Ar¢tos
Member
Object persistence has no more impact on cpu usage than static objects, it's no excuse for 30fps.
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Phil Spencer: Starfield being 30fps is a "creative choice", not a hardware issue.
- Thread starter DryvBy
- Start date
Physiognomonics
Member
"30fps is a creative choice" is the "30fps is more cinematic" Microsoft version.
Captain Toad
Banned
Chosing 30 fps for a FPS sure is creative. Redfall had the same creative idea.
The game looks great though.
The game looks great though.
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analog_future
Resident Crybaby
He's saying it isn't a platform issue. Which it isn't. It's not an issue, it's a decision. He even references that other games run at 4k/60 on the platform, which is true.
But, with a static piece of $500 hardware with finite resources, the creative decision was made to prioritize scale, density, AI, systems, lighting, render distances, resolution, etc.. etc.. etc.. All considerations to be made when targeting 30fps vs 60fps on a fixed hardware spec.
I don't even know why I'm bothering in this thread. Ya'll are going to twist it to make it sound however you want it to sound.
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-COOLIO-
The Everyman
That's not what he's saying at all though. He's not saying 30fps is better than 60fps, He's saying that given the hardware they're opting for locked 30fps vs a bouncy 30-60. That's the choice.
Gamer_By_Proxy
Member
I look forward to the not creative 60 fps games and the really not creative 120 fps games. 
Captain Toad
Banned
They need Peter Molyneux.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Yeah, Spencer's comment is what makes this all mental gymnastics.
What he really means, "we chose to have it locked at 30 because this game needs to ship on time, optimizations be damned."
If they ever make a 60fps mode well after release... "creative choice" is gonna be a hell of a phrase to spin out of.
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MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
Possibly the worst main quest and writing in any RPG ever. Possibly! But. And it's a huge but. It's one of, if not my favourite exploration game ever. If Starfield is just that but on a galactic scale I'll be super happy. If it's a competent RPG, I'll be over the moon happy.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I say to you all that have issues with this news, buy it on pc
Watching the deep dive again in 4k I don't see how they get this to locked 60fps on console. Maybe crazy cuts to foliage and draw distance, lighting and resolution with fsr?
Watching the deep dive again in 4k I don't see how they get this to locked 60fps on console. Maybe crazy cuts to foliage and draw distance, lighting and resolution with fsr?
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Handle 60 fps in other games. That is games that are not Starfield. It is not an issue with the hardware being incapable of playing games at 60 fps in general if the developer wants to target that.
God fucking damn, you people are all so stupid. The severe lack of any sort of comprehension abilities people have these days is mindblowing.
StealthGoblin
Banned
Complete and utter crap.
The only legit reason for not having a game running at 60fps is that you can’t do it.
The only legit reason for not having a game running at 60fps is that you can’t do it.
bender
What time is it?
Again, I'm confused by your reply. My comment was in response to someone thinking switching engines would help Bethesda overcome their technical shortcomings. Obviously their engine can run at framerates above 30fps, even on consoles, but not on the same generation of console hardware as the game was released.
Ar¢tos
Member
Because people are using it as excuse for 30fps.
hyperbertha
Member
If by creative choice he means in order to include all the gameplay systems he needed to limit it to 30 fps on console I applaud it. 60 fps shouldn't come at the cost of gameplay advancement.
But if he means he chose 30 fps for the cinematic effect or what have you, I need to talk to phil. In person.
But if he means he chose 30 fps for the cinematic effect or what have you, I need to talk to phil. In person.
bender
What time is it?
I'm not one of those people so save the captain obvious replies for someone else.
TehGoomba7s
Member
Only issue with it will be when the recommended specs can run it at 60fps which are quite similar to XSX.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Phil and Todd are saying the same thing in the respective GB and Kotaku interviews though.
Who can say, maybe they'll add a 60 FPS most post-launch. But this is what they're saying at this time as their decision.
nemiroff
Gold Member
This is a simple matter of balancing current expected standards of graphical fidelity vs finite resources. Obviously a high end PC has more. so if a game is made for a less powerful platform the PC version doesn't have to be constrained to the same level. Why is this simple utterly logical concept so hard to understand..? It's almost like some of you don't want to..
A lot of people expected a 60fps console generation, but it was clear very early in the generation that it was completely unrealistic.
What "ruined" a flat common denominator 60fps was (indication, not scientifcally per se):
- After many lofty promises consoles are not as powerful afterall
- 4K
- Open worlds trend
- Ray Tracing
- Industry and customer level gfx expectations (a certain base level of shaders / vfx).
- Trends, a mix of basically all of the above and more
Phil, don’t you know?
That reply was kinda ironic.. An example of the desperate need to latch on and not take any dynamic context into consideration.
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Stare-Bear
Banned
Phil, don’t you know?
MikeM
Member
We don’t need 4k native. Upscalers work well to make up the difference. My 7900xt never sees native 4k.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Dick Jones
Gold Member
Watching you squirm defending another ill-advised comment from Phil Spencer. At this stage, Xbox should have hired the Phil Spencer from Love it or List it.
Todd Howard: Starfield Locked At 30FPS On Console For 'Consistency'
Bethesda's long-awaited space fantasy won't have a performance mode on Xboxkotaku.com
Man ..
the topic: "it's a creative decision"
Todd "we want the full fidelity so we're locking it at 30"
adam "they've locked it deliberately to avoid a scaled back 60 FPS version"
I'm literally saying the same thing ...
Y'all just want my blood ..
I'm just busting
adamsapple
for defending a stupid comment. I know it and so does he.
Phil is back with what he does best lol
It's a choice that is being forced by technical limitations.
They can't get the game run at 60fps in any way by just dropping resolution and details.
People will get 60fps on PC so it's precisely a console hardware issue that forced a choice.
It's a choice that is being forced by technical limitations.
They can't get the game run at 60fps in any way by just dropping resolution and details.
People will get 60fps on PC so it's precisely a console hardware issue that forced a choice.
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Balducci30
Member
Here’s the thing - you can technically call it a “creative choice” I guess - because they are CHOOSING to prioritize the visuals and lighting in this massive game with many systems at work -I’m speculating of course - but I assume with a game this massive and with real-time gi - it would require many sacrifices to make it work at 60 that they are unwilling to do.
Horizon looks amazing, especially the expansion - but lighting in that is not its strong suit and it has nowhere near this amount of stuff going on.
Fact is, the only reason this choice has to be made is because the series x, at three years old, is not capable of running it with satisfactory visuals at that framerate. It is what it is.
Horizon looks amazing, especially the expansion - but lighting in that is not its strong suit and it has nowhere near this amount of stuff going on.
Fact is, the only reason this choice has to be made is because the series x, at three years old, is not capable of running it with satisfactory visuals at that framerate. It is what it is.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Alright, fess up, which one of you is this ?
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Team Andromeda
Member
So all these 30 FPS trolls going to say the same when GTA 6 is running at 30 FPS?
Dick Jones
Gold Member
ChoosableOne
ChoosableAll
What will PC gamers do? Hopefully they will add a 30 fps lock so that we can play according to the developers' creative choice.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
SF Kosmo
Al Jazeera Special Reporter
I mean it looks like a better game than HFW by miles.
MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
This is why the game is locked to 30:
nemiroff
Gold Member
It could've been any of the usual suspects at gaf.
Alright, fess up, which one of you is this ?
That doesn't make any sense. Kinda makes you look stupid tbh.
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DryvBy
Member
Todd Howard: Starfield Locked At 30FPS On Console For 'Consistency'
Bethesda's long-awaited space fantasy won't have a performance mode on Xbox
Man ..
the topic: "it's a creative decision"
Todd "we want the full fidelity so we're locking it at 30"
adam "they've locked it deliberately to avoid a scaled back 60 FPS version"
I'm literally saying the same thing ...
Y'all just want my blood ..
What you just described is a hardware problem.
JackMcGunns
Member
It's true though, when you start a project like Startfield or Skyrim on a closed platform, you choose a target framerate as part of the design from Day 1, the framerate or resolution is not something that just dawns on you. Starfield is expected to have the same run as Skyrim and needs to be ambitious enough that it will span across the Pro consoles and even next gen.
Liamario
Banned
Of course it is and if Phil Spencer had been honest, he'd just say. A 'creative choice' implies that they could have ran the game at 60fps if they wanted. I suspect they simply couldn't hit the target and they decided to target 30 fps instead.Phil is back with what he does best lol
It's a choice that is being forced by technical limitations.
They can't get the game run at 60fps in any way by just dropping resolution and details.
People will get 60fps on PC so it's precisely a console hardware issue that forced a choice.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
I am going to try and make this as simple as possible.the topic: "it's a creative decision"
Todd "we want the full fidelity so we're locking it at 30"
adam "they've locked it deliberately to avoid a scaled back 60 FPS version"
I'm literally saying the same thing ...
Y'all just want my blood ..
To say, this is a creative decision, not a hardware decision... means/suggests that the hardware is fully capable of running it at 60fps. But that they creatively, the same way you would creatively place textures or choose lighting.... set it at 30fps instead.
If you are setting it at 30fps because you CANNOT run it at a higher fps with any form of stability... then that is NOT a creative choice, its a hardware limitation.
![L*][*N*K](/data/avatars/m/842/842515.jpg?1696510303){kind=avatar}
L*][*N*K
Banned
Nodidn’t they previously claim there was a 60fps mode on Xbox they’d show off?
Ev1L AuRoN
Member
Thank god for PC. I'm intrigued by the game, it looked interesting, I intend to dust it off my gamepass subscription when it launches, hopefully my PC can push it beyond the 30fps limbo. Being Bethesda, if the game runs at a lock 30fps with proper frame-pacing, I will consider it a massive win. By the graphics showed so far I'm suspecting it is a CPU issue, I'm expecting the game to be somewhat easy to run on mid-end PC's. Of course, I might be wrong.
Negotiator101
Member
No, you're doing it wrong, like I said I'm talking about a Broadway production vs a University production. One is doing things the other could only dream about.
Captain Toad
Banned
That was the point. It's called sarcasm and he was using it to point out the BS in Phil's comments that the game runs at 30 because of creative decisions and not limitations of the hardware.
The facts are that the game, as designed, can't do 60 on the Series X and S. If it could, it would. And PC can, so it will. There's nothing creative about it.
The honest answer would have been, "we chose to limit it to 30, so we could do other stuff, that the consoles would not have otherwise been able to handle". He doesn't want to show that the consoles have limitations, so he's doing PR speak (in other words, BS-ing us).
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Elder Legend
Banned
Yeah, I am not so sure what the fuck was that statement. Why can't they just offer 4K30 on Series X with 1080/60 as another option??? Why is the Series X locked to 4K/30 makes 0 sense to me.
And wtf does a "creative" even mean? Honestly, he really shouldn't have used the word "creative" that just makes it sound way worse.
Gudji
Member
Imagine being such a naive person to think that "there's very little going on under the hood" in Horizon and using that as an excuse for starfield not having 60 FPS mode on consoles. You either have no idea what you're talking about or never played it. The machines alone are incredibly complex and they have over 40 in the vanilla game - I haven't played Burning Shores yet btw so I have no idea how many are new.
Why are you talking about yourself in third person? And why do you want to be fired, you could just quit? Weird post.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Oh how selective, how selective indeed.
Phil said it was not a hardware issue tho!
We love twisting words. He's talking about other games that run at 4K/60 on console as not a hardware issue, clearly we can all read that. But we choose to misconstrue it.
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