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Microsoft Now Advertising Series S as a 1080p/60 Device

Facts are none of the games use Mesh Shaders or SFS yet, so he's correct. 3 use VRS and two of these get to 120fps as advertised, the other one is 1440p as advertised.
So he's correct.
Youre Wrong John C Mcginley GIF
 
Are you actually for real? :messenger_tears_of_joy:

The Chief Technical Officer, of 4A games, says it's difficult.

https://www.tomsguide.com/news/xbox...-for-future-games-says-metro-exodus-developer

And guess what he IS using VRS for the next gen update for Metro Exodus, along with ray tracing and all the other good stuff :messenger_tears_of_joy:

https://www.theverge.com/2021/2/16/...xbox-series-x-s-upgrades-ray-tracing-dlss-2-0


But you're convinced that he and all of the others, who have complained aren't using the features properly? And you can prove it by looking at gameplay? What gameplay have you watched of all these games. Certainly not Metro Exodus eh?

By the way, it is an impressive skill to be able look at an image and say for definite if it is or isn't using VRS. I Iean, take the image below you're able to tell that the one the left is without VRS right? Even though to a layman like me, I wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Not without an on/off comparison. It's that subtle.

BswGw6c.png


It's very convenient.

What a 🤡

That's software VRS, Series S supports hardware VRS.
 
That's software VRS, Series S supports hardware VRS.
:messenger_tears_of_joy:
The Metro Exodus studio uses Direct X 12 ultimate, how else are you supposed to implement it?

In your world you just need hardware support and not software to implement it? Ok.

Always thought they worked together.

Next time do some research, get some facts and proof before go head first into an argument you don't understand.
 
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:messenger_tears_of_joy:
Direct X 12 ultimate, how else are you supposed to implement it?

In your world you just need hardware support and not software to implement it? Ok.

Always thought they worked together.

Next time do some research, get some facts and proof before go head first into an argument you don't understand.

You have no idea what you're talking about as usual, Microsoft did a deep dive on Gears 5 it uses hardware Tier 2 VRS, same with Gears Tactics. Fact.
The Dirt 5 developer said they introduced VRS and said Mesh Shaders and SFS was "coming later". Fact.

Not one developer has said they are using Mesh Shaders or SFS yet and Jason Ronald said recently he expects the first games to use them later this year. Fact.

You provide no evidence because you can't as once again you're totally wrong.
 
You have no idea what you're talking about as usual, Microsoft did a deep dive on Gears 5 it uses hardware Tier 2 VRS, same with Gears Tactics. Fact.
The Dirt 5 developer said they introduced VRS and said Mesh Shaders and SFS was "coming later". Fact.

Not one developer has said they are using Mesh Shaders or SFS yet and Jason Ronald said recently he expects the first games to use them later this year. Fact.

You provide no evidence because you can't as once again you're totally wrong.

What on earth are you talking about?

Who cares about mesh shaders? Tell me exactly where I have ever mentioned those? :messenger_tears_of_joy:

You, just like the other fanatic, seriously don't know how to follow discussions and have obviously decided to jump straight into something you don't even understand.

Dirt 5, you might recall, I told you they implemented VRS waaay back. So I was right then.

I will fill you in though with what's going on now, since you're struggling, The Dark One's post was him ignorantly claiming none of the games use any features of the Series S. Everyone who complained about Series S weren't using these features at all. He could just tell.

And I shot that idea down, with proof and facts.

Want to argue against that point? Go ahead, but don't straw man with Mesh Shaders ffs :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
Velocity Architecture is another feature I haven't seen used. Did we get an answer to this question yet?
What is wrong with you? Actually don't answer that.

It was games aren't using Series S features at all, which I totally disproved, now attempting to move the goalposts?

I think I've seen this tactic before.:messenger_tears_of_joy:


Convienently ignoring my rebuttal post then?

Figures.
 
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Why not just play the PS5 and be happy. Why hate on something you don't own and know little about? It's so weird. You don't like the XSS? Just don't buy one. Done.
Wow, double teamed by two of the biggest Xbox fanatics. Worrying times.

If you really put your minds together, you might stumble upon a coherent argument.

It will be filled with bullshit and no facts but could potentially be coherent. :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
What on earth are you talking about?

Who cares about mesh shaders? Tell me exactly where I have ever mentioned those? :messenger_tears_of_joy:

You, just like the other fanatic, seriously don't know how to follow discussions and have obviously decided to jump straight into something you don't even understand.

Dirt 5, you might recall, I told you they implemented VRS waaay back. So I was right then.

I will fill you in though with what's going on now, since you're struggling, The Dark One's post was him ignorantly claiming none of the games use any features of the Series S. Everyone who complained about Series S weren't using these features at all. He could just tell.

And I shot that idea down, with proof and facts.

Want to argue against that point? Go ahead, but don't straw man with Mesh Shaders ffs :messenger_tears_of_joy:
Hate, hate, hate and name call. It's pretty sad bro. You tell me to do better yet you keep your arguments in the trash can. You can't show XSS games using the full feature set of the system because currently they aren't any. When those games come out we can address how well they were implemented and if it addresses the issues the devs were complaining about. We can also use MS's first party efforts to get a real gage of what the system is capable of, a control of sorts. Until then it's just noise. Like said go enjoy your PS5 you clearly don't know anything about the XSS.
 
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Hate, hate, hate and name call. It's pretty sad bro. You tell me to do better yet you keep your arguments in the trash can. You can't show XSS games using the full feature set of the system because currently they aren't any. When those game come out we can address how well they were implemented and if it addresses the issues the devs were complaining about. We can also use MS's first party efforts to get a real gage of what the system is capable of, a control of sorts. Until then it's just noise. Like said go enjoy your PS5 you clearly don't know anything about the XSS.
Hate?

Actually I hate bullshit, which you constantly talk.

The problem I have with Series S is it's a hindrance to next gen development. Which has been proven, just read the interviews.

You state, these complaints don't count because no games use any Series S features yet. Well...

.. the Chief Technical Officer of 4A games, says it's difficult to develop with, and for his next gen upgrade he is using VRS, Raytracing and many more goodies.

You said he was using none. You could just tell right?

That level of delusion to worrying.

In summary empathically prove you wrong. And you still believe you're right.

Like all the other discussions with you.

What do you contribute except ignorant claims? Hating on developers. SonyToo. And all sorts of troll posts and conspiracy theories.

you clearly don't know anything about the XSS.

And why's that?
Excited Jimmy Fallon GIF by The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon
 
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What on earth are you talking about?

Who cares about mesh shaders? Tell me exactly where I have ever mentioned those? :messenger_tears_of_joy:

You, just like the other fanatic, seriously don't know how to follow discussions and have obviously decided to jump straight into something you don't even understand.

Dirt 5, you might recall, I told you they implemented VRS waaay back. So I was right then.

I will fill you in though with what's going on now, since you're struggling, The Dark One's post was him ignorantly claiming none of the games use any features of the Series S. Everyone who complained about Series S weren't using these features at all. He could just tell.

And I shot that idea down, with proof and facts.

Want to argue against that point? Go ahead, but don't straw man with Mesh Shaders ffs :messenger_tears_of_joy:

He said that not all the hardware features were being used yet, you disputed that.
You were asked what games released so far are using Mesh Shaders and SFS, you haven't answered because there aren't any and your wrong.
 
I'd like to see you buy a more capable console for less money.
Capable has many definitions.
The machine is overpriced,will be the bottleneck for XSX and become a expensive headache when someone wants to upgrade the measly 364gb(available) storage.

Needs a price drop and or a bigger storage option as $300 + $220 isn't feasible as one would be way better off just buying a XSX.
 
He said that not all the hardware features were being used yet, you disputed that.
You were asked what games released so far are using Mesh Shaders and SFS, you haven't answered because there aren't any and your wrong.

Wrong again. How many times is that now? Go back to the start and read, I don't understand why you find it so difficult to keep up.

Actually, don't worry, I will help. His actual & original quote:
Keep seeing the same line about how XSS is 'holding back' next gen and can't point to any evidence that that is true. Same comments from devs complaining about optimizing challenges with the XSS but none of those devs are actually using the features to mitigate the challenges they are having.

Which part of the above suggests he scoped the argument to just hardware?

You were asked what games released so far are using Mesh Shaders and SFS, you haven't answered because there aren't any and your wrong.
Why was I even asked that in the first place?

Am I apparently disputing this? Where?

Series S features includes VRS right and Raytracing, yeah? Which is shipping with the next gen update of Metro Exodus = the point.



Mesh shaders literally has nothing to do with this conversation. :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
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Capable has many definitions.
The machine is overpriced,will be the bottleneck for XSX and become a expensive headache when someone wants to upgrade the measly 364gb(available) storage.

Needs a price drop and or a bigger storage option as $300 + $220 isn't feasible as one would be way better off just buying a XSX.
Storage is awful for a next gen machine.

Especially when it's being used as a GamePass machine.
 
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That was your reply when I said that only three games use Tier 2 VRS and none use Mesh Shaders or SFS, which is what Darkmagic was talking about when he says Devs arent using all the hardware features.

So show us the games that are using SFS and Mesh Shaders.
 
all console clearly do not reflect (at the moment) the characteristics much discussed by their respective manufacturers pr.
the s series without ML Super Resolution will remain a 1080p (or less in future) console. The ps5 without I / O optimization (by now we understand that only the first party will exploit it) will not see any improvement due to the speed of the SSD. The X series without the use of the mesh shader + sfs + vrs + ml will not see the difference given by the 12 tf of power + cpu and + bw
We are in the March after a November console launch. Your presumption of what "we understand" is ridiculous.
 
Better sooner rather than later tbh; I'm pretty sure when more of the next-gen features start getting used 1440p will be more of a reality consistently on Series S, but for now most games are getting closer to the 1080p mark and that's basically what people with the system will perceive it as for the time being.

Doesn't really hurt its value proposition all that much, because there ARE games hitting that resolution @ 60 FPS, they just aren't that prevalent currently. Once 1440p60 becomes more of the rule rather than the exception, then hype up that 1440p60 performance more.
 
Capable has many definitions.
The machine is overpriced,will be the bottleneck for XSX and become a expensive headache when someone wants to upgrade the measly 364gb(available) storage.

Needs a price drop and or a bigger storage option as $300 + $220 isn't feasible as one would be way better off just buying a XSX.
Oh I can define capable. It is clear. Show a device that offers all the features the XSS has for the same or less money. Pretty sure you can't do it. You can't buy a PC that has the same specs for $300 and you can't buy a console with the better specs for $300. The storage on the system is easily upgradeable with a regular HDD it is not a headache at all. OK maybe a minor one as you move the games around that you actually want to play. Still easier than re-downloading them though. It was never a requirement you buy the proprietary memory card.

It will drop in price though as time goes on so maybe in a year or 2 it will be $250. It will be an even better deal then.

And why's that?
Excited Jimmy Fallon GIF by The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon
You started typing and it was clear you had more of an agenda than any salient point. No different than any other random console warrior on the forum sadly. It's my fault for thinking you were arguing in good faith but I get it now. Yes, yes Xbox bad I get it.
 
That was your reply when I said that only three games use Tier 2 VRS and none use Mesh Shaders or SFS, which is what Darkmagic was talking about when he says Devs arent using all the hardware features.

So show us the games that are using SFS and Mesh Shaders.
Your final sentence of your post was this:
So he's correct
Which was you summarising, right?

Which is what I was referring to. And it isn't true at all.

"Darkmagic" (wtf :messenger_tears_of_joy: ), said this in his next message:

It's easy. You'd see the results. Games using VRS exhibit certain artifacts when implemented. It is also pretty evident that most developers, especially during this cross gen period, are simply using the techniques used during the last generation. It's not surprising that time will be needed to get up to speed with the latest techniques. I am glad to hear you don't like opinions presented as facts. I'm sure you'll jump up and correct @onnextflix5 when he makes claims about the XSS 'holding the gen back' right? Surely you wouldn't stand for that!

Clearly indicating that he was specifically referring to VRS. :messenger_tears_of_joy:

And he can physically see results of it not being implemented, which is an amazing feat.

So no he wasn't referring to mesh shaders.

Can he not reply for himself by the way?
 
Your final sentence of your post was this:

Which was you summarising, right?

Which is what I was referring to. And it isn't true at all.

"Darkmagic" (wtf :messenger_tears_of_joy: ), said this in his next message:



Clearly indicating that he was specifically referring to VRS. :messenger_tears_of_joy:

And he can physically see results of it not being implemented, which is an amazing feat.

So no he wasn't referring to mesh shaders.

Can he not reply for himself by the way?

What he actually said,

"XSS but none of those devs are actually using the features to mitigate the challenges they are having."

Features.
As in plural, as in the full suite of RDNA2 hardware support. That includes VRS, SFS and Mesh Shaders. That's why it's plural.
So he is correct like I said.
 
You started typing and it was clear you had more of an agenda than any salient point. No different than any other random console warrior on the forum sadly. It's my fault for thinking you were arguing in good faith but I get it now. Yes, yes Xbox bad I get it.

You sprout ignorant claims about developers not being able to do their job properly and lambast them for daring to highlight the limitations of a little plastic boy and I'm the fanboy?! :messenger_tears_of_joy:

What on earth is wrong with you, so I highlight that a developer has actually proven you wrong, on ALL accounts, and you can't accept that, so I must also hate Microsoft?

That's very convenient.:messenger_tears_of_joy:

I've said it before but how about some facts, proof and some substance in your next discussion maybe? It's getting very dull correcting you all the time.
 
What he actually said,

"XSS but none of those devs are actually using the features to mitigate the challenges they are having."

Features.
As in plural, as in the full suite of RDNA2 hardware support. That includes VRS, SFS and Mesh Shaders. That's why it's plural.
So he is correct like I said.
Arguing over plurals and singular now, always a sign of a healthy argument.:messenger_tears_of_joy:

He couldn't see the VRS being used. That was his 'proof', just how silly is that?

They are also ray tracing and whole host of next gen stuff. All optimized shaders, so it's hardly like the developers are incompetent, which he implies.

Suggest you read on the features they are shipping with by the way. Actually get upto speed.

But it's weird you're having to explain to me what he has said.. are you his big bro? Did he ask you to get involved?

Noticed he sends you love hearts on a lot of your posts. Weird to see around here.
 
Oh I can define capable. It is clear. Show a device that offers all the features the XSS has for the same or less money. Pretty sure you can't do it. You can't buy a PC that has the same specs for $300 and you can't buy a console with the better specs for $300. The storage on the system is easily upgradeable with a regular HDD it is not a headache at all. OK maybe a minor one as you move the games around that you actually want to play. Still easier than re-downloading them though. It was never a requirement you buy the proprietary memory card.

It will drop in price though as time goes on so maybe in a year or 2 it will be $250. It will be an even better deal then.


You started typing and it was clear you had more of an agenda than any salient point. No different than any other random console warrior on the forum sadly. It's my fault for thinking you were arguing in good faith but I get it now. Yes, yes Xbox bad I get it.
Capable has many meanings for example...
PS4 Pro has and will have more 4K/fake 4K games.
More storage/more storage options as external usb drives can't play xss/XSX games but they can play Pro made games.
Physical Media isn't a option on xss.
But by going by just the few above examples the xss is less capable to another similar spec mid gen console.

Agenda? More like lets call the xss what it really is a overpriced,less capable,underpowered,mid generational option that's laughably bad compared to other options including MS own XSX.
 
You sprout ignorant claims about developers not being able to do their job properly and lambast them for daring to highlight the limitations of a little plastic boy and I'm the fanboy?! :messenger_tears_of_joy:

What on earth is wrong with you, so I highlight that a developer has actually proven you wrong, on ALL accounts, and you can't accept that, so I must also hate Microsoft?

That's very convenient.:messenger_tears_of_joy:

I've said it before but how about some facts, proof and some substance in your next discussion maybe? It's getting very dull correcting you all the time.
I wouldn't waste my time those two walk hand and hand to defend xb and troll ps threads.
 
Capable has many meanings for example...
PS4 Pro has and will have more 4K/fake 4K games.
More storage/more storage options as external usb drives can't play xss/XSX games but they can play Pro made games.
Physical Media isn't a option on xss.
But by going by just the few above examples the xss is less capable to another similar spec mid gen console.

Agenda? More like lets call the xss what it really is a overpriced,less capable,underpowered,mid generational option that's laughably bad compared to other options including MS own XSX.


Don't upset him, he will set Riky on you.
 
Arguing over plurals and singular now, always a sign of a healthy argument.:messenger_tears_of_joy:

He couldn't see the VRS being used. That was his 'proof', just how silly is that?

They are also ray tracing and whole host of next gen stuff. All optimized shaders, so it's hardly like the developers are incompetent, which he implies.

Suggest you read on the features they are shipping with by the way. Actually get upto speed.

But it's weird you're having to explain to me what he has said.. are you his big bro? Did he ask you to get involved?

Noticed he sends you love hearts on a lot of your posts. Weird to see around here.

I just like correcting people who are wrong.
Ray Tracing is not a performance saving feature, so it's irrelevant to this discussion.
They are using hardware VRS, as they have stated, let's see how it actually runs on Series S before we jump to conclusions. He didn't say the developers are incompetent, he said they are not using all the hardware features, they aren't so he's right.
 
Arguing over plurals and singular now, always a sign of a healthy argument.:messenger_tears_of_joy:

He couldn't see the VRS being used. That was his 'proof', just how silly is that?

They are also ray tracing and whole host of next gen stuff. All optimized shaders, so it's hardly like the developers are incompetent, which he implies.

Suggest you read on the features they are shipping with by the way. Actually get upto speed.

But it's weird you're having to explain to me what he has said.. are you his big bro? Did he ask you to get involved?

Noticed he sends you love hearts on a lot of your posts. Weird to see around here.
So what are you doing now? You trying to prove those developers are using the features of the XSS and still can't get their games to work? If that's true you should be able to show that pretty easily. No one is calling any dev lazy or bad only that the feature set of the XSS isn't being used to its full potential yet complaints are still coming. It's like tying an arm behind your back and complaining about how hard it is to do push ups.

Rather than worrying about Riky Riky or myself being 'fanatics' and calling us names for us pointing our your lack of a good point why not make your case by listing the games using the features we stated repeated are not being used. It shouldn't be that hard since you don't think we are telling the truth. I know you mentioned Dirt 5 and Gears 5. Aside from neither of those games using the full suite of features either, those devs ARE NOT COMPLAINING.
 
Still at $300 bucks that will have a good amount of life and a vast amount of games to play thanks to Gamepass and it's grown 1st party output. I could care less about the resolution. That's why the SX exists.
 
That's software VRS, Series S supports hardware VRS.

I just like correcting people who are wrong.
Ray Tracing is not a performance saving feature, so it's irrelevant to this discussion.
They are using hardware VRS, as they have stated, let's see how it actually runs on Series S before we jump to conclusions. He didn't say the developers are incompetent, he said they are not using all the hardware features, they aren't so he's right.
Weird.

They were using software VRS earlier according to you.
 
Forza Horizon at 1080p/60 is a damn good time.

Microsoft is going to sell a shit ton of these during the Holidays when they get discounted.
 
You said I said devs were lying. This wasn't true and your strawman was refuted. Devs needing to optimize their titles to run on ANY console has been true since the dawn of programming of video games. I take a dev complaining without any commentary of efforts to fix the issue as seriously a person complaining about how hard it is to eat steak without using a knife and fork. The XSS has features to deal with its shortcomings and it also has a multi trillion dollar company available to support any dev that needs it. MS is making XSS titles too.

So what are you doing now? You trying to prove those developers are using the features of the XSS and still can't get their games to work? If that's true you should be able to show that pretty easily. No one is calling any dev lazy or bad only that the feature set of the XSS isn't being used to its full potential yet complaints are still coming. It's like tying an arm behind your back and complaining about how hard it is to do push ups.

Rather than worrying about Riky Riky or myself being 'fanatics' and calling us names for us pointing our your lack of a good point why not make your case by listing the games using the features we stated repeated are not being used. It shouldn't be that hard since you don't think we are telling the truth. I know you mentioned Dirt 5 and Gears 5. Aside from neither of those games using the full suite of features either, those devs ARE NOT COMPLAINING.

Yeh just assume they are incompetent until they provide evidence, I guess eh? Very mature.

Its a good job the legal system doesn't work like this.

4A games have difficulty with your cherished box, and they are doing a next gen patch with multiple features. Despite your claims to the contrary.

It proves they are technically capable after all, believe it or not.

And they still have complaints about it.

You're going to have to get over it and make peace with it, that skilled developers are limited / held back by it.

calling us names for us pointing our your lack of a good point
You've pointed out my lack of a good point?

I literally disproved with evidence your ignorant claim. Which you've ignored completely.

So I'm surprised I haven't made a good point, when you've managed to contradict yourselves and even each other :messenger_tears_of_joy: .

I try and keep these discussions honest I've only ever been interested in disproving your original (very embarrassing) quote.

No moving goal posts from me.

You trying to prove those developers are using the features of the XSS and still can't get their games to work? If that's true you should be able to show that pretty easily.

I have proven it. The CTO of the studio even said himself by describing the experience developing for your favourite box.

How about you prove that he is lying? Since you said he is struggling because using no next-gen features.

Or still ignoring that one? Don't blame you.

Just continue to straw man. Or ask Riky to reply for you.
 
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I'm sure by then people will want to be playing new games.

Unless I've missed some sarcasm? If so, well played.

Sarcasm? Nope. Nothing wrong with 1080p/60, its how i play the vast majority of my games.

The discounted Xbox One Digital was a huge hit during the holidays so i expect nothing less from the Series S.
 
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Hardware on Xbox
Software on PlayStation

Like you said, do your research.
What on earth..

What could possibly be the reason to bring up anything regarding PlayStation?

Why is that relevant to developers struggling with the Xbox Series S?

But listen, I'm going to be honest.. I'm very, very bored right now arguing with you both in tandem.

With your post above, I think deep down you realise this discussion is going no where.

Nothing here is personal but when someone ignorantly makes claims, people should be able to back it up with facts, not believe it purely based on their own delusions / allegiance.

The particular user in question is notorious for this.
 
Completely different:

The 8K Logo on the PS5 is about the HDMI 2.1 Output resolution

The 1440p/60 fps of the Xbox Series S was about the internal game rendering resolution

Don't try to compare the two
Go back and look at the old posts on here. Anybody who knows much about tech knew it wasn't a 1440p/60fps machine. Resolution wise that's 78% more pixels to push over 1080p with a mere 10GB of RAM.

Series S is only worth buying if you have no option for a more expensive machine, but you'd still be better off sticking with your current-gen console for another year or two, and saving the money for a real next-gen console.
 
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