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JB1981 · Sep 28, 2006

The non-answers can be found here --- http://gear.ign.com/articles/735/735860p1.html

mysticstylez · Sep 28, 2006

I'm glad 1080p doesn't mean anything to me right now. Hell I can't even afford a TV that displays at 720p.

Y2Kev · Sep 28, 2006

In the world of high-definition displays 1080p = 1920 x 1080 progressive scan. It isn't algebra, it just looks like it. Videogames have made the jump to High-Def, but understanding all this resolution, HDMI, HDCP, AACS, ICT and other techno babble is actually more confusing than your average equation.

I hate articles that entertain this premise that understanding a few basic terms and ideas is so difficult and confusing.

Shogmaster · Sep 28, 2006

JB1981 said:
The non-answers can be found here --- http://gear.ign.com/articles/735/735860p1.html

WTF, dude? We went over this like a million time in other threads! Just because IGN is dumb as bricks and can't ask the right question doesn't mean we have to retread this dead horse here YET AGAIN.

DreamMachine · Sep 28, 2006

Shogmaster said:
WTF, dude? We went over this like a million time in other threads! Just because IGN is dumb as bricks and can't ask the right question doesn't mean we have to retread this dead horse here YET AGAIN.

thank you, this is unnessary

mood · Sep 28, 2006

How are they dancing around 1080p?

IGN: Will games begin to be developed with 1080p as the native resolution, or is the 360's new 1080p support an advance in the console's internal scaling abilities?

Microsoft: If developed, the Xbox 360 will support playback of native 1080p games and all existing Xbox 360 titles can be up-scaled to 1080p.

JB1981 said:
No, they did ask the right questions. Those people who don't have a VGA monitor that supports 1080p want to know how the 1080p "support" is going to be useful to them. IGN asked how, exactly, MS is going to provide 1080p without HDMI. I think it's time MS comes up with a satisfactory answer to that. Because if they don't, it's all a bunch of PR hot air.

Cant you get 1080p through component for games and marketplace movies? On the other side, I dont see why Microsoft doesnt just release an HDMI cable when the HDDVD is released. The people that want it will buy and those that dont wont. Dont see the big deal bu whatever.

JB1981 · Sep 28, 2006

Shogmaster said:
WTF, dude? We went over this like a million time in other threads! Just because IGN is dumb as bricks and can't ask the right question doesn't mean we have to retread this dead horse here YET AGAIN.

No, they did ask the right questions. Those people who don't have a VGA monitor that supports 1080p want to know how the 1080p "support" is going to be useful to them. IGN asked how, exactly, MS is going to provide 1080p without HDMI. I think it's time MS comes up with a satisfactory answer to that. Because if they don't, it's all a bunch of PR hot air.

And please, shog, don't feign outrage because you can't tolerate a thread that calls out MS on their announcements because you want to see it locked.

Shogmaster · Sep 28, 2006

JB1981 said:
No, they did ask the right questions. Those people who don't have a VGA monitor that supports 1080p want to know how the 1080p "support" is going to be useful to them. IGN asked how, exactly, MS is going to provide 1080p without HDMI. I think it's time MS comes up with a satisfactory answer to that. Because if they don't, it's all a bunch of PR hot air.

And please, shog, don't feign outrage because you can't tolerate a thread that calls out MS on their announcements because you want to see it locked.

BS. I call this crap thread because WE LEARNED THE CORRECT ANSWER ALREADY. It's over and done with. Amir confirmed what we needed to know and I even made a damn chart for you numbnuts!

Rookies1stDay · Sep 28, 2006

Oh god another 1080p thread. Seriously, all 3 of you with 1080p tvs should just get on aim chat and yell at each other there

Kleegamefan · Sep 28, 2006

IGN: There are very few 1080p native HDTVs that accept 1080p via Component connections. The signal will only come in as 1080i and be de-interlaced back to 1080p. How is the 360's new 1080p support, in practical application, going to be any different than what was already possible?

Microsoft: We can offer 1080p support through both the VGA connection and the Component connection.

Didnt Amirm @ avsforums say 1080p over VGA *only*?

Kleegamefan · Sep 28, 2006

Rookies1stDay said:
Oh god another 1080p thread. Seriously, all 3 of you with 1080p tvs should just get on aim chat and yell at each other there

Somebody hasn't been an active poster in the sticky, I see...

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101246

Shogmaster · Sep 28, 2006

Kleegamefan said:
Didnt Amirm @ avsforums say 1080p over VGA *only*?

Amir said 1080p through Component for games and downloaded movies too.

edit: I WANT EVERYONE TO LEARN THIS GODDAMN CHART ONCE AND FOR ALL!

sangreal · Sep 28, 2006

Kleegamefan said:
Didnt Amirm @ avsforums say 1080p over VGA *only*?

for hd-dvd movies. 1080p over component for games if you even have a TV that supports it

Kleegamefan · Sep 28, 2006

Shogmaster said:
Amir said 1080p through Component for games and downloaded movies too.

Oh, OK

I thought I read VGA only somewhere.....

JB1981 · Sep 28, 2006

Kleegamefan said:
Didnt Amirm @ avsforums say 1080p over VGA *only*?

I don't know. Is that what he wrote on the forums over there? This also begs the question, shog, how the **** are people going to get 1080p from the HD-DVD add-on.

So they're releasing an update and designing an add-on that'll work properly with 1% of the TVs available on today's market. Great.

sangreal · Sep 28, 2006

btw, we have had this thread like 3 times already. I dont see any new info in the article

Shogmaster · Sep 28, 2006

sangreal said:
btw, we have had this thread like 3 times already. I dont see any new info in the article

Fvck any new info, these dumbfvck at IGN are making us regress! :lol

Sgt. Killjoy · Sep 28, 2006

i wanna know why 1080i isn't good enough

Kleegamefan · Sep 28, 2006

JB1981 said:
I don't know. Is that what he wrote on the forums over there? This also begs the question, shog, how the **** are people going to get 1080p from the HD-DVD add-on.

So they're releasing an update and designing an add-on that'll work properly with 1% of the TVs available on today's market. Great.

Its much more than 1% of the TVs out there.....probably around 1/4 of all the new *HDTVs* coming out are 1080p....every single manufacturer has at least a 1080p model (Pioneer Plasma) and most have a full lineup of 1080p TVs (~50% of Samsungs DLP RPTVs are 1080p)

And of course, the proportion of 1080p to 720p HDTVs available are only growing with time, in favor of 1080p....

In other words, of all the new HDTVs coming out, 1080p models are a pretty good chunk....$2K(and below) price points of 1080p DLPs, LCD flat panels and SXRDs have helped alot in this regard...

Shogmaster · Sep 28, 2006

JB1981 said:
I don't know. Is that what he wrote on the forums over there? This also begs the question, shog, how the **** are people going to get 1080p from the HD-DVD add-on.

VGA.

So they're releasing an update and designing an add-on that'll work properly with 1% of the TVs available on today's market. Great.

1~3% vs 3~5%. 1080p makes both connections a loser in the market anyways. :lol

Bad_Boy · Sep 28, 2006

Shogmaster said:
edit: I WANT EVERYONE TO LEARN THIS GODDAMN CHART ONCE AND FOR ALL!

wtf, why cant you use vga on ps3? a simple hdmi to vga/dvi converter should solve that, no?

Shogmaster · Sep 28, 2006

Bad_Boy said:
wtf, why cant you use vga on ps3? a simple hdmi to vga/dvi converter should solve that, no?

I don't think HDMI sends out analog signal.

bill0527 · Sep 28, 2006

I knew this would show up on GAF right after I read it about an hour ago over at IGN.

The only real question about the article showing up here would be just who exactly would post it - I had it narrowed down to either: Monkeymagic, JB1981, or Onix as those three always seem to show up in threads (or create new threads) just giddy as a bunch of schoolgirls whenever there is questionable or bad Xbox news.

But yeah, there's nothing new in this article that hasn't been discussed ad naseum over the last week in various other 1080p threads.

sonycowboy · Sep 28, 2006

Shogmaster said:
Amir said 1080p through Component for games and downloaded movies too.

What 1080p downloaded movies are you expecting to watch with a 20GB HDD? Are there any announcements of 1080p movies being downloadable anywhere in the near term? And if you could, you'd be able to fit 1 on the system at a time?

Mark Gonzales · Sep 28, 2006

Why does he not answer this question? It's the only one they don't answer.

IGN : Does the Xbox 360 have the internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors necessary to move a full 1080p image? There's a big difference between 1080i and the 3GB/s of 1080p.

Microsoft: No Comment.

Mmmkay · Sep 28, 2006

Bad_Boy said:
wtf, why cant you use vga on ps3? a simple hdmi to vga/dvi converter should solve that, no?

No. HDMI is a purely digital interface. The PS3s VGA implementation isn't known yet, and it may not even be worth mentioning if it's the same as the PS2 had.

Bad_Boy · Sep 28, 2006

Shogmaster said:
I don't think HDMI sends out analog signal.

has sony denied vga support for the ps3?

sonycowboy · Sep 28, 2006

Bad_Boy said:
has sony denied vga support for the ps3?

No. But there likely isn't as much reason for it to be supported with HDMI being standard.

sangreal · Sep 28, 2006

sonycowboy said:
What 1080p downloaded movies are you expecting to watch with a 20GB HDD? Are there any announcements of 1080p movies being downloadable anywhere in the near term? And if you could, you'd be able to fit 1 on the system at a time?

You could fit plenty of 1080p trailers and other short videos

Currently marketplace videos come at 480p and 720p but I dont think its out of the realm of possibilities that in the future some may come at 1080p

More importantly, the 360 will upscale the video to the resolution you set I believe

sangreal · Sep 28, 2006

Mark Gonzales said:
Why does he not answer this question? It's the only one they don't answer.

IGN : Does the Xbox 360 have the internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors necessary to move a full 1080p image? There's a big difference between 1080i and the 3GB/s of 1080p.

Microsoft: No Comment.

Because the spokesperson probably doesn't know wtf IGN is talking about.

Also, they really already answered it:

IGN: Will games begin to be developed with 1080p as the native resolution, or is the 360's new 1080p support an advance in the console's internal scaling abilities?

Microsoft: If developed, the Xbox 360 will support playback of native 1080p games and all existing Xbox 360 titles can be up-scaled to 1080p.

ForzaItalia · Sep 28, 2006

1080p is coming.....believe.

JB1981 · Sep 28, 2006

Kleegamefan said:
Its much more than 1% of the TVs out there.....probably around 1/4 of all the new *HDTVs* coming out are 1080p....every single manufacturer has at least a 1080p model (Pioneer Plasma) and most have a full lineup of 1080p TVs (~50% of Samsungs DLP RPTVs are 1080p)

And of course, the proportion of 1080p to 720p HDTVs available are only growing with time, in favor of 1080p....

In other words, of all the new HDTVs coming out, 1080p models are a pretty good chunk....$2K(and below) price points of 1080p DLPs, LCD flat panels and SXRDs have helped alot in this regard...

You misinterpreted my post. I meant that 1% of the TVs out there actuallyl accept 1080p over component. In fact, the number's probably even less than that.

sonycowboy · Sep 28, 2006

sangreal said:
You could fit plenty of 1080p trailers and other short videos

Currently marketplace videos come at 480p and 720p but I dont think its out of the realm of possibilities that in the future some may come at 1080p

More importantly, the 360 will upscale the video to the resolution you set I believe

So, you don't see a way to do downloadable movies either. And I can have a DVD player upscale to 1080p as well through HDMI, but I don't think anybody wants that. But even if you did, a DVD can take upwards of 7-8GB of space, which again doesn't work well with the 360 HDD for more than a movie or so.

Shogmaster · Sep 28, 2006

Mark Gonzales said:
Why does he not answer this question? It's the only one they don't answer.

IGN : Does the Xbox 360 have the internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors necessary to move a full 1080p image? There's a big difference between 1080i and the 3GB/s of 1080p.

Microsoft: No Comment.

They didn't anwer because they didn't want to embarass the person asking the question? It's a stupid question. The amount of bandwidth shuffled between CPU, GPU, FSB etc of both consoles are in about the same neighborhood. If PS3 is not having problems in that area, it shouldn't be for X360 either.

A much better question would have been "how much is using more than 4 tiles per frame in Xenos to output 1080p gonna effect game performance?"

sangreal · Sep 28, 2006

JB1981 said:
I don't know. Is that what he wrote on the forums over there? This also begs the question, shog, how the **** are people going to get 1080p from the HD-DVD add-on.

So they're releasing an update and designing an add-on that'll work properly with 1% of the TVs available on today's market. Great.

JB1981 said:
You misinterpreted my post. I meant that 1% of the TVs out there actuallyl accept 1080p over component. In fact, the number's probably even less than that.

I'm curious why you seem to be deliberately ignoring the VGA output

shpankey · Sep 28, 2006

bill0527 said:
The only real question about the article showing up here would be just who exactly would post it - I had it narrowed down to either: Monkeymagic, JB1981, or Onix as those three always seem to show up in threads (or create new threads) just giddy as a bunch of schoolgirls whenever there is questionable or bad Xbox news.

:lol so true

SnakeXs · Sep 28, 2006

Mark Gonzales said:
Why does he not answer this question? It's the only one they don't answer.

IGN : Does the Xbox 360 have the internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors necessary to move a full 1080p image? There's a big difference between 1080i and the 3GB/s of 1080p.

Microsoft: No Comment.

Because he threw ****ing shit like goddamnd transfer speeds at a ****ing rep, that's why. These are people meant to simply say 1080p is good, we can do it. They don't know the ****ing internal transfer speeds of the h ardware. Jesus christ, the ****ing shady agendas are really goddamned annoying. And they're ****ing transparent, at that.

JB1981 · Sep 28, 2006

bill0527 said:
I knew this would show up on GAF right after I read it about an hour ago over at IGN.

The only real question about the article showing up here would be just who exactly would post it - I had it narrowed down to either: Monkeymagic, JB1981, or Onix as those three always seem to show up in threads (or create new threads) just giddy as a bunch of schoolgirls whenever there is questionable or bad Xbox news.

But yeah, there's nothing new in this article that hasn't been discussed ad naseum over the last week in various other 1080p threads.

I actually like to know how products are going to work before I decide to buy them. Getting official answers err, non-answers seems to be pretty relevant.

sangreal · Sep 28, 2006

sonycowboy said:
So, you don't see a way to do downloadable movies either. And I can have a DVD player upscale to 1080p as well through HDMI, but I don't think anybody wants that. But even if you did, a DVD can take upwards of 7-8GB of space, which again doesn't work well with the 360 HDD for more than a movie or so.

I dont think anyone is talking about downloading feature length HD films to the 360.

If you're talking feature length HD films, the obvious path would be to stream them from a PC using managed copy

Raistlin · Sep 28, 2006

Shogmaster said:
Amir said 1080p through Component for games and downloaded movies too.

edit: I WANT EVERYONE TO LEARN THIS GODDAMN CHART ONCE AND FOR ALL!

Still think you need to change NA to ?? for PS3 VGA.

In the case of 360 HDMI ... it's known to be NA. PS3 VGA we just don't know yet.

mood · Sep 28, 2006

Onix said:
Still think you need to change NA to ?? for PS3 VGA.

In the case of 360 HDMI ... it's know to be NA ...

"???" Would imply that you dont know what the PS3 VGA is capable of. And there isnt PS3 VGA yet.

sangreal · Sep 28, 2006

JB1981 said:
I actually like to know how products are going to work before I decide to buy them. Getting official answers err, non-answers seems to be pretty relevant.

Care to explain how these answers offer any more or less info than the last thread on this subject?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=120427

JB1981 · Sep 28, 2006

sangreal said:
I'm curious why you seem to be deliberately ignoring the VGA output

VGA has the same problem. It's not something that appears on a lot of TVs. And very, very rarely accepts 1080p unless it's a PC monitor, which usually don't appear often in peoples' living rooms.

Raistlin · Sep 28, 2006

mood said:
"???" Would imply that you dont know what the PS3 VGA is capable of. And there isnt PS3 VGA yet.

Okay ... then something else should be listed to imply it is unknown whether it is supported (regardless of resolution).

bill0527 · Sep 28, 2006

Kleegamefan said:
Its much more than 1% of the TVs out there.....probably around 1/4 of all the new *HDTVs* coming out are 1080p....every single manufacturer has at least a 1080p model (Pioneer Plasma) and most have a full lineup of 1080p TVs (~50% of Samsungs DLP RPTVs are 1080p)

And of course, the proportion of 1080p to 720p HDTVs available are only growing with time, in favor of 1080p....

In other words, of all the new HDTVs coming out, 1080p models are a pretty good chunk....$2K(and below) price points of 1080p DLPs, LCD flat panels and SXRDs have helped alot in this regard...

This week's Best Buy ad has 30 TVs listed in it. 4 of which are advertised as 1080p televisions with prices ranging from $2799-$3499.

A quick browse of the Circuit City ad shows 47 TVs listed - 4 of which are 1080p with prices ranging from $2499-$3499.

That's hardly 1/4th of all new HDTVs.

720p was first introduced back in 2003 I believe and it has taken 720p a good 3 years to get to mass market pricing.

Bad_Boy · Sep 28, 2006

Onix said:
Okay ... then something else should be listed to imply it is unknown whether it is supported (regardless of resolution).

Exactly what I was thinking. Not that it matters much anyways, its just one of those "just because it hasnt been said, does not mean its not there" situations.

JB1981 · Sep 28, 2006

bill0527 said:
This week's Best Buy ad has 30 TVs listed in it. 4 of which are advertised as 1080p televisions with prices ranging from $2799-$3499.

A quick browse of the Circuit City ad shows 47 TVs listed - 4 of which are 1080p with prices ranging from $2499-$3499.

That's hardly 1/4th of all new HDTVs.

720p was first introduced back in 2003 I believe and it has taken 720p a good 3 years to get to mass market pricing.

But it certainly won't take 1080p that long. Like I said before, 720p was and is a stop-gap resolution. By the time both of these consoles hit their stride 1080p will be everywhere.

ForzaItalia · Sep 28, 2006

bill0527 said:
This week's Best Buy ad has 30 TVs listed in it. 4 of which are advertised as 1080p televisions with prices ranging from $2799-$3499.

A quick browse of the Circuit City ad shows 47 TVs listed - 4 of which are 1080p with prices ranging from $2499-$3499.

That's hardly 1/4th of all new HDTVs.

720p was first introduced back in 2003 I believe and it has taken 720p a good 3 years to get to mass market pricing.

You'll be singing a different tune come Christmas of 2007....

Miburou · Sep 28, 2006

Off topic, but my TV doesn't have VGA, but it does have component (and DVI-D). Can I use a VGA-to-component converter together with the Xbox 360 VGA cable to watch up-scaled DVD movies on my Xbox 360?

Mrbob · Sep 28, 2006

bill0527 said:
This week's Best Buy ad has 30 TVs listed in it. 4 of which are advertised as 1080p televisions with prices ranging from $2799-$3499.

A quick browse of the Circuit City ad shows 47 TVs listed - 4 of which are 1080p with prices ranging from $2499-$3499.

That's hardly 1/4th of all new HDTVs.

720p was first introduced back in 2003 I believe and it has taken 720p a good 3 years to get to mass market pricing.

Wait about 6-12 months.

To be fair 1080P sets are really just starting to hit the market in mass scale.

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