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[Wazzy]

Lightning Returns costumes. I feel that they are intended to turn Lightning into a sex object and that they betray her FF13 personality.

Vanille: http://www.significant-bits.com/wp-...XIII_Oerba_Dia_Vanille_16_9_by_Quick_Stop.jpg

I can almost see her vagina. I can see her butt. Her l'Cie brand is by her vagina. She spends the majority of the game moaning.

I won't even get started on how fake, gorgeous, and anorexia-thin every female FF character is. This depiction of women isn't exclusive to FF by any means, but it's still there.

If you still don't find the portrayal of women concerning in FF, that wouldn't surprise me at all; it's par for the course, much like Africans being perceived as inferior was par for the course decades ago.

I can see there being some merit to your point about LR but the rest is completely baseless. All the FF female leads have never been exploited and are completely toned down visually.

Give me an example of how Rinoa, Aeris, Yuna, Garnet and Terra are exploited.

 

[DarkLordMalik]

Vanille: http://www.significant-bits.com/wp-...XIII_Oerba_Dia_Vanille_16_9_by_Quick_Stop.jpg

I can almost see her vagina. I can see her butt. Her l'Cie brand is by her vagina. She spends the majority of the game moaning.

 

[Jawmuncher]

I'm fine with the more sci-fi look of FF. However I think the best bet would be for FF to go a bit back and forth on the look. Something like FF14 but as a mainline FF game would be great. But then again I guess they had their shot at that with FF12 and it kind of bit them in the ass. Though I still blame that games sales on changing the formula and its late release in the US.

 

[cafemomo]

Lightning Returns costumes. I feel that they are intended to turn Lightning into a sex object and that they betray her FF13 personality.

Vanille: http://www.significant-bits.com/wp-...XIII_Oerba_Dia_Vanille_16_9_by_Quick_Stop.jpg

I can almost see her vagina. I can see her butt. Her l'Cie brand is by her vagina. She spends the majority of the game moaning.

I won't even get started on how fake, gorgeous, and anorexia-thin every female FF character is. This depiction of women isn't exclusive to FF by any means, but it's still there.

If you still don't find the portrayal of women concerning in FF, that wouldn't surprise me at all; it's par for the course, much like Africans being perceived as inferior was par for the course decades ago.

I'll agree with you that the costumes in LR are a bit overboard, but as for Vanille

How is that exploitation at all. Yes, she's dressed up stupid, but how is wearing some fur skirt, with a pink top with fruit loops all over the place exploitation. Her brand is on her thigh, not by the vagina.

And you absolutely cannot be serious about the last part. I mean really? You are saying the way some characters are portrayed in a video game is ON PAR WITH RACISM?

 

[Frumix]

I can see there being some merit to your point about LR but the rest is completely baseless. All the FF female leads have never been exploited and are completely toned down visually.

Give me an example of how Rinoa, Aeris, Yuna, Garnet and Terra are exploited.

I can't.
Does navel piercing betray Lightning's personality?
Because she had it in the original 13.
Out of revealed LR outfits, well, the default one is particularly dumb and the one with visible thong could be considered offensive to some, but the rest aren't even that revealing, they're just crazy fashion.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

I can't.
Does navel piercing betray Lightning's personality?
Because she had it in the original 13.
Out of revealed LR outfits, well, the default one is particularly dumb and the one with visible thong could be considered offensive to some, but the rest aren't even that revealing, they're just crazy fashion.

Ironically, searching for this image, it came from another thread here on GAF.

The excuse that "this is a character from another Final Fantasy game" doesn't exactly float, either.

And it definitely could be worse, but it's also not great. They are definitely trying to sexualize her with this outfit, even if just a little bit. They even admitted to making Lightning's boobs bigger with some flimsy excuse like "it lets her wear costumes better"

 

[Solid Samus]

Tetsuya Nomura. :]

Or Yoshida. I am fine with the current character designers. Character designs are not a problem. It's the writers who take the designs and write them into stupid scenarios with stilted writing that need to be replaced.

This guy knows what's good

 

[Wazzy]

I can't.
Does navel piercing betray Lightning's personality?
Because she had it in the original 13.
Out of revealed LR outfits, well, the default one is particularly dumb and the one with visible thong could be considered offensive to some, but the rest aren't even that revealing, they're just crazy fashion.

There's been a couple sexualized costumes and even some of her poses. Even if they're not common they're still in the game and it's a bit detracting since it's totally opposite of the kind of character Lightning is.

 

[Frumix]

Ironically, searching for this image, it came from another thread here on GAF.

The excuse that "this is a character from another Final Fantasy game" doesn't exactly float, either.

And it definitely could be worse, but it's also not great. They are definitely trying to sexualize her with this outfit, even if just a little bit.

Yes it does, that's one of Miqo'te's poses. What if it wasn't Lightning. What if some other FF game was releasing now with some other character. Would this be as bad? Do people really care about Lightning's character integrity all of a sudden? Or maybe nobody ever did and you just need cheap jabs? The only argument that holds water here is that it dilutes the lore. And that's a weird thing to be concerned about with FF13 lore let me tell you something. It's like complaining about where friendly assassin's go in AC after summoning. Not canon, it's a video game. Her character is already off rails after 13-2 anyway.

 

[Dark Schala]

Now please read my post a second time, slower this time, so that you understand it--or if you intentionally misrepresented my argument, then stop typing, Person With Lightning Avatar.

I feel like a scientist trying to explain the Big Bang, and you're sitting here screaming, "I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT SO IT CAN'T BE TRUE!!!!!!!!!" If you're not willing to do the math, or are incapable of doing the math, I have no problem with that--but don't challenge me with personal incredulity.

(A summary for those of you who can't add/read, which wouldn't surprise me considering some of the responses I've gotten.

You're right. It requires multiplication as well. I apologize for not writing out the process step by step for you.

I know, guys. It's hard to believe that computer entertainment things are cheaper and more widespread today than they were back then, but it's true! YouTube didn't exist either!

This kind of condescension towards other users does not reflect well on you at all. Outright calling other users idiots while parroting erroneous information yourself (ie: the number of engines used) perhaps would not be to your benefit.

I can almost see her vagina. I can see her butt. Her l'Cie brand is by her vagina. She spends the majority of the game moaning.

Her brand is on her outer thigh. Not directly by her genitals. You can't even see her butt in that render. Her upper thigh, maybe, but it's not shoving a shot of her butt in your face.

 

[Nikolasvanitas]

I would love to see something more similar to the style of FF12 and FF14

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

Yes it does, that's one of Miqo'te's poses. What if it wasn't Lightning. What if some other FF game was releasing now with some other character. Would this be as bad? Do people really care about Lightning's character integrity all of a sudden? Or maybe nobody ever did and you just need cheap jabs? The only argument that holds water here is that it dilutes the lore. And that's a weird thing to be concerned about with FF13 lore let me tell you something. It's like complaining about where friendly assassin's go in AC after summoning. Not canon, it's a video game. Her character is already off rails after 13-2 anyway.

No, it doesn't float, because they didn't have to give it to Lightning to wear. They picked it for a reason, they increased her breast size for a reason. Square-Enix is starting to smell a bit of desperation over the directions they've taken the Final Fantasy franchise; even they've admitted they're fucking it up.

This is an attempt at fanservice. You can justify it however you want, but at the end of the day, it's still a character showing a lot of skin in a sexy pose that historically is not about doing either of those things.

 

[greg400]

Nope, I loathe their current character design. Part of the reason why I'm not clamoring for a Chrono Trigger remake.

 

[MilkBeard]

I would love to see something more similar to the style of FF12 and FF14

Those are some really cool designs. Who designed these particular characters?

I like most of Final Fantasy XII designs, except for Vaan and maybe a few others.

 

[BlazingRain]

I liked the localized version of the early games we got in the US to be honest. The graphics were simple enough that your minds eye could use those illustrations to interpret what you thought you were seeing.

I liked ffvii style, and i liked ffx style too even and ffxii, but the newest final fantasy games are really just a graphical realization of modern japanese popular hair and fashion styles. It probably looks really innovative and creative to someone not familiar with japan, but it all just seems extrmely pedestrian and uninspired to me.

It's like the have a japanese clothing designer and hair stylist working at square working from textbooks they went to school with our something, it's stupid.

I miss when final fantasy looked like this

Final Fantasy never actually looked like that. That's some terrible art they had commissioned for the Western release, because they correctly predicted that Westerners wouldn't like Amano's "androgynous" style.

 

[MilkBeard]

No, it doesn't float, because they didn't have to give it to Lightning to wear. They picked it for a reason, they increased her breast size for a reason. Square-Enix is starting to smell a bit of desperation over the directions they've taken the Final Fantasy franchise; even they've admitted they're fucking it up.

This is an attempt at fanservice. You can justify it however you want, but at the end of the day, it's still a character showing a lot of skin in a sexy pose that historically is not about doing either of those things.

I have to agree about some of the costumes in Lightning Returns. They are trying to sex Lightning up a bit, which does diverge from how Final Fantasy has been in the past.

However, it's still not quite as bad as some other games are with revealing body parts. Honestly I hope it never gets to that point, and XV looks like it does away with any of that kind of fan-service design.

 

[BlazingRain]

Those are some really cool designs. Who designed these particular characters?

I like most of Final Fantasy XII designs, except for Vaan and maybe a few others.

Akihiko Yoshida designed the characters for both XII and XIV, as well as Tactics, and the Ogre series, among others.

 

[Tekku]

I really loved the design of Basch and Balthier in FFXII. Such a torture to forced to play as a little brat in the company of those two.

I remember the embarrassing scene in the Viera hometown where Vaan asks the stupid questions. It pretty much sums up the inability to create good lead characters for this series.

 

[MilkBeard]

Akihiko Yoshida designed the characters for both XII and XIV, as well as Tactics, and the Ogre series, among others.

Ah, I see. Yoshida deserves more chances at character design for Final Fantasy. I think his art will connect more with western audiences, at least. I actually quite like the design of all those games listed.

 

[revolverjgw]

I have no interest in this game but that's a very nice shot. Looks like a successor to the 16 bit games.

 

[Nikolasvanitas]

Akihiko Yoshida designed the characters for both XII and XIV, as well as Tactics, and the Ogre series, among others.

I have all these games but i didnt know that Yoshida did the artwork,he must be a great artist
I hope we can see more of his work,I love Nomura's artwork but I would like to see something different for a change

 

[Mr. RHC]

We are pretty good off with Nomura. He is rather consistent.

Dat 2000 super reptile iris. Gone.. Look at that eye surgery.

Spoiler

Lol, now I know how Ash is aging.

 

[cafemomo]

We are pretty good off with Nomura. He is rather consistent.

Dat 2000 super reptile iris. Gone.. Look at that eye surgery.

Spoiler

Lol, now I know how Ash is aging.

Don't know or care about the anime, but Pokemon artwork is also ever changing

 

[RedBaron17]

Lol, what's up with the red soles on their shoes? Are they are all wearing christian louboutin?

Damn, these mofos be stylin' yo.

Edit: nvmd, apparently, they are designed by a japanese clothing company called ROEN.

 

[Dark Octave]

Thank you OP. Shit's fucked up in the FF universe and it has been for a long time. I got a lot of shit in another thread saying I have a narrow opinion of what fantasy is when I mentioned that there is a real world Hyundai in FFXV. Where's the magic and artistry in a real world car?

"bbbut there was real-ish cars in FFVII and FFVIII"

FF7 was different at the time, but they have been trying to recapture that success ever since. They think that's what everybody wants out of FF. It's getting old. Even the car in FFVIII looked somewhat fantasy.

"bbbut you have FFXIV if you want your midevil FF fix!"

How about fuck you. I don't play MMOs nor do I have the time for them. You may as well be telling me to play CoD team deathmatch to get my FF fix at least with that I don't get charged monthly.

I've said this before but my biggest problem is not that this version of FF exists, it's that because of this, my version of FF no longer does.

Just tired of the teens, guns, hair, cars, modern/future sci-fi settings. Tired of three characters per party limit. Tired of the real time battle systems where you only control one character and loosley order the others who play themselves.

Funny that when I was a teenager playing FF, all the characters were grown ups. Now I'm a grown up playing FF and all the characters are teenagers.

Maybe I wouldn't be bitching if we havent had a whole generation and decade of sci-fi FF and a whole new gen of modern day setting which will no doubt have sequels of it's own which will also probably span a decade.

Imo what I've seen so far of XV is not FF but it does look interesting as a "modern" RPG in general so I will be keeping my eye on it with hopes that they can make a better game than they did last gen.

 

[Natetan]

Final Fantasy never actually looked like that. That's some terrible art they had commissioned for the Western release, because they correctly predicted that Westerners wouldn't like Amano's "androgynous" style.

Yep and that's what I grew up thinking it looked like and I liked it. Now they show the raw terribleness of the series art style and what it's predecessors are capable of creating. It's sad that something I grew up really liking was pretty much a lie

They did they same thing with dragon warrior, which now just always had an anime style, a style I really don't like in general especially with dragon warrior.

 

[BlazingRain]

This thread has reminded me of how good Tomomi Tobayashi is.

 

[Mr. RHC]

How about fuck you. I don't play MMOs nor do I have the time for them. You may as well be telling me to play CoD team deathmatch to get my FF fix at least with that I don't get charged monthly.

It's probably one of the most accessible MMOs ever, and dat landscape, I don't know, you're gonna love that landscape.

Don't know or care about the anime, but Pokemon artwork is also ever changing

Bigger! Shinier!... oh wait.. shiny Pokémon, I see what they did there..

 

[aravuus]

"bbbut there was real-ish cars in FFVII and FFVIII"

"bbbut you have FFXIV if you want your midevil FF fix!"

This kind of "quoting" gives a really strong vibe that you were "losing" the argument, and now you're mad. Also makes you sound condescending as hell.

 

[Ridicululz]

I love Final Fantasy's new art direction.

 

[MilkBeard]

This thread has reminded me of how good Tomomi Tobayashi is.

This thread has at least ONE good thing going for it then, ha ha.

 

[GorillaJu]

Everything in Final Fantasy games is just window dressing for the graphics. It's such a shame, because FF games used to strike an excellent balance in terms of showy graphics, focus on story, and fun gameplay.

I suppose this element is partly why everyone's faces are so damn symmetrical and beautiful. And the worlds and levels are as well. It reminds me of the Star Wars episode 1-3 movies, where it was just so polished and pristine that I found it aesthetically repulsive.

The main issue to me is that every character, in every instance is perfectly beautiful or ruggedly handsome. Am I really supposed to believe that some dude, even if he's a prince, just happens to be friends with 4 guys who wear clothes like they work in host clubs, have perfect hair and jaw lines, and exactly symmetrical facial features minus the odd scar here or there, also with ideal body proportions? Or that the two protectors of the world just so happen to resemble a trendy 16 year old Harajuku shopper and her older Shinjuku-going sister, and an army super soldier and her sister who are both paragons of ideal facial features, perfectly blended to capture the best of both Japanese and Anglo faces?

Literally every character is beautiful, even the bad guys, with the very odd exception of like the pope dude. And it's not that I want ugly characters, but someone here or there that was at least 'questionable' would bring a degree of believability to it, for me.

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

For the most part yes, absolutely. Nomura gets way too much fucking hate around here. He has a distinctive look and it's usually pretty damn awesome. The aesthetics for the characters in FFXV look incredible.

I'll easily take FF's look over generic tough bald guy in a heartbeat, any day.

 

[HeelPower]

Huh? I wish the best for FF. I'm just pointing out that Square, and many other game studios, waste a lot of money and time.



Lightning Returns costumes. I feel that they are intended to turn Lightning into a sex object and that they betray her FF13 personality.

Vanille: http://www.significant-bits.com/wp-...XIII_Oerba_Dia_Vanille_16_9_by_Quick_Stop.jpg

I can almost see her vagina. I can see her butt. Her l'Cie brand is by her vagina. She spends the majority of the game moaning.

I won't even get started on how fake, gorgeous, and anorexia-thin every female FF character is. This depiction of women isn't exclusive to FF by any means, but it's still there.

If you still don't find the portrayal of women concerning in FF, that wouldn't surprise me at all; it's par for the course, much like Africans being perceived as inferior was par for the course decades ago.

you don't even know what it means to have a truly exploited female character.

Non of these characters is ever exploited a blatantly sexual situation.See the portrayal of women in GTA or the witcher series to know what i mean.

You barely look on the surface and yet your examples are bad.

 

[ULTROS!]

I'm completely fine with their designs. Best will probably be FFXII's. At least their designs are much better than 98% of the other JRPGs.

 

[RockmanWhore]

I'm with you OP. I'm tired of this Nomura madness. Enough with the gay/metrosexual bullshit. It was nice for one game or two, but I'm so tired of that style. I wish we could go back to the PSone days in which every Final Fantasy had its own style.

It's actually what's holding me back for FF XV. In the other FF, there are some female characters that look nice and some male characters that look manlier (like Balthier and Basch in XII), but in XV? It's like Backstreet Boys The Game.

 

[TheTwelve]

When I saw this pic, I moaned a little bit too. Same old, same old. I don't see much creativity here at all. Boring characters. I'll forgive and forget, though, if the game and gameplay is excellent.

 

[MilkBeard]

Everything in Final Fantasy games is just window dressing for the graphics. It's such a shame, because FF games used to strike an excellent balance in terms of showy graphics, focus on story, and fun gameplay.

I suppose this element is partly why everyone's faces are so damn symmetrical and beautiful. And the worlds and levels are as well. It reminds me of the Star Wars episode 1-3 movies, where it was just so polished and pristine that I found it aesthetically repulsive.

The main issue to me is that every character, in every instance is perfectly beautiful or ruggedly handsome. Am I really supposed to believe that some dude, even if he's a prince, just happens to be friends with 4 guys who wear clothes like they work in host clubs, have perfect hair and jaw lines, and exactly symmetrical facial features minus the odd scar here or there, also with ideal body proportions? Or that the two protectors of the world just so happen to resemble a trendy 16 year old Harajuku shopper and her older Shinjuku-going sister, and an army super soldier and her sister who are both paragons of ideal facial features, perfectly blended to capture the best of both Japanese and Anglo faces?

Literally every character is beautiful, even the bad guys, with the very odd exception of like the pope dude. And it's not that I want ugly characters, but someone here or there that was at least 'questionable' would bring a degree of believability to it, for me.

These are valid points but I don't get why Final Fantasy gets singled out for it. In some ways the styles are still derived from artwork and anime. I always get that kind of a vibe from Final Fantasy.

Seriously, do you know that people in real ads are often constructed from several different people? The designers will literally pick a person's frame, and then pick eyes and a nose from someone else, then brush it up, trim the fat, and then viola, the perfect face. I find this shit more disturbing personally. In a video game, even if the graphics are close to reality, there is still the element of understanding the fantastical nature of it.

It all boils down to taste though. I don't really notice the characters being overly perfect, but that's just me. At least every character is given an equal shot at being beautiful, eh...?

Spoiler

Lame reasoning, I know ;P

 

[sublimit]

In term of character designs it's a hit or miss for me.
I loved all the character designs in FFX,i liked some in FFXII (but hated others),i hated every single one in the FFXIII games and i seem to really like almost all the character designs from FFXV.

As for my favourite world designs (in terms of art) i have to say i LOVED everyone of them although FFXIV seems to be my favourite.I really hope FFXVI's world is more like FFXIV.

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

.... I wish we could go back to the PSone days in which every Final Fantasy had its own style.

This I can agree with. I don't understand how anyone could say Nomura's a "shitty" artist or a "bad" designer. Is he overused though? Absolutely. For as much as SE changes up FF with each entry, they really should add more variety to the character designs.

 

[Wazzy]

I'm with you OP. I'm tired of this Nomura madness. Enough with the gay/metrosexualbullshit. It was nice for one game or two, but I'm so tired of that style. I wish we could go back to the PSone days in which every Final Fantasy had its own style.

It's actually what's holding me back for FF XV. In the other FF, there are some female characters that look nice and some male characters that look manlier (like Balthier and Basch in XII), but in XV? It's like Backstreet Boys The Game.

Posts like this are disgusting.

What makes something gay? What's so gay about Final Fantasy?

 

[TheTwelve]

FF7 was different at the time, but they have been trying to recapture that success ever since.

They're not trying hard enough.

FF7 had a cool talking dog, a remote controlled fat doll with a cat on its head, a cursing old man, a couple of odd characters you could only get through sidequests and *gasp* a black guy (thanks for the shoutout to my skin color in FF13, though, Square).

Square doesn't have the guts to put this kind of variety and creativity into a major Final Fantasy again. They're appealing to a certain demographic that began in Final Fantasy 10, and they'll keep it up as long as the $$$ keeps pouring in because of it. Once that dries up, maybe we'll get "fantasy" again.

 

[Dark_castle]

I'm with you OP. I'm tired of this Nomura madness. Enough with the gay/metrosexual bullshit. It was nice for one game or two, but I'm so tired of that style. I wish we could go back to the PSone days in which every Final Fantasy had its own style.

It's actually what's holding me back for FF XV. In the other FF, there are some female characters that look nice and some male characters that look manlier (like Balthier and Basch in XII), but in XV? It's like Backstreet Boys The Game.

Not even the prospect of being able to explore this locale?

 

[killatopak]

Cor looks like he is based from the MC in Clash of the Titans

 

[MilkBeard]

Not even the prospect of being able to explore this locale?

That is some sweet looking Fantasy for you, right there. Some really good locale design.

 

[Mr. RHC]

I'm with you OP. I'm tired of this Nomura madness. Enough with the gay/metrosexual bullshit.

There's a lot of bro games out there, I think Final Fantasy is the wrong franchise for you if that is your problem. Looks like CoD and Battlefield is your genre.
Really all I can do is laugh, I really don't get the outrage over this. Hello, I'm Final Fantasy! I've always looked like animuu, why you mad?

Edit:

Upon reading your post a third time, I hope you were being sarcastic.

 

[TheTwelve]

Not even the prospect of being able to explore this locale?

SIGH.

 

[WolvenOne]

Eh, varies from game to game.

12, mostly good, Vaan though, 9_9;;

13, uugh.

14, pretty good.

15, eh, mixed bag.

Final Fantasy 9 was the last game to really satisfy me with its art style. Even then though, there are a couple odd ducks.

Name, Kuja, or more precisely that discomforting outfit he's wearing. Then, there is Quinna, aka, what the heck was Amano smoking!?

 

[Natetan]

VI and VII were the last I was totally satisfied with. X was most if the way there and XII was the closest since the FFT to satisfy me.

FFIX was a disaster.

I really like that XII is realistic without being overly masculine like western games or overly androgynous /melodramatic like a lot if Japanese RPGs are.

 

[StuBurns]

I like the Nomura stuff, I think the people attempting to work within his style at SE, handling secondary characters, or the outfits in XIII-2/LR are hacks, but the actual Nomura stuff looks good to me, for the most part. I remember thinking it was funny that XIII-2 had a DLC outfit designed by a pop star, and it outclassed all the others for Serah:

FFXV looks fantastic, I don't want people to look overly strange. Someone above said they looked 'same old, same old', I don't think that's the case, but they do look mundane for a Final Fantasy, and that's exactly what I want. Mundane doesn't mean forgettable, just because Joel in TLoU isn't wearing neon, doesn't mean I can't remember him, moreover, a more conservative look actually helps establish a world as being more relatable.

I think the character design in the XIII sub-series, outside of a couple of Nomura's originals (although not all, certainly, Snow looked terrible), has been really terrible, however I think every other entry before them, had mostly great character designs.