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[NHarmonic.]

I don't know if it's because i started to care about FF when Nomura took over, but i've came to really like his designs. Man's a master in the way he uses color and lines, and his style fits the Fantasy tematic so well, in different aspects (FF, KH or TWEWY). Defined a lot of what i actually look up to in terms of art and character design...

So i guess, i'm happy with the "visual identity". It works with the lore and atmosphere of the games.

 

[Mista Koo]

I love the Final Fantasy's modern visual identity. For every terrible Nomura design there is one of gaming's best character designs, sometimes even in the same game (Tidus and Auron).

I agree that they should try swords and sorcery again. It would be refreshing to see Nomura's take on it.

 

[APZonerunner]

I think there's been greater issues with the 13 series than its artistic merits, of which it has many, really. Some of it I like, some of it I don't. Based on what we know so far, I'm certain my opinion of 15 will be similar.

I'd like to see a really artistically bold and different game like 9 again, though.

I'd also like to see them visit a non-modern, non-futuristic setting that isn't Ivalice again. I think FF has typically done that more whimsical fantasy very well, and in games like FF6 and FF9 that are largely that it makes the moment where you're thrust into the fantastical, futuristic stuff (such as Terra, the Invincible and all that in FF9) are all the more artistically and narratively powerful & effective.

 

[MilkBeard]

lol you clearly have zero understanding of the series evolution stylewise. Nobody has a problem with it not being 'pure fantasy', which it never was to begin with. It's the androgyny and mediocrity we dislike. The design by committee to appeal to the widest demographic look. Nobody actually enjoys that. It's just what some useless hopped up marketing department thinks people enjoy. It's focus tested to shit and it isn't even particularly effective marketing wise. Their far too afraid of their fan base to every try anything approaching an actual creative visual style. Which is too bad because gameplay wise they've still consitantly knocked it out of the park.

I have to disagree. The androgyny, as many have stated, existed way back since the beginning with Amano's style. It's just not as noticeable with the tiny little character sprites. Also, I think you are mistaken about the character designs being done by committees: I believe that they are wholly Nomura's designs, and because of the rise in popularity of the Final Fantasy series when he jumped on board as a character designer, it is just assumed that his style is what people associate with Final Fantasy now. I could be wrong to a certain degree because I don't know exactly how Square Enix is run as a business, but I can't believe that those designs aren't the product of Nomura's own creative interest.

 

[HeelPower]

I can see that perspective.. But I don't share it.

1. To me, it's not aesthetically pleasing.

2. It implies something about their character that doesn't follow from the on-screen portrayal. Did cold Lulu or revolutionary Nooj really spend hours that morning getting their belt skirt or hairdoo together? I don't buy it.

3. I see no evidence of genius in Nomura's ability to generate such gimmicks (his talents lie elsewhere). This stuff is easy: what if you had a character with hair shaped like a bird? What if you had pants that were made up of a series of rings? Gimmicks are easy. Tasteful and aesthetically pleasing designs are hard.

1.Subjective perception exists.

2. what ? is that how you judge outfits ?

How exactly is Nooj's outfit so difficult/impossible to wear/utilize compared to Geralt's design then ? I see they are equally difficult. Geralt is a practically a homeless monster hunter if you don't know him ,and he is from a WRPG.

3.That's where we don't agree.I don't think they are superfluous gimmicks.

 

[Wazzy]

lol you clearly have zero understanding of the series evolution stylewise. Nobody has a problem with it not being 'pure fantasy', which it never was to begin with. It's the androgyny and mediocrity we dislike. The design by committee to appeal to the widest demographic look. Nobody actually enjoys that. It's just what some useless hopped up marketing department thinks people enjoy. It's focus tested to shit and it isn't even particularly effective marketing wise. Their far too afraid of their fan base to every try anything approaching an actual creative visual style. Which is too bad because gameplay wise they've still consitantly knocked it out of the park.

The androgyny? Ha. What is so androgynous compared to the older games? And mediocre? The games have been fantastic with the exception of the XIII series. The music, visuals, gameplay, story, etc.

I'm honestly shocked people are saying their visual style isn't creative. Each game has had such differing looks. Games like VIII were simple and modern looking, X was colourful and a little over the top, VII was anime styled.

 

[Meccanical]

2. what ? is that how you should of outfits ?

How exactly is Nooj's outfit so difficult/impossible to wear/utilize compared to Geralt's design then ? I see they are equally difficult. Geralt is a practically a homeless monster hunter if you don't know him ,and he is from a WRPG.

Well for one Geralt's belts actually hold shit together, and Nooj's belt's serve no purpose whatsoever.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

lol you clearly have zero understanding of the series evolution stylewise. Nobody has a problem with it not being 'pure fantasy', which it never was to begin with. It's the androgyny and mediocrity we dislike. The design by committee to appeal to the widest demographic look. Nobody actually enjoys that. It's just what some useless hopped up marketing department thinks people enjoy. It's focus tested to shit and it isn't even particularly effective marketing wise. Their far too afraid of their fan base to every try anything approaching an actual creative visual style. Which is too bad because gameplay wise they've still consitantly knocked it out of the park.

you clearly have zero understanding of the work of Amano.

 

[Green Mamba]

I just want to say that Nooj is just the worst design Final Fantasy has ever birthed. Like a character designer vomited on a piece of paper and said "Good enough."

Eugh.

you clearly have zero understanding of the work of Amano.

For all this talk of Amano this and Amano that, his art really didn't come through in the games outside of monster designs. I'm not sure if it's a valid excuse against anger at FF's modern androgyny.

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

Even the wasteland stuff is pretty generic though.

My issue with Western fantasy (in the general sense, not fantasy as apposed to sci-fi) is that it all tends to be very safe and the various worlds are usually just "remixes" of established ideas. Even Warhammer is too similar to LotR for my tastes.

That can be interesting in its own way (as in "how are the dwarfs going to be in this world?"), but it gets tiring. I'd like to see a WRPG in a completely new and original world one of these days.

I bet you love Chris Avellone. But yeah, in a way it's a shame that too many DnD influences are so deeply rooted in the genre.

 

[PshycoNinja]

I think the guy you quoted was talking about the five main playable characters. So this would be a better picture to post:

Honestly, I think that their clothing style and color schemes make them more samey than they really should be. Nomura's doing the game a disservice I feel when the game does seem to have much more varied (and frankly, much more interesting) side character designs. I've said it before, but Noctis is like the most boring design Nomura has ever made.

And in an unrelated note, the games' apparent lack of important female characters (and apparently no playable females) is very disappointing coming from a series that has typically been pretty strong in that regard.

I understand your point. That being said we have not seen enough of the game for you to make the argument that there isn't a single important female character. Hell, Stella seems to be a central character in this story. However if the scenario doesn't allow for a female character why should they throw one in to pander. The characters who are thrown in for diversity are usually the characters that drag down the story.

Plus that's a whole different argument for the day someone plays through the game and says a female party member would have made sense from a story perspective. For me every character must serve a story purpose moreso than a pandering purpose.

I hate labels. I don't care if the character is black or white/ male or female, it MUST make sense in story context. What we have here is a Prince where his kingdoms crystal is stollen and must get it back. Typically for people in royalty they are surrounded by people of their same sex. I don't want FF to meet some quota and check mark box for what they must have in regards to characters. Just create great characters. If you don't make a beast like character like Red XIII when all is said and done I won't get mad as long as what they did put in for characters makes complete sense for story context.

 

[MilkBeard]

I just want to say that Nooj is just the worst design Final Fantasy has ever birthed. Like a character designer vomited on a piece of paper and said "Good enough."

Eugh.

I kind of have to agree. I mean, wtf is going on there? ha ha.

 

[Dark_castle]

These?

Could be worse. But I already want to punch Noctis. The fuck is he wearing?



YES. In setting and style anyway

I bet you also wanted to punch many of the characters in Final Fantasy series and JRPG or even RPG in general.

 

[kevm3]

To me the problem is very few of the guys in the cast look like 'adventurers'. They all have modelesque looks and look like they came right off the stage at a fashion show. They are all dressed in modern, 'fashionable' clothing. Even the 'rugged' characters have their facial hair as if it is a metrosexual, controlled ruggedness. All of the cast is slim, or slightly muscular, but still a model type muscular. It's like they designed the cast to cater to what a teenage girl would find 'hot'. The perfect model style is boring to me.

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

1.Subjective perception exists.

2. what ? is that how you judge outfits ?

How exactly is Nooj's outfit so difficult/impossible to wear/utilize compared to Geralt's design then ? I see they are equally difficult. Geralt is a practically a homeless monster hunter if you don't know him ,and he is from a WRPG.
[IMG ]http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130407054149/finalfantasy/images/thumb/e/e6/Nooj.jpg/300px-Nooj.jpg[/IMG]

3.That's where we don't agree.I don't think they are superfluous gimmicks.

I think the design in the Witcher is much more convincing because each part seems to have a practical use. Even the stuff that is obviously frourishings and has really no use whatsoever.

 

[MilkBeard]

I understand your point. That being said we have not seen enough of the game for you to make the argument that there isn't a single important female character. Hell, Stella seems to be a center all character in this story. However if the scenario doesn't allow for a female character why should they throw one in to pander. The characters who are thrown in for diversity are usually the characters that drag down the story.

Plus that's a whole different argument for the day someone plays through the game and says a female party member would have made sense from a story perspective. For me every character must serve a story purpose moreso than a pandering purpose.

I hate labels. I don't care if the character is black or white/ male or female, it MUST make sense in story context. What we have here is a Prince where his kingdoms crystal is stollen and must get it back. Typically for people in royalty they are surrounded by people of their same sex. I don't want FF to meet some quota and check mark box for what they must have in regards to characters. Just create great characters. If you don't make a beast like character like Red XIII when all is said and done I won't get mad as long as what they did put in for characters makes complete sense for story context.

I kind of agree with this. If it makes sense from a story perspective that there isn't a female lead then I don't think the designers should shove one in. Also, we have yet to see Stella's involvement in the story.

 

[HeelPower]

These?

Could be worse. But I already want to punch Noctis. The fuck is he wearing?



YES. In setting and style anyway

you do realize FFXV outfits aren't designed by Nomura ???

They are designed by a japanese clothing company called ROEN.They charge thousands of dollars for their clothing and shoes.

 

[Meccanical]

To me the problem is very few of the guys in the cast look like 'adventurers'.

Because they aren't.

Pay attention to context guys.

 

[Dark_castle]

It's all about the FFXIV artwork. Now THIS... is Final Fantasy character design at its finest!

You do realize that picture looked especially good because of the job armors right? Strip them off the clothing and you will see a whole new world.

 

[Meccanical]

You do realize that picture looked especially good because of the job armors right? Strip them off the clothing and you will see a whole new world.

A magic place you never knew.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

For all this talk of Amano this and Amano that, his art really didn't come through in the games outside of monster designs. I'm not sure if it's a valid excuse against anger at FF's modern androgyny.

But ahh, I addressed this. People trying to hold Nomura responsible for the designs would have been equally disgusted if not more by Amano's work, if it ever saw the light of day after the PS2 era of FF. The problem is that sprites back in the day left a lot to the imagination, so people couldn't see how ridiculous the designs looked. FF designs were never tame, it was just a hardware limitation that kept people from seeing how crazy they were. It's why many people here have argued that FF should return to chibi or a more stripped down cell-shaded look. To that, I think that's a very fair assessment, if you're not a fan of the current look. But for someone to argue that the change in character designer has somehow effected the "masculinity" of the cast is grade-A bull.

 

[Snakeyes]

you do realize FFXV outfits aren't designed by Nomura ???

They are designed by a japanese clothing company called ROEN.They charge thousands of dollars for their clothing and shoes.

Pretty sure that Nomura is the one who has the final say on which designs make it into the final product.

 

[reezoo]

Everything is going in a sex neutral direction, is it same for Japanese culture?

 

[Usobuko]

For all this talk of Amano this and Amano that, his art really didn't come through in the games outside of monster designs. I'm not sure if it's a valid excuse against anger at FF's modern androgyny.

I don't prefer it myself but that shouldn't be an issue in the first place.

Everything is going in a sex neutral direction, is it same for Japanese culture?

The Pop Culture look doesn't restrict itself to Japan, it's apparent to other Asian countries when you look at their Idols. Same goes for Western boyband/artist like One Direction, Justin Bieber.

 

[Dark_castle]

Nomura is the worst thing to happen to the series. So no.

However, I love Yoshida's designs with the online games and FFXII.

Toriyama is.

 

[kevm3]

What is missing is the variety. Lets look at some of the art from Valkyrie Profile

You might have had your pretty boy or two

but you also had characters like this

The problem isn't that they have these model type characters. It's that there are TOO MANY of them. They all have this perfect bone structure, slim or slightly muscular bodies, these gelled-up hairstyles...

 

[DJIzana]

You do realize that picture looked especially good because of the job armors right? Strip them off the clothing and you will see a whole new world.

Flashy armor or not, I still prefer his artwork the most.

This isn't really flashy armor and I enjoy the heck out of this art. This is also by Yoshida.

 

[Perfect Cha0s]

Y'know, while I don't mind these designs, and preferred some of the original designs.. the one thing I do have a problem with are Noctis' pants. They're just so damn ugly and stupid looking... Just... ugh...

 

[Flakster99]

Not at all. I haven't been a fan of the "visual identity" the series has employed since FFVIII.

And since FF8 (excluding FFIX) the series has had this design by committee to appeal to the widest demographic look to it, which has left me shaking my head. SE are in the business in creating beautiful mediocrity and have successfully withered away, game after game, their ability to trigger my imagination, which then triggered a sense of magic and mystery I used to enjoy playing the FF series.

 

[BlazingRain]

lol you clearly have zero understanding of the series evolution stylewise. Nobody has a problem with it not being 'pure fantasy', which it never was to begin with. It's the androgyny and mediocrity we dislike. The design by committee to appeal to the widest demographic look. Nobody actually enjoys that. It's just what some useless hopped up marketing department thinks people enjoy. It's focus tested to shit and it isn't even particularly effective marketing wise. Their far too afraid of their fan base to every try anything approaching an actual creative visual style. Which is too bad because gameplay wise they've still consitantly knocked it out of the park.

You clearly have zero understanding period. Amano's characters were often more "androgynous" than any of the new ones, and FF has never used "design by committee." It's like you picked up a generic complaint about AAA games (Ubisoft in particular) and changed the names to SE.

I mean seriously, have you even played an FF?

 

[Alvarez]

 

[Green Mamba]

I understand your point. That being said we have not seen enough of the game for you to make the argument that there isn't a single important female character. Hell, Stella seems to be a center all character in this story. However if the scenario doesn't allow for a female character why should they throw one in to pander. The characters who are thrown in for diversity are usually the characters that drag down the story.

Plus that's a whole different argument for the day someone plays through the game and says a female party member would have made sense from a story perspective. For me every character must serve a story purpose moreso than a pandering purpose.

I hate labels. I don't care if the character is black or white/ male or female, it MUST make sense in story context. What we have here is a Prince where his kingdoms crystal is stollen and must get it back. Typically for people in royalty they are surrounded by people of their same sex. I don't want FF to meet some quota and check mark box for what they must have in regards to characters. Just create great characters. If you don't make a beast like character like Red XIII when all is said and done I won't get mad as long as what they did put in for characters makes complete sense for story context.

I'm not looking for token characters. I'm looking for well written female characters utilized well in a story. If they decided they didn't want to tell a story that had a gender ratio of more than 6:1 in terms of important characters then that's disappointing in and of itself in an industry already heavily male oriented and in a series that was known for being pretty equal opportunity. Final Fantasy doesn't exist in a vacuum. And unfortunately mainline Final Fantasy doesn't come out quickly enough for everyone disappointed to just hunker down and wait for the next installment (which oh god I hope is not directed by Toriyama holy shit).

 

[BocoDragon]

Yep, without a doubt, ha ha.

Spoiler

Rufio! Rufio! Rufio!

Ru-fi-ohhhhhhhhhhhhh

(sorry I had some business IRL, was a little late on that one

I'm not looking for token characters. I'm looking for well written female characters utilized well in a story. If they decided they didn't want to tell a story that had a gender ratio of more than 6:1 in terms of important characters then that's disappointing in and of itself in an industry already heavily male oriented and in a series that was known for being pretty equal opportunity. Final Fantasy doesn't exist in a vacuum.

They've already done an FF with an all female cast, so...?

 

[hardvibes]

No.

 

[NinjaBoyLao]

I'm not a fan of the current FF look, I love FF9 and 12's art. I wish they make more of that.

 

[BlazingRain]

I bet you love Chris Avellone. But yeah, in a way it's a shame that too many DnD influences are so deeply rooted in the genre.

I haven't had a chance to play Plaescape:Torment yet (just started it and am still in the opening area), but Vegas was good until it refused to work on my PS3 (talk about a game the devs should've been sued over). What I've seen from Avellone I've liked though.

 

[zroid]

Its no wonder I find the people that still enjoy the series to be either women, young men dreaming of a life in Japan and men who love the company of other men.

amazing

sexism, racism, and homophobia, all wrapped up tight in a neat little package

 

[Meccanical]

I'm not looking for token characters. I'm looking for well written female characters utilized well in a story. If they decided they didn't want to tell a story that had a gender ratio of more than 6:1 in terms of important characters then that's disappointing in and of itself in an industry already heavily male oriented and in a series that was known for being pretty equal opportunity. Final Fantasy doesn't exist in a vacuum.

I feel like there is something inherently wrong with this logic.

I feel like you wouldn't be complaining if this were an exclusively female cast.

 

[Green Mamba]

They've already done an FF with an all female cast, so...?

A single spinoff like ten years ago in the opposite direction has like nothing to do with what I just said.

I feel like you wouldn't be complaining if this were an exclusively female cast.

Probably not, considering that's comparatively rarer.

 

[Village]

I'm not looking for token characters. I'm looking for well written female characters utilized well in a story. If they decided they didn't want to tell a story that had a gender ratio of more than 6:1 in terms of important characters then that's disappointing in and of itself in an industry already heavily male oriented and in a series that was known for being pretty equal opportunity. Final Fantasy doesn't exist in a vacuum.

While I do agree with having well written female characters, you say it yourself. FF is eaqual opportunity ( gender wise) that's why I kinda don't care. there were just 3 games where females were many of the main focal points of the plot, and the protagonists. If they wanna do all boys knight out. I dunno who cares, there will be women in the next one.

 

[nbnt]

I personally find them great. Especially Noctis.

 

[BlazingRain]

I'm not looking for token characters. I'm looking for well written female characters utilized well in a story. If they decided they didn't want to tell a story that had a gender ratio of more than 6:1 in terms of important characters then that's disappointing in and of itself in an industry already heavily male oriented and in a series that was known for being pretty equal opportunity. Final Fantasy doesn't exist in a vacuum. And unfortunately mainline Final Fantasy doesn't come out quickly enough for everyone disappointed to just hunker down and wait for the next installment (which oh god I hope is not directed by Toriyama holy shit).

Designing things a certain way because you want to escape media trends is just as bad as pandering to them.

SE has shown it has no issues with prominent female characters; it's not under any obligation to include them in every single game if it doesn't want to.

 

[Flakster99]

You clearly have zero understanding period. Amano's characters were often more "androgynous" than any of the new ones, and FF has never used "design by committee." It's like you picked up a generic complaint about AAA games (Ubisoft in particular) and changed the names to SE.

I mean seriously, have you even played an FF?

You're talking about illustrations of characters that were not used in game (FF1-FF6) due to the for it's time obvious hardware limitations in comparison to modern FF games (post FF7) which have (imo) absolutely created an androgynous look to most of it's characters in-game due to more capable hardware. I believe that was the point he was trying to make.

 

[MagnaderAlpha]

I think the design in the Witcher is much more convincing because each part seems to have a practical use. Even the stuff that is obviously frourishings and has really no use whatsoever.

Also, structure-wise and balance-wise, the Geralt's clothing just looks better. I can't unsee Nooj wearing full body red long johns! Just can't unsee it, even though I WANT to unsee it!

 

[BocoDragon]

A single spinoff like ten years ago in the opposite direction has like nothing to do with what I just said.

I would say that given the series usual inclusion of multiple female strong characters, often as leads, as well as an entry that starred only female characters, I wouldn't take XV's cast of bros as a negative sign for the overall direction of the series. In fact it's a kind of rare break from the norm.

I get being personally disappointed though.

 

[Skilletor]

FF15 has the best characters designs. And dressed so well.

Can't wait.

 

[BlazingRain]

You're talking about illustrations of characters that were not used in game (FF1-FF6) due to the for it's time obvious hardware limitations in comparison to modern FF games (post FF7) which have (imo) absolutely created an androgynous look to most of it's characters in-game due to more capable hardware. I believe that was the point he was trying to make.

The "androgynous" look (and it's not even androgynous, but whatever) has been with the series since the beginning.

And there has never been a FF which utilized "design by committee" character designs. Why continue to make a false claim?

 

[Wazzy]

For all this talk of Amano this and Amano that, his art really didn't come through in the games outside of monster designs. I'm not sure if it's a valid excuse against anger at FF's modern androgyny.

I'm a huge fan of Amano but I think it's a pretty hypocritical argument to make that the later games are more effeminate than I-VI when the portrait design and artwork were Amano's.

amazing

sexism, racism, and homophobia, all wrapped up tight in a neat little package

Wow, what a disgusting post. I can't stand people that think Final Fantasy has to be about REAL men otherwise it's for girls and gays. Ugh.

 

[koutoru]

I guess everyone has their own taste in FF designs, personally I like how the series is moving with its art direction. I think it fits the current setting well (If you like the setting, that is).

Also if teenage girls regularly design video game characters like this...

more of them should be working in the industry...but that's just my opinion.

 

[CO_Andy]

Too much Nomura. Don't care if the hero is young or old.