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[pa22word]

Sure, but responding to people posting dumb and broad generalizations about devs by making broad-generalizations about ten thousand or so people doesn't really paint him in a better light. You're not going to change somebody's opinion that you're simply too lazy to flip that magical "1080/60fps/whatever" switch by calling them a cunt. If anything you're just encouraging them to further complain.

They didn't call anyone a cunt. They just ignore this message board because they feel it's a toxic environment for them. Hence, "they avoid you like the plague and think you're mostly cunts". Cunts is likely cliffyb just using his own favored euphemism for asshole, dickhead, general waste of life, etc.

And that's not going to change until the moderation staff decides to take a proactive stance against the toxicity. Until then, this site will continue to be avoided by people in the industry. Period.

 

[ohlawd]

let's do this next year assuming Treehouse is up again

 

[Seik]

He didn't call "us" cunts. He said that the majority of people working in the industry think that the people who post here are, and honestly, it's hard as shit to blame them.

I mean fuck guys, would you want to take part of a community that's filled with people who constantly call you lazy and incompetent when you bust your ass sometimes 70-80 hours a week (IF NOT FUCKING MORE) to make games for the people of gaf to enjoy? Most of the time for things entirely outside of your control? I know I sure as fuck wouldn't.

Word.

Gotta have some empathy.

CliffyB, while he probably doesn't like us very much, already left a bigger footstep in this world than most of us ever will in our entire life. He made very successful games, that you like or not. He have the right to have his opinions in the industry, too. Even if I don't agree with him, the dude got some experience and you gotta respect that.

He got a lot of hate here, I can totally understand why he have this stance with GAF. Just a few posts ago someone called him a loser, which is really disrespectful for starters . :/

 

[ShockingAlberto]

I think there's valid criticism of GAF that the board will probably never accept.

I think CliffyB is pro-business and anti-consumer, as well.

Basically, just because the person criticizing you is an asshole is not a reason not to improve.

 

[Principate]

Word.

Gotta have some empathy.

CliffyB, while he probably doesn't like us very much, already left a bigger footstep in this world than most of us ever will in our entire life. He made very successful games, that you like or not. He have the right to have his opinions in the industry, too. Even if I don't agree with him, the dude got some experience and you gotta respect that.

He got a lot of hate here, I can totally understand why he have this stance with GAF. Just a few posts ago someone called him a loser, which is really disrespectful for starters . :/

Meh, you shouldn't be afraid to dream a little bigger.

 

[Nanashrew]

let's do this next year assuming Treehouse is up again

I'd be up for it!

 

[Currygan]

He didn't call "us" cunts. He said that the majority of people working in the industry think that the people who post here are, and honestly, it's hard as shit to blame them.

I mean fuck guys, would you want to take part of a community that's filled with people who constantly call you lazy and incompetent when you bust your ass sometimes 70-80 hours a week (IF NOT FUCKING MORE) to make games for the people of gaf to enjoy? Most of the time for things entirely outside of your control? I know I sure as fuck wouldn't.

I interpreted his choice of words quite differently, tbh

 

[Frolow]

I think there's valid criticism of GAF that the board will probably never accept.

I think CliffyB is pro-business and anti-consumer, as well.

Basically, just because the person criticizing you is an asshole is not a reason not to improve.

Spot on.

 

[RMS Gigantic]

let's do this next year assuming Treehouse is up again

No, we must do like Nintendo and do something different and more thorough, just like Treehouse Live compared to traditional press conferences!

 

[HawthorneKitty]

Send gifs.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

They didn't call anyone a cunt. They just ignore this message board because they feel it's a toxic environment for them. Hence, "they avoid you like the plague and think you're mostly cunts". Cunts is likely cliffyb just using his own favored euphemism for asshole, dickhead, general waste of life, etc.

That's... still calling someone a cunt? I'm pretty sure saying I think somebody is a cunt is more or less calling them a cunt, I don't really think most people in a regular situation would interpret that wording the way you have.

Pretty sure people are picking specifically on CliffyB's comments and not the vaguely alluded to dev's either, so there's no point making an argument for why they think the place is toxic or not when that's not what I'm questioning. Just Cliffy's behavior if he's expecting a positive reaction.

And that's not going to change until the moderation staff decides to take a proactive stance against the toxicity. Until then, this site will continue to be avoided by people in the industry. Period.

The GAF call-outs at E3 sort of makes it feel like this isn't as widespread a problem the industry has with GAF as you and Cliffy make it out to be.

 

[njean777]

I think you just proved his point.

I hope he didn't go on V, they had an even bigger field day with that. Far worse than anything said on GAF.

 

[Jintor]

Let's not talk about Cliff tho since he's not getting a card for a while

 

[pa22word]

I interpreted his choice of words quite differently, tbh

There's not really anything there to interpret, though. It's completely obvious to anyone who knows someone on the other side of the window what he's talking about.

There's a reason why out of the tens of thousands of people working in the game industry, probably like >20 actively post here, and I assure you, it isn't because of a lack of discover-ability.

 

[Seik]

Meh, you shouldn't be afraid to dream a little bigger.

I said some of us, it doesn't necessarily implies me. Don't worry, I still have goals in life.

EDIT: It's not like I'm wrong, too, it's not everyone who will sell multimillion AAA games. He left quite something behind him.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

There's not really anything there to interpret, though. It's completely obvious to anyone who knows someone on the other side of the window what he's talking about.

Nobody is confused about what he's talking about, they're disputing his way of saying it and expecting it to come across as anything but similarly immature.

 

[Crazyorloco]

WTF.　Why isn't neogaf doing something this awesome?

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. I expect basically porn or disgusting things from 4chan. This is great. Nice work 4chan. I'll visit /v/ /vg/ I would love to be apart of something like this.

 

[pa22word]

Nobody is confused about what he's talking about, they're disputing his way of saying it and expecting it to come across as anything but similarly immature.

Does it really matter? Regardless of how crass his statement is, it's still pretty much the uncomfortable truth about this site.

 

[-Horizon-]

Very nice of them to do this.

 

[Surface of Me]

I wonder if there is a sleepover general on /v/ right now.

 

[-PXG-]

Come on. Having horribly and openly anti consumer points of view and calling a collective of individuals cunts, isn't really conducive towards improving the relationship between those in the gaming industry and those on GAF. And yet, devs question why people are hostile here, and on the internet in general.

 

[Fried Food]

not sure how I feel about this. All Nintendo did was show games that, at some point in the future, will be available for purchase.

 

[rpmurphy]

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. I expect basically porn or disgusting things from 4chan. This is great. Nice work 4chan. I'll visit /v/ /vg/ I would love to be apart of something like this.

Most of these things come and go very quickly, so unless you spend a lot of time there or just happen to be there at the right time, most of the threads you'll see are just normal thread topics that you'd expect.

 

[njean777]

Word.

Gotta have some empathy.

CliffyB, while he probably doesn't like us very much, already left a bigger footstep in this world than most of us ever will in our entire life. He made very successful games, that you like or not. He have the right to have his opinions in the industry, too. Even if I don't agree with him, the dude got some experience and you gotta respect that.

He got a lot of hate here, I can totally understand why he have this stance with GAF. Just a few posts ago someone called him a loser, which is really disrespectful for starters . :/

We are his customers, if he calls us "cunts' or anything else derogatory, why should we have respect for him? The second you call your customers "cunts" is the second I lose respect for you. No matter if some are acting that way, you never call a board as a whole "cunts". Not everybody is calling you out, nor is everybody using ad hominem attacks against you.

Also just because he has experience does not mean I have to respect him, he hasn't done anything for me personally to make me respect him. He makes games and gets paid for his work. Nothing more,respect does not work itself into the equation here.

 

[Terrible_Majesty]

WTF.　Why isn't neogaf doing something this awesome?

It's not too late. I would be willing to pitch in for some kind of gift to Treehouse that they can do a photo op with. Either way, even if they don't acknowledge it, it would be nice anyway. I say we do it.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

Does it really matter? Regardless of how crass his statement is, it's still pretty much the uncomfortable truth about this site.

If you're not just trying to fuel the self-perpetuating hate with more hate than yes I guess it does?

There has to be a line between proper critique and dirty mudslinging, but especially remembering how CliffyB reacted to people protesting the XBox 1 last year, I agree with Alberto that he probably sees *any* sort of disdain for any industry practices as us being 'cunts'. Considering how awful we've already gone over how /v/ can get (and how GameFAQ's and other large videogame communities aren't much better), I'm wondering what sort of enthusiast source is out there Cliffy doesn't currently have utter contempt for. Otherwise he's casting a pretty small net out there if he wants to make a game for people who like games, but simultaneously will never talk about games.

 

[Surface of Me]

We are his customers, if he calls us "cunts' or anything else derogatory, why should we have respect for him? The second you call your customers "cunts" is the second I lose respect for you. No matter if some are acting that way, you never call a board as a whole "cunts". Not everybody is calling you out, nor is everybody using ad hominem attacks against you.

Also just because he has experience does not mean I have to respect him, he hasn't done anything for me personally to make me respect him. He makes games and gets paid for his work. Nothing more,respect does not work itself into the equation here.

And some still think "gamer entitlement" isn't a thing.

 

[Gamerloid]

Is this about the Treehouse or CliffyB? ha ha

 

[Terrible_Majesty]

not sure how I feel about this. All Nintendo did was show games that, at some point in the future, will be available for purchase.

Yeah, all they do is spread joy in our lives and bring smiles to children. I guess that's why it's a special thing. They have no obligation to give Treehouse or none for that matter anything. But they did it anyway.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

That's cool of them. People in most jobs don't get enough thanks.

 

[Tripon]

This thread was love at the beginning and has now turned into hate.

 

[LouisaFerre]

And some still think "gamer entitlement" isn't a thing.

What does respect even mean in this context?

EDIT: I don't understand what entitlement means either in this case. Like, I'm not entitled to be liked or catered to by anyone, but no developer or company is entitled to my favor or support.

 

[HOMEBOY OVER HERE]

i wouldn't touch that knowing it was probably handled by a 4chan user.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

This thread was love at the beginning and has now turned into hate.

Sounds like a thread on a forum.

 

[njean777]

What does respect even mean in this context?

I don't know the point of his post either. I was called a "cunt" and now all of a sudden I am entitled... like where did he/she get that from?

But to stay on topic, it is a nice gesture from V. It can now be said that V is not all bad.

 

[-PXG-]

Is this about the Treehouse or CliffyB? ha ha

Sadly I'm part of the problem. Instead of celebrating something positive, we are, yet again, discussing and arguing over a self serving shit headed remark by someone who merely wants to cause trouble and stay relevant. I respect the guy for his past works and efforts but he has been really pissing me off with his awful commentary. It might be honest, but it's also very destructive and off putting. He wonders why people are turned off and have as much venom as they do.

 

[Terrell]

GAF didn't do shit except fantasize about Erik...

Well, in our defense, he IS pretty dreamy. I wish with all my being that he's gay just for a sliver of hope that he could marry me one day.

Don't worry, we'll outdo /v/ next year, when we overwhelm the man with Valentine's Day cards.

 

[pa22word]

Come on. Having horribly and openly anti consumer points of view and calling a collective of individuals cunts, isn't really conducive towards improving the relationship between those in the gaming industry and those on GAF. And yet, devs question why people are hostile here, and on the internet in general.

If you're not just trying to fuel the self-perpetuating hate with more hate than yes I guess it does?

There has to be a line between proper critique and dirty mudslinging, but especially remembering how CliffyB reacted to people protesting the XBox 1 last year, I agree with Alberto that he probably sees *any* sort of disdain for any industry practices as us being 'cunts'. Considering how awful we've already gone over how /v/ can get (and how GameFAQ's and other large videogame communities aren't much better), I'm wondering what sort of enthusiast source is out there Cliffy doesn't currently have utter contempt for. Otherwise he's casting a pretty small net out there if he wants to make a game for people who like games, but simultaneously will never talk about games.

The thing is though, this relationship is almost entirely onesided in terms of toxicity that drives the other side away, and it's not the underpaid, overworked people who nearly kill themselves getting stuff out the door only to be met with claims of incompetence and laziness from the other side, and I hate to break it to you guys, but most developers do view the general online communities with contempt.

The burden of change is not on them, it's on us. Until we as a community stop being so toxic towards the people who make these games, they are going to continue to ignore us and treat us with contempt, and I for one can't really blame them for doing so.

 

[xkramz]

They coated the collage with AIDS

That isn't transmitted by touch I'd understand if u said anthrax

 

[Gamerloid]

I like the idea of giving them thank you cards, but with 4chan being populated with a bunch of no names, I don't find it as effective as I would people who left their names/username.

Example is if NeoGAF did do something like this, It'd be cool because you can go on NeoGAF and see the people who actually sent the card. Go on /v/ and all you'll see is, well, /v/ being /v/.

 

[daydream]

Pretty awesome. They deserve all the recognition in the world.

 

[-PXG-]

The thing is though, this relationship is almost entirely onesided in terms of toxicity that drives the other side away, and it's not the underpaid, overworked people who nearly kill themselves getting stuff out the door only to be met with claims of incompetence and laziness from the other side, and I hate to break it to you guys, but most developers do view the general online communities with contempt.

The burden of change is not on them, it's on us. Until we as a community stop being so toxic towards the people who make these games, they are going to continue to ignore us and treat us with contempt, and I for one can't really blame them for doing so.

Both sides do need to grow up and learn how to express themselves with a bit more class and dignity than they do. But just remember this:

The industry and every single person working in it right at this very moment wouldn't be there and wouldn't have what they have and wouldn't be doing what they are doing without us. Respect should be mutual. Ideally it should work like a two way street. But at some levels it has to be earned especially from their end. At the end of the day, none of us owe them anything. We don't owe them any attention, praise, criticism or sales.

In the end, they rely on us to stay in business and to stay relevant. We have a lot of power as consumers. There should be some sense of decency, but without sacrificing brutal honesty. That has become overwhelmingly apparent over the passed year or so. We have these people by the balls, scared out of their minds and scared shirtless over whether or not they have our trust, and ultimately, our dollars. They should never forget that. Ever

 

[Krucks]

It feels kind of weird to see people talk about how great /v/ is when there's liberal use of racial slurs, anti semitism, and general horrible thoughts that populate it but suddenly they're okay because they made a card. Okay.

 

[rpmurphy]

I like the idea of giving them thank you cards, but with 4chan being populated with a bunch of no names, I don't find it as effective as I would people who left their names/username.

Example is if NeoGAF did do something like this, It'd be cool because you can go on NeoGAF and see the people who actually sent the card. Go on /v/ and all you'll see is, well, /v/ being /v/.

Putting names in the submissions would defeat the whole point of being an anonymous contributor, as is the main purpose of their community.

 

[Uncle Rupee]

not sure how I feel about this. All Nintendo did was show games that, at some point in the future, will be available for purchase.

Treehouse was the first time in E3 history where people at home could get close to the full e3 experience. We couldn't play the demos, but we could finally watch other people play them for like 30 minutes straight and hear directly from some of the devs as they demo their game. It was a great feature that blew Sony's stream out of the water.

 

[Terrible_Majesty]

I like the idea of giving them thank you cards, but with 4chan being populated with a bunch of no names, I don't find it as effective as I would people who left their names/username.

Example is if NeoGAF did do something like this, It'd be cool because you can go on NeoGAF and see the people who actually sent the card. Go on /v/ and all you'll see is, well, /v/ being /v/.

Yep. All the more reason why we SHOULD do this. Also, I wouldn't take most of what cliff's says seriously. He's probably using it as a term of endearment as odd as it may seem. He's a pretty sarcastic and grumpy dude

 

[-PXG-]

It feels kind of weird to see people talk about how great /v/ is when there's liberal use of racial slurs, anti semitism, and general horrible thoughts that populate it but suddenly they're okay because they made a card. Okay.

/v/ is funny as hell. Very few people are serious there. It's trolls trolling trolls. Just dumb shit and a place to vent and air out your dirty laundry. It's the digital embodiment of your living room with all of your friends in it talking mad shit amongst one another.

 

[Krucks]

/v/ is funny as hell. Very few people are serious there. It's trolls trolling trolls. Just dumb shit and a place to vent and air out your dirty laundry. It's the digital embodiment of your living room with all of your friends in it talking mad shit amongst one another.

I don't see how it's funny but whatever, different strokes for different folks I guess. I don't usually call my friends the N word but I guess we hang in different circles.

 

[Hours Left]

Pretty cool. They were definitely the highlight of the show.

erik ilu

Erik <3

 

[DICKS AHOY]

It feels kind of weird to see people talk about how great /v/ is when there's liberal use of racial slurs, anti semitism, and general horrible thoughts that populate it but suddenly they're okay because they made a card. Okay.

It IS weird for you to see people talk about that in this thread when in reality nobody here has talked about how great /v/ is because they made a card.

It's a nice gesture from a usually troll-ish community you should never take too seriously. I don't think anybody's really tried to argue otherwise.