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[The Technomancer]

Ah, I guess it doesn't compress the information from the IR matrix depth calculation and it does consume a bit of bandwidth. Will a better connection/bandwidth make Kinect that much better though?

Eh...the depth map isn't that large, its essentially the same amount of data as adding another channel to the RGB, since the onboard chip converts the depth patches generated by the IR to a grayscale 640x480. I don't know the specifics of USB though, so that extra data could very well be problematic.

 

[Alx]

Eh...the depth map isn't that large, its essentially the same amount of data as adding another channel to the RGB

two, actually, since the depth data is encoded on 16 bits (with only 12 bits used)

 

[The Technomancer]

two, actually, since the depth data is encoded on 16 bits (with only 12 bits used)

I stand corrected.

EDIT: Yup, right you are

 

[GQman2121]

Not enough E3 gifs in this bitch. The Ghost Recon stuff really is where they want to take gaming.

 

[derFeef]

Not enough E3 gifs in this bitch. The Ghost Recon stuff really is where they want to take gaming.

You mean optional stuff?

 

[AlanzTalon]

You mean optional stuff?

no he means experimenting in new interfaces and attempting to apply new technology in different places. no place for that in games.

 

[derFeef]

no he means experimenting in new interfaces and attempting to apply new technology in different places. no place for that in games.

Too bad, I enjoy such things

 

[Beer Monkey]

Backwards compatible fuck yeah.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Now we gonna have the "Bubba Gump" lip complaints. Thanks!

 

[enzo_gt]

"Bundled" =/= "Built-in"

Bundled is better for organization of your living room, etc. as long as it doesn't technically limit it.

As something included in every console -which I fully expect it to be- I look forward to seeing some of the creative uses of it by big name devs. The kind of sometimes subtle, but ultimately functional stuff, like head tracking.

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

Found the Next Xbox?

 

[Nealand Liquor]

How about you get the first one kinda functioning before talking about the next one?

Yeah really, wasn't there some magical update that was supposed to increase the camera's accuracy?

As time goes on I'm getting colder and colder on the kinect, yet my wife and kids love it more with every passing day. I can't say I'm unhappy with buying it even though it sucks to be left out in the cold.

 

[Takuya]

The hardware is only as good as the software makes it out to be. Good luck interpreting intended speech from lip movements devs.

 

[French]

So MS is going to continue focusing on Kinect, even next gen, ugh.

 

[AlanzTalon]

So MS is going to continue focusing on Kinect, even next gen, ugh.

what does Kinect take away from your gaming experience? as best I can tell, they are going about it perfectly. integrating it into the experience at the UI level but not forcing it, adding it to AAA games as it makes sense but never forcing it, and developing both casual and family experiences designed specifically for it.

your Call of Duty and your Skyrims still come out and still work...i don't see where the "ugh" comes from...

 

[cacildo]

"World cup!"

 

[JGS]

Forcing a nonessential gaming component into the system unnecessarily raises the price imo. Right now, Kinect adds 25-30% to the gaming experience and will be mandatory even if the games won't be. To me they should make menus and whatnot compliant with Kinect even if shooters and other games don't make sense with it.

 

[TTP]

The hardware is only as good as the software makes it out to be. Good luck interpreting intended speech from lip movements devs.

What I get from the little info we've got is that lip recognition is for determining facial expression. You know, , :/, , :O.

 

[Dragon]

How does this make gaming better?

If Microsoft is doing this solely for gaming, the question is why?!

Yes I know it's sold well but I don't find that it enhanced my gaming experience that much if at all.

 

[Alx]

How does this make gaming better?

It's bigger than just making gaming better. The iPhone multi-touch display didn't make telephoning or listening to music better. But it changed a lot for mobile interfaces in general.
That's what devices like kinect are trying to do. Motion games are just one of their use, but reducing its appeal to motion games would be like reducing the appeal of touch interfaces to Angry Birds.

 

[br0ken_shad0w]

More of the top, less of the bottom please:

 

[Pocks]

Spoiler

no it won't work, are you out of your minds?

Glad I'm not the only one who immediately thought of that...

 

[The Albatross]

Man, this is exactly what we were talking about before Kinect came out and the details of NAtal were hazy. We were all talking up this device that ended up performing much worse than expectations.

Welcome to 2009/2010 guys

 

[Globox_82]

What if these rumors are fake, coming from MS?
Just to confuse Sony and make them make some rash dumb decision?
Because let's be honest Sony likes to watch what others are doing and then trying to one up them at their own, which I personally don't like tbh

 

[jett]

No way it's built in, that'd be moronic. I imagine the kinect module will be a heck of a lot smaller though. The lip-reading thing is just hype.

 

[Dunlop]

Man, this is exactly what we were talking about before Kinect came out and the details of NAtal were hazy. We were all talking up this device that ended up performing much worse than expectations.

Welcome to 2009/2010 guys

Not sure what people's expectations were, but I was amazed at what Kinect could do for a $150 device.

 

[Emitan]

Not a fan of paying for a machine that has a POS that I don't want. If you would have told me in 07 that I'd likely be skipping the next xbox because of a lack of games and Kinect I would have laughed at you. I miss those times so much.

dammit, i was gonna make a post asking if you're going to pry the kinect out of the system, but you already posted

 

[TTP]

How does this make gaming better?

If Microsoft is doing this solely for gaming, the question is why?!

Yes I know it's sold well but I don't find that it enhanced my gaming experience that much if at all.

It's not so much about the gaming, but rather about the experience and immersion. I can think of a couple of cool implementations of this tech, like a LA Noir "in reverse" where NPC can figure out if you lying but just looking at your expression or something.

Or in a shooter, you could turn your head away from the screen or close your eyes right before a flash grenade detonates to nullify its blinding effect (screen goes fuzzy/blank or not depending on your reaction time).

Or in a MGS game have Naomi gently asks to look elsewhere as she changes clothes. She wouldn't progress until you actually do so. (You unlock an achievement if you menage to get a glimpse of her naked with the corner of the eye.)

 

[The Albatross]

What if these rumors are fake, coming from MS?
Just to confuse Sony and make them make some rash dumb decision?
Because let's be honest Sony likes to watch what others are doing and then trying to one up them at their own, which I personally don't like tbh

Yeah, usually because they absolutely fail at it too. THey rush to jump on whatever the competition has released, and make some half baked crap product that has no developer support.

 

[TTP]

Yeah, usually because they absolutely fail at it too. THey rush to jump on whatever the competition has released, and make some half baked crap product that has no developer support.

Yeah, like that stupid dual stick idea.

 

[Riddick]

The Kinect project and hyperbole have become interconnected the last couple of years so this "news" is expected. Too bad that like most Kinect hype it's most probably bullshit though and is irrelevant to gaming.

 

[The Albatross]

It's not so much about the gaming, but rather about the experience and immersion. I can think of a couple of cool implementations of this tech, like a LA Noir "in reverse" were NPC can figure out if you lying but just looking at your expression or something.

Or in a shooter, you could turn your head away from the screen or close your eyes right before a flash grenade detonates to nullify its blinding effect (screen goes fuzzy/blank or not depending on your reaction time).

Or in a MGS game have Naomi gently asks to look elsewhere as she changes clothes. She wouldn't progress until you actually do so. (You unlock an achievement if you menage to get a glimpse of her naked with the corner of the eye.)

Yeah, all great ideas, none of which will ever be implemented.

Although I do agree with the sentiment from the OP. If Kinect is really going to take off and be used effectively, it has to be built into the console. It won't be, but it has to be. Otherwise, you'll just get shitty Kinect motion games and then stupid hokey Kinect functionality that doesn't improve the game.

 

[InaudibleWhispa]

What I get from the little info we've got is that lip recognition is for determining facial expression. You know, , :/, , :O.

Avatar Kinect does that kind of basic lip recognition now.

 

[RooMHM]

Yeah, all great ideas, none of which will ever be implemented.

What? Are you serious?

Doing a more technologically advanced product is a good thing. Now the issue is that precision has never been the problem imo. What will it bring? More non-games? Yeeha...

 

[Dunlop]

The Kinect project and hyperbole have become interconnected the last couple of years so this "news" is expected. Too bad that like most Kinect hype it's most probably bullshit though and is irrelevant to gaming.

Again what did people expect Kinect to do? It does what was advertsied, there is only so much that can be done with Motion detection

I get to play BF, CoD,Skyrim to satisfy my "hardcore" needs and also have a blast with the kids playing Kinect Sports or when I have parties we get shitfaced and play Dance central

Kinect satisfies a certain market segment that Microsoft needed to take from Nintendo, peoples expectations are just too high

 

[The Albatross]

Yeah, like that stupid dual stick idea.

Yeah because obviously something that Sony releases in 1997 means that they will NEVER play catch up again... 15 years later... amirite

 

[TTP]

Yeah, all great ideas, none of which will ever be implemented.

Although I do agree with the sentiment from the OP. If Kinect is really going to take off and be used effectively, it has to be built into the console. It won't be, but it has to be. Otherwise, you'll just get shitty Kinect motion games and then stupid hokey Kinect functionality that doesn't improve the game.

I know, but it's not just about being built in or not anymore. Assuming Sony doesn't go third party next round, it would be fair to say games will still be developed on multiple platforms, and as long as these multiple platforms provide different motion control solutions you won't see any being supported to its fullest potential by the industry due to the need to stick to the lowest common denominator. Hence the only games that would be really benefit from Kinect2/Move2 would be exclusive/1st party ones.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

If it's mostly useless outside of casual games, why even add it ? Has there been any real use for it in "real" games ?

While I have to agree that Kinect implementation in most core games has been half-assed at best, the potential is still there. It frankly puzzles me how developers can't seem to wrap their heads around the tech and immediately see how it could better the experience. Mass Effect 3 has a good idea with voice recognition during combat, I'd much prefer that to using the radial menu for issuing orders. However, their implementation in dialogue segments seems awful and a completely wasted opportunity.

 

[Plinko]

The Kinect project and hyperbole have become interconnected the last couple of years so this "news" is expected. Too bad that like most Kinect hype it's most probably bullshit though and is irrelevant to gaming.

Depends on your definition of "gaming." Kinect is enjoyable in certain instances.

 

[infinityBCRT]

Popular fanboy myth. Kinect isn't hampered by USB. It's hampered by laughably low-res camera sensors. USB ports don't share bandwidth either. That's not even possible on a serial (USB) interface. Basically the entire article (and thus the OP) is bollocks.

Microsoft could transmit 1080p60 video over USB2 today, if they had been willing to spend an extra dollar on MJPEG compression. Quit blaming USB, start blaming them.

They probably put in the low res camera sensors because they knew they couldn't make use of the extra resolution.

I'm sure if they spent extra money on the hardware they could have improved the compression, but as we all know they decided to take out the Kinect CPU and offload that work to the 360 CPU, so they couldn't really do compression.

I also wonder how much lag could possibly be introduced doing compression and decompression on the data.

 

[The Albatross]

What? Are you serious?

Doing a more technologically advanced product is a good thing. Now the issue is that precision has never been the problem imo. What will it bring? More non-games? Yeeha...

Everybody had awesome ideas for the Kinect back when it was being hyped as Natal, the thing looked like a serious game changer. But aside from some iOS/Android ports and from navigating the new X-Box dash, it hasn't lived up to the hype and hasn't made any noticeable difference in any premier X-Box titles. It hasn't been a game changer for any mainstream, major games, where Kinect has actually made an improvement over the non-Kinect experience. I was thinking the one exception could have been with Forza 4, the head tracking looked like it really could improve first-person racing experiences, but no forza enthusiasts have remarked that it's improved the game.

 

[AlanzTalon]

hearing a whole lot of "I like things the way they are because that's how I like them" kind of self-centric posts.

put it this way...at some point video games have to add something because if not we are still playing on that atari joystick. sometimes they add something that works, sometimes not. Kinect is a thing that works, and people buy it. Microsoft wants to sell you things. news flash it is capitalism.

so buy it or don't buy it. MS is going to release an Xbox that will have a better Kinect as a part of it. People will still buy it.

I still don't get why people are complaining about a company releasing a new thing.

 

[TTP]

Yeah because obviously something that Sony releases in 1997 means that they will NEVER play catch up again... 15 years later... amirite

I didn't mean that. You said Sony plays catch up, period. I was just pointing out that's not some sort of company politics.

 

[Gomu Gomu]

More of the top, less of the bottom please:

Truly one of the greatest comics to grace the internet.

 

[Zeppelin]

To me it doesn't matter how accurate they make that thing, I will never want to play games with it. It honestly kind of amazes me that MS continues to push that thing. Do people still really buy it? And buy games for it? I was under the impression that most of the software sucked. I guess it's cool that they're improving the tech if people really want a Kinect 2, but do they?

 

[RooMHM]

Everybody had awesome ideas for the Kinect back when it was being hyped as Natal, the thing looked like a serious game changer. But aside from some iOS/Android ports and from navigating the new X-Box dash, it hasn't lived up to the hype and hasn't made any noticeable difference in any premier X-Box titles. It hasn't been a game changer for any mainstream, major games, where Kinect has actually made an improvement over the non-Kinect experience. I was thinking the one exception could have been with Forza 4, the head tracking looked like it really could improve first-person racing experiences, but no forza enthusiasts have remarked that it's improved the game.

I mean that those were ideas that would make me quite gaming for serious.
Natal has always been, from the start a CASUAL game changer nothing more. People have dreams and some expectations I would qualify as hype but the reality has never been different. What were the demos of Natal/Kinect that made you think it was a game changer? Star Wars? The drawing thing? the vocal command? the driving demo?

 

[The Albatross]

I know, but it's not just about being built in or not anymore. Assuming Sony doesn't go third party next round, it would be fair to say games will still be developed on multiple platforms, and as long as these multiple platforms provide different motion control solutions you won't see any being supported to its fullest potential by the industry due to the need to stick to the lowest common denominator. Hence the only games that would be really benefit from Kinect2/Move2 would be exclusive/1st party ones.

I'm with you on that for 3rd party games, just like how in this generation developers have had to develop for the lowest common denominator of non-HDD consoles. But, exclusive first party innovation could still push the platform. Some guy snarkily replied to my comment about SOny making a half-baked add on (Move) by mentioning the Dual Analog controller for the PS1, released in 1997, and while his point is lost in a discussion about innovation 15 years later, the Dual Analog controller is a great example of how console exclusive games can push the technology for other consoles.

A great example is Ape Escape, which came out shortly after the dual analog controller was released in the states, and it was a premier PS1 title that was so unique and really pushed other developers to realize that they needed to support 2 analog stick control. Next thing, major 3rd party developers were releasing content on the PS1 that supported the dual analog controller, and it pushed future console development to universally support dual analog control.

I feel like developers like Bungie or Turn10, who are totally invested in the Microsoft ecosystem, are scared to develop around the Kinect just because it wouldn't have widespread adoption and the game would only sell to Kinect owners. But if Microsoft did built kinect functionality into the next console, in some way (even if it were a competatively priced launch bundle), then you'd see more of those mostly exclusive developers taking chances, which could really push other consoles and other 3rd parties to jump onto it.

 

[pakkit]

Lip reading in conjunction with vocal recognition could mean less errors in the future with the technology.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Everybody had awesome ideas for the Kinect back when it was being hyped as Natal, the thing looked like a serious game changer. But aside from some iOS/Android ports and from navigating the new X-Box dash, it hasn't lived up to the hype and hasn't made any noticeable difference in any premier X-Box titles. It hasn't been a game changer for any mainstream, major games, where Kinect has actually made an improvement over the non-Kinect experience.

It has been a game changer for Xbox 360, however. It's helped Microsoft finally reach an audience they couldn't touch before.

And it's too early to make that call anyway. If future consoles continue implementing similar interfaces and the tech does continue permeating fields other than gaming, than it will be seen as a game changer 5-10 years from now.

 

[Riddick]

Depends on your definition of "gaming." Kinect is enjoyable in certain instances.

If by certain instances you just mean dance and party games that are already lacking new ideas and their iterations have become repetitive then we agree. These genres are so basic and devoid of content that are already struggling to offer something new even though they're brand new.