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Older Disney Animation Quality

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U

ugoo18

Member
So randomly was watching Tarzan and the Son of Man song (Great song) comes up and this scene happens

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGKj_yB5_PI#t=161

That footwork animation when Tarzan is tree surfing imo is damm good. The movie in general is making me wish for more 2D animated Disney movies for the current era. I like CGI as much as the next person but some of the 2D Disney movies have some amazing animations.
 
V

Vulcano's assistant

Banned
Glen Keane does weeks if not moths of homework before he animates. This is his studio when he was working on the giant eagle from the Rescuers Down Under
animaux35.jpg
 
G

George Oscar Bluth II

Banned
ugoo18 said:
That he is, his work in Aladdin and Tangled was top notch to say the least.

Where is he now?

EDIT: Can't forget Treasure Planet as well also animated beautifully.
Click to expand...

On December 2013, it was announced that he had joined Motorola's Advanced Technology and Projects Group and is cooperating with its engineers to create interactive hand-drawn animation. Keane released his first animated short- Duet- at the Google I/O Conference in San Francisco on June 25, 2014. It is the first hand-drawn cartoon made with 60 fps, and the third in a series of shorts called the Spotlight Stories that are designed to explore spatial awareness and the sensory inputs of a mobile device to create a distinctive storytelling experience.
Click to expand...
Wikipedia.
 
B

Bjomesphat

Banned
Technically most of that sequence in Tarzan is CGI. Still, I understand what you're saying. The art and animation is leagues better than what they're doing now.
 
JediLink

JediLink

Member
Meh. The older Disney movies are great and all but I wasn't too fond of the Princess and the Frog's visuals. CGI is fine with me.
 
B

Bjomesphat

Banned
PANTHEON said:
I thought it was pretty successful?
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They were developing Frozen as a 2D animated feature, then Princess and the Frog and Winnie the Pooh bombed so that pretty much sealed 2D's fate at Disney.

I often wonder if Frozen had come out in 2D before Princess and the Frog, if it would have been as successful as Frozen is now, and if it would have brought back a 2D renaissance.
 
Boss Doggie

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Huh, and here I thought people were talking about the 60's-70's era Disney where they reused a lot of rotoscoping scenes :p
 
Vampire On Titus

Vampire On Titus

Member
Yeah I wish 2D animation was more prevalent in America.

Some old Disney animation's super rotoscoped look is gross looking to me tho. It always really bothered me in pocahontas. Especially in contrast to the animals that moved more like normal cartoons.
 
Boss Doggie

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Doc Holliday said:
They didn't rotoscope, they used reference which keane uses as well. Rotoscoping means tracing footage.
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Yeah, but I thought they were tracing the same footage for sveral old Disney movies, hence why similar scenes like the dancing scene.
 
V

Vulcano's assistant

Banned
Boss Doggie said:
Yeah, but I thought they were tracing the same footage for sveral old Disney movies, hence why similar scenes like the dancing scene.
Click to expand...

In Robin Hood for instance, yeah, that movie must have had a "small" budget. 70s Disney seems like it was in one of their worst times, which continued until The Little Mermaid made trucks of money.
 
N

NEO0MJ

Member
Bjomesphat said:
Technically most of that sequence in Tarzan is CGI. Still, I understand what you're saying. The art and animation is leagues better than what they're doing now.
Click to expand...

If if most of the background is CGI Tarzan himself is 2D, right? He animation is incredible.
 
D

darkhunger

Member
Boss Doggie said:
Yeah, but I thought they were tracing the same footage for sveral old Disney movies, hence why similar scenes like the dancing scene.
Click to expand...
Reusing old sequences is not necessarily rotoscoping. Rotoscoping is generally used for tracing over live footage, which they stopped doing after the original Snow White.
 
B

Bjomesphat

Banned
NEO0MJ said:
If if most of the background is CGI Tarzan himself is 2D, right? He animation is incredible.
Click to expand...

I'm not entirely sure, but I think Tarzan himself is traditionally animated. It's probably splitting hairs to call some of Tarazan CGI. I don't know the full story behind the film, but all of the art still looks hand drawn, it's just composited in a 3D space and the background animation and camera movement is computer generated.
 
P

Pickman

Member
Some of my favorite Disney animation comes from The Great Mouse Detective. Also doesn't hurt that Vincent Price is amazing as Ratigan.
 
Lynd7

Lynd7

Member
I think a from the ground up 2D movie in 3D could be amazing. I thought the Lion King and Beauty and the Beast looked great and they weren't designed with that in mind.

It gives 2D that extra something it needs nowadays to surprise people I think.
 
Acrylic7

Acrylic7

Member
Old 2D Disney movies make me so fucking happy. I can watch them all fucking day.
Don't get me started on the special features and behind the scenes shit.
 
S

Sir_Crocodile

Member
Boss Doggie said:
Yeah, but I thought they were tracing the same footage for sveral old Disney movies, hence why similar scenes like the dancing scene.
Click to expand...

Had to make that Sleeping Beauty money back. It may have been the finest animated film ever made, but sadly it was so expensive it lost money.
 
P

PaulloDEC

Member
NEO0MJ said:
If if most of the background is CGI Tarzan himself is 2D, right? He animation is incredible.
Click to expand...

As I understand it, most of Tarzan is traditionally animated, or as traditionally animated as any other Disney film of that period is. For the scenes where the camera moves in and out among the trees (i.e. the branch-surfing shots, or young Tarzan swinging between the vines) they used some proprietary tech called "Deep Canvas", which I believe involved projecting hand-painted 2D artwork onto 3D geometry.

You can learn more about the (actually pretty incredible) process in this video.
 
NekoFever

NekoFever

Member
Vulcano's assistant said:
In Robin Hood for instance, yeah, that movie must have had a "small" budget. 70s Disney seems like it was in one of their worst times, which continued until The Little Mermaid made trucks of money.
Click to expand...

It's funny how you can see Disney being caught off guard by the success of The Little Mermaid when watching it. It looks insanely cheap next to the ones that followed like Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin and The Lion King. Oddly, its budget was quite high compared to those.
 
S

Sesha

Member
Just read the Princess and the Frog's wikipedia page. No wonder it did poorly when it opened up less than a week before goddamn Avatar. I love how the marketing department puts the blame on the animation department on insisting on the title having 'Princess' in it, but honestly thought putting the movie up against James Cameron's next film would be a good idea.

No wonder both Princess and Pooh underperformed. Guess we only have to blame Disney's marketing and distribution departments for the death of 2D theatrical releases.
 
D

DonasaurusRex

Online Ho Champ
Bjomesphat said:
They were developing Frozen as a 2D animated feature, then Princess and the Frog and Winnie the Pooh bombed so that pretty much sealed 2D's fate at Disney.

I often wonder if Frozen had come out in 2D before Princess and the Frog, if it would have been as successful as Frozen is now, and if it would have brought back a 2D renaissance.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say the medium is why the princess frog bombed, it just wasn't all that good , lets not pretend like all the 2D movies even with quality production values have been as good as the classics like Lion King, anything Don Bluth, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, Little Mermaid and Hercules.

Sucks that it scares off people willing to use the medium to tell a story though...damn it.
 
Boss Doggie

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Yeah PatF was kinda lame, best friend notwithstanding

NekoFever said:
It's funny how you can see Disney being caught off guard by the success of The Little Mermaid when watching it. It looks insanely cheap next to the ones that followed like Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin and The Lion King. Oddly, its budget was quite high compared to those.
Click to expand...

Man, fuck TLM, ruined Don Bluth :(
 
L

Log4Girlz

Member
Sesha said:
Just read the Princess and the Frog's wikipedia page. No wonder it did poorly when it opened up less than a week before goddamn Avatar. I love how the marketing department puts the blame on the animation department on insisting on the title having 'Princess' in it, but honestly thought putting the movie up against James Cameron's next film would be a good idea.

No wonder both Princess and Pooh underperformed. Guess we only have to blame Disney's marketing and distribution departments for the death of 2D theatrical releases.
Click to expand...

That's not an excuse. Totally different movie genre running counter programming to an action flick. It doesn't hurt animated titles. The movie just wasn't compelling and people have come to expect CGI.
 
B

blazenumb1

Member
DonasaurusRex said:
I wouldn't say the medium is why the princess frog bombed, it just wasn't all that good , lets not pretend like all the 2D movies even with quality production values have been as good as the classics like Lion King, anything Don Bluth, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, Little Mermaid and Hercules.

Sucks that it scares off people willing to use the medium to tell a story though...damn it.
Click to expand...

Don Bluth was awesome, made a lot of other classics when he left Disney too. Land Before Time, All Dogs go to Heaven, An American Tail and my favorites, Dragon Lair and Space Ace.
 
B

Bjomesphat

Banned
DonasaurusRex said:
I wouldn't say the medium is why the princess frog bombed, it just wasn't all that good , lets not pretend like all the 2D movies even with quality production values have been as good as the classics like Lion King, anything Don Bluth, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, Little Mermaid and Hercules.

Sucks that it scares off people willing to use the medium to tell a story though...damn it.
Click to expand...

Oh for sure, I don't think it was the medium that was the problem, but I guarantee that's how the Disney execs chose to see it. It's a real shame too.
 
B

BadWolf

Member
Those interested in Glen Keane and his work should definitely watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhKD6T2S98E

It's a recent talk he did at Savannah Film Festival 2014 talking about his life and all his works, including the new short Duet. Goes into the process and inspirations, gives tips and shows pencil tests and art.

A fantastic watch. The guy is so in love with animation.
 
B

BertramCooper

Banned
The Princess in the Frog didn't "bomb."

A $267 million gross on a $105 million budget isn't even remotely close to bombing.

It underperformed, but it sure as hell didn't bomb.
 
B

BadWolf

Member
Charlotte (the lead character's blonde friend) was the best thing about Princess and the Frog, other than that the movie was very safe and very bland. Can't say I'm surprised it under-performed.

Tangled and Frozen might be CG but they are also better movies overall in terms of story, characters, music, design and worlds.
 
W

WillyFive

Member
Princess and the Frog did well considering all the 'handicaps' the industry assumed it had because it was 2D and had African American protagonists.
 
D

DonasaurusRex

Online Ho Champ
blazenumb1 said:
Don Bluth was awesome, made a lot of other classics when he left Disney too. Land Before Time, All Dogs go to Heaven, An American Tail and my favorites, Dragon Lair and Space Ace.
Click to expand...

yeah i didnt it in my post but when i said all things don bluth i meant all of it, cause his work was / is amazing.
 
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