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Tomb Raider |OT| Lara's Misfortune

G

golem

Member
Nice OT but needs some more TressFX and PC Love:

lara_3frame.jpg

tomb-raider-pc-features.jpg
 
T

The Illiterati

Member
Why oh why did I just order this? I still haven't played my copies of Dishonored or X-Com, both of which I pegged as my probable favorite games of last year. Not played one minute of them. Barely played Secret World, bought and didn't touch Guild Wars 2, only played a few hours of Far Cry 3. What disorder is this called? (I did just beat Persona 3 and am deep into loving Persona 4, so its not as if I'm not playing games.) My backlog makes me feel so guilty.
 
G

GenoZStriker

Neo Member
Net_Wrecker said:
Y'know, I don't take offense to the violence, but this is something that should be brought up. The combat is a little gratuitous considering Lara's supposed to be a rookie to all this adventuring + killing stuff. I don't see any hesitation, or struggle, or disgust, or anything in these kills. In fact it's the exactly opposite with lots of unflinching up close finishers, explosive tactics, and general insanity. There's nothing in the animations that suggests Lara's anything but a cold blooded human being. People can justify the combat all they want with "Well it's self defense," but the fact remains that the narrative is goign one way, and gameplay is going another. It makes no sense.
Click to expand...

Well in one of the trailers, I believe it was the one that just recently came out, Lara screams "I'm coming for you all." Which makes me believe that at some point in the game she does go batshit crazy and unleashes an inner killer within her to fight her way through.

As fucked up as this might sound. I do not think it's unrealistic to believe that tragic events that happen to her, could flip a switch in someone to behave like this.
 
T

thetrin

Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
The Illiterati said:
Why oh why did I just order this? I still haven't played my copies of Dishonored or X-Com, both of which I pegged as my probable favorite games of last year. Not played one minute of them. Barely played Secret World, bought and didn't touch Guild Wars 2, only played a few hours of Far Cry 3. What disorder is this called? (I did just beat Persona 3 and am deep into loving Persona 4, so its not as if I'm not playing games.) My backlog makes me feel so guilty.
Click to expand...

I avoid this by simply not buying games if I don't have time to play them (and also not buying games if I'm already playing something else).
 
R

RuinerPrime

Member
Net_Wrecker said:
Y'know, I don't take offense to the violence, but this is something that should be brought up. The combat is a little gratuitous considering Lara's supposed to be a rookie to all this adventuring + killing stuff. I don't see any hesitation, or struggle, or disgust, or anything in these kills. In fact it's the exactly opposite with lots of unflinching up close finishers, explosive tactics, and general insanity. There's nothing in the animations that suggests Lara's anything but a cold blooded human being. People can justify the combat all they want with "Well it's self defense," but the fact remains that the narrative is going one way, and gameplay is going another. It makes no sense.
Click to expand...

Farcry 3 is pretty similar in that way too. But for me, if the games fun I can let it slide and not be bothered by it too much.
 
link1201

link1201

Member
So I guess puzzle solving and actual "Tomb Raiding" are optional?? This makes me sad, I loved the puzzles from the first few games, I wish they would spend more time on that aspect rather than the kill the bad guy aspect....
Don't get me wrong a random bear here or there is cool but from what I am seeing I think I will enjoy the game but not as much as I originally thought I was going to.
 
I

itzknickknac

Member
Anyone know if Newegg has any pre-order bonus?

I purchased it back when newegg had that $12 off deal. If there's no bonus, I'm tempted to throw that $12 back in for another pre-order bonus.. but idk, $12 off is a good deal to me.

I'm too hyped for this game though! I will delay my current games for this one!
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
red731 said:
Kinda this. Was that really necessary? I don't have problems with gore and litres of blood in games, but if they wanted to create some sort of emotional attachment with Lara and her misfortunes like crashing with a ship, being alone and hurt, hurt more and then, over the top realistic death scenes.....
Click to expand...
This is an oxymoron. How can you have realistic yet over the death scenes?

These are still just polygons and textures. There's still a retry option. No humans or creatures were hurt in the making of the game nor will they be hurt if you actually go on a killing spree in the game.

I really have to wonder how long its going to take for the general media to pick up on this and start up on the whole game violence shit fest again.
 
Tathanen

Tathanen

Get Inside Her!
Net_Wrecker said:
Y'know, I don't take offense to the violence, but this is something that should be brought up. The combat is a little gratuitous considering Lara's supposed to be a rookie to all this adventuring + killing stuff. I don't see any hesitation, or struggle, or disgust, or anything in these kills. In fact it's the exactly opposite with lots of unflinching up close finishers, explosive tactics, and general insanity. There's nothing in the animations that suggests Lara's anything but a cold blooded human being. People can justify the combat all they want with "Well it's self defense," but the fact remains that the narrative is going one way, and gameplay is going another. It makes no sense.
Click to expand...

Yeah and I mean, truthfully, I'm not into this kind of violence in any games. But I can accept it when it's thematically consistent. Something like Darksiders, you're a monster killing monsters, it works. Killing zombies in Resident Evil, fine, they're already dead. Any number of war games, that's war. You're TRAINED to be an efficient killing machine. Even The Last of Us, which I think straddles a fine line, yeah okay the world has become a really fucked up place (I still don't think it should be that easy to kill one of the few real humans that remain, but again, fine line).

Tomb Raider though? Lara should not be doing this. It's like Uncharted, where Nate is an ungodly killing machine, but at least it's not obscenely violent about it. This just makes me really uncomfortable, I have no reason to be killing these people like this.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
As far as violence goes Tomb Raider isn't even that graphic. If you blast someone in the face with the shotgun their heads don't explode like they would in real life, the head stays in tact and you just get a bunch of muddy blood effect. We are still a long way from actual realistic and graphic violence in games. Its only when developers start modeling inside the structure of characters like they did with MK9 will we start getting closer to realistuc believe.
 
N

Net_Wrecker

Member
GenoZStriker said:
Well in one of the trailers, I believe it was the one that just recently came out, Lara screams "I'm coming for you all." Which makes me believe that at some point in the game she does go batshit crazy and unleashing an inner killer within her to fight her way through.

As fucked up as this might sound. I do not think it's unrealistic to believe that tragic events that happen to her, could flip a switch in someone to behave like this.
Click to expand...

I'm sure there will be a turning point where Lara The Ripper will be unleashed and nuke the entire island before cracking wise and hopping onto a dolphin to ride off into the sunset. But really, is that all we ask of the narrative/gameplay dynamic? Standards be too low. There are ways to convey her turning into a hardened survivor. Cover shootouts with flawless weapon executions against 5+ enemies at a time is not that.

Tathanen said:
Tomb Raider though? Lara should not be doing this. It's like Uncharted, where Nate is an ungodly killing machine, but at least it's not obscenely violent about it. This just makes me really uncomfortable, I have no reason to be killing these people like this.
Click to expand...

Even Uncharted goes the wrong way with this stuff. That series should've relied way more on wild escapes and cunning than monster closet shootouts. Drake's a one man army in gameplay, and Indiana Jones in cutscenes. Where's the consistency?
 
T

TheFLYINGManga_Ka

Member
5 maps isn't much especially if you want to get to level 60 and unlock Lara.

But multiplayer is a distraction to a excellent single player.

Has Eurogamer or Digital Foundry do a 360/PS3/PC comparison yet?
 
P

Papercuts

fired zero bullets in the orphanage.
Net_Wrecker said:
I'm sure there will be a turning point where Lara The Ripper will be unleashed and nuke the entire island before cracking wise and hopping onto a dolphin to ride off into the sunset. But really, is that all we ask of the narrative/gameplay dynamic? Standards be too low. There are ways to convey her turning into a hardened survivor. Cover shootouts with flawless weapon executions against 5+ enemies at a time is not that.



Even Uncharted goes the wrong way with this stuff. That series should've relied way more on wild escapes and cunning than monster closet shootouts. Drake's a one many army in gameplay, and Indiana Jones in cutscenes. Where's the consistency?
Click to expand...

UC3 got especially dumb with this, having enemies go after you in burning buildings and sinking ships instead of having some actual sense and value for their lives.

I'm not going to judge how it's done in TR yet, but it atleast seems the actual build up for Lara to start killing people is done pretty poorly. Maybe an angle of her actually being/becoming psychotic can still work.
 
N

Net_Wrecker

Member
Papercuts said:
UC3 got especially dumb with this, having enemies go after you in burning buildings and sinking ships instead of having some actual sense and value for their lives.

I'm not going to judge how it's done in TR yet, but it atleast seems the actual build up for Lara to start killing people is done pretty poorly. Maybe an angle of her actually being/becoming psychotic can still work.
Click to expand...

Those sequences would've been more memorable had the enemies tried to get out as well. The potential, not only for a bit of humor as everyone is jockeying for position, but also to do something different is huge. As it is, the burning building is just a fancy backdrop for a standard cover shootout.

As for psychotic Lara, I'm sure they'll downplay it as her simply "doing what she had to do" and everyone will be fine with that because it's "fun to play." On one hand I can't be mad at people having fun, but on the other had there's so much more they can do instead of falling back on traditional combat tropes.
 
R

red731

Member
Dahbomb said:
This is an oxymoron. How can you have realistic yet over the death scenes?

These are still just polygons and textures. There's still a retry option. No humans or creatures were hurt in the making of the game nor will they be hurt if you actually go on a killing spree in the game.

I really have to wonder how long its going to take for the general media to pick up on this and start up on the whole game violence shit fest again.
Click to expand...

If you mean oxymoron in me not minding gore and not wanting to see Lara die in these realistic ways, then yes. I am just trying to say that Lara always died with her whole body crumbling, turning into gold or being eaten - but that was not so graphic like something through chin. BUT, the game wouldn't be consistent without the ways it is portraied.

I hope that general media won't ever again pick up the violence topic.
 
N

Ninjimbo

Member
I don't know. The violence seems pretty justified to me. It's messy and reckless. The sort of thing I would expect from a person who is not trained in combat. Considering the desperate situation Lara finds herself in the game, it seems appropriate to me for her to do whatever she can to survive.

That's how I see the pick-axe to the cranium deal. I can see the logic behind using it as a weapon.
 
S

Skilletor

Member
Imagine how cool it would've been if there was just a small band of people on the island, crazy people, who had been there so long they would do anything just to survive. They'd have some small loyalty to one another, but only insofar is it helped their survival. Imagine Lara getting caught by one of them, driven to madness by hunger, and Lara is forced to kill that person. And then, a series of sparse encounters with each of these people, each kill getting easier for Lara as she "does what she has to do."
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
Ninjimbo said:
I don't know. The violence seems pretty justified to me. It's messy and reckless. The sort of thing I would expect from a person who is not trained in combat. Considering the desperate situation Lara finds herself in the game, it seems appropriate to me for her to do whatever she can to survive.

That's how I see the pick-axe to the cranium deal. I can see the logic behind using it as a weapon.
Click to expand...

These kills aren't really messy; I guess the reason they look so bad is because they look too methodical. They look like someone doing it because they want to rather than because they have to.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
red731 said:
If you mean oxymoron in me not minding gore and not wanting to see Lara die in these realistic ways, then yes. I am just trying to say that Lara always died with her whole body crumbling, turning into gold or being eaten - but that was not so graphic like something through chin. BUT, the game wouldn't be consistent without the ways it is portraied.

I hope that general media won't ever again pick up the violence topic.
Click to expand...
No the oxymoron is realistic vs over the top violence. Over the top violence is like MK violence but realistic violence is something like SPR. So you said that the death scene was over the top realistic which doesn't make sense to me as its either a realistic death scene or an over the top death scene.

Now I know you meant realistic death scene so we can carry on as usual. I don't think the violence in TR is that realistic even that particular scene of her getting skewered wouldn't play out like that because she would be paralyzed instantly and not be able to use her arms.
 
N

Ninjimbo

Member
RagnarokX said:
These kills aren't really messy; I guess the reason they look so bad is because they look too methodical. They look like someone doing it because they want to rather than because they have to.
Click to expand...
I haven't seen all of them yet. The ones that stuck out to me were the pick-axe and the stone to the head kills. It's Lara using these common objects like deadly weapons. In the situation she's in, being in an island filled with cannibals or something, it does seem like she would have to do some pretty heinous shit to survive and she does it.

I need to play it to get a true feel for the violence, but what I've seen so far strikes me as thoughtful. It fits with the world they've created.
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
Ninjimbo said:
I haven't seen all of them yet. The ones that stuck out to me were the pick-axe and the stone to the head kills. It's Lara using these common objects like deadly weapons. In the situation she's in, being in an island filled with cannibals or something, it does seem like she would have to do some pretty heinous shit to survive and she does it.

I need to play it to get a true feel for the violence, but what I've seen so far strikes me as thoughtful. It fits with the world they've created.
Click to expand...

They aren't cannibals, and although they are aggressive they appear to be using deadly force against her mainly to prevent her from killing them.
 
Spazznid

Spazznid

Member
Remind me again, why is it that a game about a woman stuck on an island with Cultist, savage, and violent men, is not allowed to allude to the fact that rape is a possible outcome if she were to get caught?

That's like making a game about war and not being allowed to use IEDs or suicide bombers, or making a game based in Rural African villages and getting flak for most of the natives being black... oh...

Well, if it was a movie, it would get a pass...
 
S

sleepykyo

Member
Dahbomb said:
Really surprised that people are taken a back by the violence in the game. I mean especially on GAF of all places.

I guess after stuff like Manhunt, NG2, GoW, RE, MK nothing really shocks me anymore.
Click to expand...

The last 3 TRs were rated T, it isn't that far out of the question.
 
M

Metal Gear?!

Member
Spazznid said:
Remind me again, why is it that a game about a woman stuck on an island with Cultist, savage, and violent men, is not allowed to allude to the fact that rape is a possible outcome if she were to get caught?

That's like making a game about war and not being allowed to use IEDs or suicide bombers, or making a game based in Rural African villages and getting flak for most of the natives being black... oh...

Well, if it was a movie, it would get a pass...
Click to expand...
This game isn't real life, it's a fucking fantasy, and a carefully constructed one at that. Every single element you mention is in the game for a reason, that island and those people don't actually exist. Right now it's a murder fantasy but it doesn't have to be a rape fantasy too. If you can't see that either you have precious little socialization outside of videogames or you're a goddamn sociopath.





sleepykyo said:
The last 3 TRs were rated T, it isn't that far out of the question.
Click to expand...
All of the Tomb Raiders have been T at most, even Angel of Darkness. This would be like if The Last of Us was actually Uncharted 4.
 
S

saunderez

Member
RagnarokX said:
They aren't cannibals, and although they are aggressive they appear to be using deadly force against her mainly to prevent her from killing them.
Click to expand...
You're going out of your way to make it sound like Lara is the aggressor. She's not, no matter how much you want it to be true. If they didn't shoot at her she wouldn't have to kill them.
 
K

KiDdYoNe

Member
Okay, now im into all the hype. Was thinking of getting the game in couple of months but our retailer just announced that first buyers will get free steelbook as a gift -_____-
gif in the first post is pretty cool
 
D

Dinda

Member
I'm really excited for this.

Especially the PC Version with the new Hair.
But probably even more for the textures. Hitman Absolution had fantastic Textures on PC, and Nixxes said that the Textures in TR are by far the best they have ever done.
 
K

KAOz

Short bus special
I think this game might have even more cutscene/gameplay inconsistency than Uncharted. I really like what they're trying to do, but some of the stuff is just a bit... silly.

Very early "spoiler", and not big at all, but spoiler-tagging anyway.
Like when Lara is captured, and then kills the guy right afterwards. She breaks down, almost begins to cry, maybe on her way to vomit because she just took a life. Then she just walks off and casually kill two other people directly afterwards. Like, directly. Without even breaking a sweat or making a comment. Then walks off to kill even more of them.

Feels a bit jarring in that sense. But other than that, seems like a cool game that might scratch that adventure itch.
 
L

lfc11

Neo Member
Anyone knows where I can get the Limited Edition Strategy Guide that comes with the amulet necklace and in-game stuff in Canada? EB Games seems to be the only retailer that has the guide but it doesn't have the bonuses.

EDIT: Found it on Amazon.ca for $13 less.
 
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