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[Xeke]

There's a whole thread devoted to how you can't be racist toward whites. You should read it. Thus, my point stands!

Edit: I also removed the quotes from his post but you guys aren't whining about that.

What point? Your point is that you needlessly berate people who are trying to have a discussion because you're insecure about yourself? I agree.

He obviously gave context for his jew/black comparison and you threw it out the window and called him racist, you're the trash, oh wait sorry, White.

 

[neoanarch]

Maybe trying to forcefully integrate a people is a stupid idea.

 

[mre]

What point? Your point is that you needlessly berate people who are trying to have a discussion because you're insecure about yourself? I agree.

He obviously gave context for his jew/black comparison and you threw it out the window and called him racist, you're the trash, oh wait sorry, White.

Now that you've apparently recovered from being butthurt, maybe you can go and give me an honest answer to my question in the other thread?

 

[lastendconductor]

Back when I was a kid growing up in Russia, my mom used to warn me about the gypsies in the subway station. She said they kidnapped children and shit. Don't know if true.

That's true. Then they use the children to beg on the streets. I know it sounds like an exaggeration but Romanian ones do it; in fact, one of the riots agains gypsies in Napoles was caused because a girl broke in to a house and tried to stole a baby. The mother alerted the neighbors, they got pretty mad and attacked the settlements.

 

[Grizzlyjin]

Ok, I'm confused. People keep saying that we Americans should equate them to thugs, but aren't like 99% of the gypsies born into that culture? Like a "normal" person doesn't usually become a gypsy, right? I always thought gypsy referred to the culture.

I guess some of us NA folks are having a hard time swallowing this because we've heard the same things said about Blacks or Mexicans, or the Irish. "They're all trouble..." just kind of makes me uneasy. But hey, I've never had any experiences with the group, so I can't put in a word edgewise. Carry on.

 

[pcostabel]

Maybe trying to forcefully integrate a people is a stupid idea.

Absolutely. Problem is, what else can you do? Tolerate their criminal behavior because is part of their culture? Confine them to certain areas? Treat them like any other member of society?
Gypsy are a problem, you can't simply ignore them and call anyone who protests their presence a racist.

 

[kojacker]

I have a catalog of personal experiences with gypsies (Irish travellers) that have left me with a very poor opinion of them, but as a flavour they include such delightful behavior as slashing my uncle across the face with a knife (leaving him blind in both eyes) because he interrupted them stealing in his garage, and having my dog stolen and sold on. They move their mobile homes into the parks/car parking areas, steal all around them, and when the heat gets too much they (hopefully) move on leaving their mess and human sewage to be cleaned up. They usually double dip by claiming government benefits from both Northern Ireland/UK government and across the border from the Southern Ireland government, so I'd agree with the posters above that called them leeches.

I hate to paint a culture with such a broad brush, and I would consider myself not a racist person, but there is definitely a problem with this particular culture which seems to create so much thievery and anti-social behaviour.

 

[Xeke]

Now that you've apparently recovered from being butthurt, maybe you can go and give me an honest answer to my question in the other thread?

And the deflection. And my question.

Why are you being such a douche to somebody in this thread who made a comparison about the way jews and blacks were treated to the current situation? I'm sure you wont give a real answer so I'm prepared for disappointment. Why are you being a cock sucker to him for no reason?

 

[pcostabel]

Ok, I'm confused. People keep saying that we Americans should equate them to thugs, but aren't like 99% of the gypsies born into that culture? Like a "normal" person doesn't usually become a gypsy, right? I always thought gypsy referred to the culture.

I guess some of us NA folks are having a hard time swallowing this because we've heard the same things said about Blacks or Mexicans, or the Irish. "They're all trouble..." just kind of makes me uneasy. But hey, I've never had any experiences with the group, so I can't put in a word edgewise. Carry on.

The best comparison is with the Mafia. Just like the Mafia, the Gypsy culture is based on disrespect for the law. Just like the Mafia, you usually are born into it, although even more so for Gypsy given their nomad behavior and unwillingness to integrate.

 

[Feral Youth]

Well the Gypsies I've met in the UK seem fine to me, including the odd Roma one you see around selling rings and shit.

When they're in a society that treats them like animals (mostly European ones) I wouldn't expect them behave any other way.

Interesting that the hatred for Gypsies tends to be more wide spread in the countries that have problems with racist chanting against black players.

Makes me wonder if the Gypsies are actually the real problem.

 

[beje]

Ok, I'm confused. People keep saying that we Americans should equate them to thugs, but aren't like 99% of the gypsies born into that culture? Like a "normal" person doesn't usually become a gypsy, right? I always thought gypsy referred to the culture.

I guess some of us NA folks are having a hard time swallowing this because we've heard the same things said about Blacks or Mexicans, or the Irish. "They're all trouble..." just kind of makes me uneasy. But hey, I've never had any experiences with the group, so I can't put in a word edgewise. Carry on.

Well, they're the equivalent in the sense of, regardless if they are born gypsies or turn into thugs, you know they're trouble. Period. Not because your parents tell you so. Not because they're running a bashing campaign in the TV or with urban legends. You know they're trouble most of the time because you see it with your own eyes or suffer it yourself day after day. It really sucks for the worthy ones trying to do a normal life, in the same fashion it also sucks for a normal educated african-american kid that happens to like wearing baggy clothes, but then they also have a chance to make a difference.

 

[ksan]

Well the Gypsies I've met in the UK seem fine to me, including the odd Roma one you see around selling rings and shit.

When they're in a society that treats them like animals (mostly European ones) I wouldn't expect them behave any other way.

Interesting that the hatred for Gypsies tends to be more wide spread in the countries that have problems with racist chanting against black players.

Makes me wonder if the Gypsies are actually the real problem.

Good fucking point.
With your logic I should go out and attack gypsies because I have relatives that have been threatened by gypsies.
However, I think the culture I'm a part of is slightly more civilized than the gypsy culture we are talking about here.

 

[mre]

And the deflection. And my question.

Why are you being such a douche to somebody in this thread who made a comparison about the way jews and blacks were treated to the current situation? I'm sure you wont give a real answer so I'm prepared for disappointment. Why are you being a cock sucker to him for no reason?

To respond to your question directly would require an admission that (1) I was acting like a douche and (2) that I was being a cock sucker.

However, I'll go ahead and answer your question anyway. My original response was based upon the fact that I disagreed with his comparisons and thought they were ridiculously over the top. I'm sorry if you disagree with my delivery, but there you have it.

Now. Are you going to respond honestly to my question about Eddie Jordan and whether or not his actions were racist? Or is it my turn to prepare for disappointment?

 

[Grizzlyjin]

This subject is very interesting. So how exactly to you know when you've had an encounter with a gypsy? Do they look a certain way? Dress a certain way? How do you know it isn't some random jerk? How often do you usually have experiences with these people?

 

[EmCeeGramr]

My original response was based upon the fact that I disagreed with his comparisons and thought they were ridiculously over the top.

Over the top? I was taking things that were being said in this thread almost exactly and replacing the names. It's literally the same argument.

 

[fmcato]

Well the Gypsies I've met in the UK seem fine to me, including the odd Roma one you see around selling rings and shit.

So you've been around UK gypsies for a while? Don't know how they are apart from how they are portrayed in Snatch.

 

[mre]

Over the top? I was taking things that were being said in this thread almost exactly and replacing the names. It's literally the same argument.

Because I don't think the situation of modern Gypsies are quite analogous to the situations of Jews in pre-WWII Eastern Europe or blacks in America during the 1930s?

 

[Xeke]

To respond to your question directly would require an admission that (1) I was acting like a douche and (2) that I was being a cock sucker.

However, I'll go ahead and answer your question anyway. My original response was based upon the fact that I disagreed with his comparisons and thought they were ridiculously over the top. I'm sorry if you disagree with my delivery, but there you have it.

Now. Are you going to respond honestly to my question about Eddie Jordan and whether or not his actions were racist? Or is it my turn to prepare for disappointment?

You didn't disagree, you flat out called him racist. Unless everybody in the thread extremely misinterpreted you.

Wow. Jews and blacks in one post. Why'd you stop there? Run out of minority groups to rag on?

So you say. I'm just calling a spade a spade.

Not only that, but:

I see you removed hey let's go back in time to the 1930s from his quoted post just to serve your agenda. Nice work.

You should probably just explain how you REALLY feel.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Because I don't think the situation of modern Gypsies are quite analogous to the situations of Jews in pre-WWII Eastern Europe or blacks in America during the 1930s?

My point was that it's a racist argument that's been used for ages, and it suddenly doesn't become perfectly acceptable just because it's naming the Roma instead of blacks or Jews.

 

[WrathOfOtaibah]

You know if the Roma were to be in the US and we said the spiteful shit said in this thread, EuroGAF will have an aneurysm, wondering why we're so backwards in the way that we treat them, etc. etc.

Just another EuroGAF hypocrisy moment.

 

[mre]

You didn't disagree, you flat out called him racist. Unless everybody in the thread extremely misinterpreted you.

I'm sorry if you disagree with my delivery, but there you have it.

?

 

[Zero Hero]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaxBUZYFlhI

 

[TheCardPlayer]

You know if the Roma were to be in the US and we said the spiteful shit said in this thread, EuroGAF will have an aneurysm, wondering why we're so backwards in the way that we treat them, etc. etc.

Just another EuroGAF hypocrisy moment.

The question is, why is this kind of thing allowed here? I've seen people banned for less, but the mods don't even react here.

 

[Xeke]

?

Wow. Jews and blacks in one post. Why'd you stop there? Run out of minority groups to rag on?

So you say. I'm just calling a spade a spade.

And those? I'm supposed to believe that's just bad delivery?:lol

Oooookay dude. I just call it like I see it.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

The question is, why is this kind of thing allowed here? I've seen people banned for less, but the mods don't even react here.

I don't think any mods are online and in the OT right now.

 

[Feral Youth]

So you've been around UK gypsies for a while? Don't know how they are apart from how they are portrayed in Snatch.

Ask the question again without sounding like a miserable twat and I'll answer you.

Whoops completely read the post wrong. :lol I was getting moaned at in the background.

Yeah, I went to school with a few, quite a few in my town. No different from the average white working class person. Still friends with a few, probably wouldn't call them Gypsies now mind. They seem proud of the fact though.

 

[mre]

And those? I'm supposed to believe that's just bad delivery?:lol

Oooookay dude. I just call it like I see it.

The first post you're quoting was my original reply, which I gave you my explanation for, so I'm not quite sure why you brought it up again?

The second post was my response to someone asking me if I was dense for not comprehending the point of the post I quoted, so I gave a flippant answer. I don't really care if you accept that answer or not. I just want to know if you're ever going to reply about Eddie Jordan or not?

 

[beje]

This subject is very interesting. So how exactly to you know when you've had an encounter with a gypsy? Do they look a certain way? Dress a certain way? How do you know it isn't some random jerk?

a) Racial features. I don't know about other countries but they're easily recognisable here in Spain. Anyway, this doesn't mean anything until you reach point...
b) They're loud, they have an easily recognisable slang and they disrespectfully refer to non-gypsy people (of any race) as "payos".
Do they meet both of these requirements? Congrats, you have met some gypsies. If you're lucky, they will be the integrated kind and nothing will happen. Most of the time they will either...
a) start begging (begging as in "give me some money if you don't want to get in trouble")
b) blatantly pickpocket, especially in public transport.
c) drive a car without license
d) start a fight saying somebody "looked at them bad"
and a lot more things you've already read in this thread

How often do you usually have experiences with these people?

Depends on where you live. If you live in a small town/village, or in some "bad" areas of a city you're likely going to have to deal with them on a semi-daily basis. If you luckily don't, you will still have to deal with them from time to time. And yeah, the horror stories about a camp of gypsies illegally settling where they shouldn't and terrorizing the neighbourhood are sadly true. They will dismantle power lines of parks to sell the copper, they will create havoc and they will act completely anti-social. It's very hard to explain to people of other countries not really aware of the problem without looking like a stupid biggot. But shit sadly happens and as I said before, it really sucks for the reputation of the minority that wants to get integrated into society and have a normal life for them and their children.

 

[Prime crotch]

Well the Gypsies I've met in the UK seem fine to me, including the odd Roma one you see around selling rings and shit.

When they're in a society that treats them like animals (mostly European ones) I wouldn't expect them behave any other way.

Interesting that the hatred for Gypsies tends to be more wide spread in the countries that have problems with racist chanting against black players.

Makes me wonder if the Gypsies are actually the real problem.

The "problem" is that Gypsies are a closed community that won't even try to integrate into society and as such the perpetuation of the stereotype lives on. Hell, the only time I even made friends with one was only because he was the only Gypsy kid in school, and probably the fact that he was like five years older than us in a middle school class.

 

[-COOLIO-]

i didnt even know gypsies still exsisted. is it racial? could you spot one in a crowd?

 

[Iksenpets]

Original gypsies came from Egypt. Now they're an heterogeneous group that has their own culture in each country.

And yes, for easy north-american understanding, they're the equivlent of thugs. It doesn't matter if their skin is darker or lighter if they came from Africa, South America or their families have been in the US forever, you just know they mean trouble 90% times they're around, because you have seen so for lots of years.

Gypsies came from North India. The Egyptian label they have in a lot of languages is a misnomer similar to the Native Americans having been mislabeled as Indians in America. And Gypsies aren't Romanians, that's just where their largest population is.

And as an American, holy shit the gypsy hate is really weird.

 

[Aurora]

I hate gypsies too. The world would be a better place without them. Don't see how anyone could claim the contrary.

 

[Xeke]

The first post you're quoting was my original reply, which I gave you my explanation for, so I'm not quite sure why you brought it up again?

The second post was my response to someone asking me if I was dense for not comprehending the point of the post I quoted, so I gave a flippant answer. I don't really care if you accept that answer or not. I just want to know if you're ever going to reply about Eddie Jordan or not?

You're going to have to refresh my memory. Can I get a page for page recap? Preferably in poetry format.

 

[lastendconductor]

This subject is very interesting. So how exactly to you know when you've had an encounter with a gypsy? Do they look a certain way? Dress a certain way? How do you know it isn't some random jerk? How often do you usually have experiences with these people?

There seems to be a lot of different types of gypsies, so I can only talk about the ones nearby... they have a very characteristic way of speaking, they lack hygiene (nails full of shit, etc..), wear a lot of gold chains and rings, and have a certain way of dressing... I don't know the equivalent word in english for "hortera"... maybe "ridiculous"?.. or they just go shirtless. Males have long mullets and females have long greasy hair. And you usually notice them because they're making trouble (shouting at people, mugging them... etc). They usually do these "raids" on the city, stealing, begging...etc, then go back with the loot to their settlements. Only place I've seen them not to make much trouble is the welfare office.
I've lernt to avoid places with gypsies so it's been long since I had a problem... but last thing in the long list was when I was walking to the park with a few friends to play soccer, these gypsies decided the wanted our watches so they kicked my friend in the stomach, throw our ball into the river, bitch slapped another one of my friends and then showed us blades threatened to kill us with them if they saw us again. They stole our watches and went away laughing.
And there's plenty of affirmative action and helping hands tended towards this collective. A lot. They just laugh at us, they think of us as dumb sheep. You think they live in poverty? bullshit. These guys dress with gold everywhere, drive Mercedes, have houses in property (free lent by the government), free schools and high schools like everybody (poor teachers assigned there...)... they just like to live in dirt and steal to live.
But we've had an influx of Romanian gypsies lately... these guys make our ones look like saints (they're fucking up them too)

 

[Fusebox]

Dear American GAF, the word 'Gypsy' in the UK isn't a racial slur, it's a term used to describe the scumbags that travel around in caravans set up camp on your school oval and steal everything around them and don't leave until you pay them to. Despising fucking gypsies is an acceptable UK past-time, they fuck shit up for other people.

This is not your gypsy anymore...

These are your gypsies...

Although an ad campaign against them seems a futile way to change anything.

 

[zon]

Well the Gypsies I've met in the UK seem fine to me, including the odd Roma one you see around selling rings and shit.

When they're in a society that treats them like animals (mostly European ones) I wouldn't expect them behave any other way.

Interesting that the hatred for Gypsies tends to be more wide spread in the countries that have problems with racist chanting against black players.

Makes me wonder if the Gypsies are actually the real problem.

Yup, all of Europe are just like Nazi Germany when it comes to gypsies. We simply decided one day to blame them for all kinds of shit. You got us, time to come clean and give it up.

Okay guys, who are we going to lie about now? I've heard some things about Albanians...

 

[mre]

You're going to have to refresh my memory. Can I get a page for page recap? Preferably in poetry format.

Now THAT'S a dodge. :lol

Here, I'll give you a hint as to where to find the thread: "Shining Beacon of White Guilt."

I'll understand, though, if you don't want to ever respond as it did undermine your entire philosophy on racism that you were spouting in that thread.

 

[smurfx]

wow lots of hate for gypsies here.

 

[Feral Youth]

The "problem" is that Gypsies are a closed community that won't even try to integrate into society and as such the perpetuation of the stereotype lives on. Hell, the only time I even made friends with one was only because he was the only Gypsy kid in school, and probably the fact that he was like five years older than us in a middle school class.

We say the same thing about all Eastern Europeans here in the UK, we complain that they don't try to integrate much..

Poles seem to get the best rep here though, the rest tend to get looked down upon.

You can't just expect people to just magically become like yourselves though, it will take time and effort. In Eastern Europe probably longer with all the other racist elements there. That too will take time and effort to resolve since understanding doesn't come over night.

Needs a lot of good governance by the dominant culture.

 

[Feral Youth]

Yup, all of Europe are just like Nazi Germany when it comes to gypsies. We simply decided one day to blame them for all kinds of shit. You got us, time to come clean and give it up.

Okay guys, who are we going to lie about now? I've heard some things about Albanians...

Never said you were lying. Just that you tend to have more racists than the rest of the world combined though.

Which suggests you'll never solve the problem, and in fact perhaps deserve it.

 

[zon]

Never said you were lying. Just that you tend to have more racists than the rest of the world combined though.

Which suggests you'll never solve the problem, and in fact perhaps deserve it.

You can only be a racist if you're white!™

 

[TheCardPlayer]

Dear American GAF, the word 'Gypsy' in the UK isn't a racial slur, it's a term used to describe the scumbags that travel around in caravans set up camp on your school oval and steal everything around them and don't leave until you pay them to. Despising fucking gypsies is an acceptable UK past-time, they fuck shit up for other people.

Dear racist. The topic is about an ad calling to the extermination of the Roma people, not douches in caravans so your entire post is pointless. Good day.

 

[Feral Youth]

You can only be a racist if you're white!™

Emotional outbursts like that would hint at the fact you have no desire for the situation to improve.

Because you just love to hate.

Evidently you have found something.

Enjoy.

 

[MetatronM]

Dear racist. The topic is about an ad calling to the extermination of the Roma people, not douches in caravans so your entire post is pointless. Good day.

How was his post racist?

That said, it did completely miss the point of what the thread is about, yes.

 

[SapientWolf]

Dear racist. The topic is about an ad calling to the extermination of the Roma people, not douches in caravans so your entire post is pointless. Good day.

I honestly don't know what this topic is about anymore, which is why I'm keeping out of it.

 

[Fun Factor]

I hate gypsies too. The world would be a better place without them. Don't see how anyone could claim the contrary.

Hi-five dude.

 

[zon]

Emotional outbursts like that would hint at the fact you have no desire for the situation to improve.

Because you just love to hate.

Evidently you have found something.

Enjoy.

Translation: I can't come up with more generalizations about you Europeans right now, so I'll stop, for the moment.

 

[Fusebox]

Dear racist. The topic is about an ad calling to the extermination of the Roma people, not douches in caravans so your entire post is pointless. Good day.

If only if were as simple as you think, unfortunately a lot of people clearly got confused along the way when some other people pointed out why they don't like European gypsies, and people took that to mean all gypsies including Roma gypsies.

"Douches in caravans" just sounds like an American housing estate to me, so when you say Gypsy in Europe you need to clarify who you're talking about - hope you can understand this.

 

[Feral Youth]

Translation: I can't come up with more generalizations about you Europeans right now, so I'll stop, for the moment.

Here's one generalization, you tend to hate Gypsies.

Let me know where that leads you.

 

[fmcato]

Ask the question again without sounding like a miserable twat and I'll answer you.

Whoops completely read the post wrong. :lol I was getting moaned at in the background.

Yeah, I went to school with a few, quite a few in my town. No different from the average white working class person. Still friends with a few, probably wouldn't call them Gypsies now mind. They seem proud of the fact though.

Hah hah, thanks God I read the edit, I was going "WTH!"

Anyway, from what I've experienced in Spain, gypsies who moved out of the ghettos have no problem mixing with the rest of the population, and social workers that regularly go to the ghettos aren't messed with. Those among my friends who went to school with them also had no problem they wouldn't have with any other. So I'd say they can adapt quite well to "regular" life if they so want.

The ghettos themselves are a mess, though, and their population incredibly prone to petty crime, unemployment and a general disregard of laws, non-gypsy individuals they don't know, etc.

In the last decades violent crime against other ethnics coming from gypsies has decreased a lot, but in many populations the gypsy families/clans are still local mafias, even if quite toned down compared with the past.

I don't know how far other countries have tried to integrate gypsies, but here in Spain that includes free housing since decades ago (the gypsies that have been here for generations no longer live in caves, caravans or huts - don't expect their houses to be well kept though).

On the other hand, the ones coming here now from other (Eastern) European countries, though, are starting to build "favelas" villages around big cities and they are famous for being brutal like the gypsies here before the social aid, and lacking the organization that comes from settling in a place for generations.

I personally have had no problem with them since being mugged in arcades as a kid, but it calls my attention that as an ethnic they still stand out as the most conflictive despite the huge income of illegal immigrants from other countries in the last decades.