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When Miyamoto retires, it's going to benefit many Nintendo games

Watching the biography of Mario Bros 3 and Super Mario World by the Gaming Historian makes me think differently. He's probably one of the greatest minds left at Nintendo.
 
Having a "story" or a narrative doesn't mean hours of cinematics. The reducionism in this argument is quite something.

A platformer like Celeste is more creative than any other 2D platformer in the last 20 years, from a gameplay perspective AND also because it has an impactful narrative that intertwines perfectly with the gameplay and level design. It "just" takes talent to achieve that.

Minimalistic games like Ico, SOTC and Journey have stories too. In two of them, not a single word is said. They manage to deliver their message through gameplay and interactions with the environment.
 
"I think that developers and Nintendo will begin to add more story to the games, and many of them need it!"
The games I enjoy most keep the text, talking and cutscenes to a minimum.
 
I actually wish games had less story.. and I wish story heavy games would have a "skip this bullshit and just play the games" button.


I always roll my eyes when there some big set up scene… yea yeah… we get it. You're on a mission or some shit.. just lemme kill the bad guys or do the damn puzzle already.
 
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Am I missing something? It seems Nintendo is doing just fine and sales are very strong (especially in Japan). Such radical changes require very compelling reasons and circumstances, and they simply don't exist.
 
I think Nintendo's games have the right amount of story telling. If you need to hire professional actors and mocap faces to make a video game you might be doing too much.
 
Sure there's games where I appreciate the narrative and ones with characters I love, but 99% of the time they're like early movies in terms of quality and maturity, so I wouldn't say its something Nintendo should aspire to.

My two favourite games "story" which I would say you could show to a non-gamer and not have them think its laughable are puzzle games where in one the "story" is just philosophical lectures and thought provoking ideas (for people that arent well read, and I am not), while the other is similar but with a loose series of events to tie those philosophical questions together along with direct back and forth on said concepts.

If ND thinks they've made actually great stories (vs books and film) in Uncharted 4 and TLOU 1+2 they are deluded, these things are like "good-great HBO show quality" at best, as soon as they had free reign to lock you into long cutscenes and stretches of "gameplay" which are just veiled cutscenes they flew up their own arses or made something thats like a 1950s serial in complexity.

The best story games to me are usually just great scenarios and characters, not really a remotely surprising story (unless it abandons sense). I just think maybe give it another 20 years at least for non-Nintendo games even, a strict narrative limits gameplay and makes it feel rote, games are about a nice combo of surprise and flow to me.
 
I used to idolize Miyamoto until Reggie admitted in an interview that Miyamoto was vehemently against having Wii Sports as a free pack-in for the Wii. It's hard to imagine Wii being so successful without it. Reggie said he had to fight really hard for it be included. Now that Reggie is gone, Nintendo expects players to pay for shit like "The Welcome Tour" when they buy a Switch 2 ... while Sony is giving gamers Astro's Playroom with their PS5 purchase and Valve is giving away Aperture Desk Job.
 
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Live Nintendo HQ reaction
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I agree that stories have their place in games, hell I'll admit that story-driven games are basically the only thing I play which is why I have no interest in competitive or any kind of online game. I also agree that story-telling and characterisation in The Legend of Zelda is threadbare at best but I can forgive that because that is part of what makes that franchise so unique. It's just way to link (no pun intended) the various mechanics and puzzles together. I would like to see a Legend of Zelda game though in the future that has a proper story and even a fully-voiced Link but it would have to be done perfectly. This has to happen at some point, right?

Miyamoto has definitely been a huge influence on Nintendo though and is what makes Nintendo games so special and unique with their old-school charm even if I don't enjoy all their games (I've never understood the appeal of Pokemon or Animal Crossing for example). I think Nintendo would definitely be worse off without him.
 
When Miyamoto retires
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thats were we are mistaken, the dude is gonna work until he rests in peace (by his own will probably)

but like many have said, its not like he keeps things under his control that hard anymore, and when he passes away I believe some will chose to respect the vision he had for his series
 
Little Mac said:
I used to idolize Miyamoto until Reggie admitted in an interview that Miyamoto was vehemently against having Wii Sports as a free pack-in for the Wii. It's hard to imagine Wii b being so successful with it. Reggie said he had to fight really hard for it be included. Now that Reggie is gone, Nintendo expects players to pay for shit like "The Welcome Tour" when they buy a Switch 2 ... while Sony is giving gamers Astro's Playroom with their PS5 purchase.
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Well, that also explains why Miyamoto is not a C-Level type at Nintendo, he does not have the guts for it (to be honest, the last gaming guy with guts for a C-Level was Iwata, God bless his soul).
 
Miyamoto is one of the single most influential people in all of gaming. When that man retires it's gonna be the true end of an era. I don't know how many bangers he's got left in him, but may he live to release them all.
 
mynintendonews.com

Reggie Says Miyamoto gave him a “death stare” when he suggested Wii Sports as a pack-in

Former Nintendo of America president Reggie Fils-Aime has recalled the story of when he met with the legendary Satoru Iwata and Shigeru Miyamoto when they were discussing the launch of the iconic Wii…
mynintendonews.com mynintendonews.com

Former Nintendo of America president Reggie Fils-Aime has recalled the story of when he met with the legendary Satoru Iwata and Shigeru Miyamoto when they were discussing the launch of the iconic Wii system. As he has previously said, he wanted to ensure that Wii Sports was included as a pack-in title as it showed off the system perfectly. He says that he told Mr. Miyamoto this and received a "death stare" from him and was told 'we don't give away content for free.' Thankfully he was able to change Miyamoto's mind and the rest is history.

"I'm in a small meeting with Mr. Iwata and Shigeru Miyamoto… and we are talking about how to best launch the system (Wii) and I said I really think we should pack in Wii Sports. I kid you not. The look that Mr. Miyamoto gave me… Mr. Miyamoto gives me this death stare. Then he says Reggie-san, 'we don't give away content for free'. This is were my historical experience with the companies content came in. I instantly retorted, 'But Mr. Miyamoto, when I bought my SNES, Super Mario came free with that system. So it has been done, but strategically and with thought as a way to drive the business forward.'"
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Cool theory.
Except shoehorning in a story has unquestionably ruined more Nintendo games that it has benefited.
Zelda: Echoes of Wisdom has godawful pacing because of endless dialogues between complete morons. And while adding some cutscenes to StarFox could make it a bit cooler than just the on-rails shooter that it is, one could argue that a very good thing about arcade on-rails shooters is that they don't need cutscenes and similar time wasters.
 
I don't know op…I don't think Video Story has the same ring to it as Video Game.

I think we are good where we are. Nintendo makes video games, Sony makes Video Agendas, and Microsoft sells everything they "make" for $19.99 a month.

Seems like we* have plenty of options without changing what Nintendo does.
 
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Nintendo has movies to tell some "deep" stories. Let their games be gameplay focused. I mean, narrative can also be part of gameplay as emergent narrative, like in Tomodachi Life or Animal Crossing. If they can get a narrative where the player takes an active part in crafting it via gameplay and interacting with the game's systems, I think that might something they would (and should) go for. And no, I don't mean "choices" like in Mass Effect. More something along the line of you killing some important NPC (via gameplay, not via a deliberate, pre-designed choice point) or destroying some quest item, or changing the environment to prevent something from happening or whatever. And the game still has an answer to you for this and reacts accordingly. I always wanted Morrowind to have an answer to me behaving like a murderhobo instead of the infamous "With this character's death, the thread of prophecy is severed. Restore a saved game to restore the weave of fate, or persist in the doomed world you have created."
 
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Literally the dumbest shit ive read on this board in a long time.

Miyamoto has been the soul of Nintendo for decades. He literally is the reason the Mario games have always been so magical and full of discovery and fun. You can also say that for many of their other franchises. There was a time where regularly throughout development, the teams had to give him the latest build to play to see if he found it fun and interesting before proceeding.

I actually fear how terrible it will get once he's gone....that new woman who is the CEO has already shown her DEI cards. I fear that once Miyamoto is gone and many others from old school Nintendo, that they will start to go the route of Sony 1st Party Woke bullshit in all of their titles. That would truly be a sad day for everyone.
 
I love story in my games, but this is just the most ridiculous statement, story doesn't immediately make something better, Miyamoto has always been about making sure the actual gameplay experience is the priority and that philosophy is one of the main reasons Nintendo is successful in the first place, you have it exactly opposite, when he retires, if anything Nintendo is just going to turn into a DEI pushing, walk forward then story design gaming company just like Sony.

Not being a fanboy, I fucking hate Nintendo, but they're currently doing a better job of making good enjoyable games that aren't live service than Sony is.
 
Don't agree here either. Not everything needs so deep story with layers to it. Some things can just be simple and fun. You want a game with a deep story? Go play one of the million other games that have that.
 
dude says The Fucking Legend of Zelda aspires to be "as epic as final fantasy" when the peak of that franchise was Final Fantasy 6, 32 years ago without any voice acting.

go back to fortnite, kid...
 
I thought he already did kind of retire years ago, from being a game director anyway?.
I thought he was more of a consultant these days, helping where needed etc.
 
Nintendo games and their universes are outdated. Just looking at the new Star fox for switch2 looks so stupid and the story parts looks and sound ridiculous. it was embarrassing to watch. They need a creative guy that is not afraid of new franchises and concepts.
 
There's a couple of inherent problems with cutscene(story) games.

1) The feeling of frustration from redoing some portion of or trying to find something in the game etc or the feeling of shooting a thousand guys to get to the next story segment conflicts with the emotions a story is trying to elicit.

2). You have to capture lightning in a bottle twice. It's hard enough just to tell a great story or have great gameplay. But now you want both in the same package.

3). If you need story to play a game you to ask yourself why even bother with the game in the first place. Why not just watch the story.


I never quite understood it. Except folks in games want to be in movies actually. And gamers aren't really gamers but people who like movies that non-club members can't watch.
 
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Iwata - Aime - Miyamoto was the holy trinity of Nintendo. Now all that's left is Miyamoto. Once he leaves Nintendo will be just the same generic, microtransaction, live service game, seasonpass slop like Sony.
 
I don't agree at all. I love Nintendo games and for the most part I would like them to continue as they have been. Metroid does not need a story, Other M was an attempt at that and look how that turned out. I think that Metroid benefits from a very subdued story element similar to what we see in Metroid Prime or Super Metroid with environmental storytelling and perhaps an intro and an outro.

I could probably go on for quite a while but I completely disagree with your stance. Story has a time and place in games and in these particular games I don't think it does have a place in the way that you want it. Zelda should be nothing like Final Fantasy.
 
That's true. Miyamoto's mindset is still very rooted in the past. A lot of older developers struggle to imagine truly large-scale projects with the tools and resources available today. Zelda, for example, isn't really directed by him anymore, though he still has creative influence. Once he retires, I think Nintendo will probably start embracing more ambition.
 
RCU005 said:
No one can deny that Miyamoto is a legend in video games, and he has created many classic franchises, starting with Mario.

With that said, I think his biggest weakness is his insistence in not having story in games. I understand his point of view, as gameplay should be top priority in a video game, since the primary objective is to play and have fun. I love the fact that Nintendo redesigned the controller for each generation to give us new experiences.

However, since technology has advanced, there's a need of a story to have a more complete and cohesive narrative to join the gameplay. I know some of their franchises are simple and for kids, but even then, they could have a simple and good story.

To me, the biggest disappointment is The Legend of Zelda. This franchise has the potential to be Final Fantasy level of epic (even more so), but it's stuck with the same simple story almost non-existent. Then, in Breath of the Wild, when they introduced voce acting, I thought it was time to have a story-heavy game, but it wasn't the case. I was very disappointed, because the potential is there! And they created amazing characters in Breath of the Wild that just went to waste.

Other franchises that could benefit from having a much expansive story are Metroid and Star Fox. Those two franchises also have a potential to have AAA, JRPG, level of epicness.

There's a story that the development team had to add the story for Mario Galaxy without Miyamoto finding out until the very end, and what was the result? One of the best stories that Mario has had, and introduced a beloved new princess until today.

Whenever Miyamoto is not in control, I think that developers and Nintendo will begin to add more story to the games, and many of them need it!. I still believe gameplay should be the focus in EVERY game, not just Nintendo, but the production values are increasing, and many other developers and publishers have proven that you can have both!
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Be careful what you wish for ...
 
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