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GAF Running Club |OT| - Couch to Marathons, All abilities

Depending on your age 162 sounds about right. Yes, you need to slow down. I promise it will seem agonizing at first, but you will see results as your PR's start to drop. You will find you can run faster with the same heart rate over time if you train in that zone. If you mix in 1 day of speedwork a week you will accelerate your capability to run faster with a low heart rate. Think of this way. You need to be efficient to run a long race fast without hitting the wall. Running slower gives your body time to incrementally build that efficiency.

If you want a success story I started formally training with this 80/20 concept last August. Before I started my best half marathon PR was a 2'20. By December I hit 1'48"04. Last Sunday I ran a 1'38"04. So in 9 months of this method I dropped ~32 minutes off my half marathon. I promise it works.

Quick question. Has the pace for your easy runs changed since your 2'20 to 1'38'04? I'm getting faster, but not sure if I should keep my easy runs at the 10-11 range or start pushing it a bit as even high 9's are starting to feel like a gingerly jog now thanks to 80/20.
 
Quick question. Has the pace for your easy runs changed since your 2'20 to 1'38'04? I'm getting faster, but not sure if I should keep my easy runs at the 10-11 range or start pushing it a bit as even high 9's are starting to feel like a gingerly jog now thanks to 80/20.

My starting range was 9:50-9:20. As I got fitter I started dropping to 9:15-8:45. One key thing is to make sure your heart strap/Watch is tight on your skin/chest and positioned correctly. That can also screw up the HR measurement.
 

kottila

Member
Yes, for this model, you input age, weight, height during setup, and it will determine max HR from there. Zone 5 starts at around 162bpm,

Not sure exactly what range zone 3 is because I rarely get to it, but I would guess under 145bpm. A pace that would keep my HR this low would be maybe 6:10min/km which is way slower than I normally run. Usually I'm very comfortable at a 5:30-5:45 pace, and can generally breathe ok, and carry on a conversation. But at that pace, my HR is elevated to a zone where I'm not effectively doing aerobic training. So I guess I just have to get better at running slower?

Your max hr is probably much higher, there is no way you watch precisely can determine your max hr with those data. you need to test yourself to get a more accurate number
 

Bluenoser

Member
Depending on your age 162 sounds about right. Yes, you need to slow down. I promise it will seem agonizing at first, but you will see results as your PR's start to drop. You will find you can run faster with the same heart rate over time if you train in that zone. If you mix in 1 day of speedwork a week you will accelerate your capability to run faster with a low heart rate. Think of this way. You need to be efficient to run a long race fast without hitting the wall. Running slower gives your body time to incrementally build that efficiency.

If you want a success story I started formally training with this 80/20 concept last August. Before I started my best half marathon PR was a 2'20. By December I hit 1'48"04. Last Sunday I ran a 1'38"04. So in 9 months of this method I dropped ~32 minutes off my half marathon. I promise it works.

Holy shit that's awesome man. My first half marathon was 1:56 but I bonked pretty hard towards the end, as there were 3 killer hills in the final 5k.

So I just got back from a long, slow, painful run. It was not easy but I did it, and my Garmin is no longer telling me to slow down or I will die :)

Ran 10 miles (16k) in 1:45 (my slowest ever) and had to walk up some hills to keep my HR from elevating too high, but it went well. My average HR for the run was 145bpm. I think I can manage- it just really takes a lot of awareness and concentration.

I thought about the 80/20 but since I hadn't read up on it, I didn't want to implement it willy-nilly. I'll have to do some research first.
 

panda-zebra

Member
Back to stretford parkrun this morning for 5th attempt as my brother faniceid a crack at beating his 5k pb. Looks like a very close match for the "freak" 5k PB I got there around a year ago. Felt easier than that day and didn't really push 100% as there's a hilly half marathon in Keswick tomorrow. Probably find I did push hard and the legs will have a wobble tomorrow! Brother got his PB by a good distance.
 
Decided my make my first long (6 mile) in 88 degree weather with 100% humidity. Suffice to say it sucked! So I slowed down and went to hit my distance goal. Felt good to be back out there running. I have a 10 mile club race next Saturday that I am not planning to race at all. But it will be nice to see my group there.
 
OMG ran through some local open park land with my running team this morning and now paying the price through sneezing. Definitely worth the price for the amazing views though!
 
I feel absolutely gutted, my piriformis injury kept me out of the Seoul half today.

I went for a light run Tuesday and felt good the whole time, and the next day was good, too.

On Thursday I decided to run 3k warm up, 4k at my half pace, followed by a 3k cool down.

3k warm up was ok, but I could feel some slight discomfort after I stopped at traffic lights and picked up speed again.

Then I foolishly well all out on the 4k and felt like I was flying, went way to fast, at about 5k pace.

Once I started to slow down. I did another 200m before having to stop. Pain was worse than when I originally got it.

Still in bad shape today.

Gonna not run until at least the 8th May. Gonna focus on glute stretches and strengthening.

I just feel so gutted because I feel I would have stood a good chance of running today if I just took it completely off. However, I foolishly pushed myself. It didn't help also that I ran on the sme path that I originally got my injury on, I think it is pretty uneven and helped caused the injury.

I bought 80/20 yesterday and I am gonna start using that method when I get back into running. It is gonna be tough, as I hate when I see someone running near me. Always make sure I speed up when someone is in front or closing up behind me.

I did most of my run the last 6 weeks at a high intensity and I am guessing that is what ultimately did me over.

Just gotta hope taking it nice and easy for the next week and focusing on strengthening my problem areas will do me well.
 
I feel absolutely gutted, my piriformis injury kept me out of the Seoul half today.

I went for a light run Tuesday and felt good the whole time, and the next day was good, too.

On Thursday I decided to run 3k warm up, 4k at my half pace, followed by a 3k cool down.

3k warm up was ok, but I could feel some slight discomfort after I stopped at traffic lights and picked up speed again.

Then I foolishly well all out on the 4k and felt like I was flying, went way to fast, at about 5k pace.

Once I started to slow down. I did another 200m before having to stop. Pain was worse than when I originally got it.

Still in bad shape today.

Gonna not run until at least the 8th May. Gonna focus on glute stretches and strengthening.

I just feel so gutted because I feel I would have stood a good chance of running today if I just took it completely off. However, I foolishly pushed myself. It didn't help also that I ran on the sme path that I originally got my injury on, I think it is pretty uneven and helped caused the injury.

I bought 80/20 yesterday and I am gonna start using that method when I get back into running. It is gonna be tough, as I hate when I see someone running near me. Always make sure I speed up when someone is in front or closing up behind me.

I did most of my run the last 6 weeks at a high intensity and I am guessing that is what ultimately did me over.

Just gotta hope taking it nice and easy for the next week and focusing on strengthening my problem areas will do me well.

The bold is why you got hurt as you said. You never gave your body a chance to recover so of course it rebelled against you. :) As the book will tell you, most of your runs should be at a "conversational" pace with no hard breathing. Don't worry, you will be back and running races before you know it! Feel free to post if you need advice. The thread has a lot of runners of different fitness levels/capability to answer.
 
My job shipped me to Philadelphia this week, I was able to attend part of Penn Relay. Fun stuff. The 16 years old Brogan MacDougall won the 5k in front of the college women.

Man,

When I do calf stretches they certainly feel better then next day that when I don't. Citation on that?

Sorry about the blanket statement, it was a quick response to a jest after all. :)

Let's be more specific. I'll only talk about static stretching.

The general idea behind static stretching being bad is that flexibility in general is bad for running economy. The way we run it's better if the muscles provide greater elastic energy return, which is when they are stiffer. Fistwell already covered that, but here are some citations:

The association between flexibility and running economy in sub-elite male distance runners.
Running economy is negatively related to sit-and-reach test performance in international-standard distance runners.

Now, let's go over comme stretching use cases.

Before a run

You're better off doing a warmup or dynamic stretching to activate the muscles. In my opinion, unless you are racing or doing a workout, you simply should warm up by starting your run slowly.

It's been clearly proven bad to static stretch before sprints. I'm pretty sure I read similar stuff regarding longer distance but I cannot find it for now.
The acute effects of static stretching on the sprint performance of collegiate men in the 60- and 100-m dash after a dynamic warm-up.

During a run

Why would you stop to stretch? Keep running.

After a run.


If someone tells you it helps clear lactic acid they're just plain wrong. Your body returns to normal lactic acid levels after an hour or so of rest.

A lot of people swear by static stretching after a run to reduce delayed onset muscle soreness. Studies show it does nothing.
Effects of stretching before and after exercising on muscle soreness and risk of injury: systematic review.

What actually helps is going for a recovery run: running super slow, just to get more blood flow to the muscles. Massages can also help but there is no clear consensus.

Now, everyone is different. If you feel like static streching after a run helps you, by all means do it. Feeling good about running is the most important thing. Unless you're an elite, the miniscule potential running economy loss incurred by stretching is not worth overthinking so much.

Popped along to a physio this morning.... foot is fucked basically. Recons it's a problem with my tendon sheath? No running, at all, for a good while.

I had various issues with tendons on my right foot in the past. What saved my life is doing eccentric heel drops. A LOT of them, like 100x morning and evening, or until I was tired. This helped even when my Achille was not the problem.

I'm not sure if it can helps you more than your prescribed band exercices. Don't give up, not running is the worse.


Congrats man. Take it easy for a while. Take time to recover well and be careful not to come back too fast/too intense.
 

TTOOLL

Member
So, thanks to 80/20 now I know I don't need to push myself every time I go for a run.

I decided to go for 10 mile this morning, my longest distance so far. It was great, I felt good all the way, breathing was easy and regular. I did it in 1:39, so I think I was pretty slow. In the last 2 miles I speed up and felt good too.

I had one problem though, my gear fit 2 stopped tracking at around the 6 miles mark, I was really frustrated. Luckily I had decided to take my cellphone with me today and I was using the Nike app too. I could have lost my longest run data, I wanted to throw the fit 2 in the trash can, I don't know what happened. Time to get a Garmin I think, but they are very expensive.
 
My job shipped me to Philadelphia this week, I was able to attend part of Penn Relay. Fun stuff. The 16 years old Brogan MacDougall won the 5k in front of the college women.



Sorry about the blanket statement, it was a quick response to a jest after all. :)

Let's be more specific. I'll only talk about static stretching.

The general idea behind static stretching being bad is that flexibility in general is bad for running economy. The way we run it's better if the muscles provide greater elastic energy return, which is when they are stiffer. Fistwell already covered that, but here are some citations:

The association between flexibility and running economy in sub-elite male distance runners.
Running economy is negatively related to sit-and-reach test performance in international-standard distance runners.

Now, let's go over comme stretching use cases.

Before a run

You're better off doing a warmup or dynamic stretching to activate the muscles. In my opinion, unless you are racing or doing a workout, you simply should warm up by starting your run slowly.

It's been clearly proven bad to static stretch before sprints. I'm pretty sure I read similar stuff regarding longer distance but I cannot find it for now.
The acute effects of static stretching on the sprint performance of collegiate men in the 60- and 100-m dash after a dynamic warm-up.

During a run

Why would you stop to stretch? Keep running.

After a run.


If someone tells you it helps clear lactic acid they're just plain wrong. Your body returns to normal lactic acid levels after an hour or so of rest.

A lot of people swear by static stretching after a run to reduce delayed onset muscle soreness. Studies show it does nothing.
Effects of stretching before and after exercising on muscle soreness and risk of injury: systematic review.

What actually helps is going for a recovery run: running super slow, just to get more blood flow to the muscles. Massages can also help but there is no clear consensus.

Now, everyone is different. If you feel like static streching after a run helps you, by all means do it. Feeling good about running is the most important thing. Unless you're an elite, the miniscule potential running economy loss incurred by stretching is not worth overthinking so much.



I had various issues with tendons on my right foot in the past. What saved my life is doing eccentric heel drops. A LOT of them, like 100x morning and evening, or until I was tired. This helped even when my Achille was not the problem.

I'm not sure if it can helps you more than your prescribed band exercices. Don't give up, not running is the worse.



Congrats man. Take it easy for a while. Take time to recover well and be careful not to come back too fast/too intense.

If you would have said static stretching before a run is bad I would have agreed with you! I only dynamic stretch/do a warmup jog before longs runs. Static stretching is for after the run.
 

panda-zebra

Member
Ran the hilly half pretty hard today, had two fellow club members both set off at a good pace to work with early on in the hilly part. I wouldn't have gone out so hard that early but I felt I needed to stick with them, one is an ultra runner and the other a hill/fell runner. Dropped places on the ups (taking is steadier) and got them back on the flying downhills. Fun stuff! Hills gone I went OK through the more undulating and pleasant bits with some good runners. So many more ran it this year than last, but improved time & position coming 22nd out of 600 and under 1:30 with 1300ft of climb. 2nd V40. Beyond pleased! </annoyingbitofabragpost>

Best bit the picnic afterwards. Cake, pizza, coke, cake, quiche, cake, etc. All the stuff I never touch, but a few boiled spuds to redress the balance.

Let's be more specific. I'll only talk about static stretching.

Great post, lots to read up on in there, love it when people take the time to share their knowledge - thanks!
 

Paganmoon

Member
Had a good run yesterday (well, 2 runs, 5k path, very hilly, short rest and then 2.5k), felt great after. Did the same 5k today, and I'm feeling sort of ill, now 2 hours later, I'm getting "shitty sleep tonight" vibes.

Any good tips for winding down after runs or workouts?
 
Had a good run yesterday (well, 2 runs, 5k path, very hilly, short rest and then 2.5k), felt great after. Did the same 5k today, and I'm feeling sort of ill, now 2 hours later, I'm getting "shitty sleep tonight" vibes.

Any good tips for winding down after runs or workouts?

Sounds like hydration or nutrition issues, that's a common cause of feeling lethargic of nauseous after exertion.

If you're sure that you're drinking enough, try to get more protein or carbohydrates in and see if it helps with mood / well-being. Avoid too much sugar / salt / cafeine.
 

Paganmoon

Member
Sounds like hydration or nutrition issues, that's a common cause of feeling lethargic of nauseous after exertion.

If you're sure that you're drinking enough, try to get more protein or carbohydrates in and see if it helps with mood / well-being. Avoid too much sugar / salt / cafeine.

Thanks for the tips.
Been trying to keep hydrated throughout the day. Did just eat a bowl of Müsli so if it's food, I hope it settles soon.

Maybe I need to rethink this training twice in a day (did gym-workout in the morning).

How do you guys handle restlessness at night, after hard workouts/runs?
 

BearPawB

Banned
Recently lost around ~40 lbs. Haven't run in a couple years because, well I was fat, and it hurt my knees.

Decided instead of driving to the gym I would run around my neighborhood

Still fat, just less so (6'4" 225 now). Knees didn't feel great, but I didn't stop, and it's hot as hell outside. But progress nonetheless!

Gonna try to make it a once a week thing and see how it progresses
 
Recently lost around ~40 lbs. Haven't run in a couple years because, well I was fat, and it hurt my knees.

Decided instead of driving to the gym I would run around my neighborhood

Still fat, just less so (6'4" 225 now). Knees didn't feel great, but I didn't stop, and it's hot as hell outside. But progress nonetheless!

Gonna try to make it a once a week thing and see how it progresses

Welcome to the club! Keep us posted.
 

Cyan

Banned
I'm definitely interested in the question of stretching. Though running economy doesn't really interest me at all, I want to know if it helps avoid injury. I've always done a light bit of warming up (a couple minutes of jumping jacks, running in place, etc to get the blood flowing) followed by stretching prior to a run, and then stretching again afterwards. Given I'm pretty injury-prone, I'd love to know if there's something else I should be doing.
 

sixghost

Member
I bought a pair of Saucony's from a local running store about a year ago, and the inside part of the shoe where my heel sits has a hole that's worn down all the way to the plastic part underneath. I get a blister almost every time I run more than 5k in them now. Would it be worth a shot to contact Saucony's customer service to ask for a replacement or something? Even though it's been a year, I have only run maybe 300 miles in the shoes. They're in great shape otherwise, and I love running in them, but for $130 I'd expect them to last longer than that. It's also only in one of the shoes.

Is there some way to fix this? The picture below isn't my shoe, but that's what it looks like.

back-of-heel-shoe.jpg
 
I bought a pair of Saucony's from a local running store about a year ago, and the inside part of the shoe where my heel sits has a hole that's worn down all the way to the plastic part underneath. I get a blister almost every time I run more than 5k in them now. Would it be worth a shot to contact Saucony's customer service to ask for a replacement or something? Even though it's been a year, I have only run maybe 300 miles in the shoes. They're in great shape otherwise, and I love running in them, but for $130 I'd expect them to last longer than that. It's also only in one of the shoes.

Is there some way to fix this? The picture below isn't my shoe, but that's what it looks like.

back-of-heel-shoe.jpg

How many miles have you run in these? To be honest, you should think of running shoes as something organic that starts to break down once you use them. Shoes can wear out from age, distance, or a combination of the two.



I also wanted to thank everyone for participating in the thread the past few months. We have been surprisingly started becoming more active. For anyone lurking please feel to drop a question and/or join our Strava group!
 
I'm definitely interested in the question of stretching. Though running economy doesn't really interest me at all, I want to know if it helps avoid injury. I've always done a light bit of warming up (a couple minutes of jumping jacks, running in place, etc to get the blood flowing) followed by stretching prior to a run, and then stretching again afterwards. Given I'm pretty injury-prone, I'd love to know if there's something else I should be doing.

Gotta hit them weights! I personally started a STR training program a few months ago and it's been helping me alongside 80/20 running and my other recovery tools like stretching, foam rolling and massage.
 

combine42

Neo Member
Recently lost around ~40 lbs. Haven't run in a couple years because, well I was fat, and it hurt my knees.

Decided instead of driving to the gym I would run around my neighborhood

Still fat, just less so (6'4" 225 now). Knees didn't feel great, but I didn't stop, and it's hot as hell outside. But progress nonetheless!

Gonna try to make it a once a week thing and see how it progresses

Since its been awhile it will be painful on your joints until you get used to it again. Stick with it and listen to those knees
 
Trying to keep on a running schedule while working a full time job, while trying to do everything else I want without being a sleepy mess is kinda hard huh?

A little late, but I normally take a bit of preworkout after work to get me woken up and motivated to go run. I just do a quarter to a half dosage because if I do too much it makes me feel a little shaky.
 

panda-zebra

Member
my first Marathon on Monday in Milton Keynes

Well done on the marathon! Very close to target time. Looks like by 20 miles you were well on target - it's those last 6 miles where the real race begins (and these are the miles I feel some training programs don't give you any idea about or prepare you for, physically, mentally and fuel-wise).

You should be proud you stuck to that plan so well and practically got your time bang on! Result!
 

Bluenoser

Member
I'm definitely interested in the question of stretching. Though running economy doesn't really interest me at all, I want to know if it helps avoid injury. I've always done a light bit of warming up (a couple minutes of jumping jacks, running in place, etc to get the blood flowing) followed by stretching prior to a run, and then stretching again afterwards. Given I'm pretty injury-prone, I'd love to know if there's something else I should be doing.

Dynamic stretching seems to be the way to go prior to running. Lots of stretching but don't hold it, instead do reps. Also flexibility movements for hips, etc are helpful. I tend to get tight calf muscles so I'll do some quick calf raises to get the blood flowing before I go. And of course a light warmup helps too.
 
I had a disappointing Half-Marathon yesterday where I was comfortably running with the 1:30 pacer till about Mile 7 then it was like a switch was flicked and all my energy vanished. Checked my time at mile 10 (would have needed a 20 minute 5k) and clocked out and cruised to the end in 1:33. Annoying as I'd done 1:31 a couple of weeks ago where I deliberately slowed down during it because of some knee pain so I thought I would be able to do it yesterday.
 

Fistwell

Member
I had a disappointing Half-Marathon yesterday where I was comfortably running with the 1:30 pacer till about Mile 7 then it was like a switch was flicked and all my energy vanished. Checked my time at mile 10 (would have needed a 20 minute 5k) and clocked out and cruised to the end in 1:33. Annoying as I'd done 1:31 a couple of weeks ago where I deliberately slowed down during it because of some knee pain so I thought I would be able to do it yesterday.
We all have bad days. I'd say don't let it get to you, but I've been there and I know it''s frustrating. (Even running low on energy you ran close to your objective. Congrats on a very decent time.)
 

panda-zebra

Member
I had a disappointing Half-Marathon yesterday where I was comfortably running with the 1:30 pacer till about Mile 7 then it was like a switch was flicked and all my energy vanished. Checked my time at mile 10 (would have needed a 20 minute 5k) and clocked out and cruised to the end in 1:33. Annoying as I'd done 1:31 a couple of weeks ago where I deliberately slowed down during it because of some knee pain so I thought I would be able to do it yesterday.

Pisser :/ Hackney Half? If so, might be flat but it zig-zags all over the place, that can make it hard to get into any kind of rhythm.
 
We all have bad days. I'd say don't let it get to you, but I've been there and I know it''s frustrating. (Even running low on energy you ran close to your objective. Congrats on a very decent time.)
Thanks :)
Pisser :/ Hackney Half? If so, might be flat but it zig-zags all over the place, that can make it hard to get into any kind of rhythm.

That's the one! It was during one of those zig-zag areas I noticed the pacer drifting away from me actually.

I wish I could blame it on a bad knee or tough course but my body just wasn't doing it. It is funny though while I'm 90% disappointing I'm 10% excited to focus on certain things in my training to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Also funny little anecdote from that race, at one of the water stations I grabbed a bottle and seconds later before I'd had a sip a fellow runner tapped me on the shoulder and asked if he could drink some water, I passed him the bottle, he drank some then threw the almost full bottle away and carried on. I guess he assumed I'd done with it or something but it meant I didn't have any more water for a couple of miles which I didn't plan for. It was more funny than frustrating though.
 
Well my trusty Jaybird X2's bit the dust today on my 30min Easy Run. Thankfully they should qualify under American express' extended warranty program. Looks like the X3's are a very good upgrade so I'm about to go grab a pair.
 

anx10us

Banned
Well done on the marathon! Very close to target time. Looks like by 20 miles you were well on target - it's those last 6 miles where the real race begins (and these are the miles I feel some training programs don't give you any idea about or prepare you for, physically, mentally and fuel-wise).

You should be proud you stuck to that plan so well and practically got your time bang on! Result!

Thanks chip time was 4:01:29, according to Garmin I ran 26.5, 26.2 was under 4 hours ...

Anyway, it went wrong at 21 miles, significant horrible cramp, in 16 weeks training I have never has cramp at all, this was horrible, took forever to walk off, man aged the final mile at a "reasonable" pace.

Already thinking about another in October, now the next question is, how do I train and prepare for the final 6 miles ? Do I actually increase the long run distances in my training plan ? Do 22 or even 23 miles as my longest runs ?
 

Entropia

No One Remembers
I bought a pair of Saucony's from a local running store about a year ago, and the inside part of the shoe where my heel sits has a hole that's worn down all the way to the plastic part underneath. I get a blister almost every time I run more than 5k in them now. Would it be worth a shot to contact Saucony's customer service to ask for a replacement or something? Even though it's been a year, I have only run maybe 300 miles in the shoes. They're in great shape otherwise, and I love running in them, but for $130 I'd expect them to last longer than that. It's also only in one of the shoes.

Is there some way to fix this? The picture below isn't my shoe, but that's what it looks like.

back-of-heel-shoe.jpg

I have no answer for your question, but I've had this problem too with a pair of Asics I bought last year. :( Was pretty disappointed how quickly it happened to me as well.
 
Well I may officially join the "2 a day" club today. Just did my first official bicycle commute into work today. I then plan on doing a run later in the evening. I think this is the best time in the season to do this as my next goal race (checkpoint really) isn't until September. I will say I had the biggest smile on my face after I showered and sat at my desk.
 
I bought a pair of Saucony's from a local running store about a year ago, and the inside part of the shoe where my heel sits has a hole that's worn down all the way to the plastic part underneath. I get a blister almost every time I run more than 5k in them now. Would it be worth a shot to contact Saucony's customer service to ask for a replacement or something? Even though it's been a year, I have only run maybe 300 miles in the shoes. They're in great shape otherwise, and I love running in them, but for $130 I'd expect them to last longer than that. It's also only in one of the shoes.

Is there some way to fix this? The picture below isn't my shoe, but that's what it looks like.

back-of-heel-shoe.jpg

These holes come from too much heel movement in each stride so either your shoe isn't fitted right or the laces are too loose. The best solution is to discuss the problem with an expert at the running store, because you'll probably need to do some searching for a shoe that doesn't cause this problem.

Short-term solution is to look for technical running socks with a reinforced heel - the thicker layer might be just enough to prevent your foot from sliding up and down over thousands of turnovers. You can always take the shoes to a cobbler and have a small rubber layer sewn in there (or if you're cheap, try some gaffer tape - it'll come off after a few runs but it won't bother you during training.)

Anyway, just be happy the hole is in your shoe rather than a nasty blister on the back of your foot. Get it sorted though - stuff like this burns poor running form into your muscle memory.
 

Lorcain

Member
I did the Northface Endurance Challenge in DC this past Sunday. It was my 4th time doing their half-marathon. The weather was great, and remained below 75 with cloud cover for most of the run from Great Falls Park to Algonkian Park. The trails had some muddy spots, but were a lot less muddy than last year.

No matter how I train, this run always wears me out. The hills are a good quad and hamstring burn, even just power walking up them. There's a final set of hills right before the transition to Algonkian Park that do a great job of sucking the energy out of me before the easier crushed gravel section. I'm legitimately out of gas when I cross the finish.

My legs felt pretty good, but I did get some calf spasms around mile 11 that forced me to get off the trail and stretch against a tree.

Every year I like to try out a different trail shoe for this run. This past Sunday I wore the New Balance Vazee Summit. Not surprisingly, the lighter, less built up shoe worked really well for me. It had great traction, felt light and responsive, and had just enough cushion to feel good for 13.1. No blisters or hot spots. I had good control over roots and rocks, which I don't always feel with a more built up trail shoe.

If you haven't tried a Northface EC event, I highly recommend them, especially if you enjoy trail running. Over the past few years they've added new venues and more distances going from 5K to 50K. They're always well run and supported. You don't have to be a trail running stud to enjoy the runs. While I think the overall field is pretty damn fast for a run like this, there are plenty of mortals out there running too, like me.
 

Menthuss

Member
Just came back from the physical therapist. She thinks I don't have any serious damage to my knees as she didn't trigger any sort of painful response while massaging my knees.

I got the recommendation to look into getting my insoles replaced as they're pretty worn at this point. She also suggested I look for a knee brace (Anyone have any recommendations?).
 
Just came back from the physical therapist. She thinks I don't have any serious damage to my knees as she didn't trigger any sort of painful response while massaging my knees.

I got the recommendation to look into getting my insoles replaced as they're pretty worn at this point. She also suggested I look for a knee brace (Anyone have any recommendations?).

Were you using the same insoles that came with your shoes? If so that's probably a sign you need new shoes.
 

Salamando

Member
Just checked the forecast for Sunday's Half...rainy and cold (~40F). The realist in me is thinking "that's the exact opposite of what you trained in. That's 'I'm gonna hit the treadmill' weather". The optimist is thinking "Well at least they won't see how bad you're sweating".

Any suggestions on a running jacket to help with the rain (cold?)? Hopefully something that isn't too expensive, or is usable for more than just running (style-wise).

This should be fun. Depending on the hour I flip between "Fuck that" and "Go anyway, ain't like you were aiming for a record"
 
Just checked the forecast for Sunday's Half...rainy and cold (~40F). The realist in me is thinking "that's the exact opposite of what you trained in. That's 'I'm gonna hit the treadmill' weather". The optimist is thinking "Well at least they won't see how bad you're sweating".

Any suggestions on a running jacket to help with the rain (cold?)? Hopefully something that isn't too expensive, or is usable for more than just running (style-wise).

This should be fun. Depending on the hour I flip between "Fuck that" and "Go anyway, ain't like you were aiming for a record"

Bah it's never good to try something new on during the day of the race. You won't really know how the article will fit or rub in bad ways until you have a chance to try it out on a long run. Obviously being a few days away from the race doesn't really allow for that. :) One safe thing you could have tried is nike's running pullovers. My sister bought me this one for Christmas and it served me well last winter when it was milder.

http://store.nike.com/us/en_us/pd/d...sleeve-running-top/pid-10294032/pgid-11184971

But since it's going to be wet that's a little different. Last thing you would want is to get sick after being wet in the cold. For rainy days I use this rain jacket:

https://www.rei.com/product/893303/...lUvy1jZAMXKi2jmVstPONO1ayARTdgjb2JxoCadnw_wcB

It's incredibly lightweight and breathes. It won't keep you perfectly dry but you wont cook either between bouts of no rain. So I think if I were you I would look into some long sleeve + lightweight rain coat combination. Hopefully some other people in the thread can give you advice as well.
 

Salamando

Member
Bah it's never good to try something new on during the day of the race. You won't really know how the article will fit or rub in bad ways until you have a chance to try it out on a long run. Obviously being a few days away from the race doesn't really allow for that. :)

Yeah, I'm well aware of how non-ideal this is. But I have the choice of trying to deal with it or dropping out entirely. As it's my first Half and I already planned on taking it easier than I'm capable of, I think I can deal with the non-ideal.
 
Yeah, I'm well aware of how non-ideal this is. But I have the choice of trying to deal with it or dropping out entirely. As it's my first Half and I already planned on taking it easier than I'm capable of, I think I can deal with the non-ideal.

No no I know. That's why I made some suggestions based off what I have done in the past. :) If you have a local REI I would check the clearance sections or the REI brand for some sort of thin rain jacket. Then I would just use some light pullover if you have one in your closet.
 

Lorcain

Member
Yeah, I'm well aware of how non-ideal this is. But I have the choice of trying to deal with it or dropping out entirely. As it's my first Half and I already planned on taking it easier than I'm capable of, I think I can deal with the non-ideal.
For cold weather half-marathons I try and endure being uncomfortable just prior to the start of the race, and wear something lighter than I would want. By the 2nd or 3rd mile I'm always thankful that I did. You'll see other runners around mile 5+ start tying their jackets around their waists because they're now too hot. I've never felt good running in jackets, so I usually go with a long sleeve running shirt instead, which I can just push up the sleeves when I get warm.

If it's raining, don't forget to apply some Body Glide (or something similar) to your chafe spots, especially if you're going to be out there for 2+ hours.
 

sixghost

Member
These holes come from too much heel movement in each stride so either your shoe isn't fitted right or the laces are too loose. The best solution is to discuss the problem with an expert at the running store, because you'll probably need to do some searching for a shoe that doesn't cause this problem.

Short-term solution is to look for technical running socks with a reinforced heel - the thicker layer might be just enough to prevent your foot from sliding up and down over thousands of turnovers. You can always take the shoes to a cobbler and have a small rubber layer sewn in there (or if you're cheap, try some gaffer tape - it'll come off after a few runs but it won't bother you during training.)

Anyway, just be happy the hole is in your shoe rather than a nasty blister on the back of your foot. Get it sorted though - stuff like this burns poor running form into your muscle memory.

Thanks for the advice.
 
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