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[A-V-B]

What I'm getting from that statement is that Infinite didn't sell as well as they wanted it to. At 6 million copies. WTF.

6 million copies would've been fine if it took 2-3 years to make Infinite. It took Levine an eternity because the dude apparently has no pre-production stage. He's constantly rewriting and redefining up to the last days of actual production. This, plus a lack of a solid plan going into production, can create a lot of unfortunate delays. Infinite was a jail victim of rewrites, both on a story level and a gameplay level. Scars and trauma all over the place.

I think all they want is someone with vision, but with a different approach who won't take forever creating a tortured masterpiece. Levine definitely has his strong points, but from a purely financial perspective I understand completely where 2k's coming from.

I just hope that IS where they're coming from, and not a "we didn't make money, CoD made money, let's make CoD with ADAM" direction

 

[Daemul]

2k Marin made Bioshock 2 and it's the best Bioshock, so I'm ok with this.

 

[hydruxo]

I'll never understand the hate over Infinite. Loved that game, one of my favorites of last gen. I'd be interested in another Bioshock game but I'll remain cautiously optimistic because I'm not sure where they'd go from here with it.

 

[Dr. Buni]

I think people who like playing games rather than watching them tend to like Bioshock 2.

Perfect.

I'll never understand the hate over Infinite.

On other hand, I will never understand the praise this game gets.

 

[KissVibes]

So did I get this right.

Bioshock Infinite does not sell as expected. Irrational is shut down. Previously closed studio reopened and is now developing a Bioshock game. Wow, if I was Ken Levine I'd be pissed.

Why should he be pissed?

It's his fucking fault BioShock Infinite went off the rails and cost too fucking much. His fault Irrational shutdown.

 

[Instro]

I'm down. The universe is still appealing to me, and there's plenty that can be done under the franchise name as essentially anything is possible both in setting and themes.

 

[A-V-B]

Perfect.

On other hand, I will never understand the praise this game gets.

Infinite has great ideas, but most of them are only half-developed.

The biggest, clearest example of that is the Songbird section from BaS2. You will never find a better showpiece for that story's lack of developing and delivering on powerful concepts.

Infinite came through on its time traveling shenanigans. It did very well there. Everything else... well, was everything else.

 

[Guevara]

The gameplay in Infinite was so disappointing, but I'm still down. Actually I'm glad it will be handled by someone new.

 

[To Far Away Times]

Bioshock 2 > Bioshock Infinite.

I'm okay with this...

 

[mreddie]

I'm down.

But I think the team who did the DLC left to do Gone Home.

 

[x-Lundz-x]

I am all for more bioshock. I just don't see how they could ever top one of the best games ever made In bioshock infinite.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

The guys who made Bioshock 2? That game was pure garbage.

The series may as well be dead.

Bioshock 2 trumps 1 in terms of everything except story. Gameplay is loads better in 2.

 

[A-V-B]

I'm down.

But I think the team who did the DLC left to do Gone Home.

Yeah, Minerva's Den team is gone, off to do their own thing. Which is totally cool. I'm excited to see where they take their ideas after their successful proof of concept.

 

[Renekton]

I'm afraid I would disagree. I can't think of a single drought of creativity since 1300. Rarity does not posses inherent value. What's more, I resent the idea of "required gratitude" and I would say that simply because someone does not exalt an object for its attempted uniqueness does not mean that they are taking innovation for granted.

A team of very talented individuals worked very hard to make Infinite, that effort is important. However it doesn't mean that I should be required to be thankful for the product anymore than they need to be grateful for work of mine that they don't like.

Just look at China history, they got serious droughts which haunted them till arguably now.

The gratitude here is more of a "genuine appreciation" rather than abject worship or anything self-demeaning. Yes I'm thankful that Dark Souls was made, but it does not diminish me as a person to think that way.

 

[Wolves Evolve]

Isn't Marin, like... really fucking small now? Didn't they strangle it?

 

[Guevara]

Bioshock 2 trumps 1 in terms of everything except story. Gameplay is loads better in 2.

I kind of hated guarding the little sister harvests though.

 

[A-V-B]

I kind of hated guarding the little sister harvests though.

No way, man! I loved that. So many ways to set up traps before you started it, lots of ways to approach, and it was fun trying to predict where enemies would come out from.

 

[catmario]

Bioshock Without Ken Levine = DEAD.

 

[Gryph]

Just look at China history, they got serious droughts which haunted them till arguably now.

The gratitude here is more of a "genuine appreciation" rather than abject worship or anything self-demeaning. Yes I'm thankful that Dark Souls was made, but it does not diminish me as a person to think that way.

China unfortunately suffered two major incidents of book burning and cultural destruction, one in 200 BC and one in 1900. I think it's a bit unfair to say that they have suffered from cultural droughts. A number of important pieces of art, poetry, science and literature have come from China.

As for gratitude, I apologize if I misunderstood you. I would say that genuine appreciation is a wonderful thing. I would never say that anyone is diminished because of their appreciation.

My objection is simply to the often raised idea that we are obligated to appreciate for some reason. Regardless of the qualities of an object or other work of art there is no obligation to appreciate it.

The original post I objected to suggested that we should show gratitude because Bioshock Infinite is a rare bird, I disagree.

 

[MrFrankFontaine]

Infinite completely provided closure for this franchise.

Please let something die off with respect.

Yeah, I loved Bioshock and Bioshock Infinite, I don't need another just for the sake of having another one. Bioshock 2 was good, but it was just copying the creativity of the first. It worries me when they talk about "expanding the audience".

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

I look forward to 2K Marin's better version of Irrational's game, just like last time.

 

[MidnightCowboy]

Honestly, Minerva's Den is the greatest Bioshock related property ever, so if 2K Marin can recapture that magic, I'm game.

 

[ZSeba]

Maybe they manage to make a game more similar to E3 2011 Bioshock Infinite? :O

 

[Quadraphonic]

I'll never understand the hate over Infinite. Loved that game, one of my favorites of last gen. I'd be interested in another Bioshock game but I'll remain cautiously optimistic because I'm not sure where they'd go from here with it.

Super hype, as usual with many over-hyped games. It drew in a lot of people that didn't necessarily know what they were getting into. Add that in with people romanticizing something beyond all possible expectations and you get kickback.

 

[sleepykyo]

I kind of hated guarding the little sister harvests though.

I loved it. Setting up the traps was a joy. Dead island riptide implemented a defend the camp mechanic as well but it wasn't nearly as much fun since it wad a lot more restrictive about where turrets could be set up.

anyway bioshock 2 was fun. Just rework the mp, set in space/underground and pretend bioshock infinite never happened.

 

[FantasticMrFoxdie]

Bioshocking News


I think it could sell better with the right direction.

 

[Team Filler]

Best Bioshock devs making more Bioshock. You have my attention 2k.

 

[Eusis]

Infinite completely provided closure for this franchise.

Please let something die off with respect.

The original stories should be left where they are untouched, definitely. Make something similar, but different and unrelated in any meaningful way.

. . . And I hope they go in a more RPG-esque fashion in the future, at least not in a cheap superficial way like Ubisoft games can come off as. Most importantly I do NOT want another shooting gallery game, I'm not expecting them to eliminate gunplay or anything dramatic like that but there's enough fucking games that focus on shooting loads of enemies, and they generally do a better job with it.

 

[Cert.in.Death]

I love Infinite (not so much Burial At Sea :\ ).

I would kill for more Bioshock, but it's very hard to see where it goes from here. Vanilla Infinite was one of my favorite games ever.

 

[steven28]

I really like bioshock 2

Can't wait to see what they make

Me too..i thought it was better than infinite.Really looking forward to see what they do here.

 

[Auto-Reply]

I didn't know about 2k Marin being shrunk down... i love all 3 existing Bioshock games but I'm not sure how to expand on it. Do I want to see more of Rapture and Columbia? How do you create another new setting without it feeling forced and uninspired?

Still looking forward to whatever comes up.

 

[JayEH]

I thought 2K Marin was shut down?

 

[NateDrake]

I thought 2K Marin was shut down?

Likewise. Thought the division was closed following the release of The Bureau: XCOM Declassified.

 

[The_R3medy]

Hmmm I question this as 2K Marin was "Essentially closed" last year after the release of The Bureau. Though no real word was given on Rod Fergusson's San Diego Studio, or at least what happened to it after he left. I could totally see those two studios combining staffs and making a new Bioshock.

 

[TomShoe]

Where's my BioShock Vita, 2K?

Still good that the franchise isn't dead. I have yet to start Infinite (backlog blues), but the series is in good hands.

 

[firehawk12]

After the ending in the Buried at Sea, how the fuck do you even make more Bioshock games? Jet let it die.

 

[Orthogonal]

Bioshock 2 was great from a gameplay perspective, it really polished and improved on everything over Bioshock 1 in that regard, the story however... I guess it was impossible to eclipse the masterwork of the first story, but it's like they didn't even try.

 

[storl026]

Wow, people in this thread are really all over the map with their love/hatred of Bioshock 2 & Bioshock Infinite.

I loved all three almost equally (for slightly differing reasons; 1 for the atmosphere and story, 2 for the improved mechanics and same great atmosphere, Infinite for the story and atmosphere). I'm just excited to be in a Bioshock world again.

 

[repeater]

Vita means life.

That would be a genius way to "expand the market" for this series. (Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see Bioshock Vita someday..)

 

[Broank]

I remember not hating Bioshock 2 but not being compelled enough to finish it either.

 

[Dysun]

I really liked 2, so I'm ok with Marin handling it.

Infinite sort of killed off the future possibilities in a way, but I dont care

 

[RE_Player]

I'm not a fan of Infinite but it ended the franchise. Yes any IP is destined to be milked dry and it's business but this one in particular feels desperate. Just do something new. It's the start of the generation, where risks and new ideas have the opportunity to be rewarded.

 

[Hesemonni]

Infinite completely provided closure for this franchise.

Please let something die off with respect.

But then again: There’s always a lighthouse. There’s always a man. There’s always a city,

And I'm completely fine with it. I'd love to explore more worlds like Rapture and Columbine.

I rarely rave about games anymore, but damnit if Columbine Ascension @ 2.20 isn't some mind blowing stuff.

And Infinite. But Infinite's art was breathtaking.

Worst thing about Infinite was that the exploration itself was a bit limited. I would have loved to explore and admire the vistas.

 

[NullPointer]

From a gameplay perspective, Bioshock 2 was vastly superior to Bioshock 1.

So, I'm game.

And Infinite. But Infinite's art was breathtaking.

 

[Superflat]

From a gameplay perspective, Bioshock 2 was vastly superior to Bioshock 1.

Agreed totally.

They're really going to have to shake it up to make me want to play another Bioshock though.

 

[Bjoern the Smexy]

I'll never understand the hate over Infinite.

The story was GOTY material. The genre wasn't fitting though and sadly the gameplay was shit.

 

[bobawesome]

Infinite killed it. On purpose, I think. Levine seemed very set on killing absolutely everything, Evangelion-style.

Bioshock 1.11 confirmed for 2024.

 

[Bruticuz]

atmosphere of BS1 and you got me.
And no more generic shooter mechanics, please more emphasis on the discovery and horror side.

 

[DrDrizzay101]

Bioshock 2 had arguably the best gameplay in the series with so many competing entities (Player, Splicers, Big Sister, Big Daddy, security system). Unfortunately the premise was extremely stupid as described in the Zero Punctuation review. Play as a Big Daddy prototype that's faster, stronger, and more agile than the "finalized" versions seen in the original game. Makes sense...

 

[meta4]

I loved Bioshock Infinite and still think it was one of the best games of last year. It is still a better fps than most other fps games released last gen.