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Maxis is, yet again, removing basic features from new Sims 4

McNum

Member
Okay, first impressions of Create-a-Sim 4. It's smooth. It's really smooth. Easy to use, clean UI, maybe a little TOO clean since there's not really a "Start here" point, but... It's content starved. Some clothing categories are just empty and there's not that many hairstyles or tattoos available. It is a pretty nice first impression, though.

Hmm. "Smooth but content starved." Why do I get a feeling that's going to be a theme?
 

Tabby

Member
The problem I have with the CAS is that it's damn near impossible to get a tool that you want.
You want to rotate the tip of the nose? Have fun rotating the camera and moving the mouse to get the tool you want.

As far as content goes, I've never played a Sims at launch so I can't compare but I'm pleased with what's available; all of the choices are stuff I would actually use which is something I could never say for Sims 3.
 

RevoDS

Junior Member
CAS probably works well with a mouse, seems well done, but I tried it on my Mac with a trackpad to...not so great results. It basically rotates between min an max positions the further you go, kind of like an invisible slider.
 

Zareka

Member
Time to get my creat-a-sim on.

Actually, I hope I don't end up liking this too much. My favourite thing to do in The Sims is create Sims I really like and then play through their lives. Doing the first half will only make me want to keep going even more. Actually, most of the reason I even bought Saints Row the Third was because I tried out the character creator demo before hand, made the *perfect* character and then realised I couldn't play them,

...I know I'm going to love this regardless. ;_;
 

McNum

Member
I do miss Create-a-Style for the clothes, though. I mean, the palette swaps are nice and all, but I'd like to choose more. "And I'll give her that skirt and then this top in... oh there's no red." That bit is going to be hard to get used to.

One thing I do like, though. There's a second Aspiration in the Love one. We have the usual "Date EVERYONE!" one, but there's also one for a Sim seeking True Love, which is nice. That there's only Bodybuilder under Athletic is a bit of a downer, though. Not everyone with an athletic mindset wants to be huge.
 

Delio

Member
Yeah the no color wheel is getting to me the most. I'm trying to make a nice hipster like gay guy ( im gay so >_>) But like...the color combos are just bleh. More so with that scarf/shirt combo they have as a default. Why I cant change that scarf to every color of the rainbow... meh.

Also tried to share the girl Sim I was making on facebook but the link they make just leads to you preordering the game. what.
 

Zareka

Member
One thing I do like, though. There's a second Aspiration in the Love one. We have the usual "Date EVERYONE!" one, but there's also one for a Sim seeking True Love, which is nice.

Fin-uh-lly. I've hated that I've never been able to make a sim that aspires to romance but only with one person. Though to be fair, the family aspiration has generally ended up like that once I got 2 sims flirting.

One other thing I would like too, though purely aesthetic, is a way to build a romantic bond between sims without purely flirting. All the flirting interactions look incredibly suggestive from the get go and I'd like some more sweet, nicer looking ones. A shy, socially awkward loner's "Compliment Appearance" should look awkward and stilted, not suave and suggestive!

Edit: demo downloaded LET'S DO THIS

Edit the 2nd: Is there any way I can stop my sim from throwing her head all over the place? I'm trying to make detailed edits to the face, but I can't see what the hell I'm doing because of invisible, orbiting flies. This is why I hate constant idle animations in character creators.
 

Delio

Member
The UI for this is pretty slick tho. It took a moment to get it going but it's nice. If they had kept most of the options from Sims 3 to this it would be perfect.
 

Tabby

Member
Fin-uh-lly. I've hated that I've never been able to make a sim that aspires to romance but only with one person. Though to be fair, the family aspiration has generally ended up like that once I got 2 sims flirting.

One other thing I would like too, though purely aesthetic, is a way to build a romantic bond between sims without purely flirting. All the flirting interactions look incredibly suggestive from the get go and I'd like some more sweet, nicer looking ones. A shy, socially awkward loner's "Compliment Appearance" should look awkward and stilted, not suave and suggestive!

Edit: demo downloaded LET'S DO THIS

Edit the 2nd: Is there any way I can stop my sim from throwing her head all over the place? I'm trying to make detailed edits to the face, but I can't see what the hell I'm doing because of invisible, orbiting flies. This is why I hate constant idle animations in character creators.
If you edit their face/zoom in super close they'll stop moving.
 

Zareka

Member
If you edit their face/zoom in super close they'll stop moving.

Ah, I never noticed the actual button called detailed edits. Thanks.

Consider me super mad now. This CAS is really great, imo, if only for the additions like being able to change the width etc of different parts of the body. It would be the perfect CAS if they could combine this with all the options (Create a Style) in The Sims 3. It makes me even more annoyed that the full game looks to be the sorry shell of a failed MMO.

Also, is there any way I can grab the portraits of my families I make? I see people posting them on twitter now and then and I'm wondering how they do it.

Eeedit: I don't like the way the guys look in this. I dunno what it is, but they look a little off. The sims are a bit too clean for my tastes as well though that might just be the art style.
 

Retro

Member
One other thing I would like too, though purely aesthetic, is a way to build a romantic bond between sims without purely flirting. All the flirting interactions look incredibly suggestive from the get go and I'd like some more sweet, nicer looking ones. A shy, socially awkward loner's "Compliment Appearance" should look awkward and stilted, not suave and suggestive!

lulz36usx.jpg


Sorry, first thing that sprang to mind =p
 

Kimaka

Member
It took me a while to get used to but the CAS is so much better than previous ones. This is the closest I've came to successfully creating myself.

I miss the color wheel. There isn't enough variance with the skin tones and clothing colors provided. The hairstyles are also very limited. I would have liked to see more curly options.
 

Zareka

Member
lulz36usx.jpg


Sorry, first thing that sprang to mind =p

Hahahaha, that's brilliant.

Agree with people missing the colour wheel and create a style. The amount of times I almost had the perfect outfit only for it to be ruined because I couldn't match up colours was pretty annoying.
 

Spl1nter

Member
The colour wheel/CAS is a big loss. I'm honestly suprised they haven't created a better system for the game.

The new editor is excellent. Was always horrible at making sims but it's so easy to do now.

The gallery is awesome. So simple and quick to download other peoples sims. It should be amazing in the full game being able to download complete rooms/houses.

Despite all the negatives and removals I think the actual gameplay will be significantly improved. The focus on emotions and interactions should create a lot more individuality alongside improved ai, pathing, multitasking. The closed world should make more lively community lots which would be really nice. The sims 3 open world is nice but when you only ever have 8 sims at a community lot and story progression is broken.... really depends on load times. I think not having some of the basic careers is a bigger issue.
 

Koomaster

Member
The CAS Demo is pretty amazing I have to say. Could definitely use more outfits; especially since the game lacks Create-a-Style patterns and the color wheel. Seriously these are pretty glaring omissions. Lot of times I would find two pieces that I liked together but they didn't have matching or complimentary colors. Or I liked a patterned skirt but none of the tops that I liked with it were in a matching color.

If they put in a color wheel and the patterns again the CAS would be near perfect. I love it otherwise. Very easy to use; and quick. Lot easier to customize makeup/hair per each outfit. Although I do wish there was a way to lock down makeup or be a way to copy/paste the makeup from one outfit to another. But still, lot easier to change than in Sims 3.

On one hand this demo sort of got me excited for Sims 4; but on the other I am bummed because of no Create-A-Style. I spend a good chunk of my playtime creating clothes and building houses in Sims 3. Create-A-Style is a huge part of that. Hearing stories from the Creator's Camp about furniture not matching; and me seeing first hand clothes not matching; I just wonder why they took this specific feature out. At least keep the color wheel.

Also baffling is that sometimes I would find a nice shirt or jacket in a style/color I liked, but then the t-shirt/blouse would be a color I didn't. So I couldn't use the shirt/jacket because there was no way to change the color of what's underneath. Just an odd decision to make it this way.
 

Lucifon

Junior Member
Really enjoying the CAS demo, hope there's more options in the final game though. Hair styles are lacking again and I noticed there doesn't seem to be any 'full outfits' which I can only assume there will be in the main game, so that gives me hope for more content.

Some of the creations I've seen in the gallery are amazing. Here's a few of my favourites:

 

Sub Zero

his body's cold as ice, but he's got a heart of gold
CAS is fantastic. Hopefully there will be more content once the game launches because the hair and clothing selection is very limited at the moment. There also seems to be a toddler/baby option, so if we at least get the chance to customize babies slightly it will be way better than just having them as props

Such a shame they dumbed down the rest of the game so much. All the new features are so promising
 

McNum

Member
The Sims 3 was the same way; one promising step forward, eight inexplicable steps back.
This will sound like a complaint that's over a decade old, because, well, it is, but I do miss Fears from The Sims 2 in The Sims 3. It gave some tangible failure states, and seeing a Sim just freak out or go crazy because life was feeding them their worst fears was fun. Sims 3 was just too... "nice".

Sims 4 looks like it's going to be "nice", too, as randomized deaths seem to have been drastically reduced. I do kind of want the lethality of The Sims 2 back, maybe as a Hard Mode or something, because playing Sims that have perfect lives gets old after the first few ones.
 

Koomaster

Member
This will sound like a complaint that's over a decade old, because, well, it is, but I do miss Fears from The Sims 2 in The Sims 3. It gave some tangible failure states, and seeing a Sim just freak out or go crazy because life was feeding them their worst fears was fun. Sims 3 was just too... "nice".

Sims 4 looks like it's going to be "nice", too, as randomized deaths seem to have been drastically reduced. I do kind of want the lethality of The Sims 2 back, maybe as a Hard Mode or something, because playing Sims that have perfect lives gets old after the first few ones.
Hope the randomness of death isn't toned down too much. I've had some really funny/coincidental ones. Like the time my Sim graduated from university and as she was standing outside tossing her diploma, got struck by a meteorite and died. A bunch of other students and random sims died as well, it was quite the scene.
 

McNum

Member
Hope the randomness of death isn't toned down too much. I've had some really funny/coincidental ones. Like the time my Sim graduated from university and as she was standing outside tossing her diploma, got struck by a meteorite and died. A bunch of other students and random sims died as well, it was quite the scene.
Tosses their hats in the air, catches a meteor to the face. Because the game was feeling extra spiteful.

And stories like this is why random death can be a good thing. My best Sims 3 story was when a guest died at a birthday party and the Grim Reaper decided to join everyone at the table for cake. I can just imagine the awkward smalltalk happening at that table.
 

Retro

Member
This will sound like a complaint that's over a decade old, because, well, it is, but I do miss Fears from The Sims 2 in The Sims 3. It gave some tangible failure states, and seeing a Sim just freak out or go crazy because life was feeding them their worst fears was fun. Sims 3 was just too... "nice".

Sims 4 looks like it's going to be "nice", too, as randomized deaths seem to have been drastically reduced. I do kind of want the lethality of The Sims 2 back, maybe as a Hard Mode or something, because playing Sims that have perfect lives gets old after the first few ones.

No, you're actually making a good point, I think there's been a clear change over the course of the series in how they want you to approach the game.

TLDR:
Sims 1: We're not taking any of this seriously.
Sims 2: We're not taking any of this seriously, but you can if you want to.
Sims 3: We're going to pretend we're not taking this seriously, but we desperately want you to, because then you will spend more money.
Sims 4: LOOK HOW WE'RE NOT TAKING THIS SERIOUSLY! BUY THINGS!

The original Sims, for example, wasn't just ridiculously different from anything that had come before, but it was also quirky in all the right places (which was one of Maxis' defining characteristics in their heyday). The strangeness of a "people simulator" plus that trademark Maxis sense of humor gave the game a ton of personality. You could have your Sims wet themselves and die in weird ways because the developers didn't take the game too seriously. It was just a neat, charming thing to play with.

The Sims 2 basically took the core of the Sims and allowed players to put their personal fingerprints all over it. They realized that people were using The Sims to tell stories, so they gave players tools and control methodologies that allowed for deeper customization and storytelling. It didn't take itself seriously either, but it gave you the tools to do so if you wanted (this is an important point). This is where the Sims really became more than just a game and turned into a sort of sub-culture where people wrote fanfiction and made movies about their Sims. The expansions added more and more tools to the game, but the real show here was the modding community, which makes sense considering the game took on a heavy personalized angle.

The Sims 3 is where EA realized two things;
  1. All of those tables, chairs, lamps, shirts, hairstyles and toys that modders made were potential micro transactions, and
  2. People stick with the games for a long time because they become engrossed with their Sims.
The end result was a game that tried to pretend it wasn't taking itself seriously, but totally wanted you to because the longer you played and the more you wanted to tell stories with your Sims, the more likely you are to buy things for them. You had more space to play in, better customization tools and social media integration because all of those things create a deeper connection. The personality became entirely superficial at this point (Llama references because "LOL, Maxis has a thing with llamas, amirite?") because they wanted you to be deadly serious about your Sims because that was what kept you hooked and they would like it oh so very much if you would buy something cool for your Sim too.

From the look of Sims 4, they're trying to have their cake and eat it too. They want you to take it seriously so that you keep playing, but they've cut out as much of the customization as possible because they want to sell it back to you piecemeal, without realizing that the customization is the reason people connect with and take their Sims seriously. That Create-a-Sim feels powerful but everything else feels like a hatchet job is especially telling, because they want you to be pulled in by the potential of your Sims but things that they can sell you like clothes, furniture, etc. are suspiciously absent. The lack of Create-a-Style means they can sell you 10 different colored scarves instead of one. The same with building; there are lots of cool new features that suggest a ton of potential, but all of the meat is behind a pay wall.

Basically, they're trying to sell you The Best Sims Ever (someday); "Imagine when they finally add create-a-style to this!" or "Imagine how cool it will be when they add pools with these awesome building tools!", because all of those things are coming and gee whiz, won't it be cool when they do... but at a price.

It also really speaks to the way the Sims 4 is being sold, with an over-emphasis on meme-like strangeness and antics, almost like they're basically pushing the Sims 4 as this crazy storytelling device where anything can happen and you can totally put it on Youtube. More than ever they want you to consider the Sims an extension of yourself, your creativity and your personality (at the expense of the game and, eventually, your wallet).
 

Retro

Member
Well said. Absolutely agree here.
You put into words how I felt about the Sims 3 even though I sort of liked it. It kinda had no personality.

Yeah, I originally had a quick comment about it typed up, but I felt I needed to explain it better (and I'm still not sure that I did), because things as subtle as charm and personality are hard to put a finger on, and because I know the Sims 3 has a lot of fans and they at least deserve a clear answer on why I think that game is fundamentally flawed.

I actually left out a point I wanted to make because I was trying to be clear and it came off a little cutesy; If the Sims 1 has "the strangeness of a 'people simulator' plus that trademark Maxis sense of humor", then the Sims 3 (and by all appearances, 4) has "the strangeness of a 'people simulator' plus That Maxis Humor™, ©2014 Electronic Arts, Inc. All Rights Reserved. " A fair chunk of the humanity was sucked out of it.
 

Koomaster

Member
Tosses their hats in the air, catches a meteor to the face. Because the game was feeling extra spiteful.

And stories like this is why random death can be a good thing. My best Sims 3 story was when a guest died at a birthday party and the Grim Reaper decided to join everyone at the table for cake. I can just imagine the awkward smalltalk happening at that table.
I had never before nor since seen another meteor in my game. I wasn't sure what was going on at first, but I laughed about it once I realized.

I've also had the misfortune of having a sim die at his own wedding of old age right after cutting the cake. Of course Grim helped himself to a slice as the bride looked on weeping.

One of the funniest though was my sim driving off late at night to do a singing telegram for another sim. Apparently there is a very small chance of spontaneous combustion when doing the singing telegrams. Having never had this happen before it was quite a surprise when my sim suddenly burst into flames. The guy she was singing to was stuck in a sort of cheering/clapping/happy state because her singing was so good, so he didn't bother to get a fire extinguisher and put her out. Had to wake my family up from across town and have them drive over, only to arrive just as she died. Whoops.

Ended up playing that out to where that sim and his family were my family's mortal enemies throughout the generations. Every time a sim in my family met a sim from his, it was war, haha.
 

McNum

Member
On that note of memes, have you seen the reward they're giving The Sims 3 veterans? I mean, look at that thing: The ULTIMATE Freezer Bunny.

Yes that's a golden statue of the Freezer Bunny standing on a Llama and holding a Plumbob. This is a good example of the humor being... off. The Freezer Bunny thing was just a silly easter egg that someone at Maxis liked to put in strange, strange places. So named because it was first found in a freezer.

But this just screams "It exists, therefore it is funny!" And no... it's really not. It's like those "Epic Movie" films. It takes more than just a reference to be actually funny. Sims 1 and 2 had that oldschool Airplane-ish deadpan going on. Absurd people in serious situations, and Sims got very, very absurd sometimes. If you have Sims 2, try getting one into -1 red on the Aspiration Gauge without going totally into Aspiration Failure and then just watch. The romance Sim making out with a mop, the fortune Sim panhandling at the sidewalk, the family Sim cuddling a sack of flour. So sad, and yet so funny. And a bit creepy. And I mean, this, in real life, would be a serious situation, people seeing the lives come apart and not seeing a way out of it. That's awful, and tragically common. But Sims take the crazy route and make out with a mop. That's funny.

Sims 3 didn't really have any of that. And the Insane trait was just disappointing. "Look, he's fishing in a swimming pool? Isn't that just random?!" No, but I do have a soft spot for the fact that EA actually made it so he could catch something like that. That makes it a little funny. Sims 3 was just... so safe. Bad things couldn't really happen, the worst that could happen to a Sim was losing a loved one or have a bad breakup. And that lasted 48 Sim hours and then that was done with.

The point I'm trying to make is that for humor to exist, tragedy must be possible somehow. That and building up a "perfect life" and then send it crashing into flames (sometimes literally) and trying to rebuild from there is probably the most fun in the games. Adultery, death, money trouble, unwanted pregnancies. The soap opera tropes, really. A serious drama of relationships, life and death, played out by some very, very absurd people.

I will say one thing in favor of The Sims 3's humor, though. I had never, until Sims 3, seen a fairy get abducted by aliens before. So, kudos to the game on that one.
 

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I dunno, I really enjoyed Sims 3 with that. Aspiration negativity was a miss, but I thought traits were much better.

And lots of bad things actually happen in sims 3. Randomly getting crashed to a meteor for one thing. Also I think the cruelest is getting turned into a mummy.
 

McNum

Member
I dunno, I really enjoyed Sims 3 with that. Aspiration negativity was a miss, but I thought traits were much better.

And lots of bad things actually happen in sims 3. Randomly getting crashed to a meteor for one thing. Also I think the cruelest is getting turned into a mummy.
Oh, right. The Mummy's Cruse. That one was mean. Your Sim has 12 days to live, and each day they get worse and worse, and the screen gaining a more pronounced vignette and getting more desaturated for each day passing when that Sim is selected.

Unless you quest for the cure that is. That one is just one heck of a game changer when it happens.
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
Hope the randomness of death isn't toned down too much. I've had some really funny/coincidental ones. Like the time my Sim graduated from university and as she was standing outside tossing her diploma, got struck by a meteorite and died. A bunch of other students and random sims died as well, it was quite the scene.

I lol just imagining that happen.
 
Hope the randomness of death isn't toned down too much. I've had some really funny/coincidental ones. Like the time my Sim graduated from university and as she was standing outside tossing her diploma, got struck by a meteorite and died. A bunch of other students and random sims died as well, it was quite the scene.

This happen to my daughter right after her Sims had a romantic wedding in the Islands. She's 10 and this is no way for a 10 year old to act but she wigged out swearing every swear word she knew and a few she invented right then and there while giving the monitor two middle fingers. My hysterical laughter probably didn't help.
 
I wonder if the exclusion of Create a Style and colour palette wheel is not some cynical design decision to encourage the purchase of more clothing packs.

People complaining how hard it is to pull of certain combinations of clothes due to limited colouring could be seen as a marketing opportunity.

I can't imagine a full colour wheel being a big performance drain or an engineering challenge.
 

McNum

Member
I wonder if the exclusion of Create a Style and colour palette wheel is not some cynical design decision to encourage the purchase of more clothing packs.

People complaining how hard it is to pull of certain combinations of clothes due to limited colouring could be seen as a marketing opportunity.

I can't imagine a full colour wheel being a big performance drain or an engineering challenge.
Create-a-Style is probably one of the biggest performance hogs in The Sims 3, actually. Well, I suppose pathfinding for 200 Sims at the same time is a killer, too. You ever seen a Sim, object or, well, anything load in late or be completely white for 5-10 seconds after it loads? Or a Sim just standing there for a Sim hour before changing clothes? That's due to Create-a-Style. No textures are baked-in, since the player can do whatever with it, so it has to be done on the fly, every single time.

Now, granted, a limited version where you can only change color and not texture would be less of a drain, of course, but Create-a-Style, while awesome, was not a lightweight thing.
 
Create-a-Style is probably one of the biggest performance hogs in The Sims 3, actually. Well, I suppose pathfinding for 200 Sims at the same time is a killer, too. You ever seen a Sim, object or, well, anything load in late or be completely white for 5-10 seconds after it loads? Or a Sim just standing there for a Sim hour before changing clothes? That's due to Create-a-Style. No textures are baked-in, since the player can do whatever with it, so it has to be done on the fly, every single time.

Now, granted, a limited version where you can only change color and not texture would be less of a drain, of course, but Create-a-Style, while awesome, was not a lightweight thing.
Yeah, this feature is not one I'm not angry about it being missing. A simple color wheel would be a good substitution though.
 

Artanisix

Member
Just played around with the Create-a-Sims for Sims 4. It makes me more depressed because the creation system is actually really nice. Hopefully mods can help this game out bigtime.
 

A-V-B

Member
Create-a-Style is probably one of the biggest performance hogs in The Sims 3, actually. Well, I suppose pathfinding for 200 Sims at the same time is a killer, too. You ever seen a Sim, object or, well, anything load in late or be completely white for 5-10 seconds after it loads? Or a Sim just standing there for a Sim hour before changing clothes? That's due to Create-a-Style. No textures are baked-in, since the player can do whatever with it, so it has to be done on the fly, every single time.

Now, granted, a limited version where you can only change color and not texture would be less of a drain, of course, but Create-a-Style, while awesome, was not a lightweight thing.

Would it still be a performance hog today? If Sims 4 was 64 bit, with our improved computers compared to Sims 3's release era...
 
Well, the Create-a-Sim demo just released for everyone on Origin, so if you want to see it, it's under Demos and Betas there. Can't really link it, since Origin insists on being in Danish on the web for me.

I'm giving it a try, at least.

Nice, thanks for the heads up. The CAS stuff is one of the main features that looks interesting in Sims 4. Everything else... eh, not so much.
 

McNum

Member
Would it still be a performance hog today? If Sims 4 was 64 bit, with our improved computers compared to Sims 3's release era...
Probably, yes. At least relative to the rest of the game. Look at Spore. That game was built from the ground up to handle procedural animation and texturing of the creatures in it, and it did that part well. That's pretty much the level of dedication you need to do Create-a-Style properly. The entire game engine has to be set up to run that.

And I'm getting the feeling that Sims 4's Engine has been set up with performance in mind. Heavy features like an open world and Create-a-Style have been sacrificed with just one purpose in mind: The game has to run smoothly on as many PCs as possible, and if gameplay sacrifices have to be made, so be it.

I mean, the Create-a-Sim demo has a "Laptop Mode" toggle in options that simplifies the rendering to conserve power, it seems. Now that is something that you can't just bolt on, if it works as intended.
 
So I finally tried the Create-a-Sim demo. As expected, the interface is a significant improvement over any Sims game in the past. To be honest I wouldn't be surprised if all PC-based character creators in any game would begin to follow this approach. Sliders just don't cut it anymore.

One thing that was slightly weird was the ambiguity in how to select specific body parts and manipulating them. There is, for instance, a way to select the entire face and push it in/out and left/right/up/down, but you can't get to it easily. If you try to do this when your Sim is directly facing you you'll only select one specific thing (eyebrows, cheeks, etc.). You have to kind of find the angle at which you'll find the option to move some of the more obscure "sliders".

The manipulation of non-face body parts is unfortunately not as deep as the manipulation you get with the face. You can't, for instance, change whether your biceps are bigger than your triceps. In fact, arm adjustment is limited to thick -> skinny. There's no additional dimension of customization of the skeleton there. Same goes for shoulders, legs or anything really. You can only make them tick/big or skinny/small, that's it.

Lastly, the lack of create-a-style. I think even just letting you change the color, not necessarily the texture, would've gone a long way to preserve the complexity of create-a-style. As it is it's very simplistic and we're back to Sims 2 levels of rigidity.

So overall I got a good first impression of Create-a-Sim, but unfortunately I have the feeling that this it, this is where the game peaks. Once I actually start playing I feel the rest of the as good as CAS.

On that note of memes, have you seen the reward they're giving The Sims 3 veterans? I mean, look at that thing: The ULTIMATE Freezer Bunny.

Yes that's a golden statue of the Freezer Bunny standing on a Llama and holding a Plumbob. This is a good example of the humor being... off. The Freezer Bunny thing was just a silly easter egg that someone at Maxis liked to put in strange, strange places. So named because it was first found in a freezer.

But this just screams "It exists, therefore it is funny!" And no... it's really not. It's like those "Epic Movie" films. It takes more than just a reference to be actually funny. Sims 1 and 2 had that oldschool Airplane-ish deadpan going on. Absurd people in serious situations, and Sims got very, very absurd sometimes. If you have Sims 2, try getting one into -1 red on the Aspiration Gauge without going totally into Aspiration Failure and then just watch. The romance Sim making out with a mop, the fortune Sim panhandling at the sidewalk, the family Sim cuddling a sack of flour. So sad, and yet so funny. And a bit creepy. And I mean, this, in real life, would be a serious situation, people seeing the lives come apart and not seeing a way out of it. That's awful, and tragically common. But Sims take the crazy route and make out with a mop. That's funny.

Sims 3 didn't really have any of that. And the Insane trait was just disappointing. "Look, he's fishing in a swimming pool? Isn't that just random?!" No, but I do have a soft spot for the fact that EA actually made it so he could catch something like that. That makes it a little funny. Sims 3 was just... so safe. Bad things couldn't really happen, the worst that could happen to a Sim was losing a loved one or have a bad breakup. And that lasted 48 Sim hours and then that was done with.

The point I'm trying to make is that for humor to exist, tragedy must be possible somehow. That and building up a "perfect life" and then send it crashing into flames (sometimes literally) and trying to rebuild from there is probably the most fun in the games. Adultery, death, money trouble, unwanted pregnancies. The soap opera tropes, really. A serious drama of relationships, life and death, played out by some very, very absurd people.

I will say one thing in favor of The Sims 3's humor, though. I had never, until Sims 3, seen a fairy get abducted by aliens before. So, kudos to the game on that one.

I definitely agree with you here. The way humor and presentation was approached in Sims 1 was actually where I feel was the strongest. I agree with you on the comparison to Airplane in terms of deadpan humor. I loved the presentation in general of Sims 1, it was very reminiscent of "1950s nuclear family". Very restrained but on-point delivery of the different elements. The music, for instance, was insanely good. The 1950s-era TV sitcom music mixed with Latin Jazz and especially the contemporary piano pieces in Build Mode were just spectacular. Sims 2 onward we just got generic whimsical tween-pop "happy" music. I wish they would bring back that much more sophisticated presentation on the surface. It makes the deadpan humor stand out all the better. When everything is happy and perky like in Sims 3/4 it's all monotone, even when they try to include "absurdist" humor in there. There's just no "playing it straight" moments to contrast the absurd stuff with. Nothing tops grabbing the "classical" family from the Sims 1, getting the Business-track father of the house, and tell him to go to a Superstar lot and try karaoke for the first time.
 
Yeah, the Create a Sim demo is pretty cool. The UI and options for messing around and making unique looking faces is pretty great compared to The Sims 3. The lack of clear sliders on some of the features can be a little confusing since adjusting things is sometimes based on the camera angle. The body sliders and modifications aren't as substantial as I was thinking but its all pretty neat.

Makes it a bit of a shame that the rest of the game seems so underwhelming. Maybe this will be a worthwhile game after a couple expansion packs.
 

Viv

Neo Member
Just played the create a Sim Demo. Was not that impressed. Not enough to pay US$99 for a game that has to be downloaded. I lost Guild Wars2 this year when my hard drive fried, and was unrecoverable, and have not been able to play it again because I couldn't find their key and they are not very helpful.
Didn't have that problem with Blizzard games , all I needed was my account name etc. but I don't know how origin works.. I have external drive now that I save important stuff on .They say you don't have to be online to play ( except for the upgrades) so should be able to buy hard copy.
As to Sims 4 .
I have only played sims 1 and 2 . Have all the sims 2 expansions, but when I decided to play again this year I did not include some of the expansions vacation etc, because I thought it would prevent extra loading time.
My granddaughter, just turned 5 , is now a big fan of the game.
She starts off by making a family , mother , father and toddler She has enjoyed making silly faces , I only help her with names, and that is assisting her spelling and recognition of letters a lot. then she places her family in neighbourhood. I didn't even know you could join existing families until she did it.
Then she has to make sure to buy cot etc for toddler, and a swimming pool is a must. I just clear the area and she makes it, places everything and she gets all the characters to jump in.
She has a whole neighborhood to herself and when she goes back she looks to see which families have a toddler that might become a child. I downloaded a lot of extra designs made by wonderfully talented people out there. Without them I wouldn't bother playing game as the designs that come with game, even with all packs are really boring.
Anyway , where I am going is no way would I now consider buying sims 4 until the entire game plus "free " add-ons are as good as my sims2
 

Mr_Zombie

Member
I tried the Create A Sim demo. The new UI works fine, although I still have few problems with it:
  • it's a little bit chaotic and scattered; as McNum said, there's no "start here" point - you just get a Sim, a bunch of controls scattered around the screen and it's hard to grasp it at first where's what. For example, I created two sims and when I wanted to save the family only then did I realize (well, the game nagged me about that) that I haven't named them yet; I didn't notice the name input in the top left corner, because I was focused on sims themselves;
  • why are head accessories (glasses, earrings etc.) in a separate category than other accessories; and why does the other accessories have "glasses" icon then when glasses are not there?
  • I like the intuitive of select & drag interface, but I think it would still be good if after selecting a body part the game showed you optional sliders if you want to fine tune your character's features; currently the tool depends too much on camera angle when it comes to selecting and modifying body parts;
  • the lack of create-a-style hurts; I like the selection of clothes, hair styles etc., but the color and texture selection is really limited. Some clothes only have three or four color/texture variations :/ Also, no highlights. IIRC in Sims 3 you could choose your main hair color AND additionally choose highlights color giving you much more options on hair styles. Not here. :/
  • a minor annoyance, but if you change the hairstyle of your Sim from the randomized one, you have to change it for each clothing category (formal, sport, party etc.) separately, because after changing category it will default to the one you started with;
  • as EatinOlives said, while the face modification is pretty robust, body parts modifications is very simple; it's still good that I can give my sim a bubble butt and big thighs or make him skinny fat, or give my female sim a wasp waist and big pointy breasts (I tried to recreate original Lara Croft :p), but you're still very limited with what you can do here.
  • no body hair (j/k)
    or not
  • family photos look lifeless; I remember in Sims 2 and 3 family members were doing weird stuff depending on their relationships and character; here - they are just standing. Maybe that's only for the CAS demo purpose.

Create-a-Style is probably one of the biggest performance hogs in The Sims 3, actually. Well, I suppose pathfinding for 200 Sims at the same time is a killer, too. You ever seen a Sim, object or, well, anything load in late or be completely white for 5-10 seconds after it loads? Or a Sim just standing there for a Sim hour before changing clothes? That's due to Create-a-Style. No textures are baked-in, since the player can do whatever with it, so it has to be done on the fly, every single time.

I'm not an expert, but couldn't those textures be dumped into a file instead of recreating them on the fly every single time you load a game? Not to mention, with Sims 3 you had a whole neighborhood where each household and each sim could have a lot of custom textures. Here we're back to a single parcel so just that should help improve the performance.
 

Yrael

Member
I definitely agree with you here. The way humor and presentation was approached in Sims 1 was actually where I feel was the strongest. I agree with you on the comparison to Airplane in terms of deadpan humor. I loved the presentation in general of Sims 1, it was very reminiscent of "1950s nuclear family". Very restrained but on-point delivery of the different elements. The music, for instance, was insanely good. The 1950s-era TV sitcom music mixed with Latin Jazz and especially the contemporary piano pieces in Build Mode were just spectacular. Sims 2 onward we just got generic whimsical tween-pop "happy" music. I wish they would bring back that much more sophisticated presentation on the surface. It makes the deadpan humor stand out all the better. When everything is happy and perky like in Sims 3/4 it's all monotone, even when they try to include "absurdist" humor in there. There's just no "playing it straight" moments to contrast the absurd stuff with. Nothing tops grabbing the "classical" family from the Sims 1, getting the Business-track father of the house, and tell him to go to a Superstar lot and try karaoke for the first time.

Oh boy, that brings back so many memories. The atmosphere created by the music was something I loved from the original Sims - one of the first things I'd do in any new game was to buy a stereo and turn the channel over to Latin music. This track from the Sims 3 comes close.
 

Koomaster

Member
family photos look lifeless; I remember in Sims 2 and 3 family members were doing weird stuff depending on their relationships and character; here - they are just standing. Maybe that's only for the CAS demo purpose.
I'm guessing demo purposes as I couldn't find a way to set family relationships anyway before I saved the household.

Speaking of which, I created a gay couple tonight and since I couldn't find a way to make them spouses, I put in the description they were a gay couple. Pressed to save and I got a warning that there was a banned word in my description and I wouldn't be able to upload them to the exchange. Sure enough, took out the word gay and everything was alright.

So yeah, this may be an issue. I hope it's an oversight more than anything, Sims has usually been okay with gay couples; so don't know why they would just block the word 'gay' from being on the exchange. Don't recall this being an issue from uploading households from Sims 3. :/
 

Mr_Zombie

Member
I'm guessing demo purposes as I couldn't find a way to set family relationships anyway before I saved the household.

If you have more than one sim created, an additional button appears next to the slider where you choose sim's voice tone. You set relationships there. And yes, it's possible to set gay couples (I tried it on my first couple :p).

As I said, the UI is kind of chaotic and it's easy to miss functionality, especially if the button in question appears only in certain situations.

And it's shitty that the word "gay" is banned. I hope it's a mistake or a result of using some kind of automatic dictionary and not a conscious decision on someone's part.
 
I'm guessing demo purposes as I couldn't find a way to set family relationships anyway before I saved the household.

Speaking of which, I created a gay couple tonight and since I couldn't find a way to make them spouses, I put in the description they were a gay couple. Pressed to save and I got a warning that there was a banned word in my description and I wouldn't be able to upload them to the exchange. Sure enough, took out the word gay and everything was alright.

So yeah, this may be an issue. I hope it's an oversight more than anything, Sims has usually been okay with gay couples; so don't know why they would just block the word 'gay' from being on the exchange. Don't recall this being an issue from uploading households from Sims 3. :/
You can set the relationships in the demo. Its on the same menu as where you type in the name and choose the walk type iirc.

Edit: beaten.
 
The Sims may very well be the only franchise in the history of gaming where it is an established pattern to expect less in the sequel than all the features of the previous iteration plus expansions combined.

I was absolutely crushed to discover that there were no pets in vanilla Sims 3. Devastated. Between Sims 1 and all of the expansions of Sims 2 up to Pets, I feel, to this day, that that expansion elevated the series to places that we may not see again in games that targeted all audiences.

I am sad to see the practice being continued.
 

Mr_Zombie

Member
I think expecting sequels to incorporate what was included in expansion packs (i.e. a lot of content and functionaliy) is silly. Although I agree that pets, even basic ones (cats, dogs, birds) not being there at day one in the fourth game is annoying.

However, what hurts me more is that what was considered basic features (and a major upgrade over the previous games in the series) was taken out of Sims 4. Create-a-style and open world were game changers in the Sims 3. Knowing that you can play within a single household and yet the world around you is changing (neighbors get older or die in accidents, kids get born, people break up or get into relationships) was great. And now we're back to a single parcel :/

That said, what does Sims 4 really bring to the table? Because other than revamped UI I don't see any major features that scream "this game is better than Sims 3 so you should totally buy it".
 
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