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What do you want or expect from the next Fire Emblem?
- Thread starter SolVanderlyn
- Start date
Lets see...
Honestly, I don't mind what direction Intelligent Systems goes with as long as it's a great game (like Awakening, and all the previous Fire Emblems bar Shadow Dragon).
- Support System from Awakening
- More on that, marriage/children system I don't mind coming back either
- My Unit should play a less important role
- More mission variety
- I don't mind grinding since it's always completely optional, but for the sake of everyone else, limit it.
- Story more like the Tellius games, though without getting bit too convoluted like with Radiant Dawn.
Honestly, I don't mind what direction Intelligent Systems goes with as long as it's a great game (like Awakening, and all the previous Fire Emblems bar Shadow Dragon).
Difficulty that scales AI strategy, not stats. The game didn't feel very strategic and more like a reset/load-fest while piggying back on strong units like Frederick on the hardest difficulties without grinding and the easier difficulties are too easy to be fun. Grinding makes the game trivial on any difficulty.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
I agree with most things mihon said, FE in general should be harder and less forgiving than in Awakening, especially when you have casual mode for the people not into the unforgivingness.
One thing though: How should they make Archers viable again? Their inability to hit from close range makes them a bad option in every way, especially when most classes have 1-2 range and the reclassing.
I really want reclassing to go though, it allows you to break the game by just reclassing everyone to the most overpowered class and wreck shit. Like turn everyone into Berserkers, Sorcerers and Dark Fliers. So monotonous.
One thing though: How should they make Archers viable again? Their inability to hit from close range makes them a bad option in every way, especially when most classes have 1-2 range and the reclassing.
I really want reclassing to go though, it allows you to break the game by just reclassing everyone to the most overpowered class and wreck shit. Like turn everyone into Berserkers, Sorcerers and Dark Fliers. So monotonous.
Sir Garbageman
Member
I'd take Awakening + more map variety and quest objectives pretty much.
Yagami_Sama
Member
Fire Emblem Awakening was an awesome game, I played this game for more than 150 hours, in order to beat the game in the hardest difficulty.
I really want the new entry on the Wii U. If they remake some older games would be nice too. An HD Collection would be awesome and probably if that happen someone will need to restart the universe.
The support system was something that I did not enjoyed , I liked more the way it was on Radiant Dawn.
The class system it is ok if they keep that.
If they keep the open world map, I hope that they include more side quests.
I really want the new entry on the Wii U. If they remake some older games would be nice too. An HD Collection would be awesome and probably if that happen someone will need to restart the universe.
The support system was something that I did not enjoyed , I liked more the way it was on Radiant Dawn.
The class system it is ok if they keep that.
If they keep the open world map, I hope that they include more side quests.
I only got into the series about 6 months before awakening, I'm not much of a fan of SRPGs, but I am a huge fan of the FEs I played.
I find the best complexity comes from 'easy to play, hard to master'. When it was mostly a handful of classes, 3 weapon types, and mission by mission structure, the bulk of the gameplay was spent actually taking part in those missions.
I like FFTactics and Tactics Ogre, but I find it so painful in TO that was just remade on PSP, to manage the party so much every time I arrive at a new town. Can't even compare equipment. In FE, it's just, oh I got 5 dudes with axes, better buy enough so they can still fight.
I don't mind the series trying to evolve, but the way the core gameplay worked in past FEs is what I fell in love with the series for, world map grinding, pair-ups, class change and all that is the opposite, as some others have pointed out.
I'm sure plenty of people love the new additions, and maybe wouldn't have played the series the way it used to be, and I don't exactly hate it, but now it's just another SRPG.
More map objectives is another huge one too, there was a few psuedo different objectives in a few stages, but this is another example where awakening focused on fluff over core gameplay.
I feel this is probably the biggest thing I have an issue with, from a gameplay perspective, the characters have no individuality. I mean sure there is min/maxing involved for like Lunatic and stuff, but for the most part, there is no such thing as a jeigan anymore, series staples like two horsemen knights are gone too. Everyone is everything all the time. This also kills the animations. Since everyone needs to be able to perform every animation from standing, air, and horse, the vast majority are hugely forgettable, and past FEs, in both 2D and 3D, had AMAZING attack animations.
I find the best complexity comes from 'easy to play, hard to master'. When it was mostly a handful of classes, 3 weapon types, and mission by mission structure, the bulk of the gameplay was spent actually taking part in those missions.
I like FFTactics and Tactics Ogre, but I find it so painful in TO that was just remade on PSP, to manage the party so much every time I arrive at a new town. Can't even compare equipment. In FE, it's just, oh I got 5 dudes with axes, better buy enough so they can still fight.
I don't mind the series trying to evolve, but the way the core gameplay worked in past FEs is what I fell in love with the series for, world map grinding, pair-ups, class change and all that is the opposite, as some others have pointed out.
I'm sure plenty of people love the new additions, and maybe wouldn't have played the series the way it used to be, and I don't exactly hate it, but now it's just another SRPG.
More map objectives is another huge one too, there was a few psuedo different objectives in a few stages, but this is another example where awakening focused on fluff over core gameplay.
I feel this is probably the biggest thing I have an issue with, from a gameplay perspective, the characters have no individuality. I mean sure there is min/maxing involved for like Lunatic and stuff, but for the most part, there is no such thing as a jeigan anymore, series staples like two horsemen knights are gone too. Everyone is everything all the time. This also kills the animations. Since everyone needs to be able to perform every animation from standing, air, and horse, the vast majority are hugely forgettable, and past FEs, in both 2D and 3D, had AMAZING attack animations.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
I'm definitely prepared. Awakening didn't completely sour me on FE, but if it's the direction they intend to take the series I'll probably lose interest in it. Which is a shame because it used to be one of my favorite Nintendo franchises.
Fortunately the only one I've imported is the FE12, so at least I still have the SFC games to play someday.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
lol apart from the console of choice (i dont mind them in either), I dont like anything from the OP.
I dont really want anything to change, only have a better story and keep adding new things to the new additions of awakening.
Well maybe I lied about not liking anything from the OP lol, the kids thing without time travel makes sense, and even if I dont think they should make my unit totally backseat, make it as important as the rest, and not more, will be also good.
calc84maniac
Member
Maybe they could make them able to attack within 1 space, but with a severe penalty to hit chance.
Shin Megami Tensei
First post nailed the living fuck out of it.
But that aside, here's what's needed for the next FE:
- The gameplay needs to not be mediocre like Awakening. Good FE gameplay is created with well designed maps that have varied levels of cover, varied stage objectives, a reliance on well-placed enemies (as opposed to artificial difficulty increases through the use of reinforcments, a HUGE mistake of FE:A), and a sensitivity to the player's character preferences.
- Expand the class change system as much as possible to maximize replay value. Make each character model more than a recolor.
- Make DLC characters, if included, worth it. They should be able to have supports and romance (at LEAST with the player's created character).
- Have a real storyline. FE:A was inexcusably horrible in the plot department. FE9 is a more proper example of how to do an FE plot, and I'm sure that plot can be succeeded quality-wise.
- Change up combat somehow. This is one thing that FE:A did well. FE is a pretty conservative series and it will best sell when the game's combat has more depth or is at least tinkered with in some noticeable way.
- A well designed Lunatic mode.
Otakumegane
Member
More varying maps, better strategy mechanics like Shove, balanced skills, no Pair system.
Basically I want Radiant Dawn with a better story and character progression. Awakening nailed the characters and the shipping options but the pair system really screwed up the balance and the design of the game. The whole inheriting skills made the game broken as well.
Basically I want Radiant Dawn with a better story and character progression. Awakening nailed the characters and the shipping options but the pair system really screwed up the balance and the design of the game. The whole inheriting skills made the game broken as well.
Mental Atrophy
Banned
I see a lot of people wanting to minimize the user created character, but how great would it be to create your entire force from scratch?
Eh, I think faceless parties work in some games, but FE games tend to be fairly character heavy. I hated the jump to faceless guys in DQ9 after how great DQ8 was.
You would remove so many elements by allowing you to create the whole force, the characters would become as monotonous as the story has.
Theoretically, amazing. In practice, terrible:
- This would make map design difficult because enemy placements (in a good FE, not Awakening) are often relative to what can be reasonably expected of a player. Depending on how you create your characters, you may be considerably overpowered or considerably underpowered.
- This would complicate the story greatly. FE characters are supposed to have defined roles within a concrete plot. While you compromise and have preset character names and personalities with which your force is created, this could still be problematic for an FE plot; for example, in FE9, Mia's swordsmanship is a defining part of how she interacts with others. Another example is FE6's Gonzales, whose raw strength and stupidity are always made evident in his conversations.
Jawmuncher
Member
All I really want is the Relationships to be expanded upon even more. That was by far my favorite part of the game and I loved seeing what everyone had to say. Not to mention partnering up people to get the other children units was so much fun.
Have a feeling they'll be doing that anyway though since just about everyone was pretty positive with that aspect.
So for something else perhaps better customizing of your personal unit?
Would have been nice to have more features and actually choose the outfit and color of it.
Also while I loved the story in Awakening they could push it into being a tad bit better on the earlier stages. The story really didn't pick up until the beginning hump was passed.
Have a feeling they'll be doing that anyway though since just about everyone was pretty positive with that aspect.
So for something else perhaps better customizing of your personal unit?
Would have been nice to have more features and actually choose the outfit and color of it.
Also while I loved the story in Awakening they could push it into being a tad bit better on the earlier stages. The story really didn't pick up until the beginning hump was passed.
Waylon Drums
Member
Ahhhh, then that's my newness showing. How so?
A friend of mine wants a Fire Emblem where every character can support with every other, but characters that really hate each other will "level up" their supports, but will cause negative effects in battle as opposed to stat boosts.
I thought it was an interesting idea, but the sheer number of conversations that need to be written makes it unlikely. I seem to remember there being a jealousy system in one of the Japanese only games, how did that work?
I thought it was an interesting idea, but the sheer number of conversations that need to be written makes it unlikely. I seem to remember there being a jealousy system in one of the Japanese only games, how did that work?
Lumination
'enry 'ollins
Better balanced Lunatic/+. No, having to reset over and over during the first couple of chapters because key enemies happened to get vantage+ is not the way it should be.
Yes, but how much of that is because of what we want to change ? I doubt Awakening with more mission variety, a story on par to PoR+RD and without grinding or reinforcements that come out of nowhere would've sold less. Awakening sold a lot because of MUCH more marketing (something the others haven't had), casual mode which made it less intimidating to newcomers, amazing reviews on most sites and the fact it launched at an opportune time (it was the first game of an amazing 2013 for 3DS, it was the start for a surging platform and people were somewhat starving for games on it).
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
I thought the difficulty was all over the place in FE:A. I also thought your units were all over the place too. You had some units like Freddy that were OP from the start, but then fell off. Then you had other units like your avatar that started meh and got OP. Just made the ramp up of units sort of all over the place.
Plus the difficulty was seemed to lean way more on stats than strat. It didn't necessarily allow you to implement strategy or really mix units your way. Lower difficulty was a push over and high difficulty sort of forced you down a path since it was all about a few key classes/units to combat enemy AI that were stat patted to high hell and back.
With the addition of the side quests and dlc it seemed like grinding was sort of defacto thought of as something to do just to match the AI stats vs actually out thinking the enemy. Doesn't help either that the bland map design did little to induce a real tactful side of gameplay.
I know I sound harsh as Awakening is a great game, but when you get down to the nitty gritty I feel like it has a ton of key game issues that need to be addressed in the next version.
Plus the difficulty was seemed to lean way more on stats than strat. It didn't necessarily allow you to implement strategy or really mix units your way. Lower difficulty was a push over and high difficulty sort of forced you down a path since it was all about a few key classes/units to combat enemy AI that were stat patted to high hell and back.
With the addition of the side quests and dlc it seemed like grinding was sort of defacto thought of as something to do just to match the AI stats vs actually out thinking the enemy. Doesn't help either that the bland map design did little to induce a real tactful side of gameplay.
I know I sound harsh as Awakening is a great game, but when you get down to the nitty gritty I feel like it has a ton of key game issues that need to be addressed in the next version.
The Awesomest
Member
I don't like all the waifu and fanservice stuff in Awakening. Gimme something serious. You can keep marriage and S-supports, just make it more serious. Better map design. Include some of the innovations from more complex games (4, 5, 9,10), like the skill system, elevation, BEXP, all that. Branching paths, too. I enjoyed those.
Basically, if they made a remake of Radiant Dawn that fixed all the glaring issues it had, I'd be happy. That game has grown on me the more I replay it. However, I expect something more like Awakening. My hope is that IS takes more risks in changing things up for the next one, because their inclusion of features has never been linear from game to game. They just kinda pick and choose which features to employ in any given FE.
Said the guy with the FE8 avatar
Crossbows from Radiant Dawn? 2-3 range for Snipers or Marksmen from Radiant Dawn and Gaiden?
Basically, if they made a remake of Radiant Dawn that fixed all the glaring issues it had, I'd be happy. That game has grown on me the more I replay it. However, I expect something more like Awakening. My hope is that IS takes more risks in changing things up for the next one, because their inclusion of features has never been linear from game to game. They just kinda pick and choose which features to employ in any given FE.
Said the guy with the FE8 avatar
Crossbows from Radiant Dawn? 2-3 range for Snipers or Marksmen from Radiant Dawn and Gaiden?
It's amusing, a lot of these wants are almost in direct opposition to what I want from the next Fire Emblem. I want Awakening 2 pretty much with more pairing options and children characters. Getting supports and building the ultimate child units was by far the best aspect of this game for me.
I would like them to go back to Path of Radiance and start over from that base. PoR is one of my favorite games ever, and almost every change they made from that formula was for the worse. I don't think Awakening is necessarily a bad game, but I found it rather dull and I have no desire to actually finish it, which kind of blows my mind considering how much I love Fire Emblem when it's done right. I expect whatever they make next to be another Awakening though, which is a shame but understandable. I probably won't buy another Fire Emblem game that has a world map unless I see a lot of praise from people who actually know what they are talking about.
Things they probably won't drop but I'm ok with:
- My Unit: Sure, he/she's a bit of a mary sue, but I thought they fit it in there well. They have to have this in there to win that Japanese crowd. Maybe write him/her like they did in New Mystery of the Emblem, where the character was in the background and existed to really draw out the back stories of other units. It was well written in that game, so I think the team can pull it off again.
- Pair Up: Don't see this going away. I'm fine with it staying as it mixed things up and felt fresh, but they have to find a way to make it less broken. Absolutely need to make it so that enemies can pair up and you have to prepare for it.
- The current artist. Look, I prefer Senri Kita, but those days are past us. The current artist sells games, and at the very least it was refreshing and overall asthetically pleasing
- Composer: Awakening was the best soundtrack in the series, despite my love for Radiant Dawn's soundtrack. So they'll continue with this and I'm fine with it.
Things from awakening that I'd like to see removed but won't happen:
- The marriage system. You end up getting all these overpowered units near the end of the game and it makes it feel so unfocused and unbalanced. Add in a half-baked time travel plot line, and really everything suffered as a result. I get it, they wanted a dating system, but maybe there's a way to incorporate that without trashing the game's mechanics and story.
- The World Map. The map presents several issues core to why people found Awakening not as challenging or tactical as other tactics series. A lot of the tactics in Fire Emblem come from having to build up your characters across a set number of levels and make sure that the units in the core group you've chosen are keeping up with rest of the team. Previous Fire Emblem games were built around the fact that you couldn't grind, and therefore forced you to make a lot more tactical decisions. The bonus EXP system was a great way to help out players who weren't good at this, and I think that this as far as they should have gone to ease new players into it.
What I'd like to see that was not in Awakening:
- The return of a proper base system ala Path of Radiance/Radiant Dawn. I was shocked they haven't continued this concept. Awakening had a slight base system, but it lacked the base conversations that really help to connect individual characters to the larger story around them.
- A good story. Look, I'm not going to sit here and say that previous Fire Emblem stories were works of art, but at least they had cohesive worlds with international politics that made you feel like one part of a larger conflict. FE:A's was a mishmash of references to older games that just didn't work. I think their focus was on celebrating the series, so I'll let it slide for that one, but if the next one is still as frivolous, it'll be disappointing.
- My Unit: Sure, he/she's a bit of a mary sue, but I thought they fit it in there well. They have to have this in there to win that Japanese crowd. Maybe write him/her like they did in New Mystery of the Emblem, where the character was in the background and existed to really draw out the back stories of other units. It was well written in that game, so I think the team can pull it off again.
- Pair Up: Don't see this going away. I'm fine with it staying as it mixed things up and felt fresh, but they have to find a way to make it less broken. Absolutely need to make it so that enemies can pair up and you have to prepare for it.
- The current artist. Look, I prefer Senri Kita, but those days are past us. The current artist sells games, and at the very least it was refreshing and overall asthetically pleasing
- Composer: Awakening was the best soundtrack in the series, despite my love for Radiant Dawn's soundtrack. So they'll continue with this and I'm fine with it.
Things from awakening that I'd like to see removed but won't happen:
- The marriage system. You end up getting all these overpowered units near the end of the game and it makes it feel so unfocused and unbalanced. Add in a half-baked time travel plot line, and really everything suffered as a result. I get it, they wanted a dating system, but maybe there's a way to incorporate that without trashing the game's mechanics and story.
- The World Map. The map presents several issues core to why people found Awakening not as challenging or tactical as other tactics series. A lot of the tactics in Fire Emblem come from having to build up your characters across a set number of levels and make sure that the units in the core group you've chosen are keeping up with rest of the team. Previous Fire Emblem games were built around the fact that you couldn't grind, and therefore forced you to make a lot more tactical decisions. The bonus EXP system was a great way to help out players who weren't good at this, and I think that this as far as they should have gone to ease new players into it.
What I'd like to see that was not in Awakening:
- The return of a proper base system ala Path of Radiance/Radiant Dawn. I was shocked they haven't continued this concept. Awakening had a slight base system, but it lacked the base conversations that really help to connect individual characters to the larger story around them.
- A good story. Look, I'm not going to sit here and say that previous Fire Emblem stories were works of art, but at least they had cohesive worlds with international politics that made you feel like one part of a larger conflict. FE:A's was a mishmash of references to older games that just didn't work. I think their focus was on celebrating the series, so I'll let it slide for that one, but if the next one is still as frivolous, it'll be disappointing.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
Hopefully, the next FE has a return to more unit visual identity, be it color schemes, unique sprites for similar character classes with different units, or what have you. On this note, the base 'talk' mechanic feels quite tagged on, (as it's not based on chapters like previous FEs but instead shows up randomly) either make things more individual based on character interaction or limit them to specific chapters like FE 9/10 or 12, or rework it.
Pair up also needs to be looked at from a tactical standpoint, as does win condition variety.
I liked pretty much everything else, even if the relationship stuff got a bit silly with all the time-travel shenanigans.
Honestly, I can't see IS making some of the changes that people in here are asking for. Given Awakening's massive boost in sales, combined with FE being on its last legs, so to speak, they can't afford to change too much right away.
I didn't grind much before I beat the main game, a couple of Risen world battles. I haven't played Awakening in a while, but IIRC, the enemies didn't scale or get crazy out of control in the main game, you didn't really have to grind unless you wanted to or if you wanted to do some of the hidden character maps (Iike Priam), especially with the introduction of the no-death difficulty.
Pair up also needs to be looked at from a tactical standpoint, as does win condition variety.
I liked pretty much everything else, even if the relationship stuff got a bit silly with all the time-travel shenanigans.
Honestly, I can't see IS making some of the changes that people in here are asking for. Given Awakening's massive boost in sales, combined with FE being on its last legs, so to speak, they can't afford to change too much right away.
I didn't grind much before I beat the main game, a couple of Risen world battles. I haven't played Awakening in a while, but IIRC, the enemies didn't scale or get crazy out of control in the main game, you didn't really have to grind unless you wanted to or if you wanted to do some of the hidden character maps (Iike Priam), especially with the introduction of the no-death difficulty.
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
Keep Yusuke Kozaki.
That is all.
That is all.
One thing I forgot to mention in my last post is that I would like to axe the unit respeccing that we have had in the last few titles. Intelligent Systems seems to have no real interest in balancing it (so that it works with the RNG character progression system), so they should just go back to making units a set class, outside of the Avatar unit. Everyone in Awakening was so interchangeable/overpowered due to the unit respeccing. What is the point of giving units different growth rates, if you can just respec until almost everything is maxed?
I liked the branching promotions. They could combine that with Radiant Dawn's double promotion to add a ton of variety. Perhaps tie the second promotion into the marriage feature instead of having marriages lead to child units.
I think some people are mistaking their completionist mentality for forced grinding. On the Normal Difficulty, grinding leaves you ridiculously overpowered by the end of the game. Yes, you may need to grind out some optional maps to get everyone's relationship to S-Rank, and work up some of the child units, but that is all optional side material. If you aren't trying to "catch them all" you can beat the main storyline no problem without ever touching a side map.
I liked the branching promotions. They could combine that with Radiant Dawn's double promotion to add a ton of variety. Perhaps tie the second promotion into the marriage feature instead of having marriages lead to child units.
I think some people are mistaking their completionist mentality for forced grinding. On the Normal Difficulty, grinding leaves you ridiculously overpowered by the end of the game. Yes, you may need to grind out some optional maps to get everyone's relationship to S-Rank, and work up some of the child units, but that is all optional side material. If you aren't trying to "catch them all" you can beat the main storyline no problem without ever touching a side map.
calc84maniac
Member
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
Yeah the level design in Awakening is terrible, and it was an unbalanced mess... and yet I loved it.
I also didn't like the Overpriced DLC, I only got the 3 Future Past ones.
I also didn't like the Overpriced DLC, I only got the 3 Future Past ones.
breakfuss
Member
Really? REALLY? I freaking love the writing.
I'll echo the better map design/more varied objectives complaints. I prefer FE without a world map, but I figure they'll stick with it. Pair-up should probably be nerfed as mentioned.
If a future FE has the child system, I think it's best to split the game in two like in FE4. It was annoying that if you wanted to use the kids, you had to train them and replace the adult units you'd been using.
I'm indifferent about an avatar unit. The avatar does seem a little bit too powerful, though.
If a future FE has the child system, I think it's best to split the game in two like in FE4. It was annoying that if you wanted to use the kids, you had to train them and replace the adult units you'd been using.
I'm indifferent about an avatar unit. The avatar does seem a little bit too powerful, though.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
-Fog of War
-Make it so every single fucking mission isn't ROUT THE ENEMY ROUT THE ENEMY DEFEAT COMMANDER
-Where's my Light Magic
-Make it so that both of the Lords aren't the exact same
-Make it so that enemies can actually crit you without the need of a Killing Edge
-Bring back mechanics from Path of Radiance/Radiant Dawn like elevation
-Make it so every single fucking mission isn't ROUT THE ENEMY ROUT THE ENEMY DEFEAT COMMANDER
-Where's my Light Magic
-Make it so that both of the Lords aren't the exact same
-Make it so that enemies can actually crit you without the need of a Killing Edge
-Bring back mechanics from Path of Radiance/Radiant Dawn like elevation
ShockingAlberto
Member
I am probably alone on this, but I'd like to remove optional battles as a whole and return to the Path of Radiance-style "You have this many battles, better make each kill count" system.
"It's weird that people have all these valid concerns, but they are completely eliminated by the fact that one of these concerns has existed in the past".
Nope.
Yep.
I would like this to return.
bunch of slack-jawed [redacted] around here. surprise reinforcements will make you a goddamned sexual tyrannosaurus, just like me.
If they're going to have a world map again then they need to have the mission structure being different in the next game. It's heavily not utilizing various branching missions that cascade into different results and such. Sacred Stones sort of did this with the branching Ephraim and Eirika storylines but I'm expecting something much more expansive.
Laieon
Member
I thought Awakening was close to being the best Fire Emblem yet, I loved almost everything about it. Easily my GOTY for 2013. I did think the story was somewhat forgettable though, I'd like to see something more on par with Path of Radiance.
Someone else mentioned more variety in missions, that would be nice as well.
Someone else mentioned more variety in missions, that would be nice as well.
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