problem of console communities who seem to be ok with everything the industry is trying to impose them.
CecilRousso
Member
That Abzu still have Denuvo feels like the weirdest of those games.
Some video comparisons? Seems like nobody made them for some reason. Maybe because in reality there is no difference.
Alexander DeLarge
Member
https://youtu.be/P2qngkYKN8Y
It was widely reported on? Go read the discussion forums or check Reddit during that time period. Baldman claims there were hundreds of thousands of triggers. Even legitimate users were downloading the bypass.
"Protection now calls about 10-30 triggers every second during actual gameplay, slowing game down. In previous games like [Sniper Ghost Warrior 3], Nier, Prey there were only about 1-2 ”triggers" called every several minutes during gameplay, so do the math."
Regginator
Member
"Surely there's a way to pl--"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darkspore
Damn, I've never seen a videogame wiki page start with a past tense. Never played Darkspore before, but to think a game can actually be literally dead...
All Denuvo did to performance was slow down the initial loading of your save game. The other major contributing factor is shitty, inefficient water shaders, as far as I know.
nkarafo
Member
Was the game really running like this? I don't think i can believe that. This must be something else.
It can't even be pirated?
And if it can, does it really count as piracy in this case?
Alexander DeLarge
Member
Nope, the game was "phoning home" dozens of times a minute due to a poor implementation of Denuvo and it would basically multiply and act similar to a memory leak so it got worse the more you played. Fortunately the game was bypassed and they fulfilled their promise of "if RIME is bypassed, we'll remove Denuvo" the following day. Denuvo was removed overnight and that's the smooth gameplay from the second video.
In order to play something like Darkspore or Diablo III in the event of a shutdown, someone would need to emulate the "backend service" (which is unfortunately still a gray area legally... However, the Electronic Frontier Foundation got a favorable ruling back in 2015 which made it possible to emulate authentication servers/circumvent DRM for dead games so progress is being made, hopefully it extends to once live services like dead MMOs/master servers one day). This is a problem for games that blur the line between online/offline/singleplayer/multiplayer. Ubisoft's games are at great risk since they do the online/offline thing in pretty much everything they do nowadays. Hope those servers remain up for a long, long time.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2015/11/new-dmca-ss1201-exemption-video-games-closer-look
Yeah, that video is BS
That's what happens when you make server dependent games, it's more like MMOs.
So basically it was designed to eventually die, so from publisher perspective it went as planned.
Yeah, broken games do get removed from Steam. Compatibility is whole different thing, as game will work on older systems, but not newer (or requires
Securom titles still work even on Win10, ban affects only versions that are vulnerable. (Otherwise blacklist can be bypassed by resigning)
Agreed on disparity between GOG & Steam sucks, and there's issues other way too, some games get patches on Steam, but not on GOG.
That's how it works on theory, DRM is applied to unprotected exe.
Things like GFWL are much harder as it requires integration to code (achievements, login, etc.)
Have a Nice Day
Member
Darkspore's problem that it isn't a popular game and because of that I can't imagine anyone will dedicate the effort and money to bring it back.
Huge Succeeded
Banned
Maybe I'm a weirdo for expecting people to share some sort of precedent before they act like denuvo is a death sentence for the preservation of specific games or that they're gambling by buying a denuvo-'protected' game. Especially given that I can point to precedent being that Denuvo gets cracked eventually wherever it's not removed by the developers. And that some developers do remove Denuvo from their games, a clear reaction to our concerns.
How many games have been lost to time as a result of their DRM, anyway? Honest question.
I didn't know F1 2016 had it, I wonder if there's a performance increase if it were to be removed.
Any idea if it can be stripped from legitimate games and still used with Steam integration, online etc.?
KratosEnergyDrink
Member
But some random cracker on the internet said denuvo is bad for performance, so it MUST be true. Because cracker of games are good people and developer of games are bad people. Obviously.
Corpsepyre
Banned
Message from the ripper today:
'You guys ask me why I still release so often when I don't have much free time due to work? I was able to finish programming of my new tools that were in development for weeks. These tools allow me to automate most of the stages of denuvo v4 cracking. Result - this update of Tekken 7 was cracked within 2 fucking hours. "Improved denuvo", my ass.'
'You guys ask me why I still release so often when I don't have much free time due to work? I was able to finish programming of my new tools that were in development for weeks. These tools allow me to automate most of the stages of denuvo v4 cracking. Result - this update of Tekken 7 was cracked within 2 fucking hours. "Improved denuvo", my ass.'
Just saw this and had a good laugh, came to see if anyone posted it here.
Idk why everyone rails against Denuvo, if it gets defeated something worse will replace it and on and on. Companies will never stop protecting their IP. It will never ever stop.
You mean doesn't have online verification? Lol. I mean seriously let's think about what your seemingly simple request actually requires.
You mean doesn't have online verification? Lol. I mean seriously let's think about what your seemingly simple request actually requires.
Wonder Peter
Member
I just want something to replace that doesn't prejudice me as a paying consumer.
Let me think .... well ... a GoG release?
Theonik
Member
Due to cracking efforts very little to none. Many games are unplayable today without removing their DRM even for legitimate customers. PC version of Rayman 2 is one for instance.
Games continue to sell millions and millions of copies without using Denuvo. Denuvo is nothing but a waste of money and time for everyone involved, and it makes sure your game has a expiry date.
And yet, companies will still want to protect their IP like my original post and nothing you say or do (short of stopping piracy somehow) will change that.
And honestly this whole game preservation angle is so shallow to me. Tons of games have expiration dates due to many other reasons as well like OS compatibility or hardware issues. It doesn't really matter in the end no argument will stop a company from trying to protect its IP.
There are literally companies who came out and said that they know DRM is useless, but they put in anyway to appease their clueless shareholders.
spindoctor
Member
I can keep a PC with old hardware and an old operating system to play old games. I cannot do anything to keep Denuvo servers alive. Are you capable of seeing the difference here?
Pureauthor
Member
It's not the onus of the consumer to care if the companies want to be dumb.