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Sunset Overdrive in next months EDGE

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I was thinking that Sony would have rather had them continue producing resistance and ratchet games. What other games did they put out for Sony other than these two franchises the past couple gens. What I'm basically saying is would Sony have supported this new IP or did they have to go ms to get it done.

This also makes no sense.

Insomniac decided to branch away from Sony because Sony requires IP ownership for their 1st party published titles whereas Microsoft does not. It has nothing to do with which 1st party publisher is better at searching for IPs to publish.

Sony would have gladly supported the IP if it were on PS4. The relationship Insomniac had with Sony is similar to the one they currently have with Ready At Dawn with "The Order: 1886"
 

bidguy

Banned
This also makes no sense.

Insomniac decided to branch away from Sony because Sony requires IP ownership for their 1st party published titles whereas Microsoft does not. It has nothing to do with which 1st party publisher is better at searching for IPs to publish.

Sony would have gladly supported the IP if it were on PS4. The relationship Insomniac had with Sony is similar to the one they currently have with Ready At Dawn with "The Order: 1886"

is this why they made resistance and ratched for the past generation and only after parting ways developed fuse ?
 

EGM1966

Member
Ugh, the thread had to be stained with the console wars. :)
Yeah cautious optimism for a developer who has had a bad run of titles but a great overall catalogue and clearly thought they were switching to the more popular platform when it turns out it isn't is "the console warz"...

Don't be daft. It looks promising but any sensible view would be cautious after they managed to mess up a strong new IP with resistance IP (which they did) then over milk their established IP R&C with weak experiments like Q For e (which they did) and then they tried multi-platform (which made sense for them with the swing to Xbox in US/UK) but let EA influence the titles direction for the worse and produced a bland and mediocre title (which they did). Now after all that they're going exclusive with MS when the Xbox platform is weaker than the Playstation platform where they're best known. Given all of the above caution would be wise no? And if they deliver the goods after such a run of poor decisions after switching to MS It would be ironic after their dip on Playstation and multi-play miss fire wouldn't it, particularly in light of that success coming despite the switch in lead console?

I've played most of their stuff over the years bar some of the PSN R&C stuff and tried Fuse so I feel I can date comment to comment cautiously seperate from any notion of console wars nonsense.
 
Don't be daft. It looks promising but any sensible view would be cautious after they managed to mess up a strong new IP with resistance IP (which they did) then over milk their established IP R&C with weak experiments like Q For e (which they did) and then they tried multi-platform (which made sense for them with the swing to Xbox in US/UK) but let EA influence the titles direction for the worse and produced a bland and mediocre title (which they did).

You're presuming Insomniac alone are to blame for those failures. Surely publishers are at least partially responsible as well? Certainly in Fuse's case where Insomniac's hands were tied in regards to the direction EA wanted to take the game.

It seems far more likely to me that they've chosen to partner with Microsoft in large part because that move allows them to retain more control, rather than because of some dubious gains in exposure (PS3 and Xbox 360 were equally as popular globally).
 
Yeah cautious optimism for a developer who has had a bad run of titles but a great overall catalogue and clearly thought they were switching to the more popular platform when it turns out it isn't is "the console warz"...

Don't be daft. It looks promising but any sensible view would be cautious after they managed to mess up a strong new IP with resistance IP (which they did) then over milk their established IP R&C with weak experiments like Q For e (which they did) and then they tried multi-platform (which made sense for them with the swing to Xbox in US/UK) but let EA influence the titles direction for the worse and produced a bland and mediocre title (which they did). Now after all that they're going exclusive with MS when the Xbox platform is weaker than the Playstation platform where they're best known. Given all of the above caution would be wise no? And if they deliver the goods after such a run of poor decisions after switching to MS It would be ironic after their dip on Playstation and multi-play miss fire wouldn't it, particularly in light of that success coming despite the switch in lead console?

I've played most of their stuff over the years bar some of the PSN R&C stuff and tried Fuse so I feel I can date comment to comment cautiously seperate from any notion of console wars nonsense.

Talk of first and second place as if it will even matter in some big way with regards this game's success is console wars nonsense. If the game is genuinely good, it will have more or less the same level of success that it would have had as a PS4 exclusive, and the same would be true if the game turns out to be not very good at all. You give off an impression where it's as if the system they've chosen to release the game on being the second best selling console, as opposed to number one, has in some fashion already meaningfully harmed the game's chances at achieving success.

That's the part of your post that I felt was silly. I don't have an issue with the rest, but I didn't feel like bolding. The first part, however, generally amounts to a not so subtle and bitter sounding post about their possibly making a good game fresh after "changing sides," but that's too bad for them cause they went ahead and wasted it on the second place system, again. That's what I take away from that post, and how I feel you intended it, hence why I classified it as console wars.
 

Chettlar

Banned
is this why they made resistance and ratched for the past generation and only after parting ways developed fuse ?

It looks that way, yes.

But it also looks like the reason they went with Microsoft instead of EA was because MS seemed to like their creative vision more (remember Overstrike, and how that turned into FUSE?).

If you'll recall (and how could you not), MS is really pushing the whole, cloud and constant update thing. Insomniac has been talking about how this game will be constantly updated, so I'm thinking the reason MS was so for Insomniacs vision with SO was because what Insomniac wanted to do with it fit with MS's vision.

So it worked out pretty well for both of them. Both have something that is inline with what the other wants. So boom, exclusive.
 

Rembrandt

Banned
Yeah cautious optimism for a developer who has had a bad run of titles but a great overall catalogue and clearly thought they were switching to the more popular platform when it turns out it isn't is "the console warz"...

Don't be daft. It looks promising but any sensible view would be cautious after they managed to mess up a strong new IP with resistance IP (which they did) then over milk their established IP R&C with weak experiments like Q For e (which they did) and then they tried multi-platform (which made sense for them with the swing to Xbox in US/UK) but let EA influence the titles direction for the worse and produced a bland and mediocre title (which they did). Now after all that they're going exclusive with MS when the Xbox platform is weaker than the Playstation platform where they're best known. Given all of the above caution would be wise no? And if they deliver the goods after such a run of poor decisions after switching to MS It would be ironic after their dip on Playstation and multi-play miss fire wouldn't it, particularly in light of that success coming despite the switch in lead console?

I've played most of their stuff over the years bar some of the PSN R&C stuff and tried Fuse so I feel I can date comment to comment cautiously seperate from any notion of console wars nonsense.

Your post seems more in tune with console wars than actual concern with the game.
 
It looks that way, yes.

But it also looks like the reason they went with Microsoft instead of EA was because MS seemed to like their creative vision more (remember Overstrike, and how that turned into FUSE?).

If you'll recall (and how could you not), MS is really pushing the whole, cloud and constant update thing. Insomniac has been talking about how this game will be constantly updated, so I'm thinking the reason MS was so for Insomniacs vision with SO was because what Insomniac wanted to do with it fit with MS's vision.

So it worked out pretty well for both of them. Both have something that is inline with what the other wants. So boom, exclusive.

I doubt that's the reason. They've already stated that they wanted to go multiplatform. Going exclusive with MS means they can keep their IP in exchange for a window of exclusivity

is this why they made resistance and ratched for the past generation and only after parting ways developed fuse ?

Yes.

Sony isn't the type of publisher to turn away new IPs. They're allowing Guerilla Games and Media Molecule to develop new IPs.

I doubt Sony would have said no to "Overstrike" or "Sunset Overdrive" their initial pitches sound like they could have lots of mainstream appeal.

SO being XB1 exclusive is more an act of Insomniac realizing that they need to think about the future. Look at Skylanders, it started out as a game that just featured Spyro and now it's a billion dollar IP. Spyro was Insomniac's baby and Activision owns it and is making a fortune off of it.
 

xxracerxx

Don't worry, I'll vouch for them.
If you'll recall (and how could you not), MS is really pushing the whole, cloud and constant update thing. Insomniac has been talking about how this game will be constantly updated, so I'm thinking the reason MS was so for Insomniacs vision with SO was because what Insomniac wanted to do with it fit with MS's vision.

Is the MS certification process easier this time or waived for Insomniac?
 
My guess is Microsoft is publishing this because Insomniac gets to keep the IP.
Sony forces devs to give up their IP in order to publish.
I think Sony is gonna miss out on a lot of potential third party exclusives if they don't drop that draconian policy.

This could be the next Gears of War for Microsoft, in terms of third party relationship/success.
 

arhra

Member
Isn't MS funding development? Doubt it's a window of exclusivity if they are...

It's a Microsoft Studios game. They're publishing it, presumably funding it, and most likely have right of first refusal for potential sequels. Similar situation to GoW last gen.

The only way it goes multi is if Insomniac get Biowared.
 
It's a Microsoft Studios game. They're publishing it, presumably funding it, and most likely have right of first refusal for potential sequels. Similar situation to GoW last gen.

The only way it goes multi is if Insomniac get Biowared.

I thought as much. Thanks for confirming.
 
It's a Microsoft Studios game. They're publishing it, presumably funding it, and most likely have right of first refusal for potential sequels. Similar situation to GoW last gen.

The only way it goes multi is if Insomniac get Biowared.

We knew from the start that Insomniac owned the IP, but I was shocked to find out Ryse and Quantum Break are both the same.

None are 2nd party projects, in that sense that Microsoft doesn't own the IP of any of them, it owns the publishing rights.

Bizarre to me.
 

Chettlar

Banned
I doubt that's the reason. They've already stated that they wanted to go multiplatform. Going exclusive with MS means they can keep their IP in exchange for a window of exclusivity.

You doubt it's the reason? I think it's the entire reason. They've been advertising the quick, constant updates, new achievements, etc. kind of stuff ever since the game came about. There's definitely an element of that.

They wanted to go multiplatform. Multiform usually means you get to keep your own IP -- a lot more often than exclusivity, such as what happens with Sony. You don't go "exclusive" to keep your IP. It doesn't work like that. That can't be the driving reason.

See, what you're saying is why they would go for Microsoft over, say, Sony (because MS will let them keep the IP). It doesn't say why they would go exclusive in the first place.


Also, remember, what interest would MS have in this kind of game? Simple, it's the perfect showcase for these "update-on-the-fly" type features they've been trying to sell the Xbox on.
 
We knew from the start that Insomniac owned the IP, but I was shocked to find out Ryse and Quantum Break are both the same.

None are 2nd party projects, in that sense that Microsoft doesn't own the IP of any of them, it owns the publishing rights.

Bizarre to me.

They didn't own Gears until very recently either. Seems MS are happy enough to sign publishing deals and fund development with a contract clause that gives them right of first refusal on any sequel.
 
We knew from the start that Insomniac owned the IP, but I was shocked to find out Ryse and Quantum Break are both the same.

None are 2nd party projects, in that sense that Microsoft doesn't own the IP of any of them, it owns the publishing rights.

Bizarre to me.
Microsoft owns Quantum Break.

Also, I can't believe people think this might go multiplat.
 
My guess is Microsoft is publishing this because Insomniac gets to keep the IP.
Sony forces devs to give up their IP in order to publish.
I think Sony is gonna miss out on a lot of potential third party exclusives if they don't drop that draconian policy.

This could be the next Gears of War for Microsoft, in terms of third party relationship/success.

Sony have plenty of internal studios anyway though, which would be part of the difference between the two. MS don't mind not owning the IP though, but then that bit them arse with Mass Effect and Geometry Wars *shrug*

Although they had a co-patent with Bizarre for the kudos stuff in PGR iirc.

I wouldn't consider it that draconian, its not like Sony don't do the publishing side and probably fund it too, its up to developers to make the choice between partnering with Sony and losing the IP or going elsewhere

Microsoft owns Quantum Break.

Also, I can't believe people think this might go multiplat.

People that think they're entitled to games on their platforms or others that elsewhere are just kicking up a fuss because MS tied down what sounds like a potentially good game. Ive noticed it in a lot of XB1 game threads (can't speak for other platforms), gets annoying really, but never mind!

Fun fact: searching for some of Microsofts XB1 launch titles on google used to bring up PS4 before XB1 in the autocorrect, not sure they do anymore though.
 

bidguy

Banned
We knew from the start that Insomniac owned the IP, but I was shocked to find out Ryse and Quantum Break are both the same.

None are 2nd party projects, in that sense that Microsoft doesn't own the IP of any of them, it owns the publishing rights.

Bizarre to me.

ms owns the quantum break ip though

edit : damn
 
Can't wait to hear some details on this finally. Loved the art aesthetic they showed at E3.

Yup, when the does the digital edition usually go live? Tempted to grab it on my tablet just for this blow out.

I really want some gameplay footage though, but screens and lots of solid gameplay info will do for now.

Anyway, here's a refresher of all we know about the game so far....

sunset-overdrive.png


Sunset Overdrive Q & A with Ted Price (CEO) and Drew Murray (Co-Creative Director)

Elevator pitch: Sunset Overdrive takes place in the future, it is an open world game and is third person. It has got a lot of combat and traversal elements. It’s going to be very stylized game, so a lot of color and pop. An open world game with a lot of combat and agile traversal, in a nutshell.

Updating and player feedback:

  • Insomniac want to take the game further by constantly updating the game after release. They want to do this by involving the players in a two way conversation between developer and the player. That will help them understand what excites the player, so they can respond with stuff that fits well in the game and satisfies the players needs for change.
  • They are focused on keeping the game updated and of course fixing what needs to be fixed. They want to keep it fresh so people keep coming back and hanging out in Sunset City [where the game takes place]. So a persistent living world.
  • They want to take the persistent living world aspect a little further. This upcoming next generation gives an indication that people are more and more connected with each other, and want to have more communication with developers making the game. They looked at the new tech coming down the road and see that it gives them that chance to take those steps.
  • This generation has practically restrained them from making frequent updates to their games and having a direct conversation with the player. This is because when releasing content on a console you have to jump through a lot of hoops to get it out there. It is very difficult and impossible to respond immediately to what going on in the game.
  • Microsoft has been supportive in pulling out their restrictions and hurdles to make it more streamlined for Insomniac to update the game. Insomniac have been doing a lot of infrastructure work so they can keep changing the game after release without having to do massive horrible patches.
  • Insomniac had to rethink their position as traditional console developer and had to build systems that can make them more agile, in terms of what they deliver and make.
  • They plan on having a aggressive updating schedule and looking at what players are and are not doing in the game. If players like a certain thing, they will of course start making more of it.
  • There are mechanisms in the game which give the developers feedback. They are still figuring out the technology hurdles. They might look how Kinect can help give feedback, like giving direct audio feedback. They are still experimenting, so nothing is final. The core game will be played with the controller.
  • Too early to say if there might be a beta.
On the game itself:

  • The point of the Sunset Overdrive world is to be irreverent and fun, so breaking the fourth wall is totally fine by Insomniac. They say that it’s the DNA of the studio and with this game it’s a good chance to let loose with style and tone.
  • The game reflects a lot of Drew Murray (Co- Creative Director) and Marcus Smith ( Co-Creative Director) style. Drew was told by somebody describing Sunset Overdrive as ‘a grown up version of a traditional Insomniac game ’. Marcus came to work for the company because he loved Spyro and Drew came because he loved Rachet. They have been working on the Resistance series for 7- 8 years, which they found awesome to work on, but they are excited to explore the grownup version of Metropolis. Drew feels like it’s reflected in the reveal trailer.
  • Overdrive is an adult game, it’s going to have violence and action, but the world will be colorful and fun to move around in. Seeing as they have been working 7 to 8 years of Resistance, they were done with the grey look and their first rule for this new game was ‘no rubble’.
  • The city, Sunset City, shown in the trailer is pitched as modern, a little futuristic and a little bit exaggerated. They are pushing the idea of a hyper consumer culture.
  • They are planning on letting the player do a certain amount of customization. There will be the option to chose between male and female characters. They are thinking of a couple of archetypes which you can pick from body wise. They are still trying to figure out how customizable the outfits will be, but they hope they are very customizable.
  • They looked at what worked traversal wise in their older games. For Overdrive they want a free roaming city where you can go anywhere and traverse. The player will get all kind of powers and abilities that will allow them to move around well. They want to keep the mechanics very skill based and feels more in line like something like Rachet. It is not something like Assassins Creed and Uncharted, which look really great but tend to be ‘push a button and push into that direction’. For Overdrive you have use timing to use the traversal moves. There will be some momentum based gameplay, where the better you do the more powerful you get.
  • The reveal trailer has inspired some new ideas for the game. Before they had separated shooting and traversal, but now have a couple of prototypes going where they combining those two elements. There are other elements too, but they could not talk about it for now.
  • Cover is not something they want the player to hinge on, they want they player to use the traversal as a defense and also use it offensively to get to a better position. Getting those elements to mesh was difficult, but they are getting at a point where it feels awesome.
  • Drew sees Overdrive as a throwback to fun arcade-y action games. They have narrative and a fiction, but they are not so concerned about it. One of their internal pillars for the game is ‘fun triumphs realism’. This means that everything goes and so they can surprise players.
  • They will be depending less on the cloud compared to other games coming out. Most of Overdrive cloud capabilities will focus on updating the game and interacting with the player.
  • Sunset Overdrive is not a launch game and there will be singleplayer.
  • There will different types of mutant enemies. The trailer only shows one type.
  • The art of the game is inspired by urban art, vinyl figures, flyer art and anime (Tekkonkinkreet!).
Tidbits:
  • The headshot and Scott Pilgrim-esq text effects show in the trailer will show up in the game. They really like it and say it’s a fun way to give the player feedback on what’s going on in the game.
  • ‘Iggy’ was the internal name for the game.
  • They have no name yet for the Vinyl gun seen in the trailer, it shoots 12inch LP’s. Drew points out that Insomniac is known for their wild and exotic weapon designs, and that will be a big feature of Overdrive.
  • Marcus came up with the name ‘Sunset Overdrive’.
Working with Microsoft:
  • The DRM changes posted by Microsoft yesterday will not have a dramatic effect on what they are doing with the game. Speaks for itself, but you need to be connected to get the updates. Drew does feel that they responded well to the Xbox fans regarding the DRM issue.
  • Working with Microsoft has influenced their game design and how they will interact the with the player. They are an independent company, work with multiple publishers and release their game on different platforms. Microsoft was the right partner for Overdrive. They are excited about XboxOne in terms of the tech that it is offering. Microsoft has been getting Overdrive out there, it was a great way to have their first exposure at E3. Microsoft is engaged as partner and believes in the vision that Insomniac has for the game.
  • Upfront they hit a lot of concerns like the stylization in particular. They really wanted to make a stylizated game and saw that a lot of publishers get cold with that kind of thing. Insomniac stayed with that vision and Microsoft gave a big thumbs up. Insomniac owns the IP and is glad that Microsoft supports that.
Pew, that was more than I though it would be.
 

rrc1594

Member
Sony have plenty of internal studios anyway though, which would be part of the difference between the two. MS don't mind not owning the IP though, but then that bit them arse with Mass Effect and Geometry Wars *shrug*

Although they had a co-patent with Bizarre for the kudos stuff in PGR iirc.

I wouldn't consider it that draconian, its not like Sony don't do the publishing side and probably fund it too, its up to developers to make the choice between partnering with Sony and losing the IP or going elsewhere



People that think they're entitled to games on their platforms or others that elsewhere are just kicking up a fuss because MS tied down what sounds like a potentially good game. Ive noticed it in a lot of XB1 game threads (can't speak for other platforms), gets annoying really, but never mind!

Fun fact: searching for some of Microsofts XB1 launch titles on google used to bring up PS4 before XB1 in the autocorrect, not sure they do anymore though.

Little on topic someone needs to investigate Chinese Game studios to see who MS is possibly working with.
 

Proponent

Banned
I wonder how long this game has been in development.

And I wonder why we still haven't seen anything from it, eleven months later, and after the initial cg teaser at E3 '13
 

Miles X

Member
In terms of IP ownership, I imagine MS has it in the contact that if Sunset got huge they have to be open to deals to make sequels exclusive.

Quantum is first party because 1st party studio LA Studios is working on it.
 

xxracerxx

Don't worry, I'll vouch for them.
This probably has more to do with the game using the cloud to push updates into the game. Content being added without using patches at all.

You don't need certification if you aren't releasing a patch I think(?)

This is interesting. I just figured that even if you are not releasing a patch it would still have to go through MS cert so that it doesn't just break the game. Good to see if this is how they will implement it.
 
I wonder how long this game has been in development.

And I wonder why we still haven't seen anything from it, eleven months later, and after the initial cg teaser at E3 '13

Long enough to be releasing this year. No different than Halo 4's marketing schedule really.

CG trailer E3 2011
May 2012 magazine cover
Fall 2012 release
 
Insomniac has turned into a B developer over the years. I don't get the excitement.... Them again, I would love a good title to play on my Xbox One, the next couple of months are depressing.
 
They didn't own Gears until very recently either. Seems MS are happy enough to sign publishing deals and fund development with a contract clause that gives them right of first refusal on any sequel.

Yeah, but I think that made more sense when the largest singular software market (US) was where their hardware was ridiculously far ahead. Nowadays buying exclusives is gonna cost more, because there's not a 80+ mil hardware install, and they're significantly behind in every market other than the US.



I believe MS owns the rights to Quantum Break.

I am sorry, I thought they didn't. My mistake. But stuff like Dead Rising too. Just madness to me. Leaves them open for plenty of FFXIII style steals this generation. Titanfall is obviously gonna happen.
 
I believe other sites are doing things on it as well, huge blowout. Swear I saw on twitter that it starts "next week" so could be as early as monday.

Don't get my hopes up, Dyno. I hope you're right though, would be fantastic to have a week full of new content...

probably the best E3 ever especially if you own all three systems..it's like a climatic braingasm of games.

Yup. Also hoping for some epic handheld reveals/announcements too. Not to mention that I'm still hoping and praying that Nintendo will finally announce a new Metroid Prime. It's long overdue, Ninty really can't keep it under wraps any longer.
 
Yeah, but I think that made more sense when the largest singular software market (US) was where their hardware was ridiculously far ahead. Nowadays buying exclusives is gonna cost more, because there's not a 80+ mil hardware install, and they're significantly behind in every market other than the US.

Fair point, but I think it's more complicated than simply looking at install bases. If MS is willing to publish and fund development and by doing so, they get the option to secure exclusivity on future titles, it works out better for them and the developer.

The developer gets to establish a new IP and they have the potential to reach more people should MS decide not to lock up exclusivity.
 

Chettlar

Banned
In terms of IP ownership, I imagine MS has it in the contact that if Sunset got huge they have to be open to deals to make sequels exclusive.

Quantum is first party because 1st party studio LA Studios is working on it.

What does this mean? It's not being done by the same team as Alan Wake?
 

Rookwood

Banned
Yeah, but I think that made more sense when the largest singular software market (US) was where their hardware was ridiculously far ahead. Nowadays buying exclusives is gonna cost more, because there's not a 80+ mil hardware install, and they're significantly behind in every market other than the US.

I keep seeing this point asserted and it always leaves me shaking my head. A larger install base on the competitor's platform doesn't necessarily mean any 3rd party dealing Microsoft enters will cost them more money. There are numerous factors to consider in these dealings aside from potential sales figures. I'd imagine such dealings consider other important factors such as development time and costs for other platforms, profit margins and promotion.

While I'm absolutely certain Microsoft has gone out of their way to reach out to publishers and developers for such deal, it's probably more likely they and their competitors at Sony and Nintendo are sought out for such deal. I'd imagine Curve Studios' Stealth, Inc. 2 is a similar case.

I've used this example before in another thread, but it's still valid: Tequila Works offered exclusivity to Microsoft. They were turned down, and took their business to Sony. I'd imagine this happens all the time in this industry with the cost of game development on the rise - including with non AAA titles like Rime.

3rd party exclusives are still a trend for this very reason.
 
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