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[Dragon]

As if Patrick is immune to doing that. Goddamn his double standards are aggravating.

 

[Slashlen]

Well I thought Yoshida said as much after E3.

But to play Dodd's advocate, if they did consider it, they had no reason to tell anybody after they backed out. Should Yoshida have said, "Sure, we were all ready to stomp on used games and your consumer rights, but you just made too much damn noise." or just deny it was ever a plan?

 

[Kinyou]

It's interesting that we're hounding a guy and rightfully so for "ruining someone's career" and just now kind of celebrating another industry professional in Jason from Kotaku slandering another journalist just because they referenced Pete's rumours and speculations.

... this is an interesting thing to watch unfold.

Jason merely made that screenshot, he wasn't the one who pointed out how dualshocker seems to have overly relied on Pete's rumors.

Also is there a bit of a difference between telling a lie about a person, and just pointing something out.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Laying down the law

Thank you!

 

[prwxv3]

I have no idea why you are becoming so increasingly hostile.

I don't really think it's any secret that he favored Sony, he admitted it himself on his own personal website.

Favoring does not equal blind fanboy that protects their favorite company. He royally fucked up and deserves the ban for it but though

 

[antitrop]

EDIT: Off-topic post about Legendary Former GAF Member Dave Meltzer.

 

[Salvor.Hardin]

Kind of funny how much shit I was getting earlier today about this very topic. Wish the thread wasn't locked though. There was a good discussion to be had.

 

[Salex_]

Interesting. After all the ridiculous speculation in the recent Driveclub thread it turns out the director left due to a personal reason? Maybe people can learn something from that?

 

[ThatGuyAgain]

Outside of the two significantly unfortunate events in this thread (mort recklessly spreading a rumor that forced Col to protect his reputation and getting perma-banned, and Col having to share a personal family situation where is 4 year old son has a life-threatening illness - I really wish you and your son the best with this, Col), I wonder how UC4 will be impacted?

Sorry if this is selfish or not appropriate at this point, but I’m a huge UC (and ND) fan and the Game Director leaving at this point in time cannot be good for the development of the game.

 

[ironcreed]

The goal here isn't to ban people from posting rumors, it's to get people to think about what they're posting and not just regurgitate anything they hear.

For example, here are some simple guidelines that make a rumor posting vastly better:

1.) Generally speaking, do not post negative personal rumors about staff on GAF, and by that I mean things like someone getting fired or forced out or whatever. If you feel strongly about your information, e-mail a site like Kotaku or Polygon with your evidence and let them handle getting additional confirmation and also commentary from the person the rumor is about, and decide whether or not it's worth posting. Now, if it's something like "Oh yeah, they left to found an indie studio, get excited!", I'm not really concerned about that, but strive to not do anything libelous or disrespectful.

2.) In case this isn't clear, it is okay to post rumors about a bunch of people being laid off (not fired, but explicitly laid off) from a studio. We have allowed this in the past and will continue to do so in the future. Please really try to make sure you're certain about this first though. Similarly, if you see a bunch of staff members mentioning they were laid off on twitter, obviously that's fine to post about.

Now, for rumors that aren't about staff:

3.) Never overplay your hand. Only share what you know, and if you wish to make any additional speculation, clearly mark it as speculation. Make sure to state your level of certainty about the core rumor as well. If you've heard that something "has a chance of happening", it's totally different than hearing that it "will happen". This also applies if different parts of the rumor have different levels of credibility. For example, if you've heard that Naughty Dog is definitely making a space shooter and heard that it might have a budget nearing $75 million, make sure that you present the budget as a less certain fact than the game existing. You should explicitly make these kinds of distinctions to the best of your ability.

4.) Ask yourself "Would the person who told me this actually know this information?" Let's say you have a rumor about a game having multiplayer. If your source is a QA person working on that product, they probably do know that information. Let's say your rumor is that a senior staff member was fired (which you shouldn't be posting anyway). If your source is a QA person at a 300+ person studio, chances are they actually don't know that for certain. If your source is an external QA person who doesn't even work at the studio, you should be extremely skeptical of the rumor even if you personally trust the person, since they could easily be hearing gossip that was presented to them as fact.

5.) Ask yourself "Does this rumor make sense?" If your rumor is that Naughty Dog is making an iOS game about farting cats, even if your source is someone at the studio, you might want to think if they're playing a joke on you. Game studios generally aren't water tight, especially if you know what information you are looking for. Check their job postings and public statements and linkedin resumes, and see if that adds up with the information you've heard. A rumor sprung up that Visceral was making a Battlefield title. It was really easy for me to find buckets full of information supporting this. Chances are you can find at least one thing confirming your rumor before you bother to post it, even if you don't share what that thing is in order to protect your source. There are obviously rumors where this isn't true, but it may be worth noting in your post that you couldn't find external evidence confirming or even hinting at this.

6.) Before you hit post, ask yourself one last time "After checking all this information, do I actually believe this, or at least find it notably plausible?" Chances are that if you've completed the previous steps, by this point you do, but it's worth checking one last time and deciding if you want to do a bit more research first, especially if it's something farfetched.

Should be stickied for all future 'insiders' to read.

 

[Felix Lighter]

It's interesting that we're hounding a guy and rightfully so for "ruining someone's career" and just now kind of celebrating another industry professional in Jason from Kotaku slandering another journalist just because they referenced Pete's rumours and speculations.

... this is an interesting thing to watch unfold.

Images of links to articles referencing quotes to Pete Dodd is slander?

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

So was that a permaban?

At least Demonite and Verendus are still here.

Also reading about the director of driveclub's situation was very sad. Hope everything works good for him and his family.

 

[viveks86]

This is an interesting situation. Journalists are trained to be judicious when they use anonymous sources. It's one thing to cite unnamed people while revealing information about a company or a product; it's quite another to cite unnamed people while disparaging someone, especially someone who isn't a public figure. At the very least, if a journalist decides it's appropriate to do that, it's only right to give that person an opportunity to comment before publication.

The idea of a "GAF insider" or "Reddit insider" or whatever is a bizarre new figure that occupies a weird space between journalist and fan, and that can be harmful in situations like this, where the insider doesn't have the experience (or an editor!) to know what's right. Sometimes this can be messy and even harmful to people, as we just saw. It's good that GAF has high standards about these situations, though.

Agreed. I think Dualshockers does a lot of solid reporting. I've noticed them reporting stuff outside Gaf before any site out there. I don't want to see them banned here. They just need to stop posting "according to insiders" articles, especially when the insiders aren't their own sources. It's irresponsible and it will bite them in the ass again.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

It's interesting that we're hounding a guy and rightfully so for "ruining someone's career" and just now kind of celebrating another industry professional in Jason from Kotaku slandering another journalist just because they referenced Pete's rumours and speculations.

... this is an interesting thing to watch unfold.

Seems to be a large contingent of people celebrating his downfall merely due to his reputation for leaning towards Sony. The names dancing on the dude's grave ... is, well... expected to say the least. Ironic, too.

So...not going to back this claim up by naming names?

I'm disappointed.

 

[Ol No Bones]

You're having a field day, Vire.

What I'm curious about is how mods check for true info. Thuway, cboat, famousmortimer, verendus - all considered insiders and all have failed thus far.

Edit: Nirolak got that covered.

We still have NTkrnl.

 

[Loudninja]

Outside of the two significantly unfortunate events in this thread (mort recklessly spreading a rumor that forced Col to protect his reputation and getting perma-banned, and Col having to share a personal family situation where is 4 year old son has a life-threating illness - I really wish you and your son the best with this, Col), I wonder how UC4 will be impacted?

Sorry if this is selfish or not appropriate at this point, but I’m a huge UC (and ND) fan and the Game Director leaving at this point in time cannot be good for the development of the game.

Sony said UC has not been impacted.

Sure they are expected to say that but thats all we got.

 

[jschreier]

It's interesting that we're hounding a guy and rightfully so for "ruining someone's career" and just now kind of celebrating another industry professional in Jason from Kotaku slandering another journalist just because they referenced Pete's rumours and speculations.

... this is an interesting thing to watch unfold.

I don't think you know what "slandering" means!

 

[Aquamarine]

I just don't understand...you slander Col Rodgers, talk with his friend and clear everything up...but INSTEAD of apologizing you decide to make a cheeky Tweet instead?

What...why? Why didn't you just edit your initial post? Why didn't you come to GAF with an apology? Why didn't you give a heartfelt apology the moment that you cleared things up? Why did you have to respond with sarcasm?

Come on now...that logic is just bogus.

 

[Principate]

You're having a field day, Vire.

What I'm curious about is how mods check for true info. Thuway, cboat, famousmortimer, verendus - all considered insiders and all have failed thus far.

Emails, you have to use a paid email to register at this site (e.g your work email) so it's pretty obvious where people work. How they "become" insiders is through posting some reasonable factual information that you normally can't guess.

Of course just because you found out some information one time doesn't make you always a reliable leaker because obviously they could lose their sources and job etc. So you rarely take such statements as facts especially if they don't a proper analyses of it (talk about where they got the info from how reliable they think it is and what's there personal interpretation and keep that separate from the information they received).

That's something simply did not do in this last screw up which a major contributor to this mess.

If he said it was office gossip then it might not have reached this point (even then it was highly questionable to post it.

 

[benny_a]

Sorry if this is selfish or not appropriate at this point, but I’m a huge UC (and ND) fan and the Game Director leaving at this point in time cannot be good for the development of the game.

Depending on the direction it also could have been good. We won't know.

If the final game comes out and half of it sucks and the other half doesn't, then that might be worth investigating. Which half was influenced by which director and which half was just included so the game wasn't ridiculously short.

 

[1st Course]

I did a google search and it made me laugh.

Pathetic.

 

[Frolow]

Why are we on this tangent? Further, as has been noted numerous times, if you feel that a certain poster is a troublemaker and are bothered by their presence in threads, you are welcome to PM us with an explanation as to why their posts are problematic.

Because the discussion led this way? Sorry if it's gotten too meta for this thread, but I don't recall that being against the rules. Anyway, I have PMed mods about certain posts/users being problematic, that isn't the problem. My main issue is that I feel moderators aren't strict enough in general, especially in a time where new consoles have just launched, and let certain derogatory posting behaviors fly by for too long before action is taken. I've been meaning to bring this issue up in the form of a PM, but I never found the time to write it out up until now.

 

[Vire]

I'm not hostile, I'm tired of hypocritical behavior, because (a little detail about myself) I find hypocrites to be among the lowest rung of people.

What is hypocritical about what I said?.. He admitted his only personal favorings for the company on his website, constantly came beck and call in defense of them, even when the information was dubious at best, and I'm calling him out on it.

Sorry if you don't like to hear it.

This isn't meant to be a lynchmob, I'm just expressing my frustration with irresponsibility of his posts. Especially since a director had to reveal personal information about the sickness of his child in order to clear his name.

 

[Devolution]

Spreading rumors enough that an actual industry professional has to clear the air on their departure makes you a douchebag full stop.

 

[McDougles]

It's interesting that we're hounding a guy and rightfully so for "ruining someone's career" and just now kind of celebrating another industry professional in Jason from Kotaku slandering another journalist just because they referenced Pete's rumours and speculations.

... this is an interesting thing to watch unfold.

Observation is "slandering?"

Do you even English?

 

[Sendou]

I don't think you know what "slandering" means!

Are you calling him illiterate? That's slander bro.

 

[freenudemacusers]

I just don't understand...you slander Col Rodgers by calling him incompetent, talk with a friend and clear everything up...but INSTEAD of apologizing you decide to make a cheeky Tweet instead?

What...why? Why didn't you just edit your initial post? Why didn't you come to GAF with an apology? Why didn't you give a heartfelt apology the moment that you cleared things up? Why did you have to respond with sarcasm?

Come on now...that logic is just bogus.

what's not to believe about making a tweet about quitting your insider role on neogaf shortly after someone posts in their defense re: your claims? it's just happenstance. believe.

 

[Yekshemesh]

He has.

This guy... he knows what "GAF Insider" means. He fucking reveled in it. Lost all respect for the man after that bullshit tweet.

 

[SniperHunter]

amazing, she didnt even go check on the truck driver

humanity +1

 

[boeso]

Seemed apt

 

[Jinfash]

As if Patrick is immune to doing that. Goddamn his double standards are aggravating.

Please elaborate before making such libelous claims.

 

[Zia]

Good riddance.

 

[benny_a]

What is hypocritical about what I said?.. He admitted his only personal favorings for the company on his website, constantly came beck and call in defense of them, even when the information was dubious at best, and I'm calling him out on it.

Sorry if you don't like to hear it.

Dude, you're not King Justice that other mortals just have to look away from because they can't handle the truthbombs.

Sony pissing away an insane amount of money on a game that will never see the light of day is not a positive Sony story. I'm sure it can be spun that way but it never was up to now.

Just cherry picking some rumors and ignoring others and then calling every rumor post famousmortimer said to be pro-Sony is ridiculous and looks like wanting to look like the guy that "told you so."

 

[freenudemacusers]

Please elaborate before making such libelous claims.

#InsiderNoLibel

 

[Iacobellis]

Pete fucked up, but I'll still miss the guy. He was the CBoaT in my eyes when it came to Sony leaks.

 

[Sendou]

amazing, she didnt even go check on the truck driver

humanity +1

I think the truck made what I like to call a sick recovery.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

You are already Dodd.

Leave it to the Count. /Salutes.

 

[kurbaan]

People here take posting on a forum way too seriously.

 

[anexanhume]

People here take posting on a forum way to seriously.

*too

I don't think you know what "slandering" means!

You pointed out their lack of scruples. Slander!

 

[Mlatador]

Just don't participate in those threads. I ignore most. If you avoid most of the bees to honey console wars threads, GAF is pretty great.

The problem is not "ignoring" those threads. No matter the topic, but the console wars and their supporters find a way to derail and shit up all threads. Especially many Nintendo threads tend to get really ugly real fast. Best examples are the Bayonetta 2 threads. So much stupidity and hostility, it's just not fun anymore.

 

[Impeccable]

Wrong word choice with slandering, you are all correct.

 

[Grisby]

Geez, what a thread this turned out to be. Just going through it right now.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

What is hypocritical about what I said?..

He admitted his only personal favorings for the company, constantly came beck and call in defense of it, even when the information was dubious at best, and I'm calling him out on it.

Sorry if you don't like to hear it.

This isn't meant to be a lynchmob, I'm just expressing my frustration with his post. Especially since a director had to reveal personal information about the sickness of his child in order to clear his name.

I didn't say your words were hypocritical. Your behavior is. You're doing nothing but compounding the rampant speculation/slandering that started this whole scandal. Pete recklessly spread misinformation and speculation off as fact and deeply offended an honest working man, because of it. Now you're going from post to post recklessly spreading misinformation and speculation off as fact, while chastising Pete for recklessly spreading misinformation and speculation. You don't see the blatant hypocrisy about your behavior? Is it really that hard to see?

Vire, I don't have anything against you. I generally enjoy your posts. But what you're doing here is childish, and you need to realize that.

 

[Anion]

Sometimes I wonder if FM realized how influential all his posts were....
When he screws up, he ends up saying that he didn't realize that it would have "been blown up"
Come on man, when your claim your an insider, people trust you.

 

[Principate]

People here take posting on a forum way to seriously.

It's a forum a lot of the games industry takes it's "news" from. As sad as that fact is people do need to take some responsibility.

 

[ironcreed]

I just don't understand...you slander Col Rodgers, talk with his friend and clear everything up...but INSTEAD of apologizing you decide to make a cheeky Tweet instead?

What...why? Why didn't you just edit your initial post? Why didn't you come to GAF with an apology? Why didn't you give a heartfelt apology the moment that you cleared things up? Why did you have to respond with sarcasm?

Come on now...that logic is just bogus.

In other words, he was spewing tales from his ass and can't be considered a reliable source. That explanation is nothing but a poor attempt to back peddle out of the pit that he dug himself and then fell into.

 

[HamPster PamPster]

Please elaborate before making such libelous claims.

He made fun of anime games and never apologized

 

[Tripon]

Are you calling him illiterate? That's slander bro.

You're both using the wrong term! The pedantic in me must hit you both with libel charges.

 

[nomis]

As if Patrick is immune to doing that. Goddamn his double standards are aggravating.

I hope this is satire

Patrick can make mistakes and handle them with tact.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

He has.

It's disappointing and sad to see Mort fall so far.

The fact that someone had to come on here and give extremely personal details is perhaps the most sickening aspect of all this.