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[neutralgamer02]

Where are all of these arbitrary years coming from?

They may be arbitrary, but the point stands. DB and Transformers aren't just targeted for just kids in the same way Power Rangers and Barbie are. They also appeal to teens and young adults. The same can be said for most of sony's games.

 

[victreeb3l]

i loved the aesthetics of these games but i found them too floaty and boring. sackboy is a great character though

 

[Kenshin001]

Had some of the funniest moments this generation playing LBP co-op with a couple of friends and think it deserved every single rave review it got. I think the problem is it just didn't appeal to non gamers as it should have. My wife didn't get into it at all. LBP2 just seemed like an expansion pack.

Also the idiots at Sony never really promoted some of the fantastic user made content until it was too late and it was never promoted in game. So many really creative levels just quickly dropped away into obscurity.

 

[Leezard]

Sony games target different demographics, but in a specific range. There is no game sony has come out with that targets little kids like nintendo. It is usually 13+.

I was focusing on PS3 titles, but I have yet to see a sony title specifically for children 7 - 13. Sony titles usually targets some group 13+.

Did, I say a nintendo game targets 7-13?

You certainly are saying something like it. That said, I think both companies have games targeting kids, but in no way are Sony titles more "broad range" than Nintendo titles.

 

[RSLAEV]

I know the series gets a lot of love on this board, but personally I find the sackboy character design boring and unappealing.

 

[Drinky Crow]

because it's boring as hell as an actual platformer, and floaty jumping is physically unpleasant

 

[HappyBivouac]

because who would want 1/2 of a little big planet when they can get a whole little big planet

 

[WhyMe6]

Look at how many people were interested in the first title, and observe how that number dropped off significantly for the second. There were a lot of people disappointed!

As has already been mentioned by many, I was disappointed by three key elements: the atrocious floaty jumping, the finicky three split planes and the fact that it wasn't a very fun platformer.

A shame, really, it had so much potential.

 

[Marco1]

The floaty jumping.
I so much wanted it to be like a creative mario but it's not and that's a shame.
The idea is unrivalled though.

 

[Camilos]

Look at how many people were interested in the first title, and observe how that number dropped off significantly for the second. There were a lot of people disappointed!

I bought the game for my daughter. She was 7. She found the game too difficult. Personally, I didn't enjoy the game much. It wasn't a bad game, it just wasn't compelling enough for me to spend more than a couple of hours playing it.

 

[Americanmushroom]

Still actively playing lbp2. Just creating actually. The problem is that most of the levels people make and that are in the 'cool levels' or even 'mmpick' are just games that people know already like peggle and stuff. I find it kinda stupid that these levels get all the praises and none of the more originals ones. I made a level that got mmpicked but it had very few views compared to 'pacman, tetris, moonlanding' - remakes... cause my level was pure self made stuff. Anyway.. the main problem for the sales would be that it has the tools for grown ups but the designs for children. Some of us don't care about that but the dudebro don't want some cute sackboy..


And also... Apparently people doesnt know that there are A LOT of levels without the floaty sackboy..


PS: i love this game. I'm just stating the obvious

 

[Drinky Crow]

also: needs proper powerups. who cares about the tools?

 

[Raziel]

Because cutesy mascot-driven platformers don't largely appeal to the "core" demographic that buys a Playstation (or especially an Xbox) anymore. I don't think it's even a viable thing to pitch anymore to a major publisher.

It's plain to see 6 years into this gen what types of games rule the charts and break all the entertainment records on these platforms. Modern setting and/or high sci-fi/fantasy (starring mostly regular looking humans, natch) is what's vogue.

To get into the whole "floaty" angle is to completely miss the big picture above. As Y2Kev touched on on page 1, there are plenty of really popular games that feature really clunky and awkward gameplay. These people are mostly just treating this thread as a "Why didn't you like LBP?" and getting in their jabs where they can.

As for the amount of emphasis placed on level creation and those that contend that it's not a big draw for a big audience, I would argue that it's precisely that aspect of the game that has distinguished it from other like games and what's allowed it to enjoy as much success as it has, given that it's not really built for its platforms market.

 

[Americanmushroom]

also: needs proper powerups. who cares about the tools?

powerups? lbp2 got a lot of them, you cand shoot, grab and trhow , grappling hook etc.

 

[RedRedSuit]

The series has done well. The greatest barrier is just it being a new IP, on one console, in a genre in which no one except Nintendo does well. It's not unlike Forza failing to do blockbuster numbers, when all the brand loyalty is with GT, and the chief territory where the sales for it would be is more skewed towards the competitor console (PS3).

Gameplay-wise the jump mechanic is a big barrier. Game should be more pick-up-and-play-friendly. Personally I found the decision not to massively overhaul the default jump physics in LBP2 (compared to LBP1) a head-scratchingly arrogant and self-damaging move by Media Molecule. I highly doubt, however, that this is what led to successful but non-blockbuster sales of LBP1. Initial sales aren't about things like that... they're about marketing and luck (hitting a niche that's in huge demand at a given moment); LBP didn't have that. Assassin's Creed 1 was an immensely boring game, but it didn't matter, because it captured people's imaginations in terms of marketing/mass appeal... LBP didn't.

However the lack of improvement sales-wise from LBP1 to LBP2 may well have partially to do with people being disillusioned with LBP1 mechanics and MM arrogantly ignoring this.

 

[Darryl]

LBP is massively popular and sells plenty of copies, so I have a hard time understanding exactly what the OP is trying to say

is he expecting it to be Mario-level popular or something? 30yo franchise vs a 3 yo one

 

[SykoTech]

powerups? lbp2 got a lot of them, you cand shoot, grab and trhow , grappling hook etc.

Indeed, but the guy you're replying to isn't one to be taken too seriously.

 

[Boogalogist]

I hear this floaty complaint about LBP a lot. Can someone explain this floaty thing to me? I don't get it.

 

[RedRedSuit]

LBP is massively popular and sells plenty of copies, so I have a hard time understanding exactly what the OP is trying to say

is he expecting it to be Mario-level popular or something? 30yo franchise vs a 3 yo one

Let's not overstate things.

LBP1 sold North of 4 million copies, but much of that was with bundles. Still, pretty damn good.

LBP2 sold... what... 1.5-2 million in ~1 year? Sure, that's not bad. But it's not "massively popular." If I had to guess I'd say it's just about the minimum it would have to sell to be profitable.

There's also a huge gap between Mario-level popular and LBP2-level popular. Between those 2 there's a level of popularity of something like Uncharted... in the 3-5 million region.

 

[RedRedSuit]

I hear this floaty complaint about LBP a lot. Can someone explain this floaty thing to me? I don't get it.

Play the LBP2 demo. You'll know the exact answer to that.

It's not a game-killing flaw for most people (it is for some). It is however a discouraging element that drives people away.

 

[FairXchange]

LPB on Vita looks incredible and is seemingly a perfect fit. Hope they go all out for it, I expect a longer, more inventive SP than LBP2's less than stellar SP.

 

[blizzardjesus]

Floaty jumps
Boring platforming
No Story or memorable villain.

Was super excited for the title during the beta. When the game came out I got to world 2 or 3 and said F this, it just wasn't fun the way a Mario platformer or any other platformer from the 90's was. I didn't expect it to be a mario game, but I expected it to be fun. It felt very dull.

For example, if Little Big Planet 3 was cel shaded and controlled like Super Meat Boy - and we could build levels off that concept. It'd be great

This right here, Super Meat Boy was made by people who understood how to make a platformer feel fun. It's controls were precise and you always felt in control and comfortable with your jumps.

 

[Chuck Norris]

LBP franchise has a lot of room to grow, but they need to think how to expand it in progressive ways. A sequel to LBP should feature a new aesthetic, entirely new gameplay mechanics. The whole point of LBP is to have us be super creative with the tool set. But we can only go so far with that concept if you keep giving us the same tools over and over

For example, if Little Big Planet 3 was cel shaded and controlled like Super Meat Boy - and we could build levels off that concept. It'd be great

 

[bobbytkc]

LBP2 sold... what... 1.5-2 million in ~1 year? Sure, that's not bad. But it's not "massively popular." If I had to guess I'd say it's just about the minimum it would have to sell to be

1.5 million to be profitable? let's not get ridiculous here. The game is a sequel, isn't built from scratch, is made in less than 2 years. Media Molecule is also completely owned by Sony, so from sony's perspectives, whatever price they sell to retailers is revenue for them. They should be able to break even for far less than that. Games do not need to sell millions to break even.

 

[neutralgamer02]

LBP franchise has a lot of room to grow, but they need to think how to expand it in progressive ways. A sequel to LBP should feature a new aesthetic, entirely new gameplay mechanics. The whole point of LBP is to have us be super creative with the tool set. But we can only go so far with that concept if you keep giving us the same tools over and over

For example, if Little Big Planet 3 was cel shaded and controlled like Super Meat Boy - and we could build levels off that concept. It'd be great

That would be pretty awesome if LBP3 had that style.

1.5 million to be profitable? let's not get ridiculous here. The game is a sequel, isn't built from scratch, is made in less than 2 years. Media Molecule is also completely owned by Sony, so from sony's perspectives, whatever price they sell to retailers is revenue for them. They should be able to break even for far less than that. Games do not need to sell millions to break even.

Yeah, I agree with this. Also as I said in this thread the game is actually a pretty good success. I just didn't recognize how much it sold before I started the thread. I fully expect LBP2 to hit 3+ million like the original LBP which would put it in the top tier sales for platformers this gen.

 

[Darryl]

Let's not overstate things.

LBP1 sold North of 4 million copies, but much of that was with bundles. Still, pretty damn good.

LBP2 sold... what... 1.5-2 million in ~1 year? Sure, that's not bad. But it's not "massively popular." If I had to guess I'd say it's just about the minimum it would have to sell to be profitable.

There's also a huge gap between Mario-level popular and LBP2-level popular. Between those 2 there's a level of popularity of something like Uncharted... in the 3-5 million region.

is 1.5-2 million copies low for you?

I don't know a soul who hasn't heard of LBP, and most of my friends don't "game".

 

[Scoops]

The platforming was mediocre for me.

And I don't give a shit about creating my own game. That's what I give companies my $60 for.

This.

 

[Loudninja]

Not sure why some people are acting like this is a small franchise that barely breaks 100K.

 

[Boogalogist]

Play the LBP2 demo. You'll know the exact answer to that.

It's not a game-killing flaw for most people (it is for some). It is however a discouraging element that drives people away.

Is the LBP2 demo mechanics different from the retail version? I have both LBP 1 and 2, but I still don't get what this "floaty" thing is about.

 

[quickwhips]

My wife tried it out because i thought she might like it since she likes super mario brothers. She hated it after 10 minutes she said it wasn't for her and so I gave the game to my brother.

 

[Roto13]

You know, I really liked LBP when I bought it. I especially loved the user created levels, because there were a lot of interesting ideas out there and creative uses of the toolset.

I played it the other day after not playing it for about a year. I didn't enjoy it at all and was actually really annoyed with it. (I was playing one of the included levels by Media Molecule.) I just found the platforming really irritating. I don't know why the floatiness seemed like such a horrible thing after not bothering me so much back then.

I don't think I like it any more. :/

 

[Sean]

I bought the first one at launch and was pretty disappointed with it. The floaty jumping just didn't feel right and was a huge turn off for me.

The whole "create" / user generated content aspect was a huge failure too. Everything fell into one of four groups:

1) Trophy Whore Levels - the most popular level by far was something where Sackboy simply falls for two minutes straight and the player gets like seven or eight trophies for doing absolutely nothing. There were a bunch more like that too. Not fun and after having all those trophies there's less incentive to try out other levels since there's no "goal" to work towards.
2) Shitty Ripoffs of other franchises - the other most popular levels were terrible recreations of other games such as Mario/Sonic. There's no music or sound effects, the physics and gameplay feel absolutely nothing like those games.. What's the point? Who has fun playing these aside from novelty factor of "lololol Mario on PS3!!!"?
3) Novelty crap - someone builds a working calculator or working computer level or whatever. Ok? It's neat that they can build that I guess, but nothing more. Is anybody actually playing those and enjoying it?
4) Legitimate levels - nearly all of the original user created content was complete shit. Like you hop on a skateboard and go down a ramp and that's it. I played several ones where you could not progress if a certain event/physics thing went wrong. I'm sure some nice original levels were made eventually but most probably gave up before then (and the quality original stuff got no hype like all the novelty shit did).

 

[Rafaelcsa]

Its levels are too boring. The visuals are great, there's lots of charm, Sackboy is awesome... but the platforming (levels + controls) suck. My friend keeps trying to get me into the game but I just can't find anything in it to drive me forward.

In a generation populated by New Super Mario Bros. Wii, Kirby Canvas Curse, Braid, Super Mario Galaxy 1/2, Donkey Kong Country Returns, Trine, Kirby Return to Dreamland, Super Meat Boy, Mega Man 9/10, etc, LBP just comes off flat. Maybe last generation it'd be a true stand-out, since 2D platformers were almost extinct then.

 

[frAntic_Frog]

LBP on PSP, meh
LBP on 3DS, Console Seller.

ha

no




just look at nintendogs ds vs 3ds sales

 

[PetriP-TNT]

I also think that the collecting aspect of the single player hurts the game instead of making it better, making the levels some kind of OCD chore.

 

[SuperAngelo64]

This game was huge.

It's just not 2008 anymore.

 

[LosDaddie]

The controls aren't what I like in a platformer (ie., floaty), and I don't care to do any content creation. So yeah. Excellent idea, not so good execution

 

[RooMHM]

It's not a game. It's a tool to make factually crappy, short uninteresting minigames. It's a bit like Warioware DIY in fact just more sophisticated.

 

[Satchel]

Yeah, they would have definitely have had a great online multiplayer coop experience like lbp has which makes the game fun to play. Oh wait...

Hat the hell are you talking about?

So Mario Galaxy sucks because it doesn't have online multiplayer?

A shit game is a shit game whether multiplayer is in it or not. Not saying LBP is shit necessarily, but the fact that it gas MP is irrelevant. The game doesn't play well.

Nintendo would have made a better game. Full stop.

 

[Dark Schala]

Editor = awesome.

Core gameplay and general aesthetic = not so awesome.

Yup. Creating and sharing levels is probably the best part of the game. It's nice to see what people can come up with, no matter if it's original or an homage. I didn't mind that.

The presentation doesn't seem like it's for everyone, though. The visual aspects, mainly, are what I'm referring to. I have a few friends who seem to love it, but I have others who don't find it very engaging other than a few level designs. I fall into the latter group. I like a lot of vibrant colours and stylization more than the type of stylization that LBP was going for. There was something... sterile about some of the levels, I guess. I dunno. I just didn't go for it.

And the gameplay, well... seems to rest on collecting, but the platforming and jumping are super-floaty. It got boring after a while. :/

It's weird because when it came out in 2008, I was ok with it. Then when I played LBP2, even with the obstructions and dangerous areas added, I didn't care for it anymore... mostly because the physics and platforming weren't fixed from the first game.

Not to mention that it's a new IP. It ain't Mario, so it's not going to make those numbers.

 

[Ken Masters]

the jumping in the game fucking sucks, and if the jumping suck in a platformer that basically means the gameplay is broken. I loved LBP but I had to force myself to work through the "floaty" jumping, just horrible.

 

[Grayman]

I found that little big planet did not have a lot of staying power and had some things work against it.

-floaty controls make it just not good to play again and again like mario is. A platforming challenge in LBP just wasn't good to do over and over.
-content selection was not organized or well searchable. Just a random mess of stuff.
-I do not know about others but the pay DLC in a game about creation bugged me.

I have not checked out little big planet 2.

Sony also basically abandoned it when it should have been made a flagship for the platform. (maybe they did this because of the floaty jumping)

 

[Hazelhurst]

There are some parts of LBP2 that look as good as God of War III. I think that's because they both use MLAA if I'm not mistaken.

 

[neutralgamer02]

Hat the hell are you talking about?

So Mario Galaxy sucks because it doesn't have online multiplayer?

A shit game is a shit game whether multiplayer is in it or not. Not saying LBP is shit necessarily, but the fact that it gas MP is irrelevant. The game doesn't play well.

Nintendo would have made a better game. Full stop.

It isn't just having online multiplayer, it is having a good local/online coop integrated into the game.

First, I've never said that SMG isn't a good game, but nintendo really needs to bring their 3D mario game into the modern era and add the ability to play full on coop local/online in the story mode with luigi or something. Ever other modern platformer has it and it is what keeps me from saying it is the best platformer of this gen. That goes to Rayman Origin or meatboy.

Mario Galaxy has some sort of halfbaked 2 player local multiplayer option which was seemed to be tacked on at the last minute. LBP on the other hand is a totally different game. It has a fully fleshed multiplayer that is intergrated into the gameplay. The point of LBP isn't to play through it by yourself, but to play with others. That is what makes the game fun. You obviously don't understand that and I doubt you have played through the entire game, if you have even played it, to figure that out.

Also, the game plays just fine. The "floaty" jumps might be legitmate complaint for some, but it in no way keeps anyone from enjoying the game.

Anyway, I like what I like, you like what you like. It won't change that fact that LBP is a successful platformer which will probably be around for a while.

 

[Trent Strong]

Awful controls.

 

[linko9]

Got LBP with the welcome back program... I couldn't stand it. The game just wasn't fun for me. As a platformer, the levels were bland, the controls were loose, and the Guardian-heroes-esque "three levels of depth" just didn't work well for me. No matter how cool the creation tools are, if the core gameplay is poor, it's just not going to be fun for me.

 

[famousmortimer]

I love the LBP series, I own all 3 (psp, if you are scratching your head). LBP2 is an amazing achievement and better than LBP1 in every category.


But i do understand that it's a niche title. That niche may be 2 million strong, but it's still a niche. It's not Mario. It's not CoD. It's not GTA. It isn't going to take off with the general public and become this huge thing.

The fact of the matter is that people generally don't:

1. Play platformers at all. Or maybe *just* mario.

2. Like physics in their platformers (you can lump the 'floaty jump' haters into this)

3. Want to create their own content.



Now, i love platformers, i love the physics in the game and I will spend 75 hours working on a single level and love every second of it.


My only issue with the game, and it's a huge issue, is from the creative side. If you make a level called "FFVII skateboarding lolol omg" it will get 10s of thousands of downloads, mostly just for mentioning FFVII. If you make a 100 hour RPG and write the script yourself and it's the greatest game of all time... it will get downloaded maybe 10 times total, unless a website or MM themselves promote it.


I spent 75 hours this february making a Tower Defense level. It came out ok. It's not amazing, by any stretch, but it was more in depth than any TD games on the service at that time (im sure by now its totally outclassed, i haven't checked). I even made a website for it on my podcast's site, I promoted it heavily at 2 of the biggest LBP fansites. And after being out for one month it had 30 downloads.

Thirty!

You can double that and not even hit how many hours I spent making the thing! It totally crushed my spirit. I never made another LBP level again after that.

 

[WrikaWrek]

Same reason why The Movies* wasn't.

*I do know they aren't of the same exact quality.

 

[Anasui Kishibe]

It isn't just having online multiplayer, it is having a good local/online coop integrated into the game.

First, I've never said that SMG isn't a good game, but nintendo really needs to bring their 3D mario game into the modern era and add the ability to play full on coop local/online in the story mode with luigi or something. Ever other modern platformer has it and it is what keeps me from saying it is the best platformer of this gen. That goes to Rayman Origin or meatboy.

Mario Galaxy has some sort of halfbaked 2 player local multiplayer option which was seemed to be tacked on at the last minute. LBP on the other hand is a totally different game. It has a fully fleshed multiplayer that is intergrated into the gameplay. The point of LBP isn't to play through it by yourself, but to play with others. That is what makes the game fun. You obviously don't understand that and I doubt you have played through the entire game, if you have even played it, to figure that out.

Also, the game plays just fine. The "floaty" jumps might be legitmate complaint for some, but it in no way keeps anyone from enjoying the game.

Anyway, I like what I like, you like what you like. It won't change that fact that LBP is a successful platformer which will probably be around for a while.

ok, we get it. You like playing co-op and local multiplayer

Nintendo doesn't need to do shit, however, because the 0,1% percent of the gaming population you represent wants a feature the remaining 99,9% doesn't give a shit about in a platformer. Galaxy stomps LBP to a pulp for other reasons, first of them is that it isn't boring

 

[fernoca]

Plus, Kirby's Epic Yarn, Kirby Return to Dreamland, New Super Mario Bros. Wii, Donkey Kong Country Returns had local multiplayer some 2 players, others 4 player (and coop). Maybe it wasn't online multiplayer; but it was there and aside one of those (Mario) the others were released in the last year or so. So is not like Nintendo is ignoring it or afraid of "bringing their games into the modern era". Heck one of the first games they revealed for the Wii U is a 4 players version of New Mario.

Plus I think I mentioned earlier that in the end is not about taking a concept "adding more" and people will go to it. ModNation was (to many) technically Mario Kart with content creation, sharing and a strong online experience..on top of the HD visuals, etc. Yet, is not like many ran to get it, much less the same amount that went to get LBP...or other first party PS3 games. Heck, I think even Heavy Rain sold better. So Nintendo just adding online multiplayer to Galaxy is not going to do much.