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Will Star Wars:ROS bomb?

Dada55000

Member
And it's Kathleen Kennedy that you have to thank for the Mandalorian. Just pointing that out because she is getting shit on in the other thread.
lolno, you can thank the Disney suit above Kennedy that demanded SW content for their streaming service and Jon Favroueueuo for everything else
her credit extends to stamping shit and then fucking off to oversee the movies being sufficiently terrible, TLJ was her baby

what you did was more running interference trying to ascribe credit to some hack suit at lucasfilm
 

sol_bad

Member
lolno, you can thank the Disney suit above Kennedy that demanded SW content for their streaming service and Jon Favroueueuo for everything else
her credit extends to stamping shit and then fucking off to oversee the movies being sufficiently terrible, TLJ was her baby

what you did was more running interference trying to ascribe credit to some hack suit at lucasfilm

Proof of this?
 

Hinedorf

Banned
And it's Kathleen Kennedy that you have to thank for the Mandalorian. Just pointing that out because she is getting shit on in the other thread.

Anybody tied to Mandalorian deserves high praise. While speaking from total ignorance I feel like while staying very close to the original source material of A New Hope I sense Favreau's fingerprints all over this. And I mean that in a positive way in the sense that he tends to treat very sentimental characters with the utmost zeal of their fans.

2008: "truth is.....I am Iron Man" 2019: "This is the way"

His stuff doesn't just end totally representative of the character, it ends with with a highly memorable quote totally on point for the character.
 

sol_bad

Member
Anybody tied to Mandalorian deserves high praise. While speaking from total ignorance I feel like while staying very close to the original source material of A New Hope I sense Favreau's fingerprints all over this. And I mean that in a positive way in the sense that he tends to treat very sentimental characters with the utmost zeal of their fans.

2008: "truth is.....I am Iron Man" 2019: "This is the way"

His stuff doesn't just end totally representative of the character, it ends with with a highly memorable quote totally on point for the character.

Definitely Favreau is the creative mind behind the show and everything creatively is owed to him. My statement was more about Kathleen Kennedy green lighting the project and letting it happen. She has produced many successful movies and helped set up Amblin with Spielberg, she is far from a hack as Dada55000 Dada55000 above suggests. All of Star Wars since 2012 has been her baby, not just TLJ.
 

Dada55000

Member
Proof of this?
of what exactly? that highest level Disney suits are pushing to have content with their most well known brands on D+? pretty self evident that, what with the 5 new MCU (for real this time we swear) shows
that the quality of the show is down to Favroueuoeut being the showrunner? also pretty obvious, it certainly wasn't the bean counter that made it engaging
that she put a great deal of effort overseeing new movies, a number(arguably all) of which sucked? now that's just asking if water is wet

the only part where your question might even apply to is her love for TLJ, to which I say, she loved Rian Johnson's brainchild enough to promise him an entire trilogy
maybe it was (made) to her tastes


Definitely Favreau is the creative mind behind the show and everything creatively is owed to him. My statement was more about Kathleen Kennedy green lighting the project and letting it happen. She has produced many successful movies and helped set up Amblin with Spielberg, she is far from a hack as Dada55000 Dada55000 above suggests. All of Star Wars since 2012 has been her baby, not just TLJ.
Damning with faint praise.
 

sol_bad

Member
The last 5 years.

The 5 movies she produced and got off the ground before she bothered with the Mandolorian.

4 out of 5 of those movies were/are/will be financially successful.

As for experience................................
She knows what she is doing, she has probably been in the industry for longer than you were born, it's certainly true for me.
You don't shit all over a person just because you think a few bad films were made in your beloved franchise, especially when they have worked and helped create so many good projects over a 35+ year span.
 

Dada55000

Member
4 out of 5 of those movies were/are/will be financially successful.

As for experience................................
She knows what she is doing, she has probably been in the industry for longer than you were born, it's certainly true for me.
You don't shit all over a person just because you think a few bad films were made in your beloved franchise, especially when they have worked and helped create so many good projects over a 35+ year span.
Emotional appeal to authority+"HOW DARE YOU SAY MEAN THINGS ABOUT HER?!?"
Pathetic. Edit: Aw shit, I missed the best part, the appeal to money, which somehow supplements quality. Good to know Batman V Superman isn't shit.

Here how about this, you erased the hard work of every artist that actually made the show what it is just so you could prop up a has been executive. YoU mOnStEr!?
Just because you got butthurt about people being meanies, you initiated cross-thread preemtive felating solely attributing Mandalorian to her. Bulletpoints, schmuletpoints, you're still running interference.

And this is Star Wars, guy, people that lost all their talent producing shit is a theme.
 
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sol_bad

Member
The movie has been rumored to be in production hell with re shoots going on as close to as the last few weeks. The leaks make it sound stupider than even Dark Fate, and Rey is being set up as the ultimate Mary Sue ready to shit on all of our past heros, especially the MENZ to show us WAMANZ.

Sorry Crypto, just read your first post properly now. Any links to the on set dramas?
 
4 out of 5 of those movies were/are/will be financially successful.

As for experience................................
She knows what she is doing, she has probably been in the industry for longer than you were born, it's certainly true for me.
You don't shit all over a person just because you think a few bad films were made in your beloved franchise, especially when they have worked and helped create so many good projects over a 35+ year span.

Ah the good o'l Kathleen Kennedy list. I bet in 90% of those her name was just put on the box.

How tf if you have actually been a part in creating those movies do you create a trilogy without any kind of plan except trying to play the woke card. Even that was fake, all her talk about feminism and social justice never once did she even approach a female director despite the fact that there a lots of really good ones. All of them better than Ruin Johnson.
 

oagboghi2

Member
4 out of 5 of those movies were/are/will be financially successful.

As for experience................................
She knows what she is doing, she has probably been in the industry for longer than you were born, it's certainly true for me.
You don't shit all over a person just because you think a few bad films were made in your beloved franchise, especially when they have worked and helped create so many good projects over a 35+ year span.
It sounds like you want to crown her ass with a award or something. That’s fine, but it doesn’t erase the fact that she drove the Star Wars brand into the ground.
 
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Javthusiast

Banned
It is simply impossible that it will bomb, unfortunately enough normies will still be curious enough to see how this ends. Now if it would make like 900 mill max and not break a billion like all the other movies did then it would already be a small victory.
 
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AV

We ain't outta here in ten minutes, we won't need no rocket to fly through space
Doubt it. Solo was the only genuine failure so far, the rest did fine.

It doesn't matter what angry dorks like me say about Episode 8, it's not going to put enough people off seeing 9. I'm going and I thought 8 was shit. If anything a lot of us are going to get it over with.
 

EverydayBeast

thinks Halo Infinite is a new graphical benchmark
Its one thing if it bombs, it's another thing if it falls flat, what makes OP thinks it will bomb? The characters (Rey, Ren etc.) are in their elements, and are more than capable of carrying a Star Wars films, all the pieces are there, it's a hardcore vs casual thing and Star Wars fans at some point need to figure out what category they fall in. The thing Star Wars does best is continuing the story, again I don't think ROS will bomb but there's enough doubt there for fear of not winning a grammy, and losing even more fans.
 

Petrae

Member
I dont know if it will bomb but i have no intention of paying to see it, thats a first for me with a Star Wars movie.

I cant imagine im the only one doing that

Definitely not. I quit on Disney Star Wars after that shitty Rogue One movie. The hullabaloo over The Last Jedi and the bomb that was Solo only served me in that they provided more comedic fodder for Red Letter Media.

Bob Iger couldn’t pay me enough money to sit through his company’s awful “Star Wars” reboots... and this is coming from a former fan who saw the first six movies in theaters within their first days of release.

The characters are shit or are poorly-written returns of once-loved ones. The writing and stories are bad at best. The “diversity” of the cast isn’t at all organic and feels (pardon the pun) forced, given Disney’s social justice agenda and messaging. Disney Star Wars exists only to make Disney continued returns on its investment— the films don’t need to exist, and it can easily be argued that the Star Wars franchise would’ve been better off had they never existed.
 

sol_bad

Member
The “diversity” of the cast isn’t at all organic and feels (pardon the pun) forced, given Disney’s social justice agenda and messaging. Disney Star Wars exists only to make Disney continued returns on its investment— the films don’t need to exist, and it can easily be argued that the Star Wars franchise would’ve been better off had they never existed.

How do you "organically" introduce a diverse cast?
 

#Phonepunk#

Banned
This attempt to make KK the hero of the mandolorian is funny to watch. People are trying to rewrite history in real time
i mean it's a salvaged movie from the era where they were going to release a SW every single year. the fact we have a tv show and not a movie is proof they fucked up. judging by the show, it seems like they just took the spin off movie and padded out the running time with lots of atmospherics. time will tell if they still have enough nostalgia nods to make it entertaining in season 2, etc.
The thing Star Wars does best is continuing the story
yet they utterly bombed at this with the last film. they are not continuing with the story, they are merely retreading things, even while screaming "This is bold and new!". they are just walking in circles at this point. we already got a ROTJ throne room ripoff and are near guaranteed to get another one just one film later. this right here is why they will fail. TLJ failed to continue the story. given that the official line from people like KK is that it "moved the story forward" i can't but feel they are just flat out lying to my face. there is no reason for me to see where they will take any future entries. they have given up.
 
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oagboghi2

Member
How do you "organically" introduce a diverse cast?
Umm how about you start with writing compelling characters with their own unique goals and bring them together?

You know, that thing KK and Disney didn't bother to do in the first 3 star Wars films
 
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cryptoadam

Banned
Sorry Crypto, just read your first post properly now. Any links to the on set dramas?

Check out this YT channel


there is a ton of videos about all the rumors of how bad things are going for ROS. Of course take what is said as rumor.

Here is a good clip about how horrible the test screenings went.

 

cryptoadam

Banned
Its one thing if it bombs, it's another thing if it falls flat, what makes OP thinks it will bomb? The characters (Rey, Ren etc.) are in their elements, and are more than capable of carrying a Star Wars films, all the pieces are there, it's a hardcore vs casual thing and Star Wars fans at some point need to figure out what category they fall in. The thing Star Wars does best is continuing the story, again I don't think ROS will bomb but there's enough doubt there for fear of not winning a grammy, and losing even more fans.

Just to be clear when I started the thread I meant bomb relative to Star Wars, not to regular movies. So by bomb I mean more like underperform. Star Wars is probably the biggest franchise out there, so if it makes 1 billion or less thats a bomb by Star Wars standards. Consider TFA made 2 billion with 900+DOM, and TLJ made 1.3 Billion, if the 3rd movie can't beat the second its bad news.

Why will it bomb? TLJ was horrible and drove fans away. China was never to into Star Wars and I don't think they care much about it now. Movies have been bombing left and right and thankfully SW has stayed away from being woke but there is still time for someone to come out and woke up the marketing. And overall I just don't see much reason to care for this new star wars. TLJ didn't leave any good threads. We know what will happen. Rebels destroy the bad guys, Palpatine "dies" again, Rey beats Kylo again, Rey wins is the best, some characters from the OT will be killed. And finally I think the movie is not going to play well with audiences. Fans will finally be sick of Rey being the super Jedi just because. Fans will be pissed about Palpatine and how that will find a way to shit on the OT/Vader/Luke. If they do what is rumored to happen which will involve killing off OT characters its going to PISS people off to the point where I don't think they will see the movie again.

If you want to make huge money you need repeat customers, and in the end I don't think fans are going to want to see the movie multiple times because its not going to be good nor the ending that they want. So people will go see it opening weekend to get it out of their system, but not again and again and again.
 
It won't bomb. It'll be profitable. I'm still guessing between TLJ and TFA.

IIRC ROTJ and ROTS did about 30% higher than ESB and AOTC, so if TLJ follow the same trend it'll do about 1.6B. My guess is it'll bomb in China though, under 60MM.
 

GymWolf

Member
Just to be clear when I started the thread I meant bomb relative to Star Wars, not to regular movies. So by bomb I mean more like underperform. Star Wars is probably the biggest franchise out there, so if it makes 1 billion or less thats a bomb by Star Wars standards. Consider TFA made 2 billion with 900+DOM, and TLJ made 1.3 Billion, if the 3rd movie can't beat the second its bad news.

Why will it bomb? TLJ was horrible and drove fans away. China was never to into Star Wars and I don't think they care much about it now. Movies have been bombing left and right and thankfully SW has stayed away from being woke but there is still time for someone to come out and woke up the marketing. And overall I just don't see much reason to care for this new star wars. TLJ didn't leave any good threads. We know what will happen. Rebels destroy the bad guys, Palpatine "dies" again, Rey beats Kylo again, Rey wins is the best, some characters from the OT will be killed. And finally I think the movie is not going to play well with audiences. Fans will finally be sick of Rey being the super Jedi just because. Fans will be pissed about Palpatine and how that will find a way to shit on the OT/Vader/Luke. If they do what is rumored to happen which will involve killing off OT characters its going to PISS people off to the point where I don't think they will see the movie again.

If you want to make huge money you need repeat customers, and in the end I don't think fans are going to want to see the movie multiple times because its not going to be good nor the ending that they want. So people will go see it opening weekend to get it out of their system, but not again and again and again.
Some people are gonna say to you that is just a vocal minority who didn't like tlj...
 
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cryptoadam

Banned
I always laugh when i hear anot the narrative that who hates tlj is just a vocal minor

Some people are gonna say to you that is just a vocal minority who didn't like tlj...

And those people would be wrong. The minority are those REEEEEEEers who actually like TLJ LOL. What a boring slow crappy movie that killed all the excitment for any future instalments. IMO it turned people off enough of Star Wars that they stayed away from a movie about young Han Solo.
 

GymWolf

Member
And those people would be wrong. The minority are those REEEEEEEers who actually like TLJ LOL. What a boring slow crappy movie that killed all the excitment for any future instalments. IMO it turned people off enough of Star Wars that they stayed away from a movie about young Han Solo.
Yep, i was soo soure up by that shit that i still have to watch the solp movie, and i was a giant sw fanboy...
I mean that, and queen of retarded dragon being a co-protagonist...i hate that bitch :lollipop_halo:
 

Doom85

Member
The audience score of TLJ on Rotten Tomatoes is 44% meaning 44% liked the movie. Hardly a minority. And remember, this same forum chose to completely deny that there was any possible way those Facebook groups saying they would hack the website to lower the audience score for the movie would be able to actually do that so that means that audience score is trustworthy. And with over 200,000 voters, no one can be all, "well, it was a small group of people voicing their opinion, not really significant".
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
TLJ was a massive disappointment, but I've still gotta see this thing through. Hopefully they manage to pull it together.
 
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Azurro

Banned
How do you "organically" introduce a diverse cast?

How about not doing it as a goal of a film? If there's diversity, whatever, cool if that's your thing. Still, you can't start with that as a goal, as you usually end up with dumb ass characters just there for the sake of representation. This Rose character that was supposed to represent fat people and Asian people was one of the most annoying and useless characters in the entire movie, she could easily have been removed and the story would have been improved.

Same thing for Holdo, no need to kill off Ackbar (sp?) but they needed a wahmen with authority to teach Poe the lesson that he should...always blindly follow authority and always listen to women, I guess?

To be honest man, I'm always impressed with your dedication to the ultra woke, progressive stuff. You are there to defend Kathleen Kennedy, you are there to defend TLJ, you are there to defend Terminator: Literally the same shit as T2 but John Connor is now a tiny, Mexican and illegal immigrant. You are always there to defend woke stuff.
 
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How about not doing it as a goal of a film? If there's diversity, whatever, cool if that's your thing. Still, you can't start with that as a goal, as you usually end up with dumb ass characters just there for the sake of representation. This Rose character that was supposed to represent fat people and Asian people was one of the most annoying and useless characters in the entire movie, she could easily have been removed and the story would have been improved.

Same thing for Holdo, no need to kill off Ackbar (sp?) but they needed a wahmen with authority to teach Poe the lesson that he should...always blindly follow authority and always listen to women, I guess?

To be honest man, I'm always impressed with your dedication to the ultra woke, progressive stuff. You are there to defend Kathleen Kennedy, you are there to defend TLJ, you are there to defend Terminator: Literally the same shit as T2 but John Connor is now a tiny, Mexican and illegal immigrant. You are always there to defend woke stuff.

I'm a minority and a POC. I hate, hate diversity for the sake of diversity. Oftentimes I see white people trying to push that for whatever reason. Sometimes some minority will try to push for "representation" as well. To me, just try to tell the best story possible and if that calls for diversity, great, if not then that's great too.

Marvel does well with introducing diversity. Or at least they have done well so far. Gender/race swapping some minor characters like Marvell, Nick Fury (at the time), these new Eternal characters, etc is probably the best way to get more diversity in an elegant manner. However, I hear people calling for major characters to be race swapped or changed in a major manner. If the rumors of a non white Magneto, Xavier, or Wolverine turn out to be true then I may jump off the MCU wagon.

I remember some people somewhere else suggesting Kevin Hart for Wolverine, that Precious actress (forgot the name of the movie) as Storm, Denzel for Magneto, and so on. If they do anything close to that I am out cuz. I would love Denzel in the MCU, and as a villain too, but Magneto is not it. Maybe Marvel Studios could create an original character for him and make him this bad ass world threatening villain? That's a crazy idea. And before anyone says anything there have been plenty of Marvel characters that were first created outside of the comics like X-23.
 

Doom85

Member
Maybe you were referring to the comics, but the MCU Nick Fury isn't a race-swap as the Ultimate universe version of Fury is black. In fact, the character was designed to look like Samuel L. Jackson and when the Ultimates (what the Avengers are called in this universe) are having a little fun talk about who should play them in a possible film, Nick says it has to be Jackson who plays him.

My bad if you already knew that.

Honestly though, I only have issues with race-swapping (as in the exact character not simply the codename identity; having Miles Morales as the lead is not race-swapping Peter Parker) if it's THE lead (or the closest thing to one if it's an ensemble story). Clark Kent, Bruce Wayne, Peter Parker, Steve Rogers, etc. Everyone else I don't think is an issue as long as it's not done a lot. Domino being black isn't a problem and sure enough most of the whiners settled down once the movie came out anyway. So while I don't think Wolverine should be race-swapped (although honestly I'd rather the MCU establish the X-men team without Logan hogging the spotlight yet again for at least two movies before bringing him in) but someone like Magneto wouldn't bother me. Honestly, it's logical, Magneto being a Holocaust survivor adds to his character as it shows why he has no patience for discrimination against mutants and just wants to put as fast an end to it as possible regardless of what that means he has to do. But a modern-day Magneto being a child in WW2 is just unfeasible now, dude would be in his 80's.

Having someone like Denzel Washington could convey that same characterization. They don't even have to have a flashback, maybe just show his desk and there's a picture of Martin Luther King Jr. or something along those lines. To suggest his disgust about how it took so long for minorities to start getting treated more equally and now mutation has people back to making the exact same mistakes (it's why I love that exchange in the first movie: "What would you have me do, Charles? I've heard these arguments before." "That was a long time ago. Mankind has evolved." "Yes...into us."

But yeah, Gabourey Sidibe playing Storm makes no sense. I don't condone fat-shaming, but the X-men are constantly out on missions, spend time training in the Danger Room, etc. Storm being heavy-set wouldn't be logical. She's one of the characters I hope the MCU handles better than the previous attempts; the actress who played her in Apocalypse/DP was better than Halle Berry but they could still do better, same deal with Cyclops he was handled a bit better in the newer movies but there's room for improvement.
 

sol_bad

Member
How about not doing it as a goal of a film? If there's diversity, whatever, cool if that's your thing. Still, you can't start with that as a goal, as you usually end up with dumb ass characters just there for the sake of representation. This Rose character that was supposed to represent fat people and Asian people was one of the most annoying and useless characters in the entire movie, she could easily have been removed and the story would have been improved.

Same thing for Holdo, no need to kill off Ackbar (sp?) but they needed a wahmen with authority to teach Poe the lesson that he should...always blindly follow authority and always listen to women, I guess?

To be honest man, I'm always impressed with your dedication to the ultra woke, progressive stuff. You are there to defend Kathleen Kennedy, you are there to defend TLJ, you are there to defend Terminator: Literally the same shit as T2 but John Connor is now a tiny, Mexican and illegal immigrant. You are always there to defend woke stuff.

I wasn't asking you the question, but ok.

Here's the thing, when I think of Rose in TLJ I don't think of her as a fat Asian woman, I just think of her as a shit character. Do you think it said in the script that a fat Asian woman saves a dumb black man? Granted, at the casting level they decided to cast Kelly Marie Tran for diversity sake. The problem isn't that she is an Asian actor though, it's that her character was poorly written, she'd be just as shit and annoying if she was a sexy slim white woman.

So if we take the character of Rose, how would she be any better if she was a white actor? What would make it acceptable for her to be an Asian actor? What would it take to make it OK in your eyes?

Same thing with Holdo, that character was in the script before shooting. What would make that character better if it was a man? I'm not a big fan of the Holdo character but again it has nothing to do with her being a woman, it's just a bad character. And I honestly don't understand this affinity for Admiral Ackbar, as bad as Holdo is, she still had a ton more characterisation than what Ackbar had. He is in a couple of scenes from the original trilogy and he is not important. If you red some old EU story where he was amazing, that's fine but keep in mind that Lucas himself didn't give a shit about the EU, he only cared about the dollars he was getting from it.

And you may have seen my posts about defending DF and Kennedy but I have also critiqued them. DF has flaws as a film but it has nothing to do with "wokeness" and Kennedy has certainly mishandled Star Wars in various aspects but I still think she has done a pretty top tier job overall.
 

Azurro

Banned
I wasn't asking you the question, but ok.

Here's the thing, when I think of Rose in TLJ I don't think of her as a fat Asian woman, I just think of her as a shit character. Do you think it said in the script that a fat Asian woman saves a dumb black man? Granted, at the casting level they decided to cast Kelly Marie Tran for diversity sake. The problem isn't that she is an Asian actor though, it's that her character was poorly written, she'd be just as shit and annoying if she was a sexy slim white woman.

So if we take the character of Rose, how would she be any better if she was a white actor? What would make it acceptable for her to be an Asian actor? What would it take to make it OK in your eyes?

Same thing with Holdo, that character was in the script before shooting. What would make that character better if it was a man? I'm not a big fan of the Holdo character but again it has nothing to do with her being a woman, it's just a bad character. And I honestly don't understand this affinity for Admiral Ackbar, as bad as Holdo is, she still had a ton more characterisation than what Ackbar had. He is in a couple of scenes from the original trilogy and he is not important. If you red some old EU story where he was amazing, that's fine but keep in mind that Lucas himself didn't give a shit about the EU, he only cared about the dollars he was getting from it.

And you may have seen my posts about defending DF and Kennedy but I have also critiqued them. DF has flaws as a film but it has nothing to do with "wokeness" and Kennedy has certainly mishandled Star Wars in various aspects but I still think she has done a pretty top tier job overall.

Hey man, it's public forum. :)

The thing is the script was so shit that at one point they probably realized "hey, we don't have enough on screen time for Finn and we need to have some asian/fat representation", so they added the whole casino subplot to give them something to do, which was shit. The whole Holdo thing was the whole "listen to women with power" all over it, it was so badly done. Again, why do you even need Holdo and her purple hair there? What a waste of a good actress, it's a shame. The point was that if they had focused on the story first rather than add shit for characters to do so they can give them representation or adding inane sjw shit isn't the way to go, that's imo how things can appear organically, if they are born out of the story.

But really man, I'm not even a SW fan, but KK has had an awful handling of SW. Solo was such a shit handling of a property with constant changing of directors and rewrites, same thing for this Skywalker thing. She has managed to successfully devalue the brand and piss off their fanbase to an unimaginable degree. So much that Bob Iger has basically taken over and put a lot of Marvel guys to manage SW and quietly demote her. And yeah, come on, T: DF, with its initial posters with no men in it, with John Connor literally replaced by a minority, tiny girl to do his exact same job, a director that wants to scare the shit out of misogynists isn't a woke film.

I don't mean this in a bad way, I really don't, but you are such a SJW that you don't even notice you are a SJW, it's admirable to be honest.
 
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Doom85

Member
Demote? Last year, her contract was extended by three years to remain President of Lucasfilm. "Quietly demote" just sounds like, "a bunch of people on the Internet can't handle a reality where she's still in charge so they make shit up that is vague so it can't be easily disproven and thus they get clickbait views".
 

sol_bad

Member
Hey man, it's public forum. :)

The thing is the script was so shit that at one point they probably realized "hey, we don't have enough on screen time for Finn and we need to have some asian/fat representation", so they added the whole casino subplot to give them something to do, which was shit. The whole Holdo thing was the whole "listen to women with power" all over it, it was so badly done. Again, why do you even need Holdo and her purple hair there? What a waste of a good actress, it's a shame. The point was that if they had focused on the story first rather than add shit for characters to do so they can give them representation or adding inane sjw shit isn't the way to go, that's imo how things can appear organically, if they are born out of the story.

But really man, I'm not even a SW fan, but KK has had an awful handling of SW. Solo was such a shit handling of a property with constant changing of directors and rewrites, same thing for this Skywalker thing. She has managed to successfully devalue the brand and piss off their fanbase to an unimaginable degree. So much that Bob Iger has basically taken over and put a lot of Marvel guys to manage SW and quietly demote her. And yeah, come on, T: DF, with its initial posters with no men in it, with John Connor literally replaced by a minority, tiny girl to do his exact same job, a director that wants to scare the shit out of misogynists isn't a woke film.

I don't mean this in a bad way, I really don't, but you are such a SJW that you don't even notice you are a SJW, it's admirable to be honest.

You ignored my questions. What would be brought to the table if Rose was a white woman and Holdo was a man?

You do know that there have been hundreds of military films where male leaders tell men to do things without questioning right? You do know it happens in real like too, soldiers sent to fight know they will die because the circumstances are impossible.

It's ok for a man to give orders without question but not women?

*EDIT*
Also what do you mean about demotion for KK and Marvel guys taking over?
 
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Animagic

Banned
I’m personally done with disney StarWars. And disney everything for that matter...

maybe people in China are interested. I just don’t give a shit anymore.
 

Azurro

Banned
You ignored my questions. What would be brought to the table if Rose was a white woman and Holdo was a man?

You do know that there have been hundreds of military films where male leaders tell men to do things without questioning right? You do know it happens in real like too, soldiers sent to fight know they will die because the circumstances are impossible.

It's ok for a man to give orders without question but not women?

No, you didn't understand my point. My point is that they are there purely for representation and social politics ideology. They should be cut, there's no benefit to their characters and they don't benefit the story. It's midnight around here so I won't get too much into it, but Holdo's character is so badly done that you can't even see it for anything other than progressive propaganda, no normal human would act like that, that's why no one likes it. It's such a bad message too: "A person in a position of authority tells you to do nothing while all your friends and family are getting murdered? It's a wahmen in a position of authority, don't you dare question her and just listen to her!". The plan sucked balls and everyone died regardless, but hey.

ManaByte ManaByte I know you have been lately going on about how your internal sources contradict other internal sources, but the crazy reshoots that have been happening can't have been coming from nowhere. There's so much money riding on this that it's a bit hard to believe you.
 

ManaByte

Gold Member
No, you didn't understand my point. My point is that they are there purely for representation and social politics ideology. They should be cut, there's no benefit to their characters and they don't benefit the story. It's midnight around here so I won't get too much into it, but Holdo's character is so badly done that you can't even see it for anything other than progressive propaganda, no normal human would act like that, that's why no one likes it. It's such a bad message too: "A person in a position of authority tells you to do nothing while all your friends and family are getting murdered? It's a wahmen in a position of authority, don't you dare question her and just listen to her!". The plan sucked balls and everyone died regardless, but hey.

ManaByte ManaByte I know you have been lately going on about how your internal sources contradict other internal sources, but the crazy reshoots that have been happening can't have been coming from nowhere. There's so much money riding on this that it's a bit hard to believe you.

All you're doing is parroting bullshit from performance outrage YouTubers who just make up complete shit to get monetized views on YouTube.

Kathleen Kennedy has not been "demoted". No one from Marvel is running Lucasfilm. That's 100% bullshit. Even Hollywood Trades just two weeks ago said her job is secure.

This video does a great job showing how full of shit those YouTubers you listen to are:
 

sol_bad

Member
No, you didn't understand my point. My point is that they are there purely for representation and social politics ideology. They should be cut, there's no benefit to their characters and they don't benefit the story. It's midnight around here so I won't get too much into it, but Holdo's character is so badly done that you can't even see it for anything other than progressive propaganda, no normal human would act like that, that's why no one likes it. It's such a bad message too: "A person in a position of authority tells you to do nothing while all your friends and family are getting murdered? It's a wahmen in a position of authority, don't you dare question her and just listen to her!". The plan sucked balls and everyone died regardless, but hey.

ManaByte ManaByte I know you have been lately going on about how your internal sources contradict other internal sources, but the crazy reshoots that have been happening can't have been coming from nowhere. There's so much money riding on this that it's a bit hard to believe you.

Unless you can prove that Rose and Holdo weren't in the original script, what you are saying is just fantasy. You are trying to side step my question because you can't come up with any good reasoning. I've said they are both shit characters but that it's not due to them being Asian or women. You are saying they are shit for that very reason, so explain how they would be better characters if you gender swapped them and made them both white. If you can't, than the fact is they are just shit characters and it has nothing to do with gender or ethnicity.

Also, show proof of Kennedy being demoted, that "the Marvel guys" have taken over and that there were "crazy" re shoots. Without resorting to a stupid Youtube channel. Bloody flat Earthers always resort to Youtube videos, please contribute to the discussion in a more intelligent manner than that.
 

ManaByte

Gold Member
Unless you can prove that Rose and Holdo weren't in the original script, what you are saying is just fantasy. You are trying to side step my question because you can't come up with any good reasoning. I've said they are both shit characters but that it's not due to them being Asian or women. You are saying they are shit for that very reason, so explain how they would be better characters if you gender swapped them and made them both white. If you can't, than the fact is they are just shit characters and it has nothing to do with gender or ethnicity.

Also, show proof of Kennedy being demoted, that "the Marvel guys" have taken over and that there were "crazy" re shoots. Without resorting to a stupid Youtube channel. Bloody flat Earthers always resort to Youtube videos, please contribute to the discussion in a more intelligent manner than that.

I bet he'll post a link from Cosmic Book News, the website banned from Reddit for reposting YouTube BS as fact.
 

ManaByte

Gold Member
Haven't a clue what that is, but 'got banned from plebbit' is a pretty shit dunk.

Shit dunk? Sites only get banned from being posted to Reddit if they post complete bullshit. CosmicBookNews, We Got This Covered, and Bounding Into Comics are just pure bullshit clickbait sites.
 

#Phonepunk#

Banned
It's such a bad message too: "A person in a position of authority tells you to do nothing while all your friends and family are getting murdered? It's a wahmen in a position of authority, don't you dare question her and just listen to her!".
when placed alongside similar scenes from the previous 7 SW movies, all featuring commanders and heroes telling everyone the plans in great detail. that dude during the Death Star briefing. Leia running around at the start of ESB giving orders. Mon Mothma & Ackbar telling everyone about the ROTJ plan. Holdo acted nothing like any of these previous authority figures who put on descriptive mission briefings. she purposefully withheld information and there seemed like no good reason to, so it seems like something deliberately done for the plot. a new character has been introduced that acts like nobody had ever done before. for a good chunk of the running time i thought she would turn out to be a FO mole, she was acting like a bad guy the whole time. that's not why i watch these movies, to see good guys acting like bad guys. but if you dont like her, a woman, you are sexist. it's a bullshit trap Rian laid. make a crap character, make it a woman, then when someone calls out a crap character, call them a sexist.

TLJ does this over and over again with it's new characters. Rose is introduced stopping a hero from fleeing on an escape pod. this puts her in the same place as the stormtroopers from the start of ANH. for most of the film, she was basically a villain for me, a selfish, violent military extremist, who delivers very naive and dumb messages. why should i like this character? she is directly responsible for Luke's death and the deaths of thousands of other fighters. yet because i don't like her character, i am a sexist, and a racist to boot. which is kind of ironic given that it was Rian's idea to make the kamikazee militant extremist played by an Asian actress in the first place.
 
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