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[theSlacker]

I wonder what happened to the Syndicate member that Raubahn replaced.

Been watching all the old story cutscenes and it has made me wounder about a bunch of things. The original city story quests looked amazing writing and story wise. Still had the same problem 11 did, where you were only a side character, but other then that it was filled with a subtlety that all of what I have seen of the new story lacks. But then a bunch of that just disappears with the Grand Company stuff. Get more cliche stuff and it seems to abandon running plot points of the city storylines. No more about joining with the Beast tribes, and how little fighting the Garleans maters with the strength they have. Primals turned from something that would speak to you and let you go free to something that laughs maniacally while killing things.

Is it ever relieved what happened to characters like Corguevais and Travanchet? How about that sickly kid whos name I forget from the Ul'dah storyline? What was the deal with the demon looking thing that randomly appeared and scared the shit out of everyone else?

 

[Xux]

Been watching all the old story cutscenes and it has made me wounder about a bunch of things. The original city story quests looked amazing writing and story wise. Still had the same problem 11 did, where you were only a side character, but other then that it was filled with a subtlety that all of what I have seen of the new story lacks. But then a bunch of that just disappears with the Grand Company stuff. Get more cliche stuff and it seems to abandon running plot points of the city storylines. No more about joining with the Beast tribes, and how little fighting the Garleans maters with the strength they have. Primals turned from something that would speak to you and let you go free to something that laughs maniacally while killing things.

Is it ever relieved what happened to characters like Corguevais and Travanchet? How about that sickly kid whos name I forget from the Ul'dah storyline? What was the deal with the demon looking thing that randomly appeared and scared the shit out of everyone else?

Demon looking thing? Oh yeah, those are the Ascians aka the Masked Men in ARR. I agree about the subtlety, lol.

And no, that's all of the story. I've read that the endings were written and we might get quests to tie them up someday in ARR. I imagine it'd be easy enough to do since probably 80% of the original city stories were flashbacks to 10 years in the past.

 

[theSlacker]

Demon looking thing? Oh yeah, those are the Ascians aka the Masked Men in ARR. I agree about the subtlety, lol.

And no, that's all of the story. I've read that the endings were written and we might get quests to tie them up someday in ARR. I imagine it'd be easy enough to do since probably 80% of the original city stories were flashbacks to 10 years in the past.

So nothing more was said or done with the characters within them? That's kinda depressing. Those city stories were the best I've seen from this game.

And to the Ascians, yeah I thought I remember that from the beta. Didn't they also call themselves the "paragons" basically merging 2 separate mysteries from the original city storylines? Bah.

 

[Xux]

So nothing more was said or done with the characters within them? That's kinda depressing. Those city stories were the best I've seen from this game.

And to the Ascians, yeah I thought I remember that from the beta. Didn't they also call themselves the "paragons" basically merging 2 separate mysteries from the original city storylines? Bah.

Yeah, that's pretty much it. The class quests tied into the city stories a bit, though, if you skipped those. From what I read, the Ascians and Paragons were meant to be the same from the start; they're just different names for the same thing like Primal and Eikon.

I combed the Beta text for the first couple weeks looking for references to the old city stories but they don't seem to be there...hopefully they show up someday. Like, what the heck happened to Fye? Was the Wildling "project" successful? What the heck kind of jerks makes a mystery story and then doesn't finish it?

 

[ZiZ]

So nothing more was said or done with the characters within them? That's kinda depressing. Those city stories were the best I've seen from this game.

And to the Ascians, yeah I thought I remember that from the beta. Didn't they also call themselves the "paragons" basically merging 2 separate mysteries from the original city storylines? Bah.

well the little girl from the ul'dah storyline grows up to be minfillia.

 

[theSlacker]

well the little girl from the ul'dah storyline grows up to be minfillia.

Yeah I read that, but didn't see in a cut scene where that is found out. Must have been in text somewhere.

 

[Ravidrath]

Are we sure that the people in the 2.0 storyline are the actual Ascians and not just their deluded followers?

 

[Xux]

Are we sure that the people in the 2.0 storyline are the actual Ascians and not just their deluded followers?

No, that'd definitely be better than just a lame redesign.

 

[theSlacker]

Yeah, that's pretty much it. The class quests tied into the city stories a bit, though, if you skipped those. From what I read, the Ascians and Paragons were meant to be the same from the start; they're just different names for the same thing like Primal and Eikon.

I combed the Beta text for the first couple weeks looking for references to the old city stories but they don't seem to be there...hopefully they show up someday. Like, what the heck happened to Fye? Was the Wildling "project" successful? What the heck kind of jerks makes a mystery story and then doesn't finish it?

Yeah, I watched those as well. Made me mad for being filled with the same "anyone who is actually making an effort trying to stop bad things from happening is bad or will turn evil because fighting and revenge is wrong" cliche stuff.

Are we sure that the people in the 2.0 storyline are the actual Ascians and not just their deluded followers?

The main mask guy is something since he mentions seeing Bahamut free again. His scene would have been better if he didn't break into a evil laugh though so I can hope he's just some dunce.

 

[Ravidrath]

The main mask guy is something since he mentions seeing Bahamut free again. His scene would have been better if he didn't break into a evil laugh though so I can hope he's just some dunce.

Well, there were two of them at the Battle of Carteneau, right? Watching the generals?

Just because they were there and didn't die doesn't mean they're voidsent villains - they clearly have powerful magic at their command. We survived and so did the generals.

But I think it's feasible that the main guy is an Ascian in disguise and the others are just his idiot henchmen. I mean, I think the one that's captured after the L15 quest would have been ID'ed as non-human if he wasn't human.

I kind of wonder if they're actually the Lambs of Dalamud? They kind of appeared out of nowhere and didn't do much in 1.0, and they've been mentioned in the story / missions since, so I think it would make sense.

 

[theSlacker]

Well, there were two of them at the Battle of Carteneau, right? Watching the generals?

Just because they were there and didn't die doesn't mean they're voidsent villains - they clearly have powerful magic at their command. We survived and so did the generals.

But I think it's feasible that the main guy is an Ascian in disguise and the others are just his idiot henchmen. I mean, I think the one that's captured after the L15 quest would have been ID'ed as non-human if he wasn't human.

I kind of wonder if they're actually the Lambs of Dalamud? They kind of appeared out of nowhere and didn't do much in 1.0, and they've been mentioned in the story / missions since, so I think it would make sense.

Yeah, in that cutscene as he is watching Bahamut rampage he mentions how great it is that he gets to see him again. Implying he was alive before he was imprisoned.

 

[Ravidrath]

Yeah, in that cutscene as he is watching Bahamut rampage he mentions how great it is that he gets to see him again. Implying he was alive before he was imprisoned.

Oh yeah, I forgot that part.

That's a pretty strong implication, yeah. But given all the stuff that's been going on and all the ancient strata that have been unveiled, it also seems possible he could be someone from an ancient civilization dating back to the last cycle, and he's been in stasis all this time. I mean, really, it wouldn't be a Japanese RPG if it didn't have an advanced ancient civilization.

He might also just be better at time jumping than Louisoix? He blips forward through time, setting things in motion, and then blips forward to do the next thing / course correct history.

If it happened to us, it could happen to the bad guys. And weren't we actually in the void for that five years? So maybe he's spent so much time in the void he's been whispered to by the Ascians.

 

[theSlacker]

Oh yeah, I forgot that part.

That's a pretty strong implication, yeah. But given all the stuff that's been going on and all the ancient strata that have been unveiled, it also seems possible he could be someone from an ancient civilization dating back to the last cycle, and he's been in stasis all this time. I mean, really, it wouldn't be a Japanese RPG if it didn't have an advanced ancient civilization.

He might also just be better at time jumping than Louisoix? He blips forward through time, setting things in motion, and then blips forward to do the next thing / course correct history.

If it happened to us, it could happen to the bad guys. And weren't we actually in the void for that five years? So maybe he's spent so much time in the void he's been whispered to by the Ascians.

I really hope that is the case, because I would hate it if the real antagonists where as shallow as to be the "laughing while evil stuff is happening" kind of villain.

 

[ebil]

OT should be up 1 month before the game, but as we going first with a OpenBeta, i think you can make the OT already.

1 month could be tough. That's a bit earlier than August 1st. Ebil and I are still trying to find the best combinations of image and text and I was hoping to try PvP before writing about it. We are trying to put a huge amount of effort into this one. Another thing that is holding me back a bit is a (math...) placement test I have to do for school stuff, which I'll be done with tomorrow. I'm not saying we can't do it, but it wasn't exactly something we planned for. If you don't mind waiting a little longer, I can promise to post it as soon as it is ready instead of waiting until 1 week before official release.

1 month will definitely be tough, but we'll try to post it as soon as it's ready. I didn't know the 1-week rule didn't apply to MMOs, but I guess that'd be a good idea to have it up before Open Beta.

EDIT: The OT will not be 56k friendly

Haha, oh no it won't.

Edit: speaking of GC and avatars, I quickly cropped these from the posters I've made a while ago.

 

[Riposte]

There is a good chance those masked guys (or at least whoever is the main one) are from the Allagan Empire. Probably not Ascians proper.

I do lament how they both dropped the storyline and haven't managed to match it in its subtly or intrigue. There are some mind-blowing revelations about the old storyline to be found in the lore forum. In some ways it feels like we've retrogressed to the level of earlier FFXI main storylines with a stronger "early" FF feel with it (which is arguably another form of retrogression), but with much better production values. Although not terrible, it has really been a bit too on the nose, with little room for depth. Looking how this game handles references and fan-service, I think that is by design. However what goes down after the Ifrit fight is pretty interesting at least. I also liked how they handled "adventurers" during the main quest sequence of dungeons.

I believe Fernehalwes has said he would like to pick up the old storyline again with quests at some point in time.

 

[Taruranto]

I don't know much about the original 1.0. storyline (in fact, I don't know anything about it at all), but I'm glad i can sorta follow the storyline this time, unlike XI.

 

[theSlacker]

There are some mind-blowing revelations about the old storyline to be found in the lore forum.

Mind giving me a little taste, friend?

 

[Ferr986]

I don't know much about the original 1.0. storyline (in fact, I don't know anything about it at all), but I'm glad i can sorta follow the storyline this time, unlike XI.

lol I remember not knowing wtf happened in CoP till I rewatched the scenes and looked though speculation on various forums. Story was really good but too convoluted.

Also, I dont remember very much of the first part of 1.0 storyline but I do remember starting more in line with FFXI CoP and certainly very interesting till the bore of that Path of the Twelve misions (although the last mision was awesome).

 

[Murder. She Wrote]

Thanks ebil

 

[Teknoman]

I'm sure the primals have the same personalities they did in 1.0. Garuda was always nuts.

EDIT: Seeing other npc adventurers having the same personalities and problems as real people you meet in game was pretty cool. Also I doubt the masked men are exactly the same as the Ascian seen before. Unless thats what happens when they go a little too far with dark arts.

 

[ebil]

I'm sure the primals have the same personalities they did in 1.0. Garuda was always nuts.

EDIT: Seeing other npc adventurers having the same personalities and problems as real people you meet in game was pretty cool. Also I doubt the masked men are exactly the same as the Ascian seen before. Unless thats what happens when they go a little too far with dark arts.

You're right, that's just Garuda's personality, she's a bloodthirsty psychopath. I especially liked her introduction on The Lodestone.

Worshipped by the Ixal, this capricious primal commands the winds. A figure equal parts woman and avian, Garuda calls the sky her dominion and the storms her servants.

Ixali teachings portray Garuda as the Empress of Birds. In the age of myth, she slew the malevolent Lord of Snakes, ending his foul attempt to bind the world’s creatures to the earth. It was through this deed that birds might now soar freely amid the clouds. The ferocity of the battle, however, left the victorious Garuda sorely wounded. She feasted on the carcass of the reptilian king to restore her strength, and, with her wounds thus healed, once again took wing. Legends say that Garuda’s bloody banquet, whilst healing her physical form, also left her with a taste for the flesh of land-bound mortals…

Thus for the flightless Ixal who claim kinship with birds, their bloodthirsty guardian deity is a source of both rapture and terror.

By contrast, Titan is supposed to be gentle and compassionate, a father for the Kobold, while Ramuh is portrayed as a wise but merciless arbiter (fitting for a Primal who'll use Judgement Bolt as his signature attack).

 

[Ferr986]

Looking at the CE cover, I wonder if Garuda was more important on the original story

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Looking at the CE cover, I wonder if Garuda was more important on the original story

That's not Garuda.

Forgot who is, some deity I think.

 

[Ferr986]

That's not Garuda.

Forgot who is, some deity I think.

really? nvm them. I though she was Garuda .

 

[Ravidrath]

That's not Garuda.

Forgot who is, some deity I think.

Nophica was the one of the Twelve that gave us the Echo, so I would think that's meant to be her.

 

[theSlacker]

Yeah, I watched those as well. Made me mad for being filled with the same "anyone who is actually making an effort trying to stop bad things from happening is bad or will turn evil because fighting and revenge is wrong" cliche stuff.

Quoting myself here. I watched the "job" cutscenes before when I made that comment, not the class ones. The class ones are very good and hold up to the original city storyline. God damn, the more of this stuff I watch, the more I realize how much quality was lost story wise.

 

[Raxious]

so regarding early access, will 1.0 owners also get it, or is it only accessible by pre-purchasing ARR?

 

[Mastamind]

so regarding early access, will 1.0 owners also get it, or is it only accessible by pre-purchasing ARR?

Preorder 2.0 or 1.0 legacy.

 

[Xux]

Quoting myself here. I watched the "job" cutscenes before when I made that comment, not the class ones. The class ones are very good and hold up to the original city storyline. God damn, the more of this stuff I watch, the more I realize how much quality was lost story wise.

Oh okay, I was ask if you were talking about the job quests.

Here's some Lore posts that people mentioned:

Ferne (localization lead) talks about the intro and a few other points.
Confirms that it's Garuda on the CE box.
Talks about the OG story in 2.0 and confirms Minfilia is Ascilia.

Also, some speculation on Sthalmann (this is pretty much confirmed in the Marauder quests), Ascilia, Khrimm, and Emerick's present day selves as well as possibly being able to effect the past through the Echo which isn't supposed to be possible.

 

[theSlacker]

Oh okay, I was ask if you were talking about the job quests.

Here's some Lore posts that people mentioned:

Ferne (localization lead) talks about the intro and a few other points.
Confirms that it's Garuda on the CE box.
Talks about the OG story in 2.0 and confirms Minfilia is Ascilia.

Also, some speculation on Sthalmann (this is pretty much confirmed in the Marauder quests), Ascilia, Khrimm, and Emerick's present day selves as well as possibly being able to effect the past through the Echo which isn't supposed to be possible.

So tell me. Did they just kick out all the quality writers when they started with the remaking or something? Since there is such a clear change from the old city and class quests to the grand company, job, and now 2.0 story.

I honestly wish I didn't start reading/watching into all this. Seeing the quality that has been lost story wise makes me question my desire to even play the game now.

 

[Allard]

So tell me. Did they just kick out all the quality writers when they started with the remaking or something? Since there is such a clear change from the old city and class quests to the grand company, job, and now 2.0 story.

I honestly wish I didn't start reading/watching into all this. Seeing the quality that has been lost story wise makes me question my desire to even play the game now.

The change is all orchestrated by Yoshida, the writers are all still there, in fact the head of scenario planning is actually the previous director of the game. Much like Yoshida's stance on early part of the game, he didn't like how convoluted the original story was in the early part of the game to the point of confusion (the Echo wind effect and the lack of shadows on the Ascian characters was not even specifically known UNTIL Ferne mentioned it in that lore thread). The whole sequences were really really confusing especially in those first lvl 1-20 quests, they weren't even that exciting either and came way too few and far between.

I honestly think we will regain that subtlty down the line and we might even still have it in the main scenario. The company quests were surprisingly well done by the time game reached its conclusion with Dalamud. Decent Cut scene working and storytelling and battles were as much a part of the story as the cut scenes were (MegaFlare being used by the Garlean general in his fight was a huge foreshadow to the true nature of Dalamud yet it was subtle enough people still didn't guess the true nature of Dalamud till Bahamuts big reveal) they thought it was just simple fan service.

 

[Teknoman]

That does look like Garuda...never noticed that since she seems more loving on the box than a vicious aerial fiend.

 

[devious.one]

The hoove' like feet give it away.

 

[Kintaro]

If that's Garuda, that's a complete different vibe than how she really is. Weird and conflicting.

 

[theSlacker]

If that's Garuda, that's a complete different vibe than how she really is. Weird and conflicting.

It seems more in line with how the starting storyline looked. That the primals and beastmen weren't bad, but the empire was mindfucking people though various means (propaganda, brainwashing kids, and so on) into believing that they were because of fear of their strength. Course I only have the original story second or third hand, and not all the little details. Just cut scenes and forum posts.

 

[ZiZ]

The change is all orchestrated by Yoshida, the writers are all still there, in fact the head of scenario planning is actually the previous director of the game. Much like Yoshida's stance on early part of the game, he didn't like how convoluted the original story was in the early part of the game to the point of confusion (the Echo wind effect and the lack of shadows on the Ascian characters was not even specifically known UNTIL Ferne mentioned it in that lore thread). The whole sequences were really really confusing especially in those first lvl 1-20 quests, they weren't even that exciting either and came way too few and far between.

I honestly think we will regain that subtlty down the line and we might even still have it in the main scenario. The company quests were surprisingly well done by the time game reached its conclusion with Dalamud. Decent Cut scene working and storytelling and battles were as much a part of the story as the cut scenes were (MegaFlare being used by the Garlean general in his fight was a huge foreshadow to the true nature of Dalamud yet it was subtle enough people still didn't guess the true nature of Dalamud till Bahamuts big reveal) they thought it was just simple fan service.

I agree with this wholeheartedly the stories were too complicated, hell I didn't realize I was playing in echoes until I read it on the forums after 1.x shut down. I have high hopes for the high level story content.

 

[theSlacker]

I agree with this wholeheartedly the stories were too complicated, hell I didn't realize I was playing in echoes until I read it on the forums after 1.x shut down. I have high hopes for the high level story content.

Surly that must be better then having an npc tell you "oh yeah, you have the echo, also I have it too, are you surprised?".

Anyway, another thing comes to my mind while watching and reading all these things. I hope the black shroud gets burned to the ground. Not the people in it or anything, just the forest itself along with its elementals.

 

[staticneuron]

Oh okay, I was ask if you were talking about the job quests.

Here's some Lore posts that people mentioned:

Ferne (localization lead) talks about the intro and a few other points.
Confirms that it's Garuda on the CE box.
Talks about the OG story in 2.0 and confirms Minfilia is Ascilia.

Also, some speculation on Sthalmann (this is pretty much confirmed in the Marauder quests), Ascilia, Khrimm, and Emerick's present day selves as well as possibly being able to effect the past through the Echo which isn't supposed to be possible.

Why is it NOT supposed to be possible? I have always begun to think that the Echo was more powerful than just being able to see the past. I honestly imagined there was going to be some time crossing paradox type stuff going down eventually. I Also thought that the cycles of the eras (Umbral vs Astral) will be broken as well.

 

[dwix]

There are some posts on reddit suggesting that the early access begins on August 20th... I'm down for that!

 

[Xux]

Why is it NOT supposed to be possible? I have always begun to think that the Echo was more powerful than just being able to see the past. I honestly imagined there was going to be some time crossing paradox type stuff going down eventually. I Also thought that the cycles of the eras (Umbral vs Astral) will be broken as well.

You just get told in game that the past is set in stone when Minfilia explains it to you when you first went to the Order of the Twelve.

 

[Raxious]

Just pre-ordered my ARR CE, unfortunately chances of me getting early access are slim

 

[ebil]

Just pre-ordered my ARR CE, unfortunately chances of me getting early access are slim

Why would they be slim? Early access is a pre-order perk.

 

[Raxious]

Why would they be slim? Early access is a pre-order perk.

But only at assigned retailers right? Cause the store I ordered it from isn't sure if they will get the early access.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Why is it NOT supposed to be possible? I have always begun to think that the Echo was more powerful than just being able to see the past. I honestly imagined there was going to be some time crossing paradox type stuff going down eventually. I Also thought that the cycles of the eras (Umbral vs Astral) will be broken as well.

The Echo is a power that lets you look inside someone's mind and watch their memories. It's like the Pensieve in the Harry Potter universe. You can't change the past through the Echo because it's just a memory which you are watching.

If there will be time travel in the story I suspect it won't be until they run out of stuff for players to do in the present day, such as what happened with FFXI WotG. That won't happen for a good long time, since you have to fight all the Primals, defeat the Garlean Empire, defeat Bahamut, and also deplete all the oceans around Eorzea of fish first.

 

[theSlacker]

The Echo is a power that lets you look inside someone's mind and watch their memories. It's like the Pensieve in the Harry Potter universe. You can't change the past through the Echo because it's just a memory which you are watching.

If there will be time travel in the story I suspect it won't be until they run out of stuff for players to do in the present day, such as what happened with FFXI WotG. That won't happen for a good long time, since you have to fight all the Primals, defeat the Garlean Empire, defeat Bahamut, and also deplete all the oceans around Eorzea of fish first.

After watching all the cutscenes I'm still unclear about the full extent of the echo. Sometimes you seem to be just a pasanger, just watching what happened. Other times you seem to be playing an active roll in the past though. While other times have characters reacting to you being there when you clearly were not there the first time. Like with the thaumaturge class quests where you see what the Lala actually did, but then she notices you there and chases you down, when before she had no idea that you were following her.

Also did Minfilia have the Echo in the original game? Like I know she does in ARR because she directly straight out tells you as if she is an anime character boasting about her power level. But in the original there was a scene where she couldn't understand the sylphs and needed you to translate, when understanding all languages was part of what the echo gave.

Speaking of that, is that all gone now too? Seems everyone gets to talk to beastmen and moggles now.

 

[Xux]

After watching all the cutscenes I'm still unclear about the full extent of the echo. Sometimes you seem to be just a pasanger, just watching what happened. Other times you seem to be playing an active roll in the past though. While other times have characters reacting to you being there when you clearly were not there the first time. Like with the thaumaturge class quests where you see what the Lala actually did, but then she notices you there and chases you down, when before she had no idea that you were following her.

Also did Minfilia have the Echo in the original game? Like I know she does in ARR because she directly straight out tells you as if she is an anime character boasting about her power level. But in the original there was a scene where she couldn't understand the sylphs and needed you to translate, when understanding all languages was part of what the echo gave.

Speaking of that, is that all gone now too? Seems everyone gets to talk to beastmen and moggles now.

Everyone, including Minfilia, has the memory seeing part of the Echo but the translation part is more limited.

Haha, everyone? It's like three people; Yda and Papalymo are exceptions 'cause they're part of the weird and ageless Circle of Knowing and that frohawk dude I guess just learned through business, has the Echo, or they did the thing where they cut out the translating middle person to keep the pace and story going.

 

[theSlacker]

Everyone, including Minfilia, has the memory seeing part of the Echo but the translation part is more limited.

Haha, everyone? It's like three people; Yda and Papalymo are exceptions 'cause they're part of the weird and ageless Circle of Knowing and that frohawk dude I guess just learned through business, has the Echo, or they did the thing where they cut out the translating middle person to keep the pace and story going.

Well I mean in the beta so far I didn't even realize there was a language barrier. Mogs now handle mail, and no one acts surprised when you are talking to beatmen or what not. Normal towns have dealings with and trade with them as well. So just figured that they removed that part of the story.

 

[Mature]

I managed to get a Beta spot, that I played and fairly enjoyed up until the point I found out the game has a subscription.

Nope.

Here's a good one for the FAQ that will be asked about a million times: "Why isn't this f2P"/"When will this be going F2p?"

Let's see... what else...

• Is the collectors edition sold out?
• Where can I find info on the different classes?
• Do the races have a mechanical difference?
• Have they announced Samurai or Ninja or (insert job) yet?
• Can I play this game solo?
• What server is GAF playing on? What's this about data centers?
• What's the difference between a Free Company and a Link Shell?
• What's the armoury system?
• What's a duty finder?
• What does picking a deity affect?
• Will I have to grind in this game?

 

[Mastamind]

Here's a good one for the FAQ that will be asked about a million times: "Why isn't this f2P"/"When will this be going F2p?"

Let's see... what else...

• Is the collectors edition sold out?
• Where can I find info on the different classes?
• Do the races have a mechanical difference?
• Have they announced Samurai or Ninja or (insert job) yet?
• Can I play this game solo?
• What server is GAF playing on? What's this about data centers?
• What's the difference between a Free Company and a Link Shell?
• What's the armoury system?
• What's a duty finder?
• What does picking a deity affect?
• Will I have to grind in this game?

"I just downloaded the game but the play button is greyed out"

 

[ZiZ]

Everyone, including Minfilia, has the memory seeing part of the Echo but the translation part is more limited.

Haha, everyone? It's like three people; Yda and Papalymo are exceptions 'cause they're part of the weird and ageless Circle of Knowing and that frohawk dude I guess just learned through business, has the Echo, or they did the thing where they cut out the translating middle person to keep the pace and story going.

some beastmen have learned the common tongue. I think the echo is only needed when speaking to beastmen who only speak in their native tongue.