Keyser Soze
Member
Even if I am stuck at low rank for now I should be happy I have already saved over 700 gold since the expansion launched. I am well on way to be ready to the next one! I will break 10,000 gold this time!
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Hearthstone |OT9| Our raid wiped in Icecrown Citadel
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
Karsticles
Member
I will fight Pirate Warrior over Priest any day.
But Murloc Paladin makes me sad.
But Murloc Paladin makes me sad.
I had a Raza Priest use the inspire minion that hits for 4 every time you hero power. I was at 37 health at the start of his turn. He brought me to 1, and I had lethal. I have never been so scared during a turn.
Just did the Brawl. My mage deck had two Prince Valanar's, Murloc Lookout card, Keening Banshees, Ozruk.
The Druid had Ultimate Infestation, bunch of other stuff. Don't remember through my rage filled vision.
The other guy actually felt so bad / was an idiot and assumed my secret was not iceblock and let me win at the end, despite having lethal.
The Druid had Ultimate Infestation, bunch of other stuff. Don't remember through my rage filled vision.
The other guy actually felt so bad / was an idiot and assumed my secret was not iceblock and let me win at the end, despite having lethal.
Wild is wild for sure.
Keyser Soze
Member
I totally forgot Brawls were even a thing. Still Classic packas reward I guess? EU so now up yet. I guess classic will always be the best pack fo offer newcomers.
Keyser Soze
Member
I started giving Pirate Warrior another shot after the talk in the thread, and faced a bunch of Priest - two who conceded at turn two cause I managed to get out a 4 attack Bloodsail Raider. I was not sure what happened the first concede, but now I understand. I might play PW more as I learned something new to annoy Priest!
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
Come on now
lol
Good Job Bob
Member
Removing Auctioneer from Standard would be the final nail in the coffin for Rogue. Might as well delete the class from the game.
Keyser Soze
Member
I really think reducing their options to refill would instantly help, but not completely not ruin the class, which is what a Blizzard 'nerf' usually does. Ultimate Infestation reduced to 9 Mana, but only Draw 3. Keeps 5/5 and 5 Armour is not a huge change, but should help. Jade were always a bit of a problem in the class, but now they are a huge problem as they always have them to play when they need them.
As for the Taunt Druid, I have not ran into it enough to know why I hate it. Crazed Alchemist actually works great for and against that deck, so maybe that is okay once the meta settles down.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
No, you don't fix ultimate infestation by reducing it's cost in a class with ramp and innervate. Big deal, they draw 2 less but they're playing it a turn earlier. That might even be a net buff.
Portugeezer
Gold Member
They can print a similar Rogue card if needed.
Keyser Soze
Member
Another option. Make it cost more that 10 Mana, and have it reduce when they are less cards in your hand. So your hand must have less than 3 cards for it to be under 10 and playable. Forcing a druid to make plays they might not want to use the card that give them power seems somewhat helpful
Also, maybe reduce the amount shuffles a Jade Idol can do every time a Jade Idol gets shuffled. It does not ruin the card, cut caps its uses... and give us back some lovely mill decks.
Maybe I am been too soft on the cards, but I like nerfs that keep cards alive not outright kill them.
Good Job Bob
Member
Then Rogue would have 4x Auctioneer in Wild, which might be broken.
I don't think Auctioneer is the problem right now for Druid. Maybe they will Hall of Fame the card eventually but they need to figure out what the hell they're doing with Rogue before they do.
Druid's ramp doesn't need to be hall of famed, that's his class identity. He was fine before KotFT, his new cards are just too powerful.
Auctioneer probably should be hall of famed, but they need to give Rogue some seriously strong tools to compensate for his removal.
Ice block is fine imo, the biggest problem is RNG cards like babbling book or Primordial Glyph that give Mages more copies of OP cards. Slow cards like Cabalists Tome are more acceptable for random card creation.
Auctioneer probably should be hall of famed, but they need to give Rogue some seriously strong tools to compensate for his removal.
Ice block is fine imo, the biggest problem is RNG cards like babbling book or Primordial Glyph that give Mages more copies of OP cards. Slow cards like Cabalists Tome are more acceptable for random card creation.
Karsticles
Member
For real. I had a Priest that got up to 8/8 Jades because of stolen cards. He was somehow only one behind me...
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
No one is asking for wild growth to get HoFd and the latest card they made like Innervate was for rogue.
Innervate has to go.
Nah.
I don't even play Druid, but no.
I swear I'm going to go through these threads one day and tally up every card that supposedly needs to be nerfed or pushed out of classic. Should be hilarious
Innervate has never been a huge problem, its a strong card but Druid's other cards have usually been balanced around it. Innervate is key to Druid's class identity and is part of what makes Druid so fun, it doesn't need to go anywhere.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Be my guest. You'll find I've been advocating for nerfing Innervate fairly soon after starting posting regularly in these threads and before the HoF was even introduced.
There's more than 2 decades of experience with the card already and it's broken beyond believe.
Innervate is ALWAYS a huge problem...LOL!
There hasn't been a Druid deck made that didn't run two Innervates. Even Swipe has been cut in aggressive board centric Druid decks but Innervate is eternal, the one singular Druid constant.
Just go online and look at card win rates in the best Druid decks. Innervate towers over all other cards.
At this point it's not a matter of whether Innervate is too strong... it for sure is too strong. The issue is that Innervate is too much married to the class identity of Druid to ever get changed. Rockbiter and Execute were the last two basic class cards to get nerfed so this is not outside of the realm of possibility but I don't think it will happen.
There hasn't been a Druid deck made that didn't run two Innervates. Even Swipe has been cut in aggressive board centric Druid decks but Innervate is eternal, the one singular Druid constant.
Just go online and look at card win rates in the best Druid decks. Innervate towers over all other cards.
At this point it's not a matter of whether Innervate is too strong... it for sure is too strong. The issue is that Innervate is too much married to the class identity of Druid to ever get changed. Rockbiter and Execute were the last two basic class cards to get nerfed so this is not outside of the realm of possibility but I don't think it will happen.
Star Falcon
Member
How do you beat this broken OHKO mage deck if you're not running aggro? :/
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Dirty Rat.
I've been trying to figure out how to tweak my Raza priest deck to beat it, but so far I haven't had any luck. It's an infuriating deck, they just stall and stall and stall until "durrr, got my combo!"
You can beat Quest Mage with Dirty Rat and Eater of Secrets.
But any Egg Druid not running Innervate is doing it wrong. Very wrong.
Though every Egg Druid I played against runs Innervate and degenerates out Eggs plus board wipe buffs on a single turn.
They don't run Swipe for sure.
But any Egg Druid not running Innervate is doing it wrong. Very wrong.
Though every Egg Druid I played against runs Innervate and degenerates out Eggs plus board wipe buffs on a single turn.
Lots of egg druids don't run anything big enough to justify an innervate. And they are already dumping their hands by turn 3 or 4. Innervate is the worst top deck ever. Stickiness above all else is how lots of egg druids operate.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
It isn't circles when your position never changes.
Innervate is almost identical but better than this card printed 24 years ago and it's among the strongest cards ever printed. Wizards had to ban multiple cards like it that were considerably worse since then.
Innervate is almost identical but better than this card printed 24 years ago and it's among the strongest cards ever printed. Wizards had to ban multiple cards like it that were considerably worse since then.
Coldlight Oracle. I've beat my last two quest mages by over-drawing their Antonidas, leaving them no way to actually win the game.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Same lessons. Free spells, cheating costs and mana acceleration are extremely powerful.
of course, innervate talk.
isn't that card like a better nourish for mana? innervate at least make the mana gain for only the turn it is played.
isn't that card like a better nourish for mana? innervate at least make the mana gain for only the turn it is played.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Flare
Eater of secrets
Also a few other ways you can win (I've pulled these edge scenarios off):
Valeera Deathknight. After I popped both ice blocks I played valeera deathknight which makes you stealth until your next turn. The timegate spell makes you skip your turn, so you're stealth during the second turn they take. They simply cannot combo you out.
Snipe. The combo is very finnicky. If they lose a combo piece to snipe (sorceress apprentice) then they cannot pull off a OHKO.
Counterspell/iceblock. Pretty obvious ones though.
I mean that's like saying gnomeferatu is a counter to it. Sure sometimes you will get lucky and burn a key card, but more often you will burn garbage and help them get closer to completing the combo. Dirty rat is much more consistent at countering them.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
the way mana works in magic is that it's always temporary but you have cards that produce it.
It's functionally identical except that Innervate is better because you can play it after you spent all your mana on a draw spell.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Well, for innervate nothing has changed since WOTOGs nerfs. The card dodged a bullet back then. They could have altered it to be minions only or require mana but give back more. They could have hit innervate in a meaningful way. Things have not changed. The card is still problematic and no one should be surprised.
I beat one with a Howlfiend --> Treachery --> Defile combo, but to say I wasn't lucky would be a lie.
I saw you on my friendlist open it! congratulations!