Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
Don't give them any ideas
Sorry for the dp, my dumb phone cant handle the internet
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#GAMERGATE: The Threadening [Read the OP] -- #StopGamerGate2014
- Thread starter besada
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Sorry for the dp, my dumb phone cant handle the internet
Neoriceisgood
Member
Right, redacted that.
jim-jam bongs
Member
If gamergate has achieved anything, it's that we can all now be confident that stupidity does not discriminate. Milo bless you, #gamergate.
Neoriceisgood
Member
Wow, I feel like I just got introduced to the modern version of obnoxious 1337-sp34k or something.
Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
Imagine how I felt after people started using "kek"
VibratingDonkey
Member
lel is the new kek.
I learned this from a group of F1 fans who appear to be spectacularly stupid children or possibly stupid robots, obsessed with Alan Sugar who communicate by spamming each other's accounts with incomprehensible nonsense messages and on occasion say they're gonna rape someone's wife in front of their mother. Because that's the world we live in apparently? Scroling through the timelines of these accounts is like stepping into a parallel dystopian future universe from the 80's that time traveled into the future. I don't know what the fuck is happening. Don't shiv, spud. lel cri banter pls what
Anyway...
Lalalandia
Member
Apparently some GG folks think that Jack Thompson is worth digging up again because of course he would agree with 'anti-GG' and thus deliver a crippling blow to the 'anti-GG movement'. Seriously what?
http://secretgamergirl.tumblr.com/post/99278805850/the-longterm-plans-of-gamergate
http://secretgamergirl.tumblr.com/post/99278805850/the-longterm-plans-of-gamergate
Is it me, or is this now bizarrely starting to resemble the plot of Killzone: Shadowfall? A highly destructive weapon that's potentially dangerous to both sides being unearthed in the name of 'good'?
More_Badass
Member
Fuck, that's the last thing we need. I forgot who said, but damn it, he was right: GamerGate really is setting the industry back 15 years
Neoriceisgood
Member
Is GG about literally doing everything they claim the opposition of doing and then going "SEE? SEE?" or something?
"To show you're as bad as Jack Thompson we got Jack Thompson involved again! Checkmate."
Where is Jack Thompson mentioned in that? I mean, my brain is probably blanking out half the crap I'm reading in that image for my sanity but I can't see any reference to him.
Lalalandia
Member
Nope it's one of the images she culled from there, here's a direct photobucket link
http://s36.photobucket.com/user/secretgamergirl/media/bring-back-jack_zps976e2600.png.html
Also why being nice is apparently fruitless, after all 'there's a war going on'
http://s36.photobucket.com/user/secretgamergirl/media/gg-future-plans_zpsb516e4b0.png.html
Dr_LucienSanchez
Banned
Wow! What real heroes! Good luck with that whole internet martyrdom thing, guys. Now you can go brag about being banned and how this website is evil.
Anyway, it was pretty clear that boogie had lost it yesterday. Not really surprised by the permanent ban, as so much of what he posted here was questionable (especially when contrasted to his activity elsewhere). In addition to the fact that he kept stating that gaffers were calling him a monster and insulting him, which as far as I'm aware never happened, the ban makes sense.
I really thought that the whole GG thing was dying down though, and it's a shame that it's seemingly gaining momentum again. So now we're left with people getting disillusioned and driven out of the industry, and the fact that we can't talk about any real issues without being inundated with GG bullshit. Just wonderful.
Neoriceisgood
Member
Considering the way he interpreted some of my replies to him I'm fairly certain that in the midst of his anxiety he mentally misconstrued any criticism to mean the worst thing possible.
All of it was just generally sad, really.
Jim Sterling
Member
Had a brief morning glance over my Twitter mentions this morning and quickly closed them down again. Also had to clear a bunch of comments on my YouTube channel containing some delightfully insulting suggestions. Days later, people are still rampantly furious that their movement is being called out for containing arseholes, and they feel the best way to counter that is to ... be arseholes.
This movement, which regularly claims to be "hurt" by the notion that the stereotypical gamer identity is going away in the public eye, dismisses the abuse poured onto anybody else, cares more about telling people to be quiet rather than highlight the insults they're getting because it makes them look bad, or otherwise actively engages in abuse. This is my personal experience with it, and I fail to understand why anybody thinks I owe the movement niceties and the benefit of the doubt anymore.
Twitter's become an absolute fucking shit-circus.
This movement, which regularly claims to be "hurt" by the notion that the stereotypical gamer identity is going away in the public eye, dismisses the abuse poured onto anybody else, cares more about telling people to be quiet rather than highlight the insults they're getting because it makes them look bad, or otherwise actively engages in abuse. This is my personal experience with it, and I fail to understand why anybody thinks I owe the movement niceties and the benefit of the doubt anymore.
Twitter's become an absolute fucking shit-circus.
It always has been. Twitter IMO has always been one of the worst "big things" ever one the internet.
Edit - Just my opinion, your Twitter experience may vary
More_Badass
Member
Depends on who you follow. I only really follow game devs and friends, so I've been pretty insulated from those kinds of comments. I didn't even know about GamerGate till mid/late-September. Now I'm following Zoe and Anita so yeah, I'm definitely seeing more of the "shit circus" side of Twitter
Neoriceisgood
Member
Twitter's fine as long as you don't become the target of a harassment campaign, something made incredibly easy for people due to how easily #GG is aimed at specific people.
Out of curiosity, when exactly was the movement given the benefit of the doubt from you? Was it at the initial creation of the tag by an anti-feminist right wing actor to harass Zoe Quinn? Later, when it became a vehicle to harass Anita? Or was it when they were applauding the doxxing of Phil Fish?
EDIT: That comes off as a bit harsh, but I just can't wrap my head around people waxing on about the good old days of Gamergate "before it became toxic".
I had a partial meltdown on Twitter last night because one of my friends went on an extended rant about how Zoe Quinn is supposedly a terrible person who bullies everyone she doesn't like and has a secret cabal of worldwide mad deadly gangster police. I suggested that he save the character assassination until after this whole thing had blown over but he was pretty determined to keep the shitstorm going. The most baffling part is that he's still really critical of GG and treats this more as a personal vendetta.
On the plus side, it was reassuring to learn that my friends won't instantly disown me for calling them on GG shit or, on the other side of things, disown me for NOT disowning my few GG-type friends.
tl;dr I know that feel, Jim.
On the plus side, it was reassuring to learn that my friends won't instantly disown me for calling them on GG shit or, on the other side of things, disown me for NOT disowning my few GG-type friends.
tl;dr I know that feel, Jim.
More_Badass
Member
And he was...serious? What the hell? How do people come to such inane conclusions?
Intheflorsh
Banned
Hey now, not everyone followed the movement closely from the beginning. If you weren't paying attention, there was a day or two when #gg seemed like a legitimate thing.
Thanks, so that's where it is. Lmao they actually unironically think people would pay attention to anything Jack Thompson says at this point.
Jim Sterling
Member
I said I don't know why THEY feel I should give them the benefit of the doubt anymore. There's a reason I've very adamantly stated that I will not throw my lot in with GG since this all began, and there's a reason the wingnuts in that group have been declaring me a "traitor" for the past six weeks, because I wouldn't march in line with them.
These people. Truly the ones deserving rational discourse and acknowledgment of their obviously legitimate issues.
theirsbailiff
Neo Member
Hi. Been lurking around and reading this thread for a while.
Reading up on the whole gamergate thing has made me exceptionally angry about the idiocy of pro-gg types. How can a group of people claim their "movement" is about ethics and corruption in games journalism when it's been clearly shown that not only has that been not the case, but it's been shown time and time again that it's been about harassing and verbally abusing "enemies" of gaming and being a wretched hive of right wing paranoia?
Reading up on the whole gamergate thing has made me exceptionally angry about the idiocy of pro-gg types. How can a group of people claim their "movement" is about ethics and corruption in games journalism when it's been clearly shown that not only has that been not the case, but it's been shown time and time again that it's been about harassing and verbally abusing "enemies" of gaming and being a wretched hive of right wing paranoia?
The "worldwide mad deadly gangster police" is a shout-out to the similarly paranoid rants of Francis E. Dec. The actual term my friend used was "secret clique," though he might as well have used the former since he was implying that she could ruin anyone's career in a heartbeat and had a history of doing so.
Shit was pretty gross.
Shit was pretty gross.
Neoriceisgood
Member
His thoughts on ethics are summarized in his piece Roger's Little Rule Book.
On having friends in the industry:
Ebert also had clear boundaries on freebies and what you shouldn't do with review copies, but also considered there to be an exception for critics who aren't making a living from it. On freebies:
On review copies:
Maybe there are some people within GG that honestly are only concerned about ethics and corruption in games journalism? I dunno, just my two cents, I've admittedly not payed too much attention to the whole thing.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Its a weird kind of dissonance. I mean, on paper it makes sense that you would throw your lot in with a movement concerned with ethics in the industry since your whole thing, especially Jimquisition, is pointing out unethical activity. So why isn't Jim Sterling part of our movement!?!
Because they're disillusioned bigots incapable of empathy who live in epistemically closed-off bubbles with little to no understanding of other human beings.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
This fact alone reinforced my already cemented opinion that GG is not about what it claims to be about. I haven't the time or energy to keep up with everything going on in the gaming community but I feel what I have seen from you was very much critical of the waning integrity within the entire industry. If they've aligned themselves against that then how can they even begin to make the claim that they're all about journalistic integrity.
Baron_Calamity
Member
I'm quickly learning that. I have no followers beyond a few people I know in real life. I posted a link to an anti #GG news article mostly because someone I knew wanted to know some details on the harassment. The link included the #gamersgate tag. Because of that Tag I guess, within 40 minutes I was getting messages stating they would find women I knew and shove rusty knives into their private parts. I'm not even sure if it was a real person or some bot that is spamming twitter. Either way, pretty crummy experience.
As for the topic in general. I've gotten to the point that I don't care if corruption exists. If every review is bought and paid for with cash, drugs, or sex, its not worth the gamersgate reaction. It just doesn't solve anything. Partly its because I'm pro feminist and pro diversity. Partly because I don't believe reviews alter my purchases in anyway. At least not any more than official advertising. Of course others believe differently and I respect that
GG definitely has some otherwise decent people who've been convinced that they're actually fighting corruption and an anti-gamer agenda in the media. Those are the ones who might change their mind if presented with the right evidence and a persuasive argument.
I'd liken them to Christians who believe they're being persecuted by Obama's evil secular humanist regime because that's what their pastor told them; some are reachable and sincerely misled, but others are true believers unfortunately.
It's about ethics and corruption! #notallgamergaters
Seriously, I'm so sorry to hear that. Twitter really needs to do something about this. Not tomorrow, but NOW.
Jim Sterling
Member
What truly got me were the accusations that I was a "coward" who was "too afraid" to criticize games media - that thing I've been criticizing for years, long before this new bandwagon. The accusation that I was afraid to lose my job, even though my site's general manager's sympathies for GG are quite well known, and it should be obvious I had *nothing* to fear, job-wise, from championing their movement. One would think that would tip folks off to the fact that I might, shock horror, actually be saying what I fucking believe when I say I don't think GG is the way to achieve anything, and that Leigh Alexander is a good writer.
The funny thing was, I think most people in the public eye have been afraid on some level, but not of bloody games journalists. All the while I was getting insults and attempts at intimidation from pro-GG people, I was being told I was too afraid to face the insults and intimidation from the games media. The games media that has, incidentally, never insulted or threatened me. Despite going to bat for customers for years, I'm now an enemy who has done nothing but *shit* all over customers for years. I betrayed them, you see, because I said I wanted to be a consumer advocate on my terms, not theirs.
Hell, because I won't abandon the label of consumer advocate, a few of them are even trying to undermine the notion of consumer advocacy now. You will surrender it to them, or they will burn it. Again, this has been my personal experience.
Hi there,
Twitter isn't big in my country, so I feel this whole thing is very US/UK centric, but I always think it's funny when internet "celebrities" are whining about it. The internet is, was and will be full of trolls and assholes. Only because twitter works for you as long as you can speak to your fans and don't get any negative feedback, doesn't mean you are entitled to not get feedback. And feedback on the internet always includes assholes that, in reality are only a few, but unfortunately are the loudest.
So you have two choices. Stop using twitter or continue using it but use it as it is and don't act as if you have a right to talk to your minions without them having a chance to reply. Block assholes, make your twitter private or whatever function twitter offers, but stop complaining. All of you developers/YT personalities/gaming "journalists" or whatever. There is no right not to be offended. If you can't handle it, don't use it. You know what I did after I was sick of seeing baby photos and company ads all the time on Facebook? I fucking quit using facebook. I mean what do you really need twitter for other than screaming out your latest opinion to your followers? Do something good for yourself, quit using this shit.
This whole ordeal, including this whole feminsm debate, is so funny for a non-american you have no idea. It's the year 2014 damnit, you make me feel like it's the 60s all over again.
Twitter isn't big in my country, so I feel this whole thing is very US/UK centric, but I always think it's funny when internet "celebrities" are whining about it. The internet is, was and will be full of trolls and assholes. Only because twitter works for you as long as you can speak to your fans and don't get any negative feedback, doesn't mean you are entitled to not get feedback. And feedback on the internet always includes assholes that, in reality are only a few, but unfortunately are the loudest.
So you have two choices. Stop using twitter or continue using it but use it as it is and don't act as if you have a right to talk to your minions without them having a chance to reply. Block assholes, make your twitter private or whatever function twitter offers, but stop complaining. All of you developers/YT personalities/gaming "journalists" or whatever. There is no right not to be offended. If you can't handle it, don't use it. You know what I did after I was sick of seeing baby photos and company ads all the time on Facebook? I fucking quit using facebook. I mean what do you really need twitter for other than screaming out your latest opinion to your followers? Do something good for yourself, quit using this shit.
This whole ordeal, including this whole feminsm debate, is so funny for a non-american you have no idea. It's the year 2014 damnit, you make me feel like it's the 60s all over again.
Wow, huge props to her. That is one of the most heartening things I've read in all of this mess.
Jim Sterling
Member
Yeah, many of us HAVE had to stop using Twitter to interact with fans. Sadly, however, it wasn't our fans that stopped us using it. I am actually far less stressed out now that I've disabled Twitter replies, but at the same time, it's my audience that cannot interact with me now, because of people who are not my audience.
But you're right, being unable to interface with my own community anymore because of the mountains of shit drowning my audience members out is nowhere near as bad as a picture of a baby on Facebook.
Mixed in with the weird obvious targeting of women unfairly is quite a bit of your typical illusory superiority chest thumping that comes along with just about any "conspiracy theory" and the proponents of said theory.
I see correlations between Gamer Gate and how 9/11 truthers act for instance. Wild accusations.. claims of "proof" that aren't proof.. refusal to listen.. emotions on a hair trigger.. and some sort of scapegoat they are trying to pin blame on.
"I KNOW the truth and you DONT!" being the illusiary superiority aspect.. you can tell some people are "caught up" in being a part of a movement of what they perceive as greater truth and knowledge.
The one's not focusing on Zoe or are maybe really really against harassment but "for the movement" remind me of anti-GOP truthers.. whereas the ones focusing their ire on Zoe and seeming to enjoy the harassment remind me of anti-semetic 9/11 truthers.
I see correlations between Gamer Gate and how 9/11 truthers act for instance. Wild accusations.. claims of "proof" that aren't proof.. refusal to listen.. emotions on a hair trigger.. and some sort of scapegoat they are trying to pin blame on.
"I KNOW the truth and you DONT!" being the illusiary superiority aspect.. you can tell some people are "caught up" in being a part of a movement of what they perceive as greater truth and knowledge.
The one's not focusing on Zoe or are maybe really really against harassment but "for the movement" remind me of anti-GOP truthers.. whereas the ones focusing their ire on Zoe and seeming to enjoy the harassment remind me of anti-semetic 9/11 truthers.
Neoriceisgood
Member
This is the most uninformed post I've read for a while! Good job, that's not an easy thing to accomplish.
For a lot of people twitter is a fairly significant communication and networking platform that has significant benefit, utility & sometimes borderline mandatory functions. It's perfectly possible to block people on it yes, but not if they initate a harassment campaign.
Every single thing you just said about twitter applies exactly the same to nearly every email service or social media.
Oh what's that? People spam your email with death threats and graphic images? Well that's your fault for using your email thinking it'd be only to your benefit. It's inane victim-blaming logic.
I understand the analogy you're trying to make, but I think comparing harsh tweets to baby pics might have been a misfire. But I do agree with your general idea (at least how I interpreted it) - not everyone belongs on Twitter and shouldn't have direct access to the masses. Cant stand heat, get out of kitchen. Internet has always been full of assholes, etc. That still doesn't justify people being assholes, though.
What did Boogie say exactly to get banned? I watched his post-ban video and he seemed to be pretty reasonable there and had, what I thought, was a pretty balanced view on the whole thing.
Instead of generalizing everyone on one side of the debate and attacking them, people should focus on making the community better for everyone, while attacking the few individuals who are actually causing harm.
When we take the extreme crazy posts on some obscure Tumblr blog, and paint all feminists that way. Or take some incredibly offensive twitter remarks from some random person and paint all gamers that way.. well that just adds fuel to the fire on both sides. Everyone moves into defensive mode, and it incites more of them to go on the attack.
Instead of generalizing everyone on one side of the debate and attacking them, people should focus on making the community better for everyone, while attacking the few individuals who are actually causing harm.
When we take the extreme crazy posts on some obscure Tumblr blog, and paint all feminists that way. Or take some incredibly offensive twitter remarks from some random person and paint all gamers that way.. well that just adds fuel to the fire on both sides. Everyone moves into defensive mode, and it incites more of them to go on the attack.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
This is purely my own speculation but I believe he requested a temp ban for himself so that he could get some sleep. Again, purely my own guesswork.
Edit: My assumption was incorrect.
Neoriceisgood
Member
He essentially had an emotional breakdown that heavily affected the quality of his posts.
Incorrect, he got permabanned for various reasons. Mostly his defensive and (honestly) troubling attitude when speaking on GG.
I'm wondering, is it demonstrably true through its actions and figureheads that #Gamergate is unavoidably a branch of Men's Rights Activism? I sort of feel like it is. Gamergate, for all of its varied voices and demands, ceases to be Gamergate if you remove the MRA-ey parts right? It's far too large a portion of the mass.
What I'm getting at is, if we put aside all extremism and any accusations of persons being explicit shitheads and assume we're only addressing the well-intended moderate-to-upset/concerned Gamergate folk, do any of them deny that the hashtag is inescapably linked to MRA (without any pejorative extremist implications, just as a political leaning)? I want to think not, but I'm sort of doubtful. Are they largely all aware of this? Or, conversely, is the MRA link just an unspoken obvious thing? I don't see it get pointed out to them too often. And I don't mean in an accusatory fashion, just as a sort of clarification, to make sure they're aware of it.
What I'm getting at is, if we put aside all extremism and any accusations of persons being explicit shitheads and assume we're only addressing the well-intended moderate-to-upset/concerned Gamergate folk, do any of them deny that the hashtag is inescapably linked to MRA (without any pejorative extremist implications, just as a political leaning)? I want to think not, but I'm sort of doubtful. Are they largely all aware of this? Or, conversely, is the MRA link just an unspoken obvious thing? I don't see it get pointed out to them too often. And I don't mean in an accusatory fashion, just as a sort of clarification, to make sure they're aware of it.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Ah, I see. Must have missed that. I pretty much digested the entire thing this morning and it's quite a large bite to chew.
Edit: On a semi-related note (?) Are permabans actually permanent around here? I'm still a new poster and all. Though I agree much of what he said was troubling I still feel he's a good guy that will come around and have something of value to submit in the future.
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