Support NeoGAF

[eXistor]

I have to say, I find it a little odd that the art style on Horizon doesn't do anything for you while Zelda BOTW does a lot for you. Horizon basically just looks like a way better version of Zelda BOTW from an art standpoint, from a lot of nature mixed with some future technological advancements.

For me, Horizon hasn't impressed me in any way, artstyle included. It comes across as Zelda-Lite/ Monster Hunter-Lite. When I say art-style I really mean the lack of one. When I look at videos I see impressive tech, but not much to really latch onto in terms of actual style. I know people are really into the game and that's fine, but I'm just not seeing it myself.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

For me, Horizon hasn't impressed me in any way, artstyle included.

O_O

 

[Inuhanyou]

For me, Horizon hasn't impressed me in any way, artstyle included. It comes across as Zelda-Lite/ Monster Hunter-Lite. When I say art-style I really mean the lack of one. When I look at videos I see impressive tech, but not much to really latch onto in terms of actual style. I know people are really into the game and that's fine, but I'm just not seeing it myself.

I can say with full certainty that your viewpoint is not the majority

 

[Dalibor68]

That's simply untrue. We have seen a lot of other footage in the first reveal and the story trailers. The area you are referring to is simply the demo version they put together for E3. It is time expensive to make such a vertical slice, and this one is particularly well done, thus it is reused everywhere for demo purposes (e.g. Brazil, GamesCom Germany). So naturally we have seen a lot of that part.

There are different demos, E3 2015 E3 2016 and the ones we're seeing now. All of them consist mainly of shooting arrows at robot dinos in the same area. Watch the damn videos. I don't care if it's hard to make, it's from different years and the marketing department actively chose to show this (again).

We know settlements will be in the game, probably not yet polished enough to be presentable (remember, February!). We have seen there is dialogue with choices, even though you are not satisfied with the amount shown, it clearly is there and it was very context specific. Why the worry it won't be in the final game? Is that so particularly difficult to do?

That is simply incorrect.
http://images.cdn.stuff.tv/sites/st.../Horizon_Zero_Dawn/horizon_dialogue_wheel.png
There were no choices here. My whole point is about them talking but not showing, so your "but they said it will be there" doesn't amount to anything in this discussion.

We have, in the story trailers and the screen shots.

Show me those screenshots then. I have seen exactly one screenshot of a brightly lit forest. And I don't care about story trailers with cut-together inengine cutscenes.

We also haven't seen the ending yet, but I bet there is one. Man you really need proof for everything, do you?

Yes obviously wanting to see one of their sidequests they praise so much is equal to wanting to see the ending. Now you're not even trying anymore.

The games flopped not because of the quality, which was there, but because it isn't Call of Duty or Battlefield, and especially the US gamers doesn't seem to care for anything else. Killzone multiplayer was very good, though maybe the SP story wasn't a masterpiece. But I have heard similar about most any CoD which never hurt sales there.

Now you really seem desperate. The game(Killzone Shadowfall) flopped critically. I didn't say KZ2 or KZ3 were flops.

What's on the table for Horizon does look better than ever for GG, improving on everything suboptimal in their former games, seeming to keep up their phenomenal track record on the technical stuff. We have never been in this situation before, GG isn't Hello Games, neither any other studio that hurt your feelings before with not delivering the thing you wanted. Cut them some slack, hype isn't always overhype.

How is Horizon improving on everything suboptimal from the killzone series(=their former games)? We haven't seen enough at all from a narrative standpoint to say "finally a good narrative/interesting characters!" etc. I explained very well what I meant by overhyping but you didn't understand it it seems.

 

[Always-honest]

For me, Horizon hasn't impressed me in any way, artstyle included. It comes across as Zelda-Lite/ Monster Hunter-Lite. When I say art-style I really mean the lack of one. When I look at videos I see impressive tech, but not much to really latch onto in terms of actual style. I know people are really into the game and that's fine, but I'm just not seeing it myself.

You are one of those people who think when graphics become more realistic, there is no longer any art-direction.
You're wrong. You prefer stylised graphics, that's fine. But there is a clear art-driection and art-style to this game. So was there in Gears of War, Uncharted, etc.

I do think it's weird that some people say: "well, if you like Zelda's artstyle, you should definitely like this artsyle". That's nonsense.

 

[Shin-Ra]

Horizon has plenty of style and we haven't seen much night, underground or high-mountain gameplay yet. Guerrilla's lighting always comes alive in the dark.

 

[Luigiv]

You are one of those people who think when graphics become more realistic, there is no longer any art-direction.
You're wrong. You prefer stylised graphics, that's fine. But there is a clear art-driection and art-style to this game. So was there in Gears of War, Uncharted, etc.

I do think it's weird that some people say: "well, if you like Zelda's artstyle, you should definitely like this artsyle". That's nonsense.

Always-honest
always-end-with-a-swirl
(Today, 06:35 PM)

Fitting user name. No lies detected.

 

[Zedark]

Horizon has plenty of style and we haven't seen much night, underground or high-mountain gameplay yet. Guerrilla's lighting always comes alive in the dark.

True, this game has very unique look to it, and is instantly recognisable.

 

[sublimit]

For me, Horizon hasn't impressed me in any way, artstyle included. It comes across as Zelda-Lite/ Monster Hunter-Lite. When I say art-style I really mean the lack of one. When I look at videos I see impressive tech, but not much to really latch onto in terms of actual style. I know people are really into the game and that's fine, but I'm just not seeing it myself.

+1

I'm still not sold on this game.Both art and gameplay look meh to me even though the tech is impressive.

The concept of robot dinos always seemed silly too.

 

[Shadowheart]

Personally, I love the art style and design of the game. The old people with skin and fur have great details in their characters and weapons. The dinos look sleek as heck and could fit in any futuristic game. The blend between the two is beautiful.

On top of that, I was surprised when I learned the game was open world. I thought with so much detail and tech it would be linear.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

+1

I'm still not sold on this game.Both art and gameplay look meh to me even though the tech is impressive.

The concept of robot dinos always seemed silly too.

You say that, and yet have a Xenoblade Chronicles X avatar. The inclusion of Robot Dinosaurs being 'silly' is such a weird complaint and it's not the first time I've seen it on GAF, a forum where people playing countless fantasy videogames with concepts that are just as 'silly'. How is it anymore ridiculous than mechs in general? Or Demons, dragons, my list could go on.

 

[DemWalls]

The game looks good and all, but I hope they'll fix the facial animations, if they haven't already. That conversation during the E3 demo was downright creepy.

 

[sublimit]

You say that, and yet have a Xenoblade Chronicles X avatar. The inclusion of Robot Dinosaurs being 'silly' is such a weird complaint and it's not the first time I've seen it on GAF, a forum where people playing countless fantasy videogames with concepts that are just as 'silly'. How is it anymore ridiculous than mechs in general? Or Demons, dragons, my list could go on.

It's the fact that this game tries to convince me this happened as an evolution of life that i find it silly not the designs themselves.

If the these robot dinos were created by someone or something i wouldn't have a problem.But as an evolution of life i just find it silly.

 

[silva1991]

For me, Horizon hasn't impressed me in any way, artstyle included. It comes across as Zelda-Lite/ Monster Hunter-Lite. When I say art-style I really mean the lack of one. When I look at videos I see impressive tech, but not much to really latch onto in terms of actual style. I know people are really into the game and that's fine, but I'm just not seeing it myself.

It's OK if you don't like the art style, but saying that it doesn't have one just doesn't compute.

 

[Shin-Ra]

The game looks good and all, but I hope they'll fix the facial animations, if they haven't already. That conversation during the E3 demo was downright creepy.

GG made a few callouts specifically for freelance facial animators:

https://twitter.com/guerrilla_jobs/status/757501373684539392
https://twitter.com/guerrilla_jobs

 

[Luigiv]

It's the fact that this game tries to convince me this happened as an evolution of life that i find it silly not the designs themselves.

If the these robot dinos were created by someone or something i wouldn't have a problem.But as an evolution of life i just find it silly.

That's probably "the twist". lol

That said I totally agree with this sentiment, but I find the shear coolness of the robo dinos' designs make up for it. If I snubbed every scifi that had a stupid premise, then I'd simply end up snubbing every scifi. Sometimes you just have to force yourself to suspend your disbelief, so you can get to the good stuff instead.

 

[Shadowheart]

It's the fact that this game tries to convince me this happened as an evolution of life that i find it silly not the designs themselves.

If the these robot dinos were created by someone or something i wouldn't have a problem.But as an evolution of life i just find it silly.

I think you misunderstood. As I know it, the dinos were a product of a lost civilization (probably our own in the future before the tech reset crash), or something like that. That also explains the futuristic tech the humans in the game use like batteries and why they need to get them from the machines since they can't build them themselves.

In any case, I remember them saying the story won't be spoiled so they aren't talking about it. Maybe there'll be a surprise and revealing last act.

 

[cheesekao]

It's the fact that this game tries to convince me this happened as an evolution of life that i find it silly not the designs themselves.

If the these robot dinos were created by someone or something i wouldn't have a problem.But as an evolution of life i just find it silly.

It's more like you're convincing yourself it's true because the trailers do not imply such and we know nothing about their origins.

 

[silva1991]

It's more like you're convincing yourself it's true because we know nothing about their origins.

Yeah I don't recall any trailer outright saying that those machines evolved by themselves.

 

[Zedark]

It's the fact that this game tries to convince me this happened as an evolution of life that i find it silly not the designs themselves.

If the these robot dinos were created by someone or something i wouldn't have a problem.But as an evolution of life i just find it silly.

They have mentioned multiple times in interviews and presentations that

Spoiler

you will research the reason for existence of these machines. The whole premise of the game is that there are these mysterious robot animals and you should find out why they came to be.

 

[sublimit]

It's more like you're convincing yourself it's true because the trailers do not imply such and we know nothing about their origins.

I'm pretty sure one of the trailers implied exactly that.

 

[wapplew]

Watch a lot hands on impression, so far everyone said good control, fun combat, great graphic and animation etc.
Very solid foundation. Just need good writing, diverse mission structure, better voice acting, more gameplay depth and we are golden.

 

[cheesekao]

I'm pretty sure one of the trailers implied exactly that.

I just rewatched the trailers before my previous post and they don't.

 

[Zedark]

I'm pretty sure one of the trailers implied exactly that.

Could you link it? I have never heard them say that, and I have, if I say so myself, watch quite some footage and interviews surrounding this game.

 

[pringles]

You say that, and yet have a Xenoblade Chronicles X avatar. The inclusion of Robot Dinosaurs being 'silly' is such a weird complaint and it's not the first time I've seen it on GAF, a forum where people playing countless fantasy videogames with concepts that are just as 'silly'. How is it anymore ridiculous than mechs in general? Or Demons, dragons, my list could go on.

Things can be unrealistic and part of a fantasy/sci-fi world without being silly as long as it follows some kind of internal logic that makes enough sense. It seems really difficult for Horizon to make the in-universe explanation good enough to in a satisfactory way explain all these mechanical creatures that look and behave just like their real-life counterparts.. my feeling is that it would have been better to leave some of the lesser creatures as actual living creatures, and narrow the mech designs into fewer but more distinctive and more threatening ones. Would have made the low-tech/high-tech and living/mech mix more interesting too and better explain why the humans aren't swimming in high-tech gear.

 

[benny_a]

Even if it wasn't.

What's the objection? Oh the horror these machines have reached a similar point in individual species that at some point in Earth's history were at the optimal fitness for their environment?

How absolutely silly. Must be an evil genius creator with an animal fetish.

my feeling is that it would have been better to leave some of the lesser creatures as actual living creatures

You mean like the game did?

 

[sublimit]

I just rewatched the trailers before my previous post and they don't.

Could you link it? I have never heard them say that, and I have, if I say so myself, watch quite some footage and interviews surrounding this game.

I thought it was the first trailer from E3 2015 but now that i watched it again i admit that it doesn't imply anything like it.Maybe i read some journalist's assumption at the time or something and i mixed it as an implication in the trailer.
My bad then.

 

[pringles]

You mean like the game did?

Sorry must have missed that, but from the gameplay/screenshots I've seen most stuff seems to be mechs, even the type of creatures that don't seem to pose any threat to you but simply act like wild animals with herd behaviour, effectively making it pointless that they're mechanical at all.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

We haven't seen anything of the backstory

They implied things about the fall of human civilisation in the first trailer (and I think a little in the story trailer from just before E3 this year?), but I don't know why you're expecting backstory from story trailers anyway. Doesn't seem like a particularly reasonable request.

we haven't seen any human settlements

Not properly, no. But then, they seem to be focusing on world-building and interacting/fighting with the machines, which I'd guess predominantly takes place outside of human settlements

we haven't seen any proper NPC interactions

We have seen a brief conversation mid-quest. They're focusing on action in their gameplay demos, so I'm not surprised they're not showing much of this stuff. And remember, they've still got at least two major events to show off the game as well as six months of marketing.

we haven't seen any other locale than the plains

We have seen them, but that's not where the gameplay demos have taken place.

we haven't seen any sidequest play out which they talked about.

You seem to want to see the entire game before release. It's not reasonable to expect to see every single individual element in pre-release footage. So far we've seen a gameplay demo of combat against smaller enemies and then a bigger 'boss' enemy, a story trailer and then the most recent E3 demo showing what is obviously a quest beginning outside of a settlement, which shows how dialogue plays out, resource gathering, combat against a couple of different enemies, getting a mount, riding to a location and then a boss battle, showing how Aloy uses the mount mid-battle. There's a lot of stuff in there which is shown briefly, provided the viewer isn't doing their best to ignore it.

For me, Horizon hasn't impressed me in any way, artstyle included. It comes across as Zelda-Lite/ Monster Hunter-Lite. When I say art-style I really mean the lack of one. When I look at videos I see impressive tech, but not much to really latch onto in terms of actual style. I know people are really into the game and that's fine, but I'm just not seeing it myself.

You might not like the art style, but it's foolish to say the game doesn't have one.

The game looks good and all, but I hope they'll fix the facial animations, if they haven't already. That conversation during the E3 demo was downright creepy.

Yeah; the voice acting, body animations and facial animations were definitely the weakest part of that trailer. I'm pretty sure they've already said they will be working on improving this though.

It's the fact that this game tries to convince me this happened as an evolution of life that i find it silly not the designs themselves.

If the these robot dinos were created by someone or something i wouldn't have a problem.But as an evolution of life i just find it silly.

I'm pretty sure that was never inferred, and Aloy finding out what happened to the old human civilisation and how these robot creatures came about seems to be the game's premise.

I'm pretty sure one of the trailers implied exactly that.

Should be easy to find then, as there's only been a few trailers.

 

[kyser73]

+1

I'm still not sold on this game.Both art and gameplay look meh to me even though the tech is impressive.

The concept of robot dinos always seemed silly too.

If you look closely at the designs they're representative of many different types of animal. While the Thunderjaw is clearly inspired by the T-Rex, the tall grazers and robo-bull are both obviously based on giraffes & bovines, the crab thing...well, crabs! It's also worth noting that in the E3 demo, the infector robot and the one being controlled by the tribe with the Lightning sigil on the trailer, are both 'antique' according to Aloy in her commentary, but also far more insectile in design, suggesting and interesting lineage.

Calling them robo-Dinos is a disservice to the varied inspirations the designs come from.

 

[benny_a]

Sorry must have missed that, but from the gameplay/screenshots I've seen most stuff seems to be mechs, even the type of creatures that don't seem to pose any threat to you but simply act like wild animals with herd behaviour, effectively making it pointless that they're mechanical at all.

I'm seriously not understanding what your point is.

What's pointless got to do with anything?
There is no point to life.
The only reasons we have giraffes and fish and snakes is because they haven't died.

In the purported world of Horizon the machines have taken roles that used to be handled by animals that we know of today. There is no point to that, the fictional world as presented means one thing: Machines are better at filing a certain niche.
Maybe they were better at adapting because machines are built, not born and therefor don't have to rely on random mutation and time to hone their specialization.

 

[Magic Mushroom]

+1

I'm still not sold on this game.Both art and gameplay look meh to me even though the tech is impressive.

The concept of robot dinos always seemed silly too.

If by silly you mean cool, sure. It's something different and the game definitely stands out from all the fantasy and sci-fi games that flood the market.

The jury is still out on the gameplay, though feedback from players who went hands-on is positive and combat looks a helluva lot smoother and interesting than most RPGs with none of the jank that plagues The Witcher and Bethesda's sorry excuses for combat.

 

[pringles]

I'm seriously not understanding what your point is.

What's pointless got to do with anything?
There is no point to life.
The only reasons we have giraffes and fish and snakes is because they haven't died.

In the purported world of Horizon the machines have taken roles that used to be handled by animals that we know of today. There is no point to that, the fictional world as presented means one thing: Machines are better at filing a certain niche.
Maybe they were better at adapting because machines are built, not born and therefor don't have to rely on random mutation and time to hone their specialization.

And exactly because mechs don't rely on random mutation there is no need for them to look exactly like the living creatures that have evolved randomly. Even if there is some in-game logic at play there it would have probably been easier to have it make sense if the mechs were more different from their real-life counterparts. Like having a mechanical creature that is vaguely familiar to a crocodile, but far superior, instead of having a just a mechanical crocodile.

 

[Sanctuary]

I can say with full certainty that your viewpoint is not the majority

That doesn't really mean anything. I think this game looks gorgeous, but I also don't believe Bloodborne is the best Souls game, nor do I belive that Naughty Dog makes the most interesting games.

 

[WhiskerFrisker]

And exactly because mechs don't rely on random mutation there is no need for them to look exactly like the living creatures that have evolved randomly. Even if there is some in-game logic at play there it would have probably been easier to have it make sense if the mechs were more different from their real-life counterparts. Like having a mechanical creature that is vaguely familiar to a crocodile, but far superior, instead of having a just a mechanical crocodile.

Honestly, why does this matter?

 

[potatohead]

Honestly, why does this matter?

Narrative dissonance.

Someone was gonna whine about it at some point. Might as well just get it out of the way.

 

[Sjefen]

Watch a lot hands on impression, so far everyone said good control, fun combat, great graphic and animation etc.
Very solid foundation. Just need good writing, diverse mission structure, better voice acting, more gameplay depth and we are golden.

If you have a solid foundation you have come a long way, and like you said, lets hope the rest follows. If they manage to pull the rest of this could be one hell of a game. Fingers crossed

 

[benny_a]

And exactly because mechs don't rely on random mutation there is no need for them to look exactly like the living creatures that have evolved randomly. Even if there is some in-game logic at play there it would have probably been easier to have it make sense if the mechs were more different from their real-life counterparts. Like having a mechanical creature that is vaguely familiar to a crocodile, but far superior, instead of having a just a mechanical crocodile.

The individual mutation that causes a slightly stronger bite, a slightly longer neck might be random, that doesn't mean the complete build is random. That's just misunderstanding evolution to a massive degree.

And they don't even look exactly like living creatures. They look like they fill the same niche.

 

[Raiden1018]

Are weapons customizable?

 

[LifeBrandRobot]

The haters are coming out for this game now, ehh? First time I've seen so much dislike for this game, its kind of baffling since I don't understand what's triggered it.

 

[OléGunner]

If by silly you mean cool, sure. It's something different and the game definitely stands out from all the fantasy and sci-fi games that flood the market.

The jury is still out on the gameplay, though feedback from players who went hands-on is positive and combat looks a helluva lot smoother and interesting than most RPGs with none of the jank that plagues The Witcher and Bethesda's sorry excuses for combat.

Bit harsh on TW3, it's sword combat I thought was really good considering other open world RPG's. Bethesda's though, I wholeheartedly agree is quite poor, especially in Elder Scrolls.

Personally I'm not sweating the combat in Horizon right now. Impressions have been glowing and GG's history with amazing combat in Killzone series makes me quietly confident they will nail that.

Hopefully it doesn't get stale as the game progresses.

The haters are coming out for this game now, ehh? First time I've seen so much dislike for this game, its kind of baffling since I don't understand what's triggered it.

We are surprisingly getting close to the "Drake is a mass murderer, therefore dissonance" meme status haha.

 

[Shredderi]

The concept of robot dinos always seemed silly too.

This.So.Much. Games like Horizon, Ni No Ku Ni, RE4, RE5, Valkyria Profiles are all fucking ridiculous with their settings.

Spoiler

;P

 

[BigEmil]

So according to people devs can't takes risks and try to be different and must stick to stuff many other games already looks/done and must not try be original. Must be generic. Ok.

The haters are coming out for this game now, ehh? First time I've seen so much dislike for this game, its kind of baffling since I don't understand what's triggered it.

It's mostly Zelda fans I noticed.

 

[Raylan]

So according to people devs can't takes risks and try to be different and must stick to stuff many other games already looks/done and must not try be original. Must be generic. Ok.

Robo dinos are silly, Kratos is a jerk, Drake is a mass murderer, babysitting Ellie is annoying, Killzone doesn't have enough colours, etc. etc Same old, same old.

 

[The God]

So according to people devs can't takes risks and try to be different and must stick to stuff many other games already looks/done and must not try be original. Must be generic. Ok.

then they'll complain about a lack of new ip and ideas

 

[GIANKRATOS]

Show me those screenshots then. I have seen exactly one screenshot of a brightly lit forest. And I don't care about story trailers with cut-together inengine cutscenes.

I don't understand your "obsession" with forests in this game XD

Are you afraid that the game will not capture the atmosphere of the 2 artworks you posted? We haven't seen night gameplay or gameplay in a forest with fog so it's pretty hard to make a comparison...

 

[Krakin]

Things can be unrealistic and part of a fantasy/sci-fi world without being silly as long as it follows some kind of internal logic that makes enough sense. It seems really difficult for Horizon to make the in-universe explanation good enough to in a satisfactory way explain all these mechanical creatures that look and behave just like their real-life counterparts.. my feeling is that it would have been better to leave some of the lesser creatures as actual living creatures, and narrow the mech designs into fewer but more distinctive and more threatening ones. Would have made the low-tech/high-tech and living/mech mix more interesting too and better explain why the humans aren't swimming in high-tech gear.

So what you're saying is you want everything explained to you before the game comes out?

 

[Sayad]

And exactly because mechs don't rely on random mutation there is no need for them to look exactly like the living creatures that have evolved randomly. Even if there is some in-game logic at play there it would have probably been easier to have it make sense if the mechs were more different from their real-life counterparts. Like having a mechanical creature that is vaguely familiar to a crocodile, but far superior, instead of having a just a mechanical crocodile.

It was clear from the first leaked concept images that they went in too hard with the rule of cool. I was hoping the game doesn't take it self seriously because I sure as hell wont be able to take mecha dinos seriously. At this point I just hope the gameplay is good enough, don't have much interest in the game's world, setting, narrative, etc... Which is a big disappointment seeing as this is a story driven action RPG.

 

[SOR5]

Are weapons customizable?

Well weapons are definitely upgradable so I dont see why not

 

[benny_a]

It was clear from the first leaked concept images that they went in too hard with the rule of cool. I was hoping the game doesn't take it self seriously because I sure as hell wont be able to take mecha dinos seriously. At this point I just hope the gameplay is good enough, don't have much interest in the game's world, setting, narrative, etc... Which is a big disappointment seeing as this is a story driven action RPG.

That sucks for you.

I like it a lot.

But don't worry, there will be another game that will explain everything by explaining nothing and just allude to magic, I'm sure.