Support NeoGAF

[Laconic]

Should we expect the Wii U to be the next Dreamcast? We'll look back at it years from now and romanticize how wonderful it was?

I picked up a Wii U this past month for X-mas, and I am excited as hell to play my copy of Wonderful 101, Mario 3D World, NSMBU, Zombi U, and Monster Hunter 3 U. Even if the system goes belly under, I will have some wonderful games to play until I get a PS4 in 2015.

The Dreamcast WAS wonderful.

But Vyse failed, and the pirates looted and killed it.

The Wii U IS wonderful. It is Wonderful, too. I really do not blame Ninty for the Wii U's failure to date. I blame the shift in the core target audience of game systems. Nintendo still makes games I and much of the old core want to play. The new gen of gamers want something else, apparently. And third parties only want on that new gen money train. It is a shame. Many things have come together that work against Nintendo and its old school ways. One could posit that this is Nintendo's fault for not adapting, but this is a rather simplistic stance that misses out on the critical fact of what they are, and what they bring to the table. To change that is to destroy them. And it is to destroy that which makes their fans, and fans of older gen games love them. They really are the last bastion of the old guard. Hopefully, once the untenable insatiable beast that is the AAA philosophy of game design comes crashing and burning down, the Indie scene will rise from the ruin, and old style gaming shall become mainstream again.

 

[leroidys]

Releasing on the same day as the 360, Zelda, and Tearaway (lol I wish) probably had an impact.

 

[BattleMonkey]

Could be that many of the fans just gave up on the console already (sold it off, traded, whatever) so they weren't there to buy the game.

 

[H_Prestige]

When you overwhelm the market with Mario games, the franchise loses its luster. Hence the terrible sales for NSMBU and 3DW. People look at them and say "been there, done that" and pass.

All these years people were telling Nintendo to stop milking Mario while forum "experts" smugly disagreed. Well, here's the result of that strategy. Nintendo should have been focusing in their other IP's, or creating new ones like Sony, while keeping Mario a once every three year type of game like Zelda.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

There are a lot of things to consider. One of them being an overall saturation of products on a hardware with very little third party releases. Two different 4-player Super Mario games within a year, even if one is a much superior product from Tokyo, certainly might have an overall impact on general software sales.

Of course there are a myriad of problems like Nintendo deciding to release 3 first-party mini-game products in less than a year.

 

[Rebel Leader]

When you overwhelm the market with Mario games, the franchise loses its luster. Hence the terrible sales for NSMBU and 3DW. People look at them and say "been there, done that" and pass.

Too bad the same couldn't be said for... Assassin's creed, halo, call of duty, battlefield, madden, ETC.... T_T

 

[Loofy]

Maybe people thought it was a port of 3DS game.. cause of the name and all.

 

[18-Volt]

Nice marketing, Nintendo. Luigi's Mansion, Luigi U, Mario & Luigi, Mario 3d World and Mario Party. People are confused with all the Mario games around. You should have released couple of titles aren't named mario.

 

[BD1]

New Wii U owners who picked up the console this Holiday got 2 Mario games for free in the box. Do they really need a third Mario game?

I love 3D World, but it doesn't shock me at all that there is Mario fatigue right now.

 

[Stet]

I had a WiiMU joke set up but that would be insulting to the Dreamcast.

 

[xxracerxx]

It looks like a fantastic game, I wish it would do better.

 

[outunderthestars]

Nice marketing, Nintendo. Luigi's Mansion, Luigi U, Mario & Luigi, Mario 3d World and Mario Party. People are confused with all the Mario games around. You should have released couple of titles aren't named mario.

That would require the kind of risk taking that the company simply is not capable of anymore

 

[SquiddyCracker]

The king is dead.
Long live the king!

 

[Kai Dracon]

Personally I think it isn't this hypothetical too many Marios problem, as it is Mario to the exclusion of everything else. That is, there's not too many Mario games. People seem to love Mario on 3DS, and keep buying Mario this, Luigi that, etc.

On the Wii U though, Nintendo did need a lot more major 1st party games to stand beside the Mario entries. A limited software palette makes a platform looking boring and unexciting - even if technically every game is excellent.

We already see this with a minority of people who think say, the PS3 or 360 suck because "it's just got COD and a couple of FPS games, that's all the make, it's so boring". Those are extreme perspectives because there's quite a lot of variety even with so many ongoing AAA franchises out there. But it's just an example of how people can see a console.

 

[Tripon]

Have to think December will be better. It's starting to get some sales, and its pretty much THE game to pick up for your Wii U.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

Its the console, not the game. Unfortunately.

Never mind that, those who actually own the console... just what are they doing with it?

 

[brandonh83]

It's not the girl, Peter, it's the building.

Never mind that, those who actually own the console... just what are they doing with it?

Playing one of the greatest games ever, Mario 3D World, playing one of the other greatest games ever, Wonderful 101, playing some VC games on the game pad which is strangely fantastic, sharing experiences and pics and strategies on Miiverse, using it for the huge library of original Wii games (BC ftw), etc. Also have great things like Mario Kart, Smash, Zelda, Bayonetta 2, more VC games, unannounced titles, etc. to anticipate. But that's one man's experience and opinion.

 

[Steel]

To be fair, that attach rate will probably increase over time.

 

[Captain Smoker]

Franchise fatigue makes sense, but if it is the cause then Nintendo are in big, big trouble. Mario is their single most recognisable character, without him being front and centre I don't know how they differentiate their software line up from Sony or MS. It's not like Nintendo is gushing with original IP right now.

Nintendo won't produce any new Mario platformers in the next few years, we had one Mario every year since 2009, 2014 is going to be the first year with a break lol. (which is good imo)

As for 2014, they have three key titles: Mario Kart (strongest console brand) + Smash Bros. + Donkey Kong + mid-tier IPs (though, X has a lot of hype amongst gamers, I hope it does ok at least, I can't wait for this game).

I believe that the 2014 lineup looks far more promising to gamers (talking about 1st Party) than 2013. But Nintendo needs the casual crowd to reach GCN numbers at least.

We'll see how things turn out.

 

[Manmademan]

Have to think December will be better. It's starting to get some sales, and its pretty much THE game to pick up for your Wii U.

I wouldn't get your hopes up.

November and December of 2012 were virtually identical, with the exception of the 3DS. (which for some reason did monster numbers in dec, far more than november.).

With black friday turning into a 4 day sales marathon, it's shifting a lot of sales out of december and into november and they're at parity.

 

[ryushe]

The Dreamcast WAS wonderful.

But Vyse failed, and the pirates looted and killed it.

The Wii U IS wonderful. It is Wonderful, too. I really do not blame Ninty for the Wii U's failure to date. I blame the shift in the core target audience of game systems. Nintendo still makes games I and much of the old core want to play. The new gen of gamers want something else, apparently. And third parties only want on that new gen money train. It is a shame. Many things have come together that work against Nintendo and its old school ways. One could posit that this is Nintendo's fault for not adapting, but this is a rather simplistic stance that misses out on the critical fact of what they are, and what they bring to the table. To change that is to destroy them. And it is to destroy that which makes their fans, and fans of older gen games love them. They really are the last bastion of the old guard. Hopefully, once the untenable insatiable beast that is the AAA philosophy of game design comes crashing and burning down, the Indie scene will rise from the ruin, and old style gaming shall become mainstream again.

+1

If only, my friend. If only..

 

[narton]

It's a little expensive for me to get it right now. I really want it though. I just bought my Wii u though.

 

[Messofanego]

X gonna give it

Is X the next thing to be on the blackboard?

 

[Randolph Freelander]

I am absolutely shocked at this number. Say what you will about attach rates to systems, I figured this wouldn't possibly do below 300K and I thought it really do 400K or more.

The reason is that I figured Wii U's base would be a super-concentration of the really hardcore Nintendo fan, enough to surely gobble up a Mario game. No, Mario doesn't appeal to everybody, or even every super hardcore fan, but I thought surely it appealed to enough Wii U owners to see it rocket out of the gates.

Shocked. Just shocked.

I said in another thread in response to prediction for sub-100K for this game that if it did that low, Nintendo should just can every game left on the system, as there would be no point. 215K isn't far off that, to be honest.

 

[Jagsrock]

I have a Wii U. I didn't buy it.

The fact that it's a rehash of 3D Land's style, which was itself criticized for looking generic and unexciting when it was first shown, makes it a rather boring proposition.

I know the gameplay is probably phenomenal. But I think it could have had a more engaging setting or art style or something to make it seem like a must see destination.

Super Mario Galaxy wasn't just great, gameplay-wise. It was also Mario's foray into space, with brilliant new imagery, set to a thrilling orchestral score. 3D World looks like generic classic Mario with dopey music and a new suit. I'm not engaged ... That makes it something I pick up down the line.

It borrows elements from 3d land but blows it out of the water in every way. You are only saying it looks generic because you probably have only seen the early stages. The game is amazing visually, with a ton of variety in terms of stages and even gameplay wise given that each character has a completely unique feel. As a wii u owner you are honestly doing yourself a disservice by not owning this game.

 

[benny_a]

To be fair, that attach rate will probably increase over time.

Can we get a clarification if the data in the OP is based on the launch month of those games?

Otherwise Nintendo games have very long tails.

(Of course those numbers need to be weighted against the amount of new consoles sold... but about that...)

 

[mrmickfran]

Even less than Sunshine!?! Jesus Christ.

 

[Blueblur1]

Never mind that, those who actually own the console... just what are they doing with it?

It was gathering dust all year up until recently when Zelda and Sonic came out. It's still gathering a little dust as I'm super busy with work and school and when I do have time I use it to play my 3DS or surf the web (mostly tumblr).

 

[Manmademan]

It borrows elements from 3d land but blows it out of the water in every way. You are only saying it looks generic because you probably have only seen the early stages. The game is amazing visually, with a ton of variety in terms of stages and even gameplay wise given that each character has a completely unique feel. As a wii u owner you are honestly doing yourself a disservice by not owning this game.

sure, if you happened to somehow avoid a PS3 or 360 for the past 8 years.

which is sort of the problem, isn't it?

 

[RoboPlato]

Really surprised at the low attach rate. I expected it to fair far better.

 

[Rebel Leader]

Is X the next thing to be on the blackboard?

http://i.imgur.com/hGxiLcm.png[/IM G][/QUOTE]

How is it not already? =3

 

[Yagharek]

I dont know why genre fatigue is being cited. Cod and other shooters are the same each year and keep selling well.

It's purely a function of the console itself selling poorly.

 

[Coloress_Kafka]

I find it funny that those sales are the same as LittleBigPlanet's first month. Ohh Nintendo how far you have fallen........

 

[K' Dash]

I just bought a Wii U, the library is starting to shape up and I still believe Nintendo can turn this console around like they did with the 3DS.

Why did I buy it? well I just got a PS4 on it's launch, I loved Assassins Creed 4 and was in love with the game, but when I finished it, the love was over.

Went to play Knack, but God DAMN it is a TERRIBLE game, I tried really hard to like it, but it just sucks at gameplay and it is BORING as hell, Killzone is fine, but it's just a pretty FPS with mediocre gameplay, Battlefield 4 is awesome... when it works.

So I got myself a AC4 and Resogun Box until next february, with Second Son

 

[Thorakai]

Is X the next thing to be on the blackboard?

where is cranky kong.

 

[Bgamer90]

sure, if you happened to somehow avoid a PS3 or 360 for the past 8 years.

which is sort of the problem, isn't it?

Disagree. It looks good. First 3D Mario in HD.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

Playing one of the greatest games ever, Mario 3D World, playing one of the other greatest games ever, Wonderful 101, playing some VC games on the game pad which is strangely fantastic, sharing experiences and pics and strategies on Miiverse, using it for the huge library of original Wii games (BC ftw), etc. Also have great things like Mario Kart, Smash, Zelda, Bayonetta 2, more VC games, unannounced titles, etc. to anticipate. But that's one man's experience and opinion.

I'm referring to the lowest attach rate thing if that wasn't clear. Randolph Freelander above put it better than I did basically.

 

[Hypron]

How is it not already? =3

People are really expecting a JRPG to save the console?

 

[786110]

 

[Bending_Unit_22]

Too bad the same couldn't be said for... Assassin's creed, halo, call of duty, battlefield, madden, ETC.... T_T

To be fair, those come out at most once a year. For the last 2.5 years or so Nintendo has been releasing a similarish Mario game every 6 months (and 4 in a little more than a year, and yes NSLU counts, it doesn't matter much if you don't want to deal with it as Mario has been released way more).

More to the point:

Assassin's Creed - New ip, changes year to year and nobody cares about the portables. Fatigue will set in soon enough.

Halo - There have been what, 4 in the last 7 years? Yes indeed the luster is wearing off either way.

CoD - Best argument, but then unlike Mario, CoD is THE game of the current prime gaming generation. It's also showing signs of fatigue.

Battlefield - May as well of said Medal of Honor. This doesn't count in the slightest.

Madden - It is what it has been for 20+ years, an annual $50 roster update with upgrades for each console generation.

 

[Rafterman]

The hell are you doing with a Wii U if you're not gonna buy the best game on the system (so far)!?

Agreed, which is why I sold my U to Amazon yesterday. I'll probably pick another up in a couple of years for dirt cheap if if a few more decent games come out on it, but for now I'd rather have the money than the console.

 

[Manmademan]

Disagree. It looks good. First 3D Mario in HD.

sure, it looks good. But if you've been playing 360 or PS3 consistently, can you honestly look at mario 3D world and say "those graphics are amazing!"

I find that hard to believe, and apparently so does much of the market. Nintendo has yet to put together a more visually impressive game than Sony's first parties were circa 2009.

 

[Taker666]

Is X the next thing to be on the blackboard?

Mario Kart 8 is the only thing on that board that was ever really capable of pushing the Wii U sales. ..that and a lower price (much lower than a $50 cut) /decent marketing.

Smash Bros won't do much for it due to being on the 3DS.

 

[Graphics Horse]

The king is dead.
Long live the Kong!

fixed

 

[Darksol]

WiiU walking the green mile

 

[Log4Girlz]

Disney's most recognizable character is Mickey. You don't see them make 3 or 4 movies a year with the guy.

 

[Chamber]

So since the public is a little tired of Mario, can we get some Wave Race, F-Zero or Star Fox action in here? Nintendo pls...

 

[brandonh83]

I'm referring to the lowest attach rate thing if that wasn't clear. Randolph Freelander above put it better than I did basically.

My bad!

 

[Ponn]

I'm really not getting this whole "blame console sales". What the hell else are people buying the Wii U for but Mario?? Something seriously wrong, I was expecting low Wii U sales but not Mario game sales. This is crazy sauce.

 

[Bgamer90]

sure, it looks good. But if you've been playing 360 or PS3 consistently, can you honestly look at mario 3D world and say "those graphics are amazing!"

I find that hard to believe, and apparently so does much of the market. Nintendo has yet to put together a more visually impressive game than Sony's first parties were circa 2009.

Its art style helps it. It's not a realistic looking game and therefore it has its own charm.

And this is coming from someone who has played games on the Xbox 360 for 8 years and currently owns an Xbox One.

It's more of an art style problem than a graphics problem. Even if Mario was made for a PS4 like console, the general audience would still find games like Battlefield or NBA 2K14 more visually impressive.