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[The Mad Draklor]

It's really shocking how there is such a difference between gaming journalists and gaming YouTubers.

 

[Denton]

This whole thing should serve as a wake up call for quite a few people.

What saddens me though is seeing some devs, e.g. at Arkane, defending Price and smearing O'Brien/gamers.

It will be very interesting to see where Price ends up. My guesses are:
Arkane
Bioware
Waypoint
Polygon
Kotaku
RPS

If I ran a gamedev studio, I wouldn't touch her with a ten foot pole. But I might hire Peter Fries, because he wasn't a toxic asshole, he was just being well meaning but misguided.

 

[Kadayi]

That last comment slays me, "Don't explain things to women".

It's so weirdly sexist in its own way it beggars belief as if women are some sort of other species that are simply incapable of handling explanations of things and need to be protected from them, lest such things warp their fragile little minds in some fashion......

 

[Denton]

That last comment slays me, "Don't explain things to women".

It honestly reads sarcastic to me, but with resetera you never know.

 

[ickythingz]

The Resetera Topic is already lit

What gets you banned and what doesn't:

Holy shit..... those ban reasons............

 

[nakedeyes]

Man. I have been one of the few that has decided to put the ResetEra vs. NeoGaf bullshit to the side and just roll with GAF since its been my home for years.

But holy shit you guys. This thread is ridiculous. You guys need to relax a little. Even if you believe that she did something wrong and should have been fired, you can do a bit better than just sitting here crying about SJWs and Liberal leaning Games Journo outlets.

I actually agree that she should have not been so aggressive with her customer. I disagree with the firing, but I understand why they did it too ( and some scolding at least probably would have been appropriate ). Sitting here bitching ( in a SUPER embarrassing way for you guys, I might add ) about someone who just disagrees with you is pretty immature and not very entertaining.

 

[lifa-cobex]

Nobody was fired because of "Twitter mobs". People were fired for poor customer relations and insulting known members of the community while making baseless accusations of sexism and misogyny.

Also keeping in mind what she was stating after the passing of totalbiscuit whilst representing the company.

If anything, I'll bet money that was a huge crux in her being sacked.

 

[Lupingosei]

TL;DR version with their mindset...

You cannot engage in public discourse with a woman if you identify as a man, otherwise, you are dominant, attacking, and using your patriarchy over her, no matter how polite and tactful you are being.

Even if she is in a position of power on a hierarchy chart above you. Untouchable, unaccountable, and infallible to any wrong doings on their part.

You can start an interaction and I will try to explain it from their perspective.

First:
As already mentioned, he invaded her private Twitter. So he must ask for permission to interact. If she says no or does not answer, that is the end.

Second:
She is the expert. She is not interested in his suggestions, because she already thought of it herself. He, however, can ask a question and she as the expert can explain to him, why he was wrong. So he has the chance to learn something.

Third:
At this point, he still has no right to an answer. If she does not feel like it, again it would be the end of the conversation.

Forth:
He has to be mindful of the context. Every woman in the game industry is getting harassed all the time. He has to accept that and adapt his behavior and his language accordingly.

Fifth:
If she thinks his question is answered, that is also the end of the conversation. Adding another question is only possible if she allows that. Are asks him if he has understood everything.

Within this boundaries, a conversation is possible as long as Deroir is always mindful of his position and the general context of the situation. And because he was ignorant about all of this, in their mind he was the offender. I know this is all a bit much, but according to their ideology, it is the task of Derior to inform himself and if he fails, Jessica Price has every right to expose him.

 

[Cosmogony]

Man.
But holy shit you guys. This thread is ridiculous.

The whole of it?

You guys need to relax a little. Even if you believe that she did something wrong and should have been fired, you can do a bit better than just sitting here crying about SJWs and Liberal leaning Games Journo outlets.

What would one do on a gaming forum beside posting?

I actually agree that she should have not been so aggressive with her customer. I disagree with the firing, but I understand why they did it too ( and some scolding at least probably would have been appropriate ).

So the thread is ridiculous but you're somewhat aligned with what seems to be the prevalent sentiment. I see.

Sitting here bitching ( in a SUPER embarrassing way for you guys, I might add )

Will people's self-esteem ever recover from your blanket unexemplified assessment?

about someone who just disagrees with you is pretty immature and not very entertaining.

Oh, I see now. When she goes on Twitter to say the things she has said and in the way she has said them, there doesn't seem to be a problem. When some people do the exact same thing on a gaming forum, albeit not as vitriolically, then it turns into collective embarrassment.

You not giving examples makes it difficult to dismantle what appears to be your point, but I suppose such vagueness is strategic.

 

[SNIKT!]

Just got banned on ResetEra for the following post "This site is biased as hell. People in here free to insinuate Deroir is an alt-right, sexist, mansplainer. And painting Price as the victim. Thoroughly disappointing." I was greeted with this message: "You have been banned for the following reason: User Banned (Duration Pending): Trolling + Pushing false narratives."
Ridiculous.

 

[DeepEnigma]

You can start an interaction and I will try to explain it from their perspective.

First:
As already mentioned, he invaded her private Twitter. So he must ask for permission to interact. If she says no or does not answer, that is the end.

Second:
She is the expert. She is not interested in his suggestions, because she already thought of it herself. He, however, can ask a question and she as the expert can explain to him, why he was wrong. So he has the chance to learn something.

Third:
At this point, he still has no right to an answer. If she does not feel like it, again it would be the end of the conversation.

Forth:
He has to be mindful of the context. Every woman in the game industry is getting harassed all the time. He has to accept that and adapt his behavior and his language accordingly.

Fifth:
If she thinks his question is answered, that is also the end of the conversation. Adding another question is only possible if she allows that. Are asks him if he has understood everything.

Within this boundaries, a conversation is possible as long as Deroir is always mindful of his position and the general context of the situation. And because he was ignorant about all of this, in their mind he was the offender. I know this is all a bit much, but according to their ideology, it is the task of Derior to inform himself and if he fails, Jessica Price has every right to expose him.

Ah yes, my mistake. He should have known his peasantry.

 

[Cosmogony]

I am going to respond as though you actually endorsed the points below.

First:
As already mentioned, he invaded her private Twitter. So he must ask for permission to interact. If she says no or does not answer, that is the end.

That's not the nature of Twitter.

Second:
She is the expert. She is not interested in his suggestions, because she already thought of it herself. He, however, can ask a question and she as the expert can explain to him, why he was wrong. So he has the chance to learn something.

Her being the self-proclaimed expert does not preclude other people who she knows from Adam from being equally if not more knowledgeable than her.

Third:
At this point, he still has no right to an answer. If she does not feel like it, again it would be the end of the conversation.

He has the right to Tweet her. Others have the right to Tweet her as well. She has the right to ignore whomever she wishes. Others have the right to comment on her omissions, her Tweets, her attitude, her writing.

Forth:
He has to be mindful of the context. Every woman in the game industry is getting harassed all the time. He has to accept that and adapt his behavior and his language accordingly.

I do not accepot that's the context. That is your unsubstantiated assertion. If that were the context, the wisest thing to do would still be to read the Tweet itself and reply to the Tweet itself, especially when it was worded in the most courteous manner possible.

Fifth:
If she thinks his question is answered, that is also the end of the conversation. Adding another question is only possible if she allows that. Are asks him if he has understood everything.

No, not at all. If she thinks that is the end of it she can definitely say and act on ti and he can definitely seek to change her mind and keep the conversation going. That's what happens between free respectful adults.

 

[Lupingosei]

I am going to respond as though you actually endorsed the points below.

That's not the nature of Twitter.

You might think that, but it is not for them. Twitter is a private space for them, where you can only give feedback if you are invited. To understand everything you have to remind, that she and Fries explained all of them over and over again, that she did not ask for feedback. Fries deleted a few of his Tweets but he also insisted, that this was her private Twitter and that Deroir is not allowed to give feedback until asked. Why do you think they use blockbots so often. Pewdiepie was blocked by her even though he never interacted with her. Comic artists with the same mindset block people only because they follow persons they don't like.

I know this is hard to understand, but just a reminder. Teebaging is an assault for them. For Price and a lot of people in the gaming press, Derior was invading her privacy and giving unwanted feedback so her reaction was legitimate.

 

[Xaero Gravity]

Just got banned on ResetEra for the following post "This site is biased as hell. People in here free to insinuate Deroir is an alt-right, sexist, mansplainer. And painting Price as the victim. Thoroughly disappointing." I was greeted with this message: "You have been banned for the following reason: User Banned (Duration Pending): Trolling + Pushing false narratives."
Ridiculous.

Welcome to the club lol. Mine went from "duration pending" to "permanent". It's no big deal though, this whole series of events has been incredibly eye opening for me, and I didn't see myself going back after seeing just how biased the mods are over there.

 

[stufte]

The skewed narrative around this in the gaming press is incredible.

 

[ipukespiders]

Man. I have been one of the few that has decided to put the ResetEra vs. NeoGaf bullshit to the side and just roll with GAF since its been my home for years.

But holy shit you guys. This thread is ridiculous. You guys need to relax a little. Even if you believe that she did something wrong and should have been fired, you can do a bit better than just sitting here crying about SJWs and Liberal leaning Games Journo outlets.

I actually agree that she should have not been so aggressive with her customer. I disagree with the firing, but I understand why they did it too ( and some scolding at least probably would have been appropriate ). Sitting here bitching ( in a SUPER embarrassing way for you guys, I might add ) about someone who just disagrees with you is pretty immature and not very entertaining.

Do you know what "shits" and "giggles" are?
I think that better describes most of our participation than your description of "crying" and "bitching".

 

[Windom Earle]

Gamez Journalism in 2018 OMEGALUL

I like how some people pretend that "there is a lot to unpack here". It's really not. Someone acted completely unprofessionally on Twitter and got fired. That's it.

 

[Redneckerz]

Should do a little of crossposting regarding this.

As for my own opinion on the Arenanet firing: Twitter is not a private place, its public. So what you say can and will be criticized and commented. This user who commented on Price's long twitter convo (Which was a decent talk, i am not going to lie) did so in equally decent phrasings. For Price to retalitate in such stark ways is immature and not done. And i am only judging her based on that, not based on her history, which i did look up by the way. The other employee defending her (And stating that Twitter is a private thing) in my eyes has a very strange perception of what Twitter is. Its not a private talk, you know. I can read it, you can read it, we all can read it - That is not the definition of private, but it is the definition of public.

Or just go there for the comedy of it.

And check in with this thread. The hilarity is provided daily.

Its almost like a company at this stage.

They're not too bright.

When any member of The Names and their Little Helpers moderates/posts based on emotion and feelings rather than making an attempt to be objective, neutral, empathic or understanding, then bright is not one of the things that comes to my mind. And that's coming from someone who definitely sees some great things that ERA can and has accomplished.

As an aside, it's a bit sad to see every hot topic thread on GAF these days turn into a "let's look how Era is discussing the issue" discussion. It's eerily similar to that forum that started up years ago made up of banned GAF members who spent their time talking about how shitty GAF is and using dumb slurs like "NeoFAG."

Not taking it personally obviously, and not attempting to appear as cocky and know-it-all but i try to provide some nuance and geniune criticism towards certain ERA posts in the thread. I am not very much fond of that mindset that you describe either, hence why i didn't post in this until now.

But in regards to this Arenanet firing even Pewdiepie (Who you will hardly ever see get mentioned in a positive way on ERA) explains this better (Starts at 10.14) and in simple manners:

First of all, provide your receipts of what you are saying over there, because the no "party line" is the biggest disingenuous fallacy about that place

I decided to search the hashtag on Twitter and noticed this has been in a lot of the banned people's responses...

https://resetera.kiwifarms.net/

I guess somebody made a bot that tracks the mod bans and the reasons for banning (they ban a ton of people a day, wow), and you only need to look at the first dozen to see exactly where that place predominantly leans, and it used to be a bane for this place prior for quite some time.

Look at some of those bans, and you can't tell us that there is no party line or group think they want over there, lol.

There is very little room for actual discussion when it comes to politics, it's just nothing but pile ons and back patting. The mods actually put disclaimers with bullet list of what you're allowed to talk about and not talk about within thread OPs controlling the narrative right off the bat, lol.

Oh good lord you guys are way behind on the times. I should better just throw in some go-to links to get you speed up (Only if you have the time, ofcourse!)
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253323238
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/neog...ject-off-topic-edition.1463407/post-253328678
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253330465
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253334802
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253335675

Disclaimer: This is only provided outside of this thread for informative purposes to get people up to speed. As with everything else, nuance, knowledge and research are more important than a quick driveby comment talking on how shit ERA is. ERA has good aspects.

Lmao that "bark, bark, bark" person is for sure the one that reported me.

Just take a look in the other thread, she is clearly just baiting the heck out of people and like you said there, just posting in bad faith. That whole thread is nothing more than a herding thread at this stage. Your change to permanent ''after review'' is a recent addition to their toolbox. They just ban with a week ban and then change it midway to a perm, so that at the moment users see you have a week ban, and a few hours later (When none notice anymore) they change it to a perm silently. Its snake levels of moderation, and not ''transparent'' whatsoever.

I googled the story behind that bot, and oh they are very aware. They filed a copyright claim against the person in hopes that would shut it down due to the URL was too similar, so he had to change it up. Now it's back and supposedly they are going to add even more features to the data it extracts.

The question is more who filed that complaint - Seeing the LLC you would think its Cerium. But i don't think Cerium is very much aware of what The Names and their Little Helpers are doing with his place...

Because he invaded Jessica Price’s private twitter space, he pressured his opinion on her (she did not ask for feedback) and as a man he had power over her, so she was in every aspect the victim.

The problem already starts here. Twitter isn't private. Its public. All this ''mansplaining/ideology/microaggression/its about gender'' stuff, the stuff that comes after this observation, is just wholly irrelevant. Its not GG, its not alt-right, its not Internet Grinches with an axe to grind, the simple story is that Price treated her public Twitter as a private space. That is her problem, because the basis of Twitter is not being a private space, but a public one. So, the way she acted upon it, and then tried to frame it as one of the things i just mentioned, its just patently untrue and just arguing in bad faith (insultively, even).

I appreciate your explanation from her POV though. Its some interesting insight as to how she arrived at this kind of thing.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Oh good lord you guys are way behind on the times. I should better just throw in some go-to links to get you speed up (Only if you have the time, ofcourse!)
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253323238
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/neog...ject-off-topic-edition.1463407/post-253328678
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253330465
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253334802
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/off-...rsonal-keep-it-in-here.1462647/post-253335675

I actually just discovered that thread a few hours ago with your coverage, kudos on that!

I knew about the banbot and Kiwifarms post on it for about 3 weeks now, from investigating on Twitter and the like with the unrest that has been going on as I noticed ban levels shoot through the roof compared to the months prior.

 

[Chiggs]

Gamez Journalism in 2018 OMEGALUL

I actually miss the days of sycophantic losers kissing every developer's ass they could find (1980 - 2007?). What we're seeing now is some sort of awkward push by *some* video game journalists to apply several coats of paint to their field, in a tragically misguided attempt to make it something that it's really not, or rush it forward to a place in time it's clearly not ready for (and we're talking caliber of talent here).

You can almost group this nonsense in with the desperate/pathetic need for *some* developers and fans to have their view that "games are art, goddamn you!" be repeatedly validated and confirmed by every organism on the planet. Fine, it's art...and you're the greatest thing ever.

 

[Ogbert]

What we're seeing now is some sort of awkward push by *some* video game journalists to apply several coats of paint to their field, in a tragically misguided attempt to make it something that it's really not, or rush it forward to a place in time it's clearly not ready for (and we're talking caliber of talent here).

There's a lot to be said for that.

As you say, for decades, video game journalism was nothing but public relations and a rather fun, cheerful pastime. Console wars are now considered infra dig (why is that by the way? what is the point of writing about and discussing a media form if you're not allowed to bicker over the greatest exponents of that medium? What we actually need is *more* console wars to replace the political gibberish).

Watching these 'journalists' attempt to wrestle with social issue is like watching Inspector Clouseau attempting to infiltrate an ambassador's party with a wig and a fake moustache. Video games just aren't worth the effort. It's not a medium that is capable of nuance, so therefore the opinions around it are equally incapable of reflecting any nuance.

We take trivial things seriously, and serious things trivially.

 

[Chiggs]

There's a lot to be said for that.

As you say, for decades, video game journalism was nothing but public relations and a rather fun, cheerful pastime. Console wars are now considered infra dig (why is that by the way? what is the point of writing about and discussing a media form if you're not allowed to bicker over the greatest exponents of that medium? What we actually need is *more* console wars to replace the political gibberish).

Watching these 'journalists' attempt to wrestle with social issue is like watching Inspector Clouseau attempting to infiltrate an ambassador's party with a wig and a fake moustache. Video games just aren't worth the effort. It's not a medium that is capable of nuance, so therefore the opinions around it are equally incapable of reflecting any nuance.

We take trivial things seriously, and serious things trivially.

Spot on. Love it.

 

[GhostOfTsu]

Thank you Lupingosei for the summary of this mental illness.

How did Fries get infected so much? At first I thought he wanted to get in her pants but he was actually this male feminist ranting about mansplaining and safe space.

It seems like the cancer spread from oldGAF into gaming journalism now. Their spin on this story is unbelievable.

 

[DeepEnigma]

There's a lot to be said for that.

As you say, for decades, video game journalism was nothing but public relations and a rather fun, cheerful pastime. Console wars are now considered infra dig (why is that by the way? what is the point of writing about and discussing a media form if you're not allowed to bicker over the greatest exponents of that medium? What we actually need is *more* console wars to replace the political gibberish).

Watching these 'journalists' attempt to wrestle with social issue is like watching Inspector Clouseau attempting to infiltrate an ambassador's party with a wig and a fake moustache. Video games just aren't worth the effort. It's not a medium that is capable of nuance, so therefore the opinions around it are equally incapable of reflecting any nuance.

We take trivial things seriously, and serious things trivially.

Well said!

 

[neverknowsbest]

You can start an interaction and I will try to explain it from their perspective.

First:
As already mentioned, he invaded her private Twitter. So he must ask for permission to interact. If she says no or does not answer, that is the end.

Second:
She is the expert. She is not interested in his suggestions, because she already thought of it herself. He, however, can ask a question and she as the expert can explain to him, why he was wrong. So he has the chance to learn something.

Third:
At this point, he still has no right to an answer. If she does not feel like it, again it would be the end of the conversation.

Forth:
He has to be mindful of the context. Every woman in the game industry is getting harassed all the time. He has to accept that and adapt his behavior and his language accordingly.

Fifth:
If she thinks his question is answered, that is also the end of the conversation. Adding another question is only possible if she allows that. Are asks him if he has understood everything.

Within this boundaries, a conversation is possible as long as Deroir is always mindful of his position and the general context of the situation. And because he was ignorant about all of this, in their mind he was the offender. I know this is all a bit much, but according to their ideology, it is the task of Derior to inform himself and if he fails, Jessica Price has every right to expose him.

The thing is, even in the context of this mindset, what she did was wrong. If she thought that he invaded her private twitter, the best response would have been to ban/ignore the tweets. Why would she engage with someone who she has already dismissed as meaningless? If she believed that this was her private twitter, and that she was an expert so far beyond lay capabilities that she didn't need to engage with them, then the only reason she could have for responding to him is to belittle him and draw sympathy to herself.

As for your fourth point, he was exceedingly respectful in his tweet, and used language to place himself below her, and used language to emphasize that what he was saying was a lay opinion in an expert's domain.

That's what really blows my mind about her response. She was in control of the entire situation the entire time. He was replying to her twitter, he was respectful, he wasn't being aggressive or trolling, and she still flew off the handle. That's just unacceptable behavior.

 

[Fuz]

The Resetera Topic is already lit

What gets you banned and what doesn't:

Fucking fascists.

 

[Lupingosei]

The thing is, even in the context of this mindset, what she did was wrong. If she thought that he invaded her private twitter, the best response would have been to ban/ignore the tweets. Why would she engage with someone who she has already dismissed as meaningless? If she believed that this was her private twitter, and that she was an expert so far beyond lay capabilities that she didn't need to engage with them, then the only reason she could have for responding to him is to belittle him and draw sympathy to herself.

As for your fourth point, he was exceedingly respectful in his tweet, and used language to place himself below her, and used language to emphasize that what he was saying was a lay opinion in an expert's domain.

That's what really blows my mind about her response. She was in control of the entire situation the entire time. He was replying to her twitter, he was respectful, he wasn't being aggressive or trolling, and she still flew off the handle. That's just unacceptable behavior.

No, in her mind she was right. I understand you don't get this idea of "we have to expose every wrongdoing". But this is part of their ideology, exposing misbehavior. You have women patrolling college campuses reporting on micro-aggressions and people are getting warned and have to visit sensitivity training to learn, what they did wrong. Within her group, there is no doubt, that she was right to point out how he was wrong and to show the world how terrible men like him are and that they don' even get it, why they are so ignorant. This is also why there is this rift between people who share her ideology and people who don't.

If you look at ResetEra you will find this need to expose in so many aspects. Because as Anita Sarkasian has said it, everything is sexist, everything is racist and you have to point it all out. And yes, having a conversation is quite difficult at that point because you always imply that the other person is arguing in bad faith all the time. That is why you have so many people insisting that Derior had this masterplan to get rid of her and his respectful tone was just an act.

 

[Hendrick's]

Man. I have been one of the few that has decided to put the ResetEra vs. NeoGaf bullshit to the side and just roll with GAF since its been my home for years.

But holy shit you guys. This thread is ridiculous. You guys need to relax a little. Even if you believe that she did something wrong and should have been fired, you can do a bit better than just sitting here crying about SJWs and Liberal leaning Games Journo outlets.

I actually agree that she should have not been so aggressive with her customer. I disagree with the firing, but I understand why they did it too ( and some scolding at least probably would have been appropriate ). Sitting here bitching ( in a SUPER embarrassing way for you guys, I might add ) about someone who just disagrees with you is pretty immature and not very entertaining.

You must have taken a wrong turn, the toilet is that way. These insane "progressives" need to be called out, not because of the crazy shit they believe, but because of the way they viciously and harmfully attack everyone who think differently than them.

Just got banned on ResetEra for the following post "This site is biased as hell. People in here free to insinuate Deroir is an alt-right, sexist, mansplainer. And painting Price as the victim. Thoroughly disappointing." I was greeted with this message: "You have been banned for the following reason: User Banned (Duration Pending): Trolling + Pushing false narratives."
Ridiculous.

Welcome back, it's much more sane here!

 

[Ballthyrm]

The notion of a "private twitter" must be one of the biggest oxymoron out there.

ie: how to blame the gasoline for burning after you throw the match.

 

[autoduelist]

You might think that, but it is not for them. Twitter is a private space for them, where you can only give feedback if you are invited. To understand everything you have to remind, that she and Fries explained all of them over and over again, that she did not ask for feedback. Fries deleted a few of his Tweets but he also insisted, that this was her private Twitter and that Deroir is not allowed to give feedback until asked. Why do you think they use blockbots so often. Pewdiepie was blocked by her even though he never interacted with her. Comic artists with the same mindset block people only because they follow persons they don't like.

I know this is hard to understand, but just a reminder. Teebaging is an assault for them. For Price and a lot of people in the gaming press, Derior was invading her privacy and giving unwanted feedback so her reaction was legitimate.

Thanks for your several posts. It helps me get a slightly better handle on what the supposed infractions are. Or, perhaps better put, it lets me know that I absolutely and fundamentally disagree with pretty much all of it.

See, I don't think there needs to be a long multi bullet pointed list of rules, a flowchart of allowable conversation that must be adhered to else you are a villain.

At its core, the only two things you can do regarding a conversation is engage or retreat. This is true whether you are talking to friend, a hero, or a brute. This is true whether we're talking about lovers whispers or drunken screaming matches. In other words, there are no rules. You can only control yourself, not the other person. Believing you can control the other person is a worse sin than anything they can say to you.

Now of course, we can categorize. And so we can talk about what the criteria are for various types of conversation. It's my firm belief we can reduce any socially expected rules set for strangers discussing a technical subject down to something very very basic. Only two words are needed, and those two words are "civil discourse". I don't even think that needs explanation. It's self-evident. And under those two words only one of the individuals in this ridiculous Opera failed to meet the criteria of civil discourse as soon as, if not before, using phrases like rando asshats.

do any of the individuals need to restrict themselves to civil discourse? No. These are the criteria for defining conversation, not a rule set. Anyone is free to be a rando asshat, and many people do so. However, there are potential ramifications for engaging in uncivil discourse. if you are an employee, you risk being fired. In layman's terms, the easiest way to break your nose is to open your mouth.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Thanks for your several posts. It helps me get a slightly better handle on what the supposed infractions are. Or, perhaps better put, it lets me know that I absolutely and fundamentally disagree with pretty much all of it.

See, I don't think there needs to be a long multi bullet pointed list of rules, a flowchart of allowable conversation that must be adhered to else you are a villain.

At its core, the only two things you can do regarding the conversation is engage or retreat. This is true whether you are talking to friend, a hero, or a brute. This is true whether we're talking about lovers whispers or drunken screaming matches. In other words, there are no rules. You can only control yourself, not the other person. Believing you can control the other person is a worse sin than anything they can say to you.

Now of course, we can categorize. And so we can talk about what the criteria are for various types of conversation. It's my firm belief we can reduce any socially expected rules set for strangers discussing a technical subject down to something very very basic. Only two words are needed, and there's two words are "civil discourse". I don't even think that needs explanation. It's self-evident. And under those two words only one of the individuals in this ridiculous Opera failed to meet the criteria of civil discourse as soon as, if not before, using phrases like rando asshats.

do any of the individuals need to restrict themselves to civil discourse? No. These are the criteria for defining conversation, not a rule set. Anyone is free to be a rando asshat, and many people do so. However, there are potential ramifications for engaging in uncivil discourse. if you are an employee, you risk being fired. In layman's terms, the easiest way to break your nose is to open your mouth.

 

[GhostOfTsu]

Zefah, you have to admit you have to be very careful if you don't agree that Price is a victim. Anything can get you banned if you are on the wrong side. Be careful if you reply to Subpar Spatula, the sjws are protected there no matter how unhinged and vile they are. They use the same tactics they did here for years, they bait you into getting banned

Price is not a hollywood heroine that finally stands up against her harassers after years of abuse. She was the bully and the harasser in this story and Era is turning her into the victim.

I'm quoting myself because I just saw that Zefah was banned from Era (permanently?). I guess your stance about them changed now? As I feared, they baited you into a ban.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I'm quoting myself because I just saw that Zefah was banned from Era (permanently?). I guess your stance about them changed now? As I feared, they baited you into a ban.

Well would you look at that. We have come full circle on that exchange.

 

[Scopa]

You can start an interaction and I will try to explain it from their perspective.

First:
As already mentioned, he invaded her private Twitter. So he must ask for permission to interact. If she says no or does not answer, that is the end.

Second:
She is the expert. She is not interested in his suggestions, because she already thought of it herself. He, however, can ask a question and she as the expert can explain to him, why he was wrong. So he has the chance to learn something.

Third:
At this point, he still has no right to an answer. If she does not feel like it, again it would be the end of the conversation.

Forth:
He has to be mindful of the context. Every woman in the game industry is getting harassed all the time. He has to accept that and adapt his behavior and his language accordingly.

Fifth:
If she thinks his question is answered, that is also the end of the conversation. Adding another question is only possible if she allows that. Are asks him if he has understood everything.

Within this boundaries, a conversation is possible as long as Deroir is always mindful of his position and the general context of the situation. And because he was ignorant about all of this, in their mind he was the offender. I know this is all a bit much, but according to their ideology, it is the task of Derior to inform himself and if he fails, Jessica Price has every right to expose him.

The tone of that sounds awfully like training a dog.

 

[iconmaster]

The Resetera Topic is already lit

What gets you banned and what doesn't:

Their mods are certainly creative, aren't they?

"A crime can always be found."

 

[Xaero Gravity]

Zefah was banned from there? For what? He was one of the few level headed folks there, and was always respectful even if he disagreed with you.

 

[Lupingosei]

The tone of that sounds awfully like training a dog.

That is how it is meant to be. Getting exposed when you make a mistake is part of the training.

Look at social media and how people love to expose people and publicly shame them. The misbehaved and have to be put back in line.

ResetEra bans work the same, they show what the person has done wrong, publicly shame them and they give them a chance to improve. Else they have to leave. Like an authoritarian kindergarten. If you can not play by the rules we will take your toys away.

 

[Chiggs]

 

[Dr. Claus]

Man. I have been one of the few that has decided to put the ResetEra vs. NeoGaf bullshit to the side and just roll with GAF since its been my home for years.

But holy shit you guys. This thread is ridiculous. You guys need to relax a little. Even if you believe that she did something wrong and should have been fired, you can do a bit better than just sitting here crying about SJWs and Liberal leaning Games Journo outlets.

I actually agree that she should have not been so aggressive with her customer. I disagree with the firing, but I understand why they did it too ( and some scolding at least probably would have been appropriate ). Sitting here bitching ( in a SUPER embarrassing way for you guys, I might add ) about someone who just disagrees with you is pretty immature and not very entertaining.

How is it "embarrassing"? We are talking about a person who has shown time and again to attack members of the very community she used to work for, make disingenuous claims, outright lie, and celebrate/promote people's death because she had a disagreement with their opinions. We then have gaming journalists push a completely fake narrative and a forum that is silencing/banning members while also pushing the aforementioned fake narrative. The only thing embarrassing are the people playing mental gymnastics to suggest she wasn't in the wrong.

The sad state is that these lies are what is being pushed to the greater world as the "truth". They need to be called out on their bullshit.

No, in her mind she was right. I understand you don't get this idea of "we have to expose every wrongdoing". But this is part of their ideology, exposing misbehavior. You have women patrolling college campuses reporting on micro-aggressions and people are getting warned and have to visit sensitivity training to learn, what they did wrong. Within her group, there is no doubt, that she was right to point out how he was wrong and to show the world how terrible men like him are and that they don' even get it, why they are so ignorant. This is also why there is this rift between people who share her ideology and people who don't.

If you look at ResetEra you will find this need to expose in so many aspects. Because as Anita Sarkasian has said it, everything is sexist, everything is racist and you have to point it all out. And yes, having a conversation is quite difficult at that point because you always imply that the other person is arguing in bad faith all the time. That is why you have so many people insisting that Derior had this masterplan to get rid of her and his respectful tone was just an act.

I think most here understand their ideology, but that doesn't change the fact that it is batshit insane and absolutely based on people who are genuinely off kilter and need to seek help, preferably professional.

 

[michaelius]

One thing I can't understand - unless employee has a history of such incidents it should have ended with public apology and a warning inside company - firing should have been last resort if she refused to apologise.

 

[cubicle47b]

It's nice of them to send the more reasonable people back to this forum.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I'm quoting myself because I just saw that Zefah was banned from Era (permanently?). I guess your stance about them changed now? As I feared, they baited you into a ban.

Nah, just for a day for losing my cool and taking it a bit too far on one particularly egregious user (who was also banned). I probably needed to get away from that thread anyway. I wasn't banned for the position I took in the thread, just for raging out on a specific individual.

 

[SScorpio]

One thing I can't understand - unless employee has a history of such incidents it should have ended with public apology and a warning inside company - firing should have been last resort if she refused to apologise.

Read through the discussions about her that highlight her past postings. She seems like a very angry person who seems like she'd be very difficult to work with. It's possible this was a straw that broke the camel's back situation.

 

[MiguelItUp]

Nah, just for a day for losing my cool and taking it a bit too far on one particularly egregious user (who was also banned). I probably needed to get away from that thread anyway. I wasn't banned for the position I took in the thread, just for raging out on a specific individual.

Yeah, don't do that to yourself, stepping away from that was wise. It doesn't look like a place of mature and/or civil discussion.

 

[hollowcupra]

People should stop comparing stuff with deceases that take millions everyday, it's luck of respect to those people and to people that mourn them every day. When people decide to make their opinions open to the "mob" they must be ready to handle the "mob's" reaction good or bad.

 

[Derekloffin]

One thing I can't understand - unless employee has a history of such incidents it should have ended with public apology and a warning inside company - firing should have been last resort if she refused to apologise.

It is difficult to say what else happened here. She may have been given that option but refused it. She may have had a history of other incidents internally that we don't know about.

 

[oagboghi2]

Man. I have been one of the few that has decided to put the ResetEra vs. NeoGaf bullshit to the side and just roll with GAF since its been my home for years.

But holy shit you guys. This thread is ridiculous. You guys need to relax a little. Even if you believe that she did something wrong and should have been fired, you can do a bit better than just sitting here crying about SJWs and Liberal leaning Games Journo outlets.

I actually agree that she should have not been so aggressive with her customer. I disagree with the firing, but I understand why they did it too ( and some scolding at least probably would have been appropriate ). Sitting here bitching ( in a SUPER embarrassing way for you guys, I might add ) about someone who just disagrees with you is pretty immature and not very entertaining.

No one is bitching. We are mocking hypocrisy and people acting dumb in the name of their hypocrisy, because it's funny.

Calm down. You don't need to defend resetera's honor. They have none, and Ms Price is a big girl.(as she is quick to tell us) she'll survive.

 

[GhostOfTsu]

Nah, just for a day for losing my cool and taking it a bit too far on one particularly egregious user (who was also banned). I probably needed to get away from that thread anyway. I wasn't banned for the position I took in the thread, just for raging out on a specific individual.

Victim-blaming yourself...they taught you well ;-)

There was nothing wrong with your posts. Anyway you won't survive long there now that you have a target on your back. Good luck!

 

[Dirk Benedict]

I want to know how many credits he was fined.

 

[SirKicksalot]

LUL

This is the ban reason that always gets me.
They VILLIFY the press all day in OT.
Incredible comedy.

I think I'm going to reinstall GW2 this weekend. Much cooking awaits!