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[ViolentP]

Why you mad at physical hold outs? Isn't this the best place to be in? Where you have a choice between digital or/and physical? Why do you personally want digital only?

Here is where my confusion lies. It's always a war between digital vs. physical when really it should be about both sides being protected in the case of shutdown.

 

[93xfan]

When you buy digital you don't own the product you paid for in any way. So for publishers or devs to pull a game, song, movie etc. from a store front really doesn't matter to them. It was never yours to begin with. People need to understand that none of these companies are your friends or "tech bros". They don't give a shit.

The digital future is not going to be good for anyone but publishers, developers etc.

I’m pretty sure that MS and Sony have it written into their rules that companies cannot pull the rights for you to re-download purchased games.

MS and Sony have that power, and there’s literally no reason not to have digital be like this, especially if you want to encourage people going digital.

 

[Mattyp]

Companies have no chance of winning ME over actually. If physical disappears I just won't buy anymore.

100% Correct

I don't believe you.

I'm with him, I own probably over 1,000 physical games now. And its a continually growing collection. That collection is worth $10's of thousands of dollars, that same collection in digital $0. Absolute shit.

The moment physical media is done with in gaming I guess I'll be known as retro only and start finishing off collections.

Digital only cunts only have themselves to blame for this and their worthless collections. And it's only going to get oh so very much worse as time goes on. A simple thing to look at is my itunes purchases from about 10 years ago, when apps where first a thing. Dozens of purchases that I can no longer download or use or get a refund for or sell, money I have thrown into the gutter that I no longer get a return on investment for regardless of the cost. There's ad filled new free versions, that I can pay again to remove ads on a game I previously already owned but? so digital hooray I guess?

 

[ViolentP]

Digital only cunts only have themselves to blame for this and their worthless collections. And it's only going to get oh so very much worse as time goes on. A simple thing to look at is my itunes purchases from over 10 years ago, when apps where first a thing. Dozens of purchases that I can no longer download or use or get a refund for or sell money I have thrown into the gutter that I no longer get a return on investment for regardless of the cost. There's ad filled new free versions, that I can pay again to remove ads on a game I previously already owned but? so digital hooray I guess?

Being one of those cunts, I have a closet full of old PSX, Gamecube, PS2 games that I would be willing to sell off to you.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

With what games and services has this happened?

i can redownload all 360 stuff that isnt available anymore.

MS, or the publisher took away my abilty to redownload a game I bought on the 360..

Dreamfall: The longest journey.

I bought it. Went to download it one day years ago, gone. Just straight up robbery happend.

I was pissed. Contacted support and they played dumb.

 

[Mattyp]

Being one of those cunts, I have a closet full of old PSX, Gamecube, PS2 games that I would be willing to sell off to you.

Are you in Australia? Or are they PAL region? Would honestly put in a bulk offer.

Also Neogaf free tip of the day.

For anyone collecting physical, look in the console section on ebay. You'll get listings of PS1 + 18 games. Most of the games are usually valuable popular titles, that you will pay a fraction of the cost for compared to just searching and finding only the listed title you want. Part out the rest of the collection and make a profit or keep the other titles you don't have. This applies to all generations, you'll usually see bottoms in generations before a rise and stocks start getting lighter. At the moment 360/PS3 collections can be had for a bargain, as I've watched all the generations prior to that climb steadily after bottoming out.

 

[ViolentP]

Are you in Australia? Or are they PAL region? Would honestly put in a bulk offer.

That's another tip for anyone collecting physical, look in the console section on ebay. You'll get listings of PS1 + 18 games. Most of the games are usually valuable popular titles, that you will pay a fraction of the cost for compared to just searching and finding only the listed title you want. Part out the rest of the collection and make a profit or keep the other titles you don't have.

US. And to your point, I would prefer to sell off in bulk and there are in fact a few rarities in the lot. I would price accordingly, however.

 

[PhoenixTank]

I think maybe you guys are reading too much into the statement that was made by Minecraft / Telltale regarding this particular game.

The confusion comes in because on Consoles, some PC outlets, and mobile - if you buy the season pass or the "Season Pass Disc", you don't automatically "own" each episode until you download it. Once you own the game on that platform, you should be able to re-download it at any time. They're just trying to make sure you have all the stuff you've paid for before it gets pulled from the digital storefronts and that's no longer possible. I know that on PSN specifically, I even got a $0.00 receipt email after "purchasing" each episode of Guardians of the Galaxy (for example).

If you have the Season Pass disc, you can download the episodes now that will tie them to your account going forward.

I suppose we'll wait and see if what OP fears actually comes to pass, but we can probably put down the pitchforks for the short term.

That sounds a lot more sane and hope this is the case. The statement that got put out is very poorly worded if so.

 

[KingdomHeartsFan]

Dam this was one of the Telltale games that only got a season pass disc wasn't it :/

 

[KingdomHeartsFan]

I mean, I'm sure there are a minuscule amount of people out there that would quit gaming for real if it went all digital, and maybe you are one of them, but there is also a huge amount of people who say they would, but never actually would.

I mean you wouldn't have to quit gaming, at this point there's thousands and thousands of good retro games to play.

 

[Hendrick's]

Why you mad at physical hold outs? Isn't this the best place to be in? Where you have a choice between digital or/and physical? Why do you personally want digital only?

Who said I was mad? I just think it is a lost cause.

 

[mckmas8808]

Who said I was mad? I just think it is a lost cause.

Okay....but don't you believe that our video game world is better off with both options?

 

[Hendrick's]

Okay....but don't you believe that our video game world is better off with both options?

If I cared more about preservation than I would say yes, but I don't really care. I gave up physical music and films to digital years ago and I don't miss that at all. I feel exactly the same about games.

 

[MMaRsu]

MS, or the publisher took away my abilty to redownload a game I bought on the 360..

Dreamfall: The longest journey.

I bought it. Went to download it one day years ago, gone. Just straight up robbery happend.

I was pissed. Contacted support and they played dumb.

I found this on the interwebz

There's something wonky about the digital distribution rights to Dreamfall. There are other services that used to have the game but no longer offer it (Gamefly, formerly Direct2Drive, for instance). Funcom doesn't even sell a digital version themselves anymore.

The good news is that the PC version is far superior, so you should be playing that one anyway

But yeah, that fucking sucks

 

[MMaRsu]

If I cared more about preservation than I would say yes, but I don't really care. I gave up physical music and films to digital years ago and I don't miss that at all. I feel exactly the same about games.

It's pretty awesome being able to play old games right now. What would suck is in 20 years you have nostalgia for something you cannot experience anymore. You are telling me that wouldnt suck?

 

[Hendrick's]

It's pretty awesome being able to play old games right now. What would suck is in 20 years you have nostalgia for something you cannot experience anymore. You are telling me that wouldnt suck?

If there is demand for old games, they will exist. I can't think of many examples of old games that I would want to play that I can't find digitally right now. Also, I don't really play old games. I play games and then move on, almost never revisiting them outside of maybe Tetris and Ms. Pac-Man.

 

[MMaRsu]

Well that just depends on tastes. But the ability is there.

 

[Zog]

If there is demand for old games, they will exist. I can't think of many examples of old games that I would want to play that I can't find digitally right now. Also, I don't really play old games. I play games and then move on, almost never revisiting them outside of maybe Tetris and Ms. Pac-Man.

Just keep rebuying them over and over again instead of just buying them once physically?

Example: So you got the urge to play Chrono Trigger again but the Wii that had your digital copy broke and your Wii U can no longer access the Wii eShop. You will have to buy it again on another digital store. I just put in my SNES or my DS cartridge and that will work on any SNES, Clone SNES, DS or 3DS.

 

[Mihos]

If there is demand for old games, they will exist. I can't think of many examples of old games that I would want to play that I can't find digitally right now. Also, I don't really play old games. I play games and then move on, almost never revisiting them outside of maybe Tetris and Ms. Pac-Man.

Part of the digital push was started, mostly by Microsoft, specifically to squash used game sales. It was an actual bullet point.

 

[Zog]

Part of the digital push was started, mostly by Microsoft, specifically to squash used game sales. It was an actual bullet point.

Remember when game consumers cared about protecting the second hand market?

 

[trikster40]

My big beef with digital is that it should not cost the same as the physical version. There no disc/case manufacturing, so why can’t digital be $5-$10 cheaper? Oh that’s right, because we still gladly pay the same price for digital. Why give us a price break when they don’t have to?

I usually only go digital for flash sales, etc. that’s the best time to pick up games.

And I’ve got my S2 downloaded on both my PS4s. Better get them them just in case.

 

[mckmas8808]

Remember when game consumers cared about protecting the second hand market?

Feels like 30 years ago lol.

 

[Baron Samedi]

Download it into your drive or even better an external drive. How is that different from having the physical copy?

 

[Stuart360]

Part of the digital push was started, mostly by Microsoft, specifically to squash used game sales. It was an actual bullet point.

Digital games have been on consoles long before the XB1 reveal, and much longer on PC. Not everything bad in the world is down to Microsoft you know. Plus if you remember back to the start of this gen, insiders, leakers, experts, whatever, were saying it was publishers who were pushing for it, Microsoft just went along with what they wanted.

 

[Zog]

Download it into your drive or even better an external drive. How is that different from having the physical copy?

The downloads are often tied to a specific console. Try using your Wii SD card in another Wii, for example. Pretty sure this is the case for all of Nintendo's consoles and handhelds. As for the 360, in order to designate a new primary console, you have to download something to it from the Marketplace while logged into your account. Good luck with that once the 360 Marketplace is closed down.

 

[mckmas8808]

Download it into your drive or even better an external drive. How is that different from having the physical copy?

What if I just want to borrow a friend's game? Or rent a game for the weekend through RedBox?

 

[KellyNole]

Can't download a digital game to your hard drive if there is no digital game anymore to download because it was removed from a store.

I can say the same thing if the disc isn’t for sale anymore. You can download the digital copy to a hard drive and store it.

 

[Nymphae]

I can say the same thing if the disc isn’t for sale anymore. You can download the digital copy to a hard drive and store it.

What physical releases are no longer able to be acquired? Delisted digital games can never be acquired after the purchase window closes.

 

[Zog]

I can say the same thing if the disc isn’t for sale anymore. You can download the digital copy to a hard drive and store it.

Uh no, physical games can be bought used.

 

[Mattyp]

US. And to your point, I would prefer to sell off in bulk and there are in fact a few rarities in the lot. I would price accordingly, however.

If they where PAL region regardless of country I would put in a serious offer. Since you know what's worthy pick out the rare ones flog them few sales separately then bulk lot the rest.

Part of the digital push was started, mostly by Microsoft, specifically to squash used game sales. It was an actual bullet point.

Yeah, nah. Valve started this shit bundling HL2 & CSS with Steam. I still have the big box and requirement of having to install steam to play them. Was fucking outraged at the time and still am and would have spent a total of $50 on their platform in the last 20 years for being the source of it all and chucked PC gaming in after that.

Ten or so of those dollars was an older title, sadly I thought RCT would of been modified to work on newer systems so grabbed it digitally so I didn't have to fuck around. Oh look no still the same issues as the disc version, I have to get this game running in the right mode and still cant full screen it. The fuck am I paying you for to keep old games up that still need user effort to play.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Goes to show all the hoopla gamers were bitching about years back about digital/internet required gaming isn't so important after all.

Fast forward to 2019 and lots of gamers have partially (or fully) converted to digital. And for most digital heavy console gamers even requires buying an external HDD for $100 or more to store it all.

Looks like digital has taken a 10 furlong lead and the lead only grows.

 

[Zog]

Goes to show all the hoopla gamers were bitching about years back about digital/internet required gaming isn't so important after all.

It's still important to some of us. Just because some people sold their ownership rights down the river for convenience doesn't mean they won't regret it later.

Fast forward to 2019 and lots of gamers have partially (or fully) converted to digital. And for most digital heavy console gamers even requires buying an external HDD for $100 or more to store it all.

Crazy isn't it. Not only do digital games usually cost more but having to provide your own storage ups the cost even further. When that external HDD fails (or the console the games are tied to) then they will lose their whole collection at once.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

It's still important to some of us. Just because some people sold their ownership rights down the river for convenience doesn't mean they won't regret it later.


Crazy isn't it. Not only do digital games usually cost more but having to provide your own storage ups the cost even further. When that external HDD fails (or the console the games are tied to) then they will lose their whole collection at once.

Yup. Crazy.

But people running internet/digital businesses aren't stupid. They know at the end of the day convenience is the most important factor. When the internet first came, it was all about rock bottom pricing. Not anymore. Prices can be higher than a store, but people would rather sit home, pay more and get a digital copy than pick up a cheaper product at the store.

If a company can get that following funneled into purchasing habit of "convenience first", that company has hooked you in. And since people are inherently lazy, they likely won't go back to the old way.

Don't get me wrong, some people value convenience as number one priority. But like anything in life, there will be drawbacks too. Comes down to gamers trending to digital download convenience now.

 

[Zog]

Yup. Crazy.

But people running internet/digital businesses aren't stupid. They know at the end of the day convenience is the most important factor. When the internet first came, it was all about rock bottom pricing. Not anymore. Prices can be higher than a store, but people would rather sit home, pay more and get a digital copy than pick up a cheaper product at the store.

If a company can get that following funneled into purchasing habit of "convenience first", that company has hooked you in. And since people are inherently lazy, they likely won't go back to the old way.

Don't get me wrong, some people value convenience as number one priority. But like anything in life, there will be drawbacks too. Comes down to gamers trending to digital download convenience now.

The kids and young adults of today may have come into gaming not knowing the value of physical copies. To them, digital is the norm and you only buy physical when you have to. I guess that's how things slowly change. The publishers are killing the used game market without even trying.

 

[Breakage]

Tbf the problems regarding digital content began last gen. I mean, what happens when Sony and Microsoft pull the plug on PSN and Live for their gen 7 consoles and you want to pick up some important DLC for a game that isn't on current gen BC?

 

[Zog]

Tbf the problems regarding digital content began last gen. I mean, what happens when Sony and Microsoft pull the plug on PSN and Live for their gen 7 consoles and you want to pick up some important DLC for a game that isn't on current gen BC?

People will beg for a remaster.

 

[wintermutexo]

It's depressing that this industry in recent years has in several ways made piracy look better than it should. Preservation is important, and if physical copies still exist directly from the developer/publisher/gaming store despite a game being pulled from digital stores then it isn't as unfortunate for those who do want to own and play the games, but when a game is digital-only and physical copies aren't going to benefit the developer/publisher due to the copies only being owned by, for example, random eBay sellers, it becomes easier to sympathise with the emulator/pirate bunch.

 

[HeresJohnny]

Sometimes, buttsex doesn't only happen in prison. Sometimes, people pay for it.

 

[Breakage]

People will beg for a remaster.

Well-known titles will probably make their way over to whatever platform is current, but the lesser-known games with significant DLC components?
I'm guessing the additional content for those titles will be lost forever.
I suppose future collectors will just have to resign themselves to playing the base version of older games.

 

[HeresJohnny]

It's depressing that this industry in recent years has in several ways made piracy look better than it should. Preservation is important, and if physical copies still exist directly from the developer/publisher/gaming store despite a game being pulled from digital stores then it isn't as unfortunate for those who do want to own and play the games, but when a game is digital-only and physical copies aren't going to benefit the developer/publisher due to the copies only being owned by, for example, random eBay sellers, it becomes easier to sympathise with the emulator/pirate bunch.

Yep, I've been a staunch proponent of buying your shit on the straight and narrow for 30-plus years, but not anymore. Get your shit however you need to get it so that you can hang on to it and play it. after buying a copy. There are no good guys anymore, and the industry rewards bad behavior and punishes loyalists.

 

[Zog]

Yep, I've been a staunch proponent of buying your shit on the straight and narrow for 30-plus years, but not anymore. Get your shit however you need to get it so that you can hang on to it and play it. after buying a copy. There are no good guys anymore, and the industry rewards bad behavior and punishes loyalists.

According to some, we have always licensed video games and never really owned the copies that we 'bought'. They say that the publishers simply had no way to take back our purchases in the past though.

I think that's just people trying to justify the bad place game consumers are in now by pretending it was always this way.

 

[Baron Samedi]

What if I just want to borrow a friend's game? Or rent a game for the weekend through RedBox?

Gamepass... Just look at how it worked for music and film, it will be analog to that.

 

[HeresJohnny]

According to some, we have always licensed video games and never really owned the copies that we 'bought'. They say that the publishers simply had no way to take back our purchases in the past though.

I think that's just people trying to justify the bad place game consumers are in now by pretending it was always this way.

It's legally always been a license, but the accepted norm is that when you bought a game you owned it until you sold it. So while they are technically correct, they are also wrong.

Here's the thing that pisses me off. You hear the industry bitch and moan about how fucking awful it is to make games these days; that it's soooooo expensive and not enough people buy them. Ok, so why are you pulling this bullshit on people who are on YOUR side? The people who have stuck by this industry through good and bad? It's fucking sad, man. Just plain old sad.

 

[jshackles]

According to some, we have always licensed video games and never really owned the copies that we 'bought'. They say that the publishers simply had no way to take back our purchases in the past though.

I think that's just people trying to justify the bad place game consumers are in now by pretending it was always this way.

That confusion probably comes from the legality of licensing software though. You don't own (as in the rights to), say, Super Mario Bros. just because you bought a cartridge. You have a license to play that software on your hardware, but owning the game (in the legal sense) means you can claim trademark, reproduce the game for profit, etc.

You own the physical copy you bought and you're legally allowed to sell (or in some cases even make personal copies of) the game as you see fit. But ownership implies Nintendo or Sony or Sega or whoever is transferring the ownership of the intellectual property of the code contained therein, which would be a bad deal for them.

 

[Zog]

That confusion probably comes from the legality of licensing software though. You don't own (as in the rights to), say, Super Mario Bros. just because you bought a cartridge. You have a license to play that software on your hardware, but owning the game (in the legal sense) means you can claim trademark, reproduce the game for profit, etc.

You own the physical copy you bought and you're legally allowed to sell (or in some cases even make personal copies of) the game as you see fit. But ownership implies Nintendo or Sony or Sega or whoever is transferring the ownership of the intellectual property of the code contained therein, which would be a bad deal for them.

No one thinks that they own the copyright to Super Mario Bros. just because they bought a copy. There is no confusion, there are just people who want to rewrite history to pretend that you have never owned your copies of games. they try to equate owning a copy of a game with owning the copyright which isn't the way game consumers have ever thought about it. Have you ever heard anyone say 'I own the copyright to Chrono Trigger since I bought a copy of it'?

 

[HeresJohnny]

That confusion probably comes from the legality of licensing software though. You don't own (as in the rights to), say, Super Mario Bros. just because you bought a cartridge. You have a license to play that software on your hardware, but owning the game (in the legal sense) means you can claim trademark, reproduce the game for profit, etc.

You own the physical copy you bought and you're legally allowed to sell (or in some cases even make personal copies of) the game as you see fit. But ownership implies Nintendo or Sony or Sega or whoever is transferring the ownership of the intellectual property of the code contained therein, which would be a bad deal for them.

Correct, but it's splitting hairs. I own this Buck 110 Automatic in my pocket right now. Does that ownership convey the right for me to produce a copy of the knife for profit? No. Neither does owning a cartridge or a disc. Just like everything else wrong with the world these days, the truth is defined by the legion of fucking vampires known as lawyers and wordsmiths who basically can say whatever they want in a literal seaspray of word soup vomit and that's considered legally binding. Fuck that. No one is trying to make retail copies of their cartridges to sell, at least not on these forums anyway. People just want to play their games and not have them taken away on a technicality.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

No one thinks that they own the copyright to Super Mario Bros. just because they bought a copy. There is no confusion, there are just people who want to rewrite history to pretend that you have never owned your copies of games. they try to equate owning a copy of a game with owning the copyright which isn't the way game consumers have ever thought about it. Have you ever heard anyone say 'I own the copyright to Chrono Trigger since I bought a copy of it'?

Agreed.

Nobody think buying a game means you own the code to do what you want. A lot of stuff has copyright or patent info attached to it. If someone buys an album, nobody thinks they own the lyrics.

The only reason game companies do this (and not other industries) is because people don't care. And nobody gives a shit about reading any archaic 30 page Terms and Service Agreements. Again, something only software companies do. You buy a TV, a car or a music album. You don't get T&S paperwork splashed in your face.

If someone buys a car, but a back page claim says despite paying $50,000 for a car, the dealership can take it back or remotely press a button deactivating it, customers would tell the car maker or dealership to fuck off. For games, most gamers don't care, so for those times it happens, it's not enough to move the needle.

And the reason software companies do this is because it can be easily controlled with digital fingerprints, or internet checks, or server side access. The internet has been the holy grail for software companies. Sell people software without stores getting physical copy cuts or packaging, and internet checks grant or deny access.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

This is the Danger of the Digital Content in the Future.


It is not 100% sure or even 50% that your purchase is forever ... Thats why i never buy digital at least is in 75% off the price.

Even Pre-Orders Digital is Stupid.

 

[Zog]

Even Pre-Orders Digital is Stupid.

Pre-ordering digital is hilarious, I guess they think the digital store is going to run out.....LOL

 

[mckmas8808]

Gamepass... Just look at how it worked for music and film, it will be analog to that.

But you can still buy movies and music on physical media (CDs, DVDs, and Blu-rays).