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[Solid Raiden]

I have not payed any attention to Star Citizen, though I've heard rumours of issues with its development in the past. That said, having read both the piece and Roberts' response I must say that I'm firmly taking Roberts' side on this. Sure, his response wasn't the most professional but he came off as passionate, sincere, and like he easily did more legwork that the author of the Escapist article. This really brings into question both The Escapist and the author's integrity.

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

Here you go. And I don't even like that asshole. Granted, half the accusations in there are clearly true. But the other half are basically "He's associated with people I don't like/have done stupid shit."

And that's from a developer.

David Gallant is using the blog area of Gamasutra. Gamasutra allows any developer to write blogs on their website. I don't think it's comparable to journalists.

 

[Lork]

Here you go. And I don't even like that asshole. Granted, half the accusations in there are clearly true. But the other half are basically "He's associated with people I don't like/have done stupid shit."

And that's from a developer.

But that's a blog post by a community member, not an ostensibly professional news article from a journalistic outlet as the subject of this thread purports to be?

 

[Sijil]

Unless The Escapist can present actual proof, I think Sandi can sue their asses for character assassination and defamation and I hope she does, without proof this is absolute slander. I don't know about US law but around here when you accuse someone, defame them in public, without any proof you'll end up with a heavy fine.

 

[Mesoian]

That's just a blog post though, and the author is basically saying he doesn't like TotalBiscuit. The Escapist is using the flimsiest of sources to say that Chris Roberts' wife uses homophobic and ableist slurs, and racially discriminates in hiring employees.

Sources they probably would be unable to actually cite if this did go to trail in a libel suit.

"Some dude on twitter" doesn't exactly fly, you know?

 

[Green Wiggly]

I just find it amusing that Derek Smart signed up for something called the Rear Admiral.

 

[tuxfool]

Sources they probably would be unable to actually cite if this did go to trail in a libel suit.

"Some dude on twitter" doesn't exactly fly, you know?

Yeah. But they're also probably betting that it doesn't get to that. Libel is very hard to prove and it would be expensive for CIG to pursue. Not something a backer funded project could afford to do.

 

[rakhir]

Please ban Escapist on the whole forum.

It's a vile and terrible place for a while, and it's big support of GamerGate is disgusting.

 

[Azih]

The accusation of discrimination during hiring practices is blatant. Doesn't that make things easier tuxfool?

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

Listen, I'm somewhat of a recent supporter of Kotaku now, but I remember all those fiascoes too. You can judge the quality of the site for yourself. I personally thought Kotaku had apologized and paid for their mistakes.

But what does that have to do with the hit piece on Escapist? Just because Kotaku has a history doesn't immediately discount what they have to say on the matter. If a journalism piece comes out and it's terrible, people can point it out.

 

[Jinkies]

Another employee coming out to defend CIG:

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3n59ft/working_at_cig_from_a_cig_employee/

Hey guys, Thomas Hennessy here, Videographer from CIG. First off, this is not an official statement from the company, and simply me wanting to get some stuff off of my chest.

I first started working for CIG during The Next Great Starship, and came on the project full time at the beginning of this year. I’ve worked a lot of places over the last 20 years, including 11 years of military service, and a lot of work in the film industry. This is my first job working in the video game industry, and to be honest, I had never even heard of Star Citizen before I worked for them.

I’ve been hearing and reading a lot of junk lately about CIG being a toxic work environment, and Chris and Sandi being difficult, if not impossible to work for, and I really wanted to just put it out there, that this couldn’t be further from the truth. I honestly think that working for CIG is one of the best gigs I’ve ever had, and part of what makes it so great are the people.

Are there bad days? Sure, what job doesn’t have good and bad days. Do my bosses have high expectations and demand excellence? Of course, and well they should, and the more I am challenged, the better I become, not just at my job, but as a human too. Am I sometimes asked to do things with too few resources and not enough time? Yep, welcome to the real world. This is how real life operates. We used to joke when I was in the military that you could take a group of Navy cooks, and assign them to build a house. You provide them a pallet of rotting wood and rusted nails, and tell them it needs to be done by tomorrow morning. The first thing these Sailors would do would be to start incessantly complaining what a raw deal they were getting, and that what they were asked to do was impossible, but the next morning low and behold, those cooks found a way to build that house.

Those are the teams that I want be a part of. The kind of teams where we make the impossible happen. There is an incredible level of satisfaction and sense of accomplishment taken from being able to overcome obstacles, and push yourself to do good work, even in less than ideal circumstances.

It literally hurts my heart to read some of the things people are saying about Chris, Sandi, and Ben, because from my experiences, it’s just not true. I feel quite fortunate to be a part of this project, and am incredibly grateful to all of the people out there that have supported us.

Anyone who wants to reach out to me, interview me, talk more about my experiences here at CIG, please do, because there is always two sides to every story, and at this point, I feel like only one side is being put out.

Once again, I want to say thank you so much to all of our wonderful fans who are allowing us the opportunity to make the impossible possible. I know I am not the only one here he takes the responsibility you have bestowed upon us quite seriously, and we are all working hard to help make dreams reality.

See you in the verse,
TH

 

[Sun Bather]

FWIW, this is one of the most disgusting pieces of reporting I've ever seen, and I'm legit shocked that any professional website would publish something like ....

I don't like this article either, but the prize for me is that one article where Gawker outed a gay guy for... Being gay and helping with the blackmailing.

 

[Mesoian]

Yeah. But they're also probably betting that it doesn't get to that. Libel is very hard to prove and it would be expensive for CIG to pursue. Not something a backer funded project could afford to do.

While true, a suit against Smart would be SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUPER easy at this point. Every single blog post about him being held hostage by these guys that got super exposed by their financial officer and lawyer the other day...those were straight up lies with hard evidence behind them.

There's probably no suit against The escapist, but I bet they could get a CAD and a restraining order against Smart if he continues after all this.

I don't like this article either, but the prize for me is that one article where Gawker outed a gay guy for... Being gay.

Mine is still, Max Temkin raped someone in college. We don't have any evidence, and we're going off one woman's word, but even if he didn't rape her, he should still come forward about it so we can have more healthy dialogues with rape victims.

Fucking gross exploitative bullshit.

Games Journalism, actual games journalism, journalism about the industry, the community and the people interacting and leading both, is in a fucking shambles right now.

 

[RK9039]

Time to buy a new ship.

 

[Mesoian]

.

 

[goishen]

Sounds to me like Roberts is another McQuaid. And holy hell, hold on to your hats.

 

[tiredheadcrab]

An interesting response from a backer turned employee.

https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/287233/from-backer-to-employee-at-cig#latest

Yellow text on a black background is terrible for reading. Maybe its just my eyes but I hate that as a web designer sometimes.

Also doesnt really say very much since its a developer who works there posting on the forums.

I hope this game turns out okay though. I hope it doesnt crash and burn because that wont be good at all. The whole idea of buying insurance for a ship you paid a lot of money for with virtual money doesnt sound appealing to me. But hey it does to some people and i hope they are happy with that choice or game design idea.

Good luck backers.

 

[Fhtagn]

The Escapist is basically gaming Breitbart at this point; why would anyone believe Derek Smart about any of this? It's obviously a hatchet job.

 

[Corpekata]

It's okay, you can accuse someone of being racist because Kotaku once insulted my favorite artist of big boobed sorceresses.

 

[Mesoian]

Please ban Escapist on the whole forum.

It's a vile and terrible place for a while, and it's big support of GamerGate is disgusting.

Counting the days for when Yahtzee leaves. Pretty much every piece of content found on The Escapist that I enjoy would be better off being done independently.

 

[Bedlam]

Wow, what an absolutely shit move from The Escapist. I used to visit that site semi-regularly back then (Zero Punctuation etc.) ... well, not anymore. They are on the shitlist now.

The drama surrounding SC and narcissistic sociopath Derek Smart has become really incredible - even unbelievable in some way. It's beyond me how a human being can act like that guy does. I really feel for the employees at CIG. Hopefully this noise doesn't have a huge impact on their morale and they finish this thing eventually.

 

[AwShucks]

Counting the days for when Yahtzee leaves. Pretty much every piece of content found on The Escapist that I enjoy would be better off being done independently.

This article, after reading it and the responses, has made me basically not trust The Escapist. I don't really frequent it anyways, but it makes them seem shady to me now. I do like Yahtzee sometimes.

I don't even care about the game either. Not a backer, not a future purchaser.

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

While true, a suit against Smart would be SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUPER easy at this point. Every single blog post about him being held hostage by these guys that got super exposed by their financial officer and lawyer the other day...those were straight up lies with hard evidence behind them.

There's probably no suit against The escapist, but I bet they could get a CAD and a restraining order against Smart if he continues after all this.



Mine is still, Max Temkin raped someone in college. We don't have any evidence, and we're going off one woman's word, but even if he didn't rape her, he should still come forward about it so we can have more healthy dialogues with rape victims.

Fucking gross exploitative bullshit.

Games Journalism, actual games journalism, journalism about the industry, the community and the people interacting and leading both, is in a fucking shambles right now.

Well I might have to reconsider my position.
I mean wow. That's legit disgusting...


Still has nothing to do with this though...

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Counting the days for when Yahtzee leaves. Pretty much every piece of content found on The Escapist that I enjoy would be better off being done independently.

Yeah I wanna unsub escapist but Yahtzee is so good.

 

[Mesoian]

This article, after reading it and the responses, has made me basically not trust The Escapist. I don't really frequent it anyways, but it makes them seem shady to me now. I do like Yahtzee sometimes.

I don't even care about the game either. Not a backer, not a future purchaser.

Yahtzee is entertaining, Unskippable is entertaining, I wish they would just go to patreon, even if that's a little selfish of me.

Because yeah, the Escapist is up to some straight up unapologetic dirt.

Well I might have to reconsider my position.
I mean wow. That's legit disgusting...


Still has nothing to do with this though...

Yup. Totally, it was just a tangential. Sometimes we need a reaffirm what "the bottom of games journalism" actually is. The escapist is bad but...there's worse. Oooh there's worse.

 

[Fantastapotamus]

Yahtzee is entertaining, Unskippable is entertaining, I wish they would just go to patreon, even if that's a little selfish of me.

Because yeah, the Escapist is up to some straight up unapologetic dirt.



Yup. Totally, it was just a tangential. Sometimes we need a reaffirm what "the bottom of games journalism" actually is. The escapist is bad but...there's worse. Oooh there's worse.

LRR (the Unskippable guys) left long ago. Yahtzee is really the only worth while thing left on the site.

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

Yahtzee is entertaining, Unskippable is entertaining, I wish they would just go to patreon, even if that's a little selfish of me.

Because yeah, the Escapist is up to some straight up unapologetic dirt.



Yup. Totally, it was just a tangential. Sometimes we need a reaffirm what "the bottom of games journalism" actually is. The escapist is bad but...there's worse. Oooh there's worse.

Yeah, I agree. Ugh.

Is Jim still escapist? Don't follow him that closely. Made some pretty good videos.

 

[Lork]

Mine is still, Max Temkin raped someone in college. We don't have any evidence, and we're going off one woman's word, but even if he didn't rape her, he should still come forward about it so we can have more healthy dialogues with rape victims.

Fucking gross exploitative bullshit.

Games Journalism, actual games journalism, journalism about the industry, the community and the people interacting and leading both, is a fucking shambles right now.

So, so far we have a community sourced blog post, an article that has absolutely nothing to do with games or games journalism (???) and an opinion piece that doesn't actually make any accusations. I feel like "Journalism literacy" needs to become a mandatory part of school, because as you can see here, people don't know how to read the news!

 

[Mesoian]

Yeah, I agree. Ugh.

Is Jim still escapist? Don't follow him that closely. Made some pretty good videos.

Naw, he left.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

Another employee coming out to defend CIG:

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3n59ft/working_at_cig_from_a_cig_employee/

This whole thing is bizarre and The Escapist are acting very irresponsible by not trying to get both sides of the conversation. I'm far more inclined to believe anything from Roberts and his company than I am that vile website or the mentally challenged Derek Smart.

 

[Primus]

Jesus. Derek Smart with access to Twitter and a legion of post-GrandpasGuitars followers is more of a nightmare than he ever was back on Usenet in the dark days of BC3000AD. Shit gets amplified everywhere now.

EDIT: Happy to see that ditching Escapist after last year's fiasco with that horrible pro-GG community article continues to have been the right decision.

 

[Absoludacrous]

Why am I not surprised that Derek Smart was finally able to drum up support via GamerGate proponents

 

[TheOohChild]

I am skeptical reading the allegations. It could just be a small collection of disgruntled employees. But the response from Roberts doesn't really instill much confidence.

 

[aliengmr]

Yellow text on a black background is terrible for reading. Maybe its just my eyes but I hate that as a web designer sometimes.

Also doesnt really say very much since its a developer who works there posting on the forums.

I hope this game turns out okay though. I hope it doesnt crash and burn because that wont be good at all. The whole idea of buying insurance for a ship you paid a lot of money for with virtual money doesnt sound appealing to me. But hey it does to some people and i hope they are happy with that choice or game design idea.

Good luck backers.

Insurance is a common element in these types of games. Even Elite has it.

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

Insurance is a common element in these types of games. Even Elite has it.

EVE Online also had insurance iirc.

 

[Alcool313]

Some have mentioned the escapist links to GG, and the similarity in tone between Smart rants and the article; I think it is particularly ironic how much time was spent attacking a high profile woman in the project, especially accusing her of using very specific and alarming insults.

However, what I think is particularly fishy is that although they make very specific accusations (typically in situations like this you don't want to be too specific since you are working with incomplete information) they provide absolutely 0 proof from all of their sources. That 9 disgruntled employees would come forth and not provide a single e-mail (although they are mentioned several times as one of the issues) of support is extremely strange to me.

The fact that no hard proof has come up, even with the intense slander campaign that this project is enduring and substantial staff turnover, is one of the most telling things about this project.

 

[Jackpot]

Counting the days for when Yahtzee leaves. Pretty much every piece of content found on The Escapist that I enjoy would be better off being done independently.

Unfortunately Yahtzee also rails against "SJWs". His other content is so good though.

 

[Valkrai]

If this isn't true (most likely), this could be grounds for libel against Escapist and Derek Smart right?

 

[Mesoian]

Unfortunately Yahtzee also rails against "SJWs". His other content is so good though.

In a different sort of way.

His "Let's Drown Out" videos have been enlightening. SJW is a dumb term, but at least he knows the difference between someone genuinely trying to make social change and someone who is rallying against something because they were told to rally against something and doing so will increase their visibility. But yes, he does use SJW as part of his more contextually silly favor text lexicon.

 

[VibratingDonkey]

I don't know what's going on with this game, but I think I'll hold for actual competent, credible people to inform me. Derek Smart and The Escapist is total clown town.

 

[wildfire]

Thankfully Roberts posted his response on his website. As I result I didn't have to give the escapist clicks. I could get the gist of the Escapist article and surmise it's a hit piece.

You don't publish an article while telling someone you will publish an article whether or not they respond to the allegations. (I ended up being proven right since comments in this thread mention they revised their article with his responses after the fact which is a very shitty thing to do for so many reasons)

I used to read the Escapist a lot and have noticed a severe decline in quality starting around 2012. Escapist used to be a great source for insider information but this TMZ gawker style reporting is the opposite of what they used to stand for.


While I feel Escapist came off the worst for this article Roberts didn't come out unscathed.


His assertion that all the anonymous sources had to come from Derek Smart is laughable. He spends so much time trying to build this narrative even though it should be obvious that when he says he has had to let go some people over the year that some of them would be disgruntled. His attempts to make it all about Smart tells me he wants to make the source coming from a person who is clearly an asshole to everyone. It makes it easier to tell yourself you didn't act like an asshole to your own employees if you can pretend the complaints aren't credible.

I can believe that it's sometimes very hard to work at CiG but noone is putting themselves out there to provide reliable proof of the extent of how bad it is.

The second problem is that he started attacking the writer and some random person who he claims doxxed him but clearly didn't in the links provided. Roberts spent 8 hours on this and never thought it was a bad idea to leave out that part of his email. Everything he mentioned was irrelevant.

Lastly there is the nagging problem that he did everything to defend so many different accusations but the claims about foul language and racism was "a private matter." That's pretty sad.

I wonder if he'll sue the Escapist for libel. Since the article just came out I'll give him a month to reasonably measure the costs of going through with a lawsuit but if he doesn't I definitely would think he doesn't have much of a case for proving otherwise.


Ultimately the most important thing is to ask myself if the Escapist article or Robert's response says this project is in trouble. Since there is a lot of innuendo without any supporting links by Escapist I don't think there is. The community seems to be largely confident in the project so I'll continue to be. Until those emails with foul language are published I can't put any serious stock into how bad the communication between employees have been.

(This post was way longer than it need to be :| )

 

[RexNovis]

The response post is absolutely disgusting. Not only does it outright ignore the notice saying that they have multiple confirmed sources but it's basically an attack piece on a man the authors claim is not at all involved with their article. How does that make any sense? When you are going out of your way to discredit people by avoiding the issue tying them to gamergate it's clear you've got a lot to hide. Red flags everywhere. Is the article hard hitting. Yes. But they claim to have multiple sources informing them so I guess it boils down to if you believe what they say about their sources. The last person I'd believe is the man who has everything to lose here and who dances around the reported issues with accusations of bias.

 

[Jeremy]

Well, I think the interesting thing is that The Escapist differentiates between anonymous sources (2 of them) and those that "identified" themselves but chose to remain anonymous (7 employees, supposedly).

I think the ball is in The Escapist's court now. Anonymous sources trash-talking SC is non-news, but actual verifiable current or ex employees? That's a different story. Now, if we're saying this is just Derek Smart, we're implying that he grabbed the names (at least, if not created different email addresses) of current and former employees and provided false information/allegations.

I have no idea who is telling the truth, but I reeeeally hope this is pursued. I mean, if charges are pursued, this could get very interesting for all parties involved.

I think CIG is trying very hard to avoid this at all costs and that's why they try not to interact with Smart. Even Roberts' response today is going to be picked apart by anyone who wants this game to fail, especially Smart. They would have to tie up a ton of money in a legal battle that, even if they did win and Smart was made to pay for the costs associated, he probably couldn't. Money would have to go to a legal team, the case would probably take a ridiculous amount of time and by the time it was over, that's money, time and resources lost that could be going to Star Citizen.

Smart seems like he wants to go to court and be offered a settlement on the terms he leaves CIG alone since they most likely do not want to be involved with this while trying to develop a game of this magnitude.

 

[CyberPunked]

The response post is absolutely disgusting. Not only does it outright ignore the notice saying that they have multiple confirmed sources but it's basically an attack piece on a man the authors claim is not at all involved with their article. How does that make any sense? When you are going out of your way to discredit people by avoiding the issue tying them to gamergate it's clear you've got a lot to hide. Red flags everywhere. Is the article hard hitting. Yes. But they claim to have multiple sources informing them so I guess it boils down to if you believe what they say about their sources. The last person I'd believe is the man who has everything to lose here and who dances around the reported issues with accusations of bias.

"Claim" is used quite strongly there. Nobody has a reason to believe anything they have said. Anyone could claim to have sources. They have no proof.

 

[Sijil]

The response post is absolutely disgusting. Not only does it outright ignore the notice saying that they have multiple confirmed sources but it's basically an attack piece on a man the authors claim is not at all involved with their article. How does that make any sense? When you are going out of your way to discredit people by avoiding the issue tying them to gamergate it's clear you've got a lot to hide. Red flags everywhere. Is the article hard hitting. Yes. But they claim to have multiple sources informing them so I guess it boils down to if you believe what they say about their sources. The last person I'd believe is the man who has everything to lose here and who dances around the reported issues with accusations of bias.

They "Claim" to have much and yet provide nothing, so far this is nothing more than a slander piece that could possible ruin a woman's reputation by calling her a racist bigot. I really hope Sandi sues for defamation.

 

[Par Score]

The Escapist is basically gaming's Breitbart at this point, a collection of right-wing attack dogs masquerading as journalists to lend their hit-pieces and calls to mob-justice some semblance of legitimacy.

Voluntarily acting as a platform to Derek "Fucking" Smart and a cavalcade of GamerGate assholes. Smdh.

 

[tuxfool]

The response post is absolutely disgusting. Not only does it outright ignore the notice saying that they have multiple confirmed sources but it's basically an attack piece on a man the authors claim is not at all involved with their article. How does that make any sense? When you are going out of your way to discredit people by avoiding the issue tying them to gamergate it's clear you've got a lot to hide. Red flags everywhere. Is the article hard hitting. Yes. But they claim to have multiple sources informing them so I guess it boils down to if you believe what they say about their sources. The last person I'd believe is the man who has everything to lose here and who dances around the reported issues with accusations of bias.

Maybe you should read the rest of the thread. The author is indeed a gamergate supporter.

 

[RexNovis]

"Claim" is used quite strongly there. Nobody has a reason to believe anything they have said. Anyone could claim to have sources. They have no proof.

They "Claim" to have much and yet provide nothing, so far this is nothing more than a slander piece that could possible ruin a woman's reputation by calling her a racist bigot. I really hope Sandi sues for defamation.

Call me crazy but I'm just not buying it that they would lie about having multiple sources or about where they got their info. I mean why would they? Is it really so hard to believe that there are things going on behind the scenes in the obviously drawn out development of this game? Regardless of the laughable attempts to discredit the author I'm just not seeing any cause for these allegations of agenda driven falsifications. It's absurd.

Maybe you should read the rest of the thread. The author is indeed a gamergate supporter.

But that has absolutely nothing to do with this. The laughable part are the connections being made in an attempt to discredit the author by means of establishing some crackpot agenda.

 

[tuxfool]

Call me crazy but I'm just not buying it that they would lie about having multiple sources or about where they got their info. I mean why would they? Is it really so hard to believe that there are things going on behind the scenes in the obviously drawn out development of this game? Regardless of the laughable attempts to discredit the author I'm just not seeing any cause for these allegations of agenda driven falsifications. It's absurd.

Yet, they couldn't be bothered with basic journalistic integrity of waiting for his response?

 

[IISANDERII]

I'm glad (not sarcastic).

I was stunned at the survey results though that broke down amount paid vs income bracket of the base. There are some poor folks putting big dollars in this game, I imagine the emotional investment they have is huge.

Reminds me of Crackberry supporters.