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[cacildo]

I know this game has been talked about so many times. However I just want to really dig deep and understand why a game that is beautifully crafted and given a lot of love by the developers was rejected so harshly by Nintendo fans and even the media.

What are you talking about?

People love (to say they love on the internet) Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze!

Spoiler

(i got it for free from club nintendo and its a game that annoys me so much i always think about deleting it from my hdd. Which is far from full)

Edit: omg top page im dead

 

[Brandon F]

It's the best 2d platformer, and the GOTY over BloodBorne for me that year

Tropical freeze was early 2014
Bloodborne was early 2015

 

[The Horror the horror]

Because it was a throwback 2D platformer made from a studio capable of so much more.

It'd be like FromSoftware announcing a SHMUP as their next big game and then the next game after that -- for the next 5 years.

 

[345triangle]

Because it was a throwback 2D platformer made from a studio capable of so much more.

It'd be like FromSoftware announcing a SHMUP as their next big game and then the next game after that -- for the next 5 years.

hmm... i'd be down

 

[Oersted]

Great game which came out at the wrong time

I would say it's 100% because it wasn't a new Metroid. In any other scenario it likely would've been warmly welcomed.

No. Big factor was also that Nintendo made too many 2D plattformers at that time.

Edit:

This isn't a dig against it like the horror did a few posts above, it was just too much for many at that time.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

The best 2D platformer of all time.

 

[Vital Tundra]

What an amazing game. Shame it didn't get the love it deserved. Here's hoping to it coming back after Retros next project (I really don't think their next project is DK. It's not something they would be so tight lipped about). I think he 3rd game of the returns series should go back to the Kremlings.

 

[Servbot24]

I would personally take another Donkey Kong Country game by Retro over a new Metroid Prime game by Retro.

Me too. And Prime is the best game of all time imo.

 

[Razlo]

It is a truly amazing game. I hope to god they do a collection for Switch so people can see what they missed out on.

I'd re-buy it too.

 

[antitrop]

I bought my Wii U for Bayonetta 2, but Tropical Freeze was the first game I bough after I beat that. I have nothing but love for DKTF, it's an incredible game.

 

[The Hermit]

I loved the DKC series and it blew my mind that Retro managed to make the two best entries.

DkcR and Tropical Freeze are the gold standard of 2D platformer and a testament of Retro quality.

That being said I hope there isn't a third game, as it would either suffer the same drop of quality as Metroid Prime 3 or it wouldn't​ be too different of the previous games.

 

[Razlo]

I would personally take another Donkey Kong Country game by Retro over a new Metroid Prime game by Retro.

Same! I prefer 2D Metroid anyway.

 

[Father_Brain]

Here is what I remember. It was another 2D platformer where there were already plenty of platformers playable and available on the Wii U. There was also a big hole being left by the lack of third party support and many looked to Retro to be the one studio at Nintendo that could have filled that void. They were the ones with the experience of creating first person adventure/shooter games at Nintendo and the Wii U needed that. The customer base wanted more of that. Many felt it was a waste of Retro's talents to have made Tropical Freeze because it was believed any other studio at Nintendo could have made it but they were one of the few if only ones that had any experience making games like the Metroid Prime series. It also hadn't been that long since DKCR had came out on the Wii as well.

DKCR sold much better than MP3, so it's not hard to see why DKC:TF looked like a safer bet on paper to NCL than MP4 or a new/revived IP aimed more directly at Western audiences.

The key distinction that NCL overlooked, though, is that DKCR launched on Wii four years into its lifespan, when it already had a huge userbase. It didn't really matter if DKCR sold to pretty much the same people who bought NSMBWii a year earlier, because that audience was already firmly established on the platform and was so goddamn enormous. Wii U was obviously not in the same position, and could really have used another first-party title that actually diversified the platform's library and didn't sell to the exact same people who already bought or were going to buy the system for Mario.

But emphasizing short-term profit over long-term strategy was one of the hallmarks of Iwata-era NCL, so I suppose it shouldn't have been such a surprise in hindsight.

 

[ramparter]

First game I beat on Wii U, easily on of my favourites. People didnt really shit on it, they were just disappointed when it was announced.

But yeah it deserves a second chance.

 

[Sgt. Kabukiman]

I was super disappointed when it was announced but I learned my lesson. One of the very best 2D platformers I've ever played even though I never liked this series back on the SNES.

 

[JaseMath]

It did everything better than Returns, what. Did Returns have waggle free controls and a soundtrack by David Wise?

Was the gameplay different? Were the levels better? Did it add anything to the core experience that DKCR lacked? With the exception of two characters (whose inclusion weren't even needed), the game didn't add anything.

 

[Ritzboof]

i feel like the "tropical freeze" makes it come off as lame and gimmicky. thats what offput me the first time i saw it. its just a really good DKC, but it makes me think of juice more than anything

its also not metroid, and it was on the wiiu, so i think a few things came together to make it unpopular

 

[Bluth54]

Tropical Freeze is one of the best 2d platformers I've ever played and I really hope we get another 2d DKC from Retro on the Switch.

I would also love to get another Prime game. Hopefully they're almost done with their current project and they are able to put out 2 games for the Switch.

 

[Nocturnowl]

The real tragedy to its reaction as "not Metroid!" and "just another 2D platformer" is simply that it's arguably the BEST 2D platformer in a span of years where it has tremendous competition and practically tackles all the complaints you see people lobby at the rather safe modern 2D Mario titles.
Regardless the Kong gets a harder ride in reviews than Mario because....errr he's not Mario I guess?

Effectively its dismissals aren't based around the quality of the game which is top tier in its genre, its based upon a bunch of rather superficial outside factors and that really kinda smells. Fortunately now we're distanced from that time period people may actually be able to view the game for what it is as opposed to what it wasn't.

The pinnacle of this probably being the Cranky Kong reveal, you know those kind of weird Nintendo fans who are greatly concerned with how their corporate overlord looks compared to other companies? yeah they got legit shook by Cranky Kong's pogo platforming making them look uncool in front of big brother Playstation....well they would've if the whole event wasn't a complete sham that never returned (though it did lead to an equally as awful spiritual successor), funnily enough I think the only reason people remember that event now was because...Cranky Kong!

Of course this isn't to say that there wasn't no reason for disappointment but the reactions were full on toys out of the pram mode.

 

[Deadpool_X]

What? I thought everyone whow played it universally loved it? I mean, for me, it's the second best DKC game behind 2. The music was outstanding as well. Yeah, we all wished Retro would've given us a new Metroid game last gen, but I don't think anyone hated on Tropical Freeze simply because it wasn't Metroid. Now, if Retro pumps out another DKC game right now, I might be a little upset again. They have too much talent to be making 2d platformers, especially when there is a desperate need for more mature Nintendo IPs.

 

[Buckle]

People wanted Metroid and Retro just made another Donkey Kong game.

I'm not surprised people lost their shit. It was kind of a tragically hilarious reveal.

 

[Mineshaft_Gap]

I didn't own a Wii or a Wii U but I can say my personal disappointment that a studio didn't deliver the game in the genre I wanted would have been abated by them producing one of the best games of all time in a genre I wasn't clamoring for.

If the wheel of fate churns out the best 2D platformer instead of... Something else. I can't be too mad, that would be selfish.

Maybe if Retro made another Metroid it would have been the GOAT. Maybe it would have been just good. Maybe it would have been meh. Regardless, what they DID produce seems to be something special so I say deal with it and play something else if it doesn't cater to you specifically. Let others who enjoy it enjoy it in peace.

 

[Sponge]

Tropical Freeze is probably my favorite Wii U title. It's a shame people were dismissive of it. Donkey Kong was a series long dormant like Metro is now, so it's a sad to see people were hating on it.

 

[Mass_Pincup]

However I just want to really dig deep and understand why a game that is beautifully crafted and given a lot of love by the developers was rejected so harshly by Nintendo fans and even the media.

It was sixth in the GOTY thread here and it has an 83 on Metacritic.

I don't see how it was rejected by anyone.

 

[Dark Cloud]

Was the gameplay different? Were the levels better? Did it add anything to the core experience that DKCR lacked? With the exception of two characters (whose inclusion weren't even needed), the game didn't add anything.

Why would the gameplay need to be different. What a weird question. I hope you ask that for every single sequel ever. Yeah, the levels were better and the music was amazing with David Wise. The two characters allowed for some different mechanics. It did everything better than DKCR from levels to new characters to music to controls...

 

[cacildo]

Because it was a throwback 2D platformer made from a studio capable of so much more.

It'd be like FromSoftware announcing a SHMUP as their next big game and then the next game after that -- for the next 5 years.

this is a good explanation

 

[TheMoon]

It came out four years after Returns!

three + change.

Nov 2010 - Feb 2014

 

[ZSaberLink]

I think average people like the game and have no issues with it. Some Metroid fans just wanted a Metroid game at reveal (so nothing against DKC itself, more related to Retro). Honestly if anything I think GAF praises it too much. I think it's a good game, but worse than the original DKCR overall.

 

[Vanillalite]

Why would the gameplay need to be different. What a weird question. I hope you ask that for every single sequel ever. Yeah, the levels were better and the music was amazing with David Wise. The two characters allowed for some different mechanics. It did everything better than DKCR from levels to new characters to music to controls...

I thought the added characters were fluff, and I thought the level design was better in the first game.

It's a really good game, but it feels like because it was in HD with the Wise soundtrack it got more love than Returns based on things other than the core design.

 

[Dark Cloud]

I thought the added characters were fluff, and I thought the level design was better in the first game.

It's a really good game, but it feels like because it was in HD with the Wise soundtrack it got more love than Returns based on things other than the core design.

That's fine. We just disagree.

 

[AquaWateria]

It was sixth in the GOTY thread here and it has an 83 on Metacritic.

I don't see how it was rejected by anyone.

Watch the video I posted.

 

[Timeaisis]

I thought it was great. I thought GAF was pretty warm on it. Critics were hit or miss on it, with a lot of criticism focusing on the fact that it was similar to the first. Which is something I'll never understand because it was so much better than the first game. Iteration is not bad.

It was near-perfect for what it is: a challenging, co-opable 2D platformer.

 

[KooopaKid]

I thought it was just more of the same, just an expansion with new levels. DKCR 1.5. Same artstyle, same engine, same gameplay, no new mechanics.

 

[phanphare]

I love Nintendo...I just don't care enough about Donkey King or 2D platforming to pay $60.

I also am turned off by any game with an ice/winter theme.

it was never $60

I stopped playing TF after the first world because I got bored with it.

hmm

Yeah, I agree. TF felt too much like the original DKCR. And neither were as fun as the original DKC trilogy.

seems like you're not really in a position to come to make these kinds of claims, seeing as how you barely played the game

 

[tengiants]

I remember the impressions being pretty damn good, even on GAF, when it was released.

It was just a little difficult and had some interesting quirks for me. Specifically it's a 2d platformer best played with an analog stick? also the timing when holding A to high jump off the backs of enemies was different than mario and required more precision.

It's an excellent game that deserves another release on switch.

 

[Crayon]

I don't think it looks that good. Not only do I have enough 2d platformers but they are usually way cheaper too. This game has no appeal to me.

 

[FinalAres]

I have zero interest playing this game, and that is 100% because of the name and branding.

I realise that is dumb, and I will make the effort to play it when it inevitably comes to Switch, but the game's name should have been Donkey Kong Country 6 or something that doesn't sound like a low budget spin-off.

 

[phanphare]

It was just a little difficult and had some interesting quirks for me. Specifically it's a 2d platformer best played with an analog stick?

correct

 

[Schopenhauerian]

DKCR sold much better than MP3, so... DKC:TF looked like a safer bet on paper to NCL... The key distinction that NCL overlooked, though... emphasizing short-term profit over long-term strategy was one of the hallmarks of Iwata-era NCL...

While NCL may or may not have made calculations of the kind that you suggest (I have no information either way) with respect to Tropical Freeze, it's at least worth noting that in this particular instance, it was actually Retro's directly-expressed preference to continue working on DKC:

http://wegotthiscovered.com/gaming/retro-studios-running-metroid-miyamoto/
Miyamoto: ...But when it did Donkey Kong Country Returns on Wii, apparently [Retro] had a lot of fun making that title and from what I’ve heard it put in a request and said that it wanted to do a new Donkey Kong Country game on Wii U themselves. In particular the company built up quite a lot of knowhow in that specific style of gameplay and as a consequence felt that it could leverage that again in creating something new in that same style for Wii U...

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...the_list_of_candidates_for_a_new_metroid_game
...According to Retro Studios president and CEO Michael Kelbaugh, the developer had the chance to work on Metroid or Donkey Kong Country and opted for the latter because it had unfinished business with the [DKC] series...

 

[ZeoVGM]

No, I 100% hated the game. It wasn't for me. The platforming has and will always feel off to me. I've tried to see what others have several times but couldn't do it. I do not take away from the design and great soundtrack, but this mechanics and physics were not for me. Plus, it came out too soon after the first game. Felt like it was being shoved down our throats.

You realize this makes absolutely no sense, right?

... And that it was over three years?

 

[JaseMath]

Why would the gameplay need to be different. What a weird question. I hope you ask that for every single sequel ever. Yeah, the levels were better and the music was amazing with David Wise. The two characters allowed for some different mechanics. It did everything better than DKCR from levels to new characters to music to controls...

I'm talking specifically about gameplay mechanics. It's not weird to want something other than more of the same which is exactly was Tropical Freeze was. I'm knocking the people who wanted that—I'm glad they liked it. Personally, I thought it was a waste of Retro's talent.

 

[Mechanized]

I played it, thought it was pretty by the numbers. It was a good one of those. That's about it. Got bored and never finished it.

SM3D Land and World held my attention to completion, including extra stuff, and were way more fun.

 

[Nocturnowl]

It's funny that now I'm getting around to the video in the OP I've already seen two points from my previous post mentioned, including the Mario one.
This guy, he gets me!

 

[sanstesy]

The Assassination of Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze by the Coward Nintendo Fans

 

[ZeoVGM]

TF is one of the greatest platformers of all time. Perhaps one of the greatest games of all time.

The anger towards it almost completely came from a whiny and childish desire to have another sequel in a series Retro already did to death, rather than one single sequel to another series that Retro themselves said felt like there was more they could have done.

I would cry if Retro make another DK game. New Metroid Prime please.

... See?

"I'm going to cry if Retro makes a third DK game rather than a fourth Metroid game."

 

[Octavianus]

Because it was a throwback 2D platformer made from a studio capable of so much more.

It'd be like FromSoftware announcing a SHMUP as their next big game and then the next game after that -- for the next 5 years.

Cool. That sounds a lot more interesting than what they've been doing for the past couple of years.

I have zero interest playing this game, and that is 100% because of the name and branding.

I realise that is dumb, and I will make the effort to play it when it inevitably comes to Switch, but the game's name should have been Donkey Kong Country 6 or something that doesn't sound like a low budget spin-off.

You're right that is dumb.

 

[thumb]

I don't like Donkey Kong as a character. I don't find him fun, endearing, or humorous. I don't like the entire world he inhabits.

I do, however, love the world of Metroid.

 

[TheUnsunghero26]

The reason I have a Wii U. Brilliant game.

 

[FinalAres]

You're right that is dumb.

I know, and I'll happily admit my stupidity. But I will say that I won't be the only one who looks at this game and thinks "low budget spin-off" instead of "sequel to a big franchise". They need to get their branding sorted.

 

[Shiggy]

While NCL may or may not have made calculations of the kind that you suggest (I have no information either way) with respect to Tropical Freeze, it's at least worth noting that in this particular instance, it was actually Retro's directly-expressed preference to continue working on DKC:

You shouldn't read too much into these PR responses. Based on those, The Coalition also wanted to make a Gears of War sequel instead of continuing on their own game. And Activision employees want to create the next Call of Duty sequel, while NST employees are glad to create yet another Mario vs. DK sequel.

They'd get fired and wouldn't find another job in the industry if they said "we wanted to do our own thing but those titles never got greenlit, so our only choice was a DKCR sequel". If they really wanted to do this game, it's surprising that the turnover of senior staff was relatively high.