Gamernyc78
Banned
Bro project spark was obviously copying the popularity of little big planet so was Mario maker lol and none are as good as Lbp and now Dreams. I don't think he was serious though lol
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Dreams Is The Most Important New Game In A Decade
- Thread starter GribbleGrunger
- Start date
Bro project spark was obviously copying the popularity of little big planet so was Mario maker lol and none are as good as Lbp and now Dreams. I don't think he was serious though lol
Yeah this is absolutely going to shake the videogame industry to its very foundations. Just look at some of those creations, the next I Am Bread or Gang Beasts could come from this engine.
Dragon_Rocks
Gold Member
I know that and I have played several user created levels in LBP as well. I am sure many great games and levels will be created in Dreams as well. But they are all short mini games which are good to play quickly and move to next one. I look for more engaging experience with a story, plot, progression etc. I do not like racing, sports and military shooters as well so I guess this genre is also like one of those for me. Nothing wrong with the game but just not my taste.
Dthomp
Member
Yeah, I’m glad folks are excited for this, but the levels of hyperbole are nuts. This will not change gaming in any type of way, these games are always for a select audience and that’s fine, but let’s pump the brakes on most important game of the generation
DarthBuzzer
Member
Dreams is effectively a precursor tool to our digital superpowers of the metaverse. When we're all hooked into a mirror world metaverse that exists in both VR and AR simultaneously, we'll want the ability to create, edit, and change anything about any reality. Dreams is a great step forward in the direction for ease-of-use tools that will eventually get us there. Though editing realities in a shared metaverse will require a much more extensive infrastructure.
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EverydayBeast
thinks Halo Infinite is a new graphical benchmark
It should be, at the moment though I think it will hurt MM personally. Casuals aren't biting on "most important games of the decades", secondly the marketing could have been better on SONY's part.
pcostabel
Gold Member
I think Dreams could be a game changer for VR. The kind of games you can make with this tool are comparable with VR offerings. And sculpting and painting in VR should be a lot easier. If you have a PSVR, you would be crazy not to get Dreams. That's a few million copies right there.
GribbleGrunger
Dreams in Digital
I'm with you on that. I've already played a game that was 45 minutes long and played like a charm, so I'm sure, if a game can be that long and took only 6 weeks to make by ONE man, then eventually we'll get a good 3 hour game made by a team in 6 months to a year. It'll happen but when is the only question.
Krappadizzle
Member
Erhmm..
I'll pick it up in 2 years or so when people have made a bunch of cool shit. Not gonna pay full price for Sony and MM to let me make my own game. LBP was awesome with all the levels the community made, but I'll be damned if I'm gonna pay to make them. Hope those that do have a good time though.
I'll pick it up in 2 years or so when people have made a bunch of cool shit. Not gonna pay full price for Sony and MM to let me make my own game. LBP was awesome with all the levels the community made, but I'll be damned if I'm gonna pay to make them. Hope those that do have a good time though.
01011001
Banned
the game will ultimately be a financial failure, the servers will be offline within 2 to 3 years and noone will give a shit.
that's my prediction.
why? because while it's a very well made game, it is ultimately too difficult/complex for the average PlayStation customer to build their own stuff and have fun at the same time.
and only a handful of people will release a tiny handful of interesting "games" etc. , ultimately failing to keep the people that only play/look at the stuff other create interested for longer than a month maybe.
the only way this could see any success is to make it free, which wouldn't bring any revenue, so Sony would need to basically bet on this project to bring in enough new PlayStation 4 users to make it be worth it.
that's my prediction.
why? because while it's a very well made game, it is ultimately too difficult/complex for the average PlayStation customer to build their own stuff and have fun at the same time.
and only a handful of people will release a tiny handful of interesting "games" etc. , ultimately failing to keep the people that only play/look at the stuff other create interested for longer than a month maybe.
the only way this could see any success is to make it free, which wouldn't bring any revenue, so Sony would need to basically bet on this project to bring in enough new PlayStation 4 users to make it be worth it.
timonlionbladerunner
Member
Yeah I don’t see your average consumer being excited about this game at all.
CJY
Banned
I said exactly the same thing when I saw Minecraft for the very first time.
manfestival
Member
The title of this thread just makes me laugh. Even more hilarious is that bit saying that this game is like getting the internet we always wanted but never got. That must be quite the koolaid
Zaffo
Member
Spoiler, people with the will and time to create games right now are working on free and fully featured versions of Unity and EU4, none is going to waste years of their life developing a minigame on a console editor with no way to monetize or break out of the close environment.
Blow for Blow Mario Maker 2 it's going to be way bigger than dreams, since it actually empowers people with little to no technical knowledge to try their hand at level design.
Dreams it's going to be an hell of a way to get kids into programming, but once a kid grows smart enough to use a keyboard i see no reason to stay limited to such a limited editor.
Blow for Blow Mario Maker 2 it's going to be way bigger than dreams, since it actually empowers people with little to no technical knowledge to try their hand at level design.
Dreams it's going to be an hell of a way to get kids into programming, but once a kid grows smart enough to use a keyboard i see no reason to stay limited to such a limited editor.
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CJY
Banned
I thought minecraft would be stuck on PC as a creative curio and passing fad. There are a lot of things like this on the PC side.
The Powder Toy being one such “creative sandbox”-like.
Had absolutely no idea minecraft would go on to become such a massive cultural phenomenon. I’m talking at the very, very early stages... I doubt many could have predicted the eventual success of minecraft from the beginning, although its rise was exceptionally fast.
I’m not suggesting Dreams will see the same type of trajectory as minecraft. Not by a long shot, but yet... it’s highly possible it becomes a rip-roaring success in its own right too.
CJY
Banned
I haven’t seen any comparisons between the two versions but due to the nature of the rendering engine, plus other factors, such as the game being 1st party and the majority of the user base owning a base-PS4, I’m sure there’s probably an imperceptible difference between the two versions, especially at 1080P. Would love to see a detailed comparison myself.
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FranXico
Member
Well, it was influencial enough to motivate Microsoft to come up with a LBP knockoff in 3D.
Psykodad
Banned
If they allow creators to sell their projcts?
Yes, it will change lives and the medium.
Besides, as MediaMolecule themselves have said, they want to allow those who can't pay for the required education and whatever to be able to get into game development and film-making too and thát can and will definitely be changing lives.
pr0cs
Member
Which was nearly as world changing
Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the LBP series with my kids (with exception to LBP3 which was shit because Sumo Digital are a bunch of hacks) but the LBP hyperbole was pretty annoying. Dreams may be a fun game but "most important in a decade" .... Naaaah
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
David Jaffe dives in on a live stream.
Psykodad
Banned
What I don't get is why some people already talk about creations being "just tech-demos" when actual games take months if not years of development time, mostly with multiple people on a team, yet with Dreams we're looking at Creation Tools still fully in development during Early Access, that has started just a month ago and people are still learning the ropes and doing small projects to hone their skills and understand the basics.
How some people seem to completely ignore that and already judge Dreams based on that is quite suprising, especially since most of them seem to have been into gaming for years already so they ought to know that development doesn't happen overnight.
How some people seem to completely ignore that and already judge Dreams based on that is quite suprising, especially since most of them seem to have been into gaming for years already so they ought to know that development doesn't happen overnight.
CJY
Banned
Holy shit dexter’s lab. Woahhhhhh
Edit: I watched the rest of the stream. Was one of the most frustration-inducing things I’ve ever seen. Jaffe, you need to get your shit together or you’re gonna continue to languish in obscurity for the rest of your life. Do the damn tutorials mate. For fuck sake.
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Gamernyc78
Banned
Ummmm we've had history with their games already lol and no servers were shut down in two to three years. Lbp 3 was the weakest of them all but news flash Lbp IP in general sold in the multi millions each and was successful, espscially the first and ppl were still playing the first and the others online for years with hundreds of great levels if not thousands.
iconmaster
Banned
Find someone who looks at you the way
GribbleGrunger
looks at Dreams.
(J/k dude, I love your enthusiasm)
GribbleGrunger
looks at Dreams. (J/k dude, I love your enthusiasm)
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
Education has never been a barrier between someone getting into game design and someone not. Most of the influential game developers throughout the history of video games have had no education dedicated to the subject and instead were simple script kiddies who made their own games in their free time.
This will change about as many likes as RPG Maker does. I.E. almost none.
Gamerguy84
Member
Im not creative but my daughter is and she cant wait for it. Im waiting for VR to be patched in.
But i cant wait to get it and download amazing creations from others like i did with LBP.
But i cant wait to get it and download amazing creations from others like i did with LBP.
Psykodad
Banned
Yet it's literally what MediaMolecule said during an interview you can find on youtube.
Besides, its A reason, not THE reason.
Keep downplaying it though. I don't mind at all, time will tell.
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
I am not the one speaking hyperbole about a game that isn't released.
timonlionbladerunner
Member
Gamernyc78
Banned
I love alot of what I played but it suffers from what Lbp suffers, the floaty controls. I wish ppl could create games where it didnt feel like your floating or gliding.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Yes, if they just want to just browse and try out creations. The creating part is the difficult part but we know kids learn quickly so even tht I don't think would be a barrier.
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CJY
Banned
Of course they can. Like adults, most kids will probably start out with dream surfing. Those with a modicum of interest, initiative and creative abiliy will try their hand at creation.
I don't think being a kid is a barrier at all in today's world. In fact, for older kids, this might be the perfect platform for them to develop their skills in design and programming, music production, etc. Ideal for portfolio creation to enter into game studios or practical higher education.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Sony did it wayyyy before with Little Big Planet then Microsoft copied and came out with Spark. Lbp was actually successful with various sequels, made good money off dlc anddddd sold in the multimillion. Little Big Planet, Mod Nation Racers, etc started tht big interest in consoles with Create and Share thats why Media Molecule is still getting the credit deservedly so. Not to mention what and how you create in Dreams goes well beyond what you could do in Lbp, spark, Mario maker, etc..
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Vawn
Banned
So was Project Spark by a loud minority. The same is true here.
I do think this will be better received than Project Spark, but it is not going to revolutionize society like some people want to believe. It likely will lose a ton of money and could lead to the end of MM. I just don't see its target audience being big enough to support it.
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Gamernyc78
Banned
I don't get this comment. You do know tht LBP lived up to the hype right? It has a 95 meta, sold multimillion and everyone from Microsoft (spark) to Nintendo (Mario maker) copied the concept on console of create and share. It was and still is one of the most innovative games of the last several gens
I'll just drop this here because sometimes ppl forget some games importance and innovation after the years pass by...
LittleBigPlanet (Video Game 2008) - Awards - IMDb
LittleBigPlanet (Video Game 2008) - Awards, nominations, and wins
m.imdb.com
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CJY
Banned
It's absurd for anyone to have any doubts about this game, in terms of importance to sony's position as a platform holder, or the industry at-large.
Shawn Layden outlined sony's first-party game philosophy of "First, Best, Must". You can read about this philosophy here: https://comicbook.com/gaming/2018/06/30/playstation-first-party-lineup-sony-boss/.
It's pretty obvious this game fits in with that philosophy to a tee, and of course there have been mis-steps in the games they have given the green light to in the past, but in no way, shape or form should anyone be doubting this game in pretty much any capacity, because it fulfils the criteria of what Sony hope to achieve with their first-party offerings so well.
That's not to say this game will sell gangbusters or anything, of course not, but a large part of that will come down to the marketing and PR, which is mostly handled by Sony directly. The point is, no matter what it sells, it's probably still a success in Sony's book, just to have a game such as this in their exclusive portfolio. Do they want it to sell millions and become the next gaming cultural phenomenon? duh... However, one thing is for sure - the success of this product won't be dictated by how many units are sold, but instead, it will be based on how well Media Molecule executed on its core vision of putting these tools of infinite creative possibilities into the hands of the average gamer and making them accessible to everyone who owns a PlayStation... based on this criteria, Dreams is already a rip-roaring success, even before it has reached gold master.
People can shite on about any shortcomings, but as far as I can see, this "game" is the most immune to criticism of any single piece of console software that has ever come before. I'm not gonna keep waxing lyrical about how it's a full (VR) game engine, innovative rendering engine, 3D modelling and texturing package, Digital Audio Workstation, etc. etc. etc. all rolled into one, and how you can literally create anything that you can imagine. How can anyone, with even a passing interest in games or digital creative mediums hold anything against what this product sets out to do, and the level to which they have accomplished this, thus far?
Of course, there are still some unknowns and what could be considered some downfalls such as the lack of monetisation and the lack of mouse support being the two major points against Dreams.
Anyway, some here might say it's crazy to have so much positivity, or to even have this much of an opinion about a game yet to be released, but I'm going to say it now: I believe Dreams is going to score insanely high in reviews, with an average score in the absurdly high 90s. I'm gonna say 98/100. And sell 10million+ copies at least across PS4 and PS5. We'll see.
Shawn Layden outlined sony's first-party game philosophy of "First, Best, Must". You can read about this philosophy here: https://comicbook.com/gaming/2018/06/30/playstation-first-party-lineup-sony-boss/.
It's pretty obvious this game fits in with that philosophy to a tee, and of course there have been mis-steps in the games they have given the green light to in the past, but in no way, shape or form should anyone be doubting this game in pretty much any capacity, because it fulfils the criteria of what Sony hope to achieve with their first-party offerings so well.
That's not to say this game will sell gangbusters or anything, of course not, but a large part of that will come down to the marketing and PR, which is mostly handled by Sony directly. The point is, no matter what it sells, it's probably still a success in Sony's book, just to have a game such as this in their exclusive portfolio. Do they want it to sell millions and become the next gaming cultural phenomenon? duh... However, one thing is for sure - the success of this product won't be dictated by how many units are sold, but instead, it will be based on how well Media Molecule executed on its core vision of putting these tools of infinite creative possibilities into the hands of the average gamer and making them accessible to everyone who owns a PlayStation... based on this criteria, Dreams is already a rip-roaring success, even before it has reached gold master.
People can shite on about any shortcomings, but as far as I can see, this "game" is the most immune to criticism of any single piece of console software that has ever come before. I'm not gonna keep waxing lyrical about how it's a full (VR) game engine, innovative rendering engine, 3D modelling and texturing package, Digital Audio Workstation, etc. etc. etc. all rolled into one, and how you can literally create anything that you can imagine. How can anyone, with even a passing interest in games or digital creative mediums hold anything against what this product sets out to do, and the level to which they have accomplished this, thus far?
Of course, there are still some unknowns and what could be considered some downfalls such as the lack of monetisation and the lack of mouse support being the two major points against Dreams.
Anyway, some here might say it's crazy to have so much positivity, or to even have this much of an opinion about a game yet to be released, but I'm going to say it now: I believe Dreams is going to score insanely high in reviews, with an average score in the absurdly high 90s. I'm gonna say 98/100. And sell 10million+ copies at least across PS4 and PS5. We'll see.
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Frank Spencer
Banned
Are we including flash games? Cause those porn ones are amazing. Fantasy > Dreams
BigBooper
Member
I played all three and even Some Modnation Racers. Yes, they were cool games. However, the levels the community made were never as good as the MM levels. The new modes and games people were making in LBP3 were never as good as the games they were imitating. They didn't look as good and they didn't control as well.I don't get this comment. You do know tht LBP lived up to the hype right? It has a 95 meta, sold multimillion and everyone from Microsoft (spark) to Nintendo (Mario maker) copied the concept on console of create and share. It was and still is one of the most innovative games of the last several gens
I'll just drop this here because sometimes ppl forget some games importance and innovation after the years pass by...
LittleBigPlanet (Video Game 2008) - Awards - IMDb
LittleBigPlanet (Video Game 2008) - Awards, nominations, and wins
That's the exact same as all the Dreams stuff I've seen. It doesn't look or control as well as the games they're imitating. It's just like DeviantArt for gamedevs.
Verdanth
Member
Only Sony is capable of making a game like this. God bless that company
Speaking of Dreams, I'm planning on creating my own hack n' slash game with it!
Will it have Kojima as the main character?
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Ar¢tos
Member
Dreams allows the player to create things much much more complex and bigger than Project Sparks.
Don't worry about them losing money, they are still in the green from LBP cosmetics and they are a small team of 30-50 devs. It costs Sony peanuts to keep them around compared to studios like Japan Studio that have very little to show this gen for the amount of people they employ.
Also, Dreams purpose is not profitability, its to give Sony positive criticism by funding something that would be seen as a crazy risk by any other publisher and that vastly increases the diversity of their offerings.
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MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Hmmm, that's a good idea actually. Never thought of it!